Removal of the cross class system announced.

I've noticed during the discussion about the fanfest that no one has even mentioned anything about this statement during the keynote. He referred to it as a "relic of 1.0" and they'll be scrapping the system and changing it to a selection of abilities based on your role. It's going to be interesting to see definitely but I also wonder if this means a removal of certain abilities for other classes.

I.E. Will Raging Strikes become available for all DPS and be removed as a baseline of Archer? Will Blood for Blood be removed entirely in favor of everyone having Raging Strikes? Will certain defensive cooldowns be condensed to? Foresight for example is a must have for all tanks. Could they make that a baseline cross class ability and remove things like Shadow Skin and Rampart?

Or at least that was my interpretation of it. I cannot find a good transcript to post anywhere. I may have to re-watch the keynote and post it verbatim here.

you more or less seem to have an idea of what i think ill end up being. Its basically streamlining some abilities outta job into role.

and there prolly will be some consolidated ones like you think with like raging and bfb etc. Or could see raging become caster/ranged and BfB become the melee equivalent. And of course alot of stuff will just get removed that shouldn't have been xclass imo to begin with like getting the combo ones.

What?! I can no longer have Skull Sunder on my Monk?! Uninstalling...

No one has really mentioned it this time, due to the fact that it was previously announced at the Las Vegas fan fest. Don't think they've gone into specifics yet, though I did miss parts of the stream due to work.

Seems pretty clear to me at this point:

Instead of picking 5 cross-class skills, we'll now pick 5 cross-role skills in more or less the same interface. Skills will likely end up being the same or similar to what we have right now, biggest change being that you'll no longer have to level the respective jobs. Chances are, slots will be unlocked at a similar rate as now, too.

Or in other words: Big whoop over a relatively small change.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zojha

Or in other words: Big whoop over a relatively small change.

---

A relatively small change that un-hamstrings the class system. Currently every physical dps job that's introduced MUST cross-class lancer because invigorate is so important. Every tank job MUST cross-class gladiator because provoke is so important. Every healer job MUST cross-class conjurer because of protect AND thaumaturge because of swiftcast. Under this system, new jobs have all their decisions made for them before they're even designed. So the design is flawed and has to be changed. That's what this does.

This is the thing I'm wanting to learn more about, more so than RDM. Disconnecting themselves from the cross class system and into a role based system could have a lot of potential. We can get rid of some of the bloat, like for PLD. There's no need for Rampart and Foresight. Make them into one and give the enhancements via traits and throw in Shadowskin in with it. Instead you have one move that will get traits to increase the duration / potency and cool down. Maybe a higher duration to make up for what they'll loose. So a DRK that uses Shadowskin for 20s just to tack on Foresight for another 20s..make the single move have traits that gradually increase it to 40s.

I was actually hoping that all of the CC skills would be place in a single menu that you could choose from, and certain actions like BfB would become traits that could be cross classed. But, from what's been said in hearsay: it looks like we will never have to play a class or job that we hate to have access to certain skills, which should be popular. Fast cast and surecast as traits would be great!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Callinon

A relatively small change that un-hamstrings the class system. Currently every physical dps job that's introduced MUST cross-class lancer because invigorate is so important. Every tank job MUST cross-class gladiator because provoke is so important. Every healer job MUST cross-class conjurer because of protect AND thaumaturge because of swiftcast. Under this system, new jobs have all their decisions made for them before they're even designed. So the design is flawed and has to be changed. That's what this does.

---

Those four examples are really the only pertinent ones though. Agreed, that functionality should be baseline, and if SE doesn't want to spend the time to include those functions uniquely within each job that they've made dependent on them in the context of any 8-man fight lasting for more than a couple minutes, then cross-class auto-acquisition is the way to go. But I don't see why anything more than ease of acquisition should be necessary. Why purposely reduce situational options?

At present there aren't even enough dps cross-class skills to fill the five additional slots with on each dps job. Do we just make jobs, via newly broadened skills, even more homogenized? And what was so wrong about having the *option* to grab something out of role. I for one actually kind of appreciated having access to Skull Sunder as a Monk from time to time. It was still up to 450 potency of enmity usable in each situation Fracture would have been; given how many tanks bail upon entering Expert roulette, never to be replaced, it's been quite handy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Leigaon

This is the thing I'm wanting to learn more about, more so than RDM. Disconnecting themselves from the cross class system and into a role based system could have a lot of potential. We can get rid of some of the bloat, like for PLD. There's no need for Rampart and Foresight. Make them into one and give the enhancements via traits and throw in Shadowskin in with it. Instead you have one move that will get traits to increase the duration / potency and cool down. Maybe a higher duration to make up for what they'll loose. So a DRK that uses Shadowskin for 20s just to tack on Foresight for another 20s..make the single move have traits that gradually increase it to 40s.

---

There's a difference between removing bloat and removing control. Yes, Foresight feels underpowered, and may therefore feel like underutilization of its slot, but having additional triggers to your defensive toolkit is not a bad thing. Else, why not take out Sentinel, Awareness, and Bulwark while we're at it, and just have a single CD called "Guard" or "hurts less for a while"?

Nor does condensing CDs have anything to do with moving from a "cross-class" system to a "role-based" system. The ONLY differences are that (a) leveling of other classes will no longer be required for core additional skills, and (b) that you may lose access to skills no longer deemed to be of your "role", reducing your overall arsenal (SE hasn't been entirely clear on whether or not this is a system of role-exclusivity or simply role-based skill acquisition, though I certainly hope the latter).

Some significance I see is that the skills being moved from Class kits to Role kits would be replaced, since all classes learn an equal amount of abilities at certain levels (mostly, excluding some Job additions like Chakra where there's multiple in 1).

So would GLD will get something in exchange for surrendering their Provoke, CNJ their Protect, THM their Swiftcast... Unless Swiftcast stays on THM - giving BLM two instant cast abilities (safe to assume a Swiftcast copy will exist as a role skill) - if that will be the case.

Featherfoot is a cross class ability, in an interview it was used as an example of one of the class skills that will be 'updated' to be more relevant a CD to MNK, so I think the role skills update plays significantly into a somewhat larger overall battle adjustment we've been hearing about.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

(SE hasn't been entirely clear on whether or not this is a system of role-exclusivity or simply role-based skill acquisition, though I certainly hope the latter).

---

TBH I think the only freedom we're going to be left with is the choice of which Role Skill(s) has the highest priority to be equipped when we don't have all 5 slots unlocked yet (Pre lvl50). Hope the new skills (if there will be any) are worth the cost. At low levels I'll miss Fracture for multiple jobs.

They could add a lot of new stuff and fix broken stuff. A lot of jobs right now take 2-3 good skills and fill the rest with the things that are "the least bad" or might have situational use. If SE puts enough good stuff in, we could have several viable options depending on the type of content, or even extend the number of slots from 5 to 7. In some cases jobs may get new innate skills that don't fit the role share well, while many would be outright removed as native skills and put in role groups.

Keep in mind that removing a few skills from everyone is also a stated goal so that the 61+ skills that are added don't bloat our hotbars more than they are now.

I think the whole class-to-job system was a vain attempt at trying to carry over the tradition from FFXI. When they intro'ed DRK, MCH, and AST as unlocked jobs, the writing was on the wall. Glad they are planning to chuck it in favor of something a little more logical and hopefully further themselves from that ancient game.

I personally hope some skill get unique animation and maybe icon for each job.

All the defensive tank skill from the paladin are too "holy" and "white" for the darknight.
In itself it won't change a damn thing.
But I like that my 20% dmg reduction has a dark theme when I play DRK and a more bright flashy theme when I play PLD

Same for every other skill. Raging Strike icon looks weird when you play BLM, you have this bowmen among all those elemental-themed icons.

Yes, it is a not very important details, but many details make a big difference in the long run. And SE pays a lot of attention to this kind of details usually.

I assume for example that Summoner will lose the Resurrection spell.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chocolys

I assume for example that Summoner will lose the Resurrection spell.

---

I don't know... Arcanist might still be kind of a strange beast.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Callinon

I don't know... Arcanist might still be kind of a strange beast.

---

Its going to take more to fix ACN's issues, like removal of classes and rebuilding SCH and SMN as jobs. Taking Res and Physick away and putting them in healer role skills just makes them an unfair, mandatory choice for SCH. Also makes it possible to gimp oneself as a SCH by not taking them.

I imagine healers will keep their own revive spells. Arcanist is tricky to predict.

Most cautious prediction:

Healer Role Skills

- Protect
- Swiftcast <equivalent>
- Cleric Stance
- ???
- ???

These I feel are 100% safe assumptions, maybe a Surecast type buff as well (better than current hopefully).

DoW Caster
- Swiftcast
- Surecast <a better/buffed Surecast>
- Raging Strikes <alternate>
- ???
- ???

Not all the Role skills will necessarily have to come from current cross-class Actions. They could be making new skills for the Role Pool, and the leftover cross-class abilities (like E4E, Virus, Stoneskin) just become Class specific. If E4E/Virus are traited for SMN, I think that will be fine. Physick that one is a annoying. Maybe they'll adjust that spell so it heals Pets for a chunky amount, that way SMN has at least some better use out of it.

it is a little alarming that no Arcanist Actions made either of those two lists. I'm skeptical on Virus though, because if that becomes a Role Skill, AST has that + Disable over WHM/SCH. E4E I'm skeptical (but less) because of SCH Deployment Tactics,

edit: A 'new' Action that may come from the Role Pool could be something like PVP's Mana Draw: An instant ~30% MP recovery. /shrug

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Callinon

A relatively small change that un-hamstrings the class system. Currently every physical dps job that's introduced MUST cross-class lancer because invigorate is so important. Every tank job MUST cross-class gladiator because provoke is so important. Every healer job MUST cross-class conjurer because of CLERIC STANCE and thaumaturge because of swiftcast. Under this system, new jobs have all their decisions made for them before they're even designed. So the design is flawed and has to be changed. That's what this does.

---

Fixed it for you. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chocolys

I assume for example that Summoner will lose the Resurrection spell.

---

If they do this, along with not releasing dnc I'd probably finally throw in the towel lol

If they're gonna ruin my main job at least release dnc so I can switch :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Iromi

If they do this, along with not releasing dnc I'd probably finally throw in the towel lol

If they're gonna ruin my main job at least release dnc so I can switch :P

---

but most casting classes are dancers

look at those sick moves WHM does when they do Stone Free- I mean Stone III

they also all do (stance) dancing

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Madrone

Its going to take more to fix ACN's issues, like removal of classes and rebuilding SCH and SMN as jobs.

---

I don't think it would be too hard.
They could make that the main evolution of arcanist is summoner. Then at lv30 you have access to a new entire job, the scholar.
By simply updating the introduction quest to the job, they could entirely remove the arcanistlv30 requirement.

It would also be nice if new player could acess machinist, astro and DKN before reaching HW too.

This is fine, it means you don't need to muck about with other roles to get your toolbox, and that similar skills across classes can become one, but you'll still have 5 (or maybe 6) role skills on your hotbar/controller, so it does nothing to address button bloat problem itself.

Since stoneskin is a healer skill, Paladin might lose it. I hope overpower and unleash are added to the pool as skill options. I also hope that paladins native provoke is replaced with either a self heal or a viable aoe.

You know, they might give the cross-class for tanks some sort of shield cooldown based off current health, just to make up for losing stoneskin. And make it viable for tanks, as opposed to a paladin's gimmick.

Maybe not even make it a cooldown, just a specific amount of MP taken away. That could get OP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ragology

Since stoneskin is a healer skill, Paladin might lose it. I hope overpower and unleash are added to the pool as skill options. I also hope that paladins native provoke is replaced with either a self heal or a viable aoe.

---

>needing OP
>needing Unleash

You have Flash, is that not good enough? That thing does a NUMBER on aggro. Besides, Overpower and Unleash would not be okay on a Paladin.

That'd mean that PLDs could DPS! And we all know that WAR is the only DPS Job classified as a tank.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tactical

>needing OP
>needing Unleash

You have Flash, is that not good enough? That thing does a NUMBER on aggro. Besides, Overpower and Unleash would not be okay on a Paladin.

That'd mean that PLDs could DPS! And we all know that WAR is the only DPS Job classified as a tank.

---

mmm I've got no qualms with the threat generated by Flash.

I think I'd be able to use the blinding effect of paladins flash more strategically If I wasn't making things immune at the start of a pull. Also I'd like to contribute more to aoe damage. Things get better at higher levels when I can tag everything with goring blade and circle of scorn, but until then I feel like I'd be contributing more if I had Overpower or Unleash in AOE situations.

People say that they should make flash into a damaging move but I like being able to flash sleeping or bound mobs without freeing them from the negative status.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tactical

You have Flash, is that not good enough? That thing does a NUMBER on aggro. Besides, Overpower and Unleash would not be okay on a Paladin.

That'd mean that PLDs could DPS! And we all know that WAR is the only DPS Job classified as a tank.

---

It isn't even the comparison to WAR that people have an issue with when it comes to DPS, its the comparison to DRK. A recent example is that I'm currently trying to clear Zurvan EX as a PLD, and the add phase is mind numbing. There are lots of adds and the objective is to AOE them down while avoiding mechanics, which is terrible for a PLD. I already have hate, and my objective is to stand around occassionally popping CoS when it is up, and flash when I feel i might need more hate (or if im truly that bored), and the only alternative is to resort to single targeting one of the large group of mobs. Compare that to DRK who gets abyssal drain, and salted earth (not including unleash which is a straight up better flash) and procs for blood price so they can keep AOEing without fear of running out of MP. So I would say no, flash is not good enough.

WAR is it's own beast, and there are plenty of other debates and grievances when it comes to the WAR meta, but DRK and PLD are in direct competition, and are supposed to fill the same spot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ragology

Since stoneskin is a healer skill, Paladin might lose it. I hope overpower and unleash are added to the pool as skill options. I also hope that paladins native provoke is replaced with either a self heal or a viable aoe.

---

I really hope PLD gets something good out of this deal because it essentially carries the majority of the tank cross class pool. While WAR might lose one or two skills (and DRK loses none), PLD has the potential to lose 3 or 4 skills (as part of the base PLD toolkit), on top of the healing skills which diversify its gameplay.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zojha

Instead of picking 5 cross-class skills, we'll now pick 5 cross-role skills in more or less the same interface.

---

Actually, I think the change will be bigger than that. Yoshi-P mentionned, as an "example", that it's useless to have severals tanks having a "-20% damage taken/1m30 CD/20s duration" skill.
So, maybe Rampart and Shadowskin will be removed from PLD and DRK skilltrees and put into the Tank skills. It opens up a new slot for PLD and DRK, but can also make Rampart available for WAR, who will need to be adjusted accordingly.
Technically, they could decide to make a universal enmity combo too, and balance the potency gap between job-restricted skills.

As a sidenote, what it could bring in the end is the total removal of classes, and thus, potentially removing the weapon restriction.
Think about it, if your job is determined by the Crystal you equip, why not allow a PLD to use a greatsword or a Ninja to use two sword with a real Dual Wield ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lambdafish

I really hope PLD gets something good out of this deal because it essentially carries the majority of the tank cross class pool. While WAR might lose one or two skills (and DRK loses none), PLD has the potential to lose 3 or 4 skills (as part of the base PLD toolkit), on top of the healing skills which diversify its gameplay.

---

I think that PLD will gain the most of it. Considering he is the "basic" tank, Tank skills will probably be taken more from him, opening severals slots for new skills.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reynhart

Actually, I think the change will be bigger than that. Yoshi-P mentionned, as an "example", that it's useless to have severals tanks having a "-20% damage taken/1m30 CD/20s duration" skill.
So, maybe Rampart and Shadowskin will be removed from PLD and DRK skilltrees and put into the Tank skills. It opens up a new slot for PLD and DRK, but can also make Rampart available for WAR, who will need to be adjusted accordingly.

---

Even where two skills are clones of each other—and I'm not saying that's okay—I'd much rather have Shadowskin on my edgy DRK job than Rampart, and would rather not have it on my Paladin, merely in terms of name and appearance. Moreover, moving it to a broad "tank" skill does nothing for customization or button-bloat. It'd still be a required choice; you'd just no longer have aesthetic fitting for your particular job, nor the ability to increase or decrease its strength in order to better shape its proportionate value against your other job skills and would remove yet another axis of balancing, in turn forcing those other job skills to be even more like one another. That is not a good kind of "simplification".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reynhart

Technically, they could decide to make a universal enmity combo too, and balance the potency gap between job-restricted skills.

---

Making a universal enmity combo does not save space. It replaces three more unique slots with 3 absolutely homogenized ones that force the remaining skills to then also be more homogenized. It tears apart each tank's previous rotational priorities, where they previously all varied immensely. I don't understand why you would think that would be, in any way, a good thing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reynhart

As a sidenote, what it could bring in the end is the total removal of classes, and thus, potentially removing the weapon restriction.
Think about it, if your job is determined by the Crystal you equip, why not allow a PLD to use a greatsword or a Ninja to use two sword with a real Dual Wield?

---

If something tends to remove, remove, remove, with seemingly no intent of adding something in its place... it usually adds nothing in its place.

And why would you want this? Why would you want a job with shield-dependent skills like Bulwark and Shelltron and "Shield" Lob and "Shield" Bash to take on a Greatsword? Do you really think SE would be willing to create new, fitting animations, let alone names or effects, for each of those modified skills, after they'd apparently just removed all variance among (near-) identical skills?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tactical

You have Flash, is that not good enough? That thing does a NUMBER on aggro. Besides, Overpower and Unleash would not be okay on a Paladin.

That'd mean that PLDs could DPS! And we all know that WAR is the only DPS Job classified as a tank.

---

There's probably a good reason Flash was never originally designed to be an AoE filler. Originally, Gladiator had physical AoEs, same as Marauder, and these remained, distinct, even after the removal of most cross-class skills in 1.18. (Flash was merely a ranged enmity nuke, cross-classable.)

Would it really be so wrong for Gladiator to take up a physical, TP-based AoE, such as Circle Slash or Brandish, whether be that be with some unique component?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ragology

mmm I've got no qualms with the threat generated by Flash.

I think I'd be able to use the blinding effect of paladins flash more strategically If I wasn't making things immune at the start of a pull. Also I'd like to contribute more to aoe damage. Things get better at higher levels when I can tag everything with goring blade and circle of scorn, but until then I feel like I'd be contributing more if I had Overpower or Unleash in AOE situations.

People say that they should make flash into a damaging move but I like being able to flash sleeping or bound mobs without freeing them from the negative status.

---

Hum... a Flash that makes things less likely to dodge your attacks (so you don't miss Rage of Halone) would be nice, but yeah, Blinding enemies tends to be way less effective. (SE why you no remove vulnerability on this ;_;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

There's probably a good reason Flash was never originally designed to be an AoE filler. Originally, Gladiator had physical AoEs, same as Marauder, and these remained, distinct, even after the removal of most cross-class skills in 1.18. (Flash was merely a ranged enmity nuke, cross-classable.)

Would it really be so wrong for Gladiator to take up a physical, TP-based AoE, such as Circle Slash or Brandish, whether be that be with some unique component?

---

In my nonexistent defense, that last part was a bit of a shitpost, but yeah, Gladiator having something worthwhile, in terms of crowd control, would be nice.

Maybe for every target Flash hits, chance for Circle of Scorn's CD reduces by 10 seconds/ends CD? Nah, sounds pretty bust. But where my Rive @ from the Axe-wielding Training Partner

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Even where two skills are clones of each other—and I'm not saying that's okay—I'd much rather have Shadowskin on my edgy DRK job than Rampart, and would rather not have it on my Paladin, merely in terms of name and appearance.

---

The name doesn't really matter in the end. As for the animation, you could have a different one depending on the job. Like doing Fracture with a Sword is different than with an Axe.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Moreover, moving it to a broad "tank" skill does nothing for customization or button-bloat. It'd still be a required choice;

---

Considering there's no real customization with the cross-class, it wouldn't worsen the situation. The most important part, for me, is that I don't think you'll have to chose the role skills. You'll just have all of them available. But keep in mind that if tank skills are always available, you can still have traits to modify them. Maybe WAR will have the basic "Rampart-like" but PLD and DRK will keep the improved version.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Making a universal enmity combo does not save space. It replaces three more unique slots with 3 absolutely homogenized ones that force the remaining skills to then also be more homogenized.

---

Stormblood will not reduce the number of skills we have at our disposal, anyway. They already said that moving skills to the role-pool will give room for more personal skills.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

It tears apart each tank's previous rotational priorities, where they previously all varied immensely.

---

Level 70 will already change our rotation, it's not a big deal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

I don't understand why you would think that would be, in any way, a good thing.

---

IIRC, I never said this was "good". For me, not designing an expanded class/job system is where the system started declining.

But eh, it worked that way from the start "Ok we have a deep but flawed system, how do we fix it ? Adressing the flaw is boring, let's make the system as bland as possible, it can't come bite us in the future, right ?"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reynhart

IIRC, I never said this was "good". For me, not designing an expanded class/job system is where the system started declining.

But eh, it worked that way from the start "Ok we have a deep but flawed, how do we fix it ? Adressing the flaw is boring, let's make the system as bland as possible, it can't come bite us in the future, right ?"

---

My apologies for mis-extrapolating there.

And yes, painfully true.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reynhart

Stormblood will not reduce the number of skills we have at our disposal, anyway. They already said that moving skills to the role-pool will give room for more personal skills.

---

My only point here is that they said either that—and my memory isn't perfect here—that our total skill-count or the general skill requirements (skill floor and ceiling) would be the same in SB as in HW. And as long as these role skills are free, rather than having to sacrifice a native skill to be taken, then that movement has absolutely no effect on button-bloat. Whether you need to level Paladin to 22 for Provoke, or get it automatically, you still have it and 4 other obligatory "cross-class"/"role-based" skills on your bar in addition to all your native skills. There is zero effect on the total skill-count by just changing that label. You still have exactly 32 skills (+ whatever net addition, if any, comes with SB).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reynhart

Level 70 will already change our rotation, it's not a big deal.

---

Better to still have some differences... Further homogenization, at this point, should be all the scarier, not just inundating to the point of apathy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

My apologies for mis-extrapolating there.

---

No hard feeling :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

My only point here is that they said either that—and my memory isn't perfect here—that our total skill-count or the general skill requirements (skill floor and ceiling) would be the same in SB as in HW.

---

When questionned about that during the Q/A session at Fanfest, I think Yoshida meant that the skills needed for our rotations will not change. It doesn't automatically means that we won't have more situationnal skills on top of that. For example, as a DRG, you have access to Foresight, Featherfoot and Mantra, or even Ring of Thorns and Doomspike...Some of those skills are still useful, but you don't need to take them into account when practicing an optimal rotation.

Woah, ok...can someone give me a yes or no? Does this mean I can stop thinking about leveling classes I don't really want to play for cross class skills? I am a new player and want to get through 3.0 asap in prep for SB, but feel pressure to go down the rabbit trail of picking up cross class skills I need; like quelling strikes lvl 34 archer :/. Can anyone confirm I can just play w/ and forget that for now?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DadFynal

Woah, ok...can someone give me a yes or no? Does this mean I can stop thinking about leveling classes I don't really want to play for cross class skills? I am a new player and want to get through 3.0 asap in prep for SB, but feel pressure to go down the rabbit trail of picking up cross class skills I need; like quelling strikes lvl 34 archer :/. Can anyone confirm I can just play w/ and forget that for now?

---

You can do whatever you want. Though it is pretty safe to say crossclasses are going bye bye.

But dabbling in some other playstyles never hurt anyone.

Only so many additional skills are very preferential Swiftcast, Awareness, Raging Strikes. While others are very optional like Stoneskin, Eye for an Eye, Quelling Strikes, Blood for Blood.

And still at the end of the day it's still your choice whether to get those or not.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DadFynal

Woah, ok...can someone give me a yes or no? Does this mean I can stop thinking about leveling classes I don't really want to play for cross class skills? I am a new player and want to get through 3.0 asap in prep for SB, but feel pressure to go down the rabbit trail of picking up cross class skills I need; like quelling strikes lvl 34 archer :/. Can anyone confirm I can just play w/ and forget that for now?

---

The answer is NO, that will be a thing in the past. you wont have to level another class.

you should be fine just continuing with 3.xx series of quests without quelling strikes, and yeah the cross class revamp is to make it to were they open up by role not by job/class. So using a very loose example atm you get quelling at 34 arc (if i remember right) but come 4.0 it will be more like "open quelling strikes at lvl 34 ranged dps" or w/e the criteria becomes. (as in if your blm hits 34 it opens up quelling strikes for the "ranged dps" category of cross class skills etc)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MPNZ

I was actually hoping that all of the CC skills would be place in a single menu that you could choose from, and certain actions like BfB would become traits that could be cross classed. But, from what's been said in hearsay: it looks like we will never have to play a class or job that we hate to have access to certain skills, which should be popular. Fast cast and surecast as traits would be great!

---

I don't think these would be good as traits... Imagine taking 20% more damage all the time for a 15% damage boost? Swiftcast always being up, so there's no cast time for anything anymore? Surecast always being up so you can't be interrupted?

I'm a bit concerned by this change and hope that customization of cross-classed skills will still be a thing. For example; with WAR I tend to cross class second wind over flash because the enmity I build as WAR is more than enough and generally don't need flash except for large mob pulls where I might start running low on TP. For PvP content, I drop provoke in favor of featherfoot. As long as we still have the same skills to choose from and can customize additional actions; I'm all for the change. But if the cross-class skills are pre-set and can't be customized; I'd hate to work within those restrictions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llus

I don't think these would be good as traits... Imagine taking 20% more damage all the time for a 15% damage boost? Swiftcast always being up, so there's no cast time for anything anymore? Surecast always being up so you can't be interrupted?

---

Well what would happen is that the skills would probably have to be rebalanced to have a smaller affect on stats, or allowing stuns and silences still affect players with sure cast.
But, it would seriously remove a lot of the clutter that is currently a problem. They have to do something or they'll just end up pushing away the crossbar users, which is already a major handicap in some the game's content right now.