Healing melds..

Hello, this thread probably already been posted before but what are good melds for healer? Is it the same for all healing or is each healing class different melds?

you just opened up a can of worms....

let me end this befor it starts... there is no worng or right way to meld a healer, Crit/Dete/SpS/Acc are all good, and it all up to you on HOW you do it. Each player has there own way for playing healer. How you do your melds/stat build it up to you. Sure there are good ways to do it for each healer..but in the end a healer is still a healer and NOT a DPS. So see what others do and plan to your own play, dont let other tell you that it worng bc there way may not be your ways of playing healer.

On that note im out be for shit hit the fan. In a nut shell there are to many build and ways to go about playing a healer to give just 1 or 2 build or answer to this so ya lol

For me it
WHM: SpS/Dete
SCH: Crit/Acc
ASL: Crit/Dete
I play each healer diff so each have diff build to a point but WHM alwas comes 1stAs it my main. AGAIN THIS IS MY WAY OF DOING IT!

I had no idea what to use on WHM so I just put Det on everything and like Pie on what I couldn't put Det on.

Melding Determination on Healers gives laughable returns and Spellspeed, while noticeable, doesn't feel practical on a MP limited class. Piety allows me to do way more sustained damage (especially AoE) and gives me more overhealing freedom. Critical Hit Rate, while unreliable, is just a fun stat to me and gives okay returns compared to the "alternatives".

Accuracy is required to DPS effectively in Savage/Extreme content.

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Originally Posted by Rennies

Melding Determination on Healers gives laughable returns and Spellspeed, while noticeable,

Accuracy is required to DPS effectively in Savage/Extreme content.

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This is my way of looking at it for WHM..

Sadly Dete has 0.325 over Crit 0.204 on WHM that = higher Mind & Higher Heals and DPS if you build Acc/Dete for DPS WHM Healer.
SpS for WHM is 0.175 sure it low but for WHM it good for Hot heals for higher and faster tiks and that where WHM shiens the most over other healers.. but if you build DPS you cant do SpS.

Thats why for my WHM im a Pure healer build Dete/SpS for higher heals and better Hots.. and i have SCH for DPS/Sheld Buffs Acc/Crit
and ASL for my Hibyred healer Crit/Dete..

Piety in my mind it useless and pointless.. bec if you know how to heal/DPS you will never run out if your team is good and know how to doge shit, Also 1-2k more Mp wont help in the long run if your useing your Mp skills and pots sooner then l8tr dont wait till your @ 20/30% mp start using them at 70/80%. Again if your new to hea it may be a good idea you boots MP till you learn how to manage your Mp.

Again there are many was to go about it... each has there own pro/cons and it up to YOU as the player to get a fell for each and build them to YOUR own way of playing.

Accuracy is the only option!

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Originally Posted by Fayo

Accuracy is the only option!

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Not after 4.0 there redoing Acc. All the Qq/Bitching over healer haveing to build Acc just to dps will be fited finely

I only meld between Critical or Accuracy. Since they still make healer accuracy so low and my role is SCH, of course my priority is accuracy first.

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Originally Posted by Lulu89

This is my way of looking at it for WHM..

Sadly Dete has 0.325 over Crit 0.204 on WHM that = higher Mind & Higher Heals and DPS if you build Acc/Dete for DPS WHM Healer.
SpS for WHM is 0.175 sure it low but for WHM it good for Hot heals for higher and faster tiks and that where WHM shiens the most over other healers.. but if you build DPS you cant do SpS.

Thats why for my WHM im a Pure healer build Dete/SpS for higher heals and better Hots.. and i have SCH for DPS/Sheld Buffs Acc/Crit
and ASL for my Hibyred healer Crit/Dete..

Piety in my mind it useless and pointless.. bec if you know how to heal/DPS you will never run out if your team is good and know how to doge shit, Also 1-2k more Mp wont help in the long run if your useing your Mp skills and pots sooner then l8tr dont wait till your @ 20/30% mp start using them at 70/80%. Again if your new to hea it may be a good idea you boots MP till you learn how to manage your Mp.

Again there are many was to go about it... each has there own pro/cons and it up to YOU as the player to get a fell for each and build them to YOUR own way of playing.

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Those weights are out dated.

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Originally Posted by Lulu89

Not after 4.0 there redoing Acc. All the Qq/Bitching over healer haveing to build Acc just to dps will be fited finely

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Quite honestly that's the way it should be. Cleric Stance should give an accuracy bonus.

No one like capping accuracy, it's a lazy stat.

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Originally Posted by BiggieSmallz

Hello, this thread probably already been posted before but what are good melds for healer? Is it the same for all healing or is each healing class different melds?

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Personally, I use DET/SS as a WHM that main heals.
DET/CRIT or on AST that main heals. (Due to AST's versatility, I found CRIT/SS is also nice. I am personally loath to meld DET/SS on AST simply because of how a proc Benefic II now functions.)
ACC/CRIT on SCH and DPS healers, regardless of class.

I don't meld PIE as I've never had MP management issues. Nor do I ask for a BRD or MCH to drop their DPS from giving me the refresh status unless I've died (and even then.. I'm probably going to see how long until I can hold out until my own refresh skills are up).

However, this is only OK until we see what 4.0's revised combat system will bring us.

Check this Reddit thread for tested information on WHM and AST stats: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/54f2hu/whm_and_diurnal_ast_healing_formulas_and_more

Crit is the most powerful boost for your direct casts as well as your HoTs and DoTs, so that should always be prioritised over SpS and Det. SpS and Det give about equal boosts, but for reasons explained in that thread, SpS goes ahead Det in longer fights. But both SpS and Det are worth much less than crit.

Because SCH also values crit over all other secondary stats, the priorities are currently same for all healer jobs.

If you're planning to raid, you should also aim for capped accuracy (currently 592 I think) and enough Pie (MP) to be comfortable.

I main WHM and play SCH also. I agree with Taika up here. For me after playing with melds for a bit i prefer CRIT above all. Then depending on what you can put on that piece i like sps det. Piety is useful but only really If you have to keep raising ppl, otherwise in a regular/good Group you should be able to maintain MP with shroud and assize on CD with no problem even dpsing.

Accuracy is needed if you do savage, but things might change in the future as ppl say.

Hope this helps :)

This is the way i do it all wrong , but meh.
First off , I only fit gear with the highest crit available, irrespective of the rest of the stats.
Then I fit det /sp as allowed .

Mumble ,mumble, complain about me not dps again , mumble ........

We are talking about HEALING. No DPS builds. Do not meld accuracy, I think is a waste on healers. Determiantion is the higest weight stat in all healer classes. Critical for shields (SCHand AST) are good. Spell Speed is not really worth and Piety... well. You need too mcuh to make it worth.

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Originally Posted by Xlantaa

We are talking about HEALING. No DPS builds. Do not meld accuracy, I think is a waste on healers. Determiantion is the higest weight stat in all healer classes. Critical for shields (SCHand AST) are good. Spell Speed is not really worth and Piety... well. You need too mcuh to make it worth.

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Okay, sure. You think Accuracy is a waste on a healer in Savage/Extreme, but math proves its the stat with the highest contribution to a healer's overall performance.

By the way, although it has been mentioned before, the Det weights you're looking at are wrong. Critical is going to offer much more than Det, and it probably doesn't even need the Potency half of its scaling to remain superior.

I am no pro healer. But as far i can tell when you min maxing certain stat you're sacrificing other stat.

For example, most crit healer gear sacrifice its pie. So a really high crit stat could result minimal MP pool. Which everyone has their own comfort zone when balancing. But I heard you should at least have 13k for some classes.

You don't need Piety or Acc to be a good healer so there both useless.. there is NO rule in the book that said a heal HAS TO DPS at any time, if your DPS is low in raid, then your DPS need to get there shit together and do there ONLY JOB and DPS.

And as for Piety I have 14k MP @ iLv258 and don't have any problems solo healing Sav, did A9S, A10S and A11S np after we had it down.. as a whm. and i never DPS...again there not needed to be a good healer. At the same time if you want tro be a DPS raid healers go for it.. more power to you.. if not it uesless.

If SE wanted Healers to be DPS'ing like other in raid they give us more Acc form the start AND make it so we don't have to heal so much. Also were the healer SSS Dummy? oo that right there is not one... Again bec it not our job to DPS ^^/goodbye

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Originally Posted by Lulu89

You don't need Piety or Acc to be a good healer so there both useless.. there is NO rule in the book that said a heal HAS TO DPS at any time, if your DPS is low in raid, then your DPS need to get there shit together and do there ONLY JOB and DPS.

And as for Piety I have 14k MP @ iLv258 and don't have any problems solo healing Sav, did A9S, A10S and A11S np after we had it down.. as a whm. and i never DPS...again there not needed to be a good healer. So take this eilit bs about healers needing Acc so were ells.

If SE wanted Healers to be DPS'ing like other in raid they give us more Acc form the start AND make it so we don't have to heal so much. Also were the healer SSS Dummy? oo that right there is not one... Again bec it not our job to DPS ^^/goodbye

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Healers are in the best situation for Accuracy. We can meld our heart out to cap then stop melding. No excess. No shortage. Dps often can't upgrade to new pieces because it would require them to fall below the accuracy requirements.

Main Healers don't need the extra piety or to touch accuracy, so long as their cohealer meets the requirements if they don't want to dps. The main healer should be practically solo healing since every GCD and OGCD they have should be used to heal, mitigate and precast heals. This should leave the off healer DPSing 90% of the fight and be dealing significant DPS, somewhat near your off tank.

In our static, I contribute about 40% of the outgoing heals, while our WHM does the other 60%. In A9s I do about 1400 dps and she does 700. This drastically increases our raid performance and we are able to skip the add phase after double scrap line and just burn.

There also are healer SSS dps dummies. They require more damage than the tank versions. They are a fun challenge. :]

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

In our static, I contribute about 40% of the outgoing heals, while our WHM does the other 60%. In A9s I do about 1400 dps and she does 700. This drastically increases our raid performance and we are able to skip the add phase after double scrap line and just burn. :]

There also are healer SSS dps dummies. They require more damage than the tank versions.

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Shhh. I've been on the Healer forums the last few days. Turns out, lots of Healer's would prefer to do the Manderville between heals than to help DPS. You'll anger them.

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Originally Posted by Lulu89

You don't need Piety or Acc to be a good healer so there both useless.. there is NO rule in the book that said a heal HAS TO DPS at any time, if your DPS is low in raid, then your DPS need to get there shit together and do there ONLY JOB and DPS.

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Originally Posted by Lulu89

you just opened up a can of worms....

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/10characters

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

Healers are in the best situation for Accuracy. We can meld our heart out to cap then stop melding. No excess. No shortage. Dps often can't upgrade to new pieces because it would require them to fall below the accuracy requirements.

Main Healers don't need the extra piety or to touch accuracy, so long as their cohealer meets the requirements if they don't want to dps. The main healer should be practically solo healing since every GCD and OGCD they have should be used to heal, mitigate and precast heals. This should leave the off healer DPSing 90% of the fight and be dealing significant DPS, somewhat near your off tank. :]

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and that how i see it, i do 95-99% of the healing on WHM, only time i DPS is if my aoe hits the boss..The only healer is the OH that can be DPSing if they want to, but not all healers can Solo heal a raid, so int ill you know for sure the Main healer is fine without your heals Acc is a NO GO!

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Originally Posted by Lulu89

You don't need Piety or Acc to be a good healer so there both useless..

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I beg to differ about piety, it's no more "useless" then DET or acc on a non sch, keep in mind the more mp you have the more you regen when you use shroud/aether, and the longer you last during intense healing moments, and when you do dps you have mp to spare, it is far from useless. but since you said you never dps that is why you don't run into healing issue, because you are not expending additional MP for DPS, which means even having 12k mp, you likely won't have mp issues.

as for choice there really is no right or wrong answer i tend to like SS the most and then PIE and det as a left over, since my mains are WHM and AST acc is pretty useless to me.

The problem with pushing for accuracy on cleric stance and not melding is that energy drain can miss. I use it outside of cleric stance to recover mp..

What i have on my WHM for melds (Main healer in raids):

Left Side: Acc > Pie
Right Side: Vit > Acc (Cant meld pie on right side because of vitality melds)
And when i have enough acc and pie is capped on a piece i meld crit in every slot left. Not a huge fan of det and ss. Det is usually just a very minor buff and spellspeeds full potential can only be reached when chaincasting like a blackmage, but a healer obviously doesnt chaincast and 1-2 extra regen ticks over a span of a minute is never required.

If raiding in Savage and will contribute DPS: Accuracy to cap

If Scholar: CRT wherever possible, Spell Speed after that

If WHM/AST: I would recommend SpS>CRT

I would not recommend DET.

Explanations:
Accuracy: Healers get no accuracy on equipment, if you are DPSing in savage, you'll waste a lot of MP
Critical Hit: Scholars get a bonus of a double-shield on Adloquium that crit's. Spell Speed does not affect your pet, so Crit bumps up to more powerful for your pets heals as well.
Spell Speed: This is both the best stat for upping your heals and upping your DPS as a caster (only reason SMN favours DET is because the attacks by your pet count as auto attacks and SPS doesn't help them, otherwise SPS > CRT > DET for all casters DPS)
Determination: This has very little benefit to casters, especially healers. It will more predictably up your heals than a CRT, but the difference is something like... with +200 DET you will have a 50% chance to do 1.5% more healing power, and with +200 CRT you will have a 4.5% chance to do ~55% more healing power.
Piety: This is great for progressing through content, but most healers have a lot of Piety on gear and have lots of skills to get back their MP. However, a "sweet spot" sort-to-speak is at 16k MP, where MP regened per tick = MP cost per cure/phsyick.

Sources: Various testing through 3.x, discussions on /r/reddit with other healers testing, discussions on sub-forum healers with other healers testing, and with a discussion with Dervy

PS: My fairly rough stat weights (IIRC) are:
Scholar
WD: between 6 and 9
MND: 1
CRT: 0.3
SPS: 0.25
DET: 0.08

WHM/AST
WD: between 6 and 9
MND: 1
CRT: 0.25
SPS: 0.3
DET: 0.08

As people have mentioned, it depends on what healer you are.

Generally, the healer melds are looked at subjectively because of their minimal impact. If you dps at all, meld ACC to cap (atm that is at 593) which will require basically all 100% slots unless you use crafted pieces. If not, then you can choose from Crit, PIE, SpS, and Det. Personally, I have PIE till comfortable > Crit > Det > SpS.

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Originally Posted by raela

The problem with pushing for accuracy on cleric stance and not melding is that energy drain can miss. I use it outside of cleric stance to recover mp..

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This is why I suggest a scholar always meet ACC, even if they don't DPS. It royally stinks to have Energy Drain miss when you really need it. Remember, bad parties, newbies, etc., do happen. With 4.0's combat and skill revision, I secretly hope they change that for Energy Drain.

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Originally Posted by JunseiKei

This is why I suggest a scholar always meet ACC, even if they don't DPS. It royally stinks to have Energy Drain miss when you really need it. Remember, bad parties, newbies, etc., do happen. With 4.0's combat and skill revision, I secretly hope they change that for Energy Drain.

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I feel like any issue with Energy Drain is going to stay around as long as it is still tied with SMN, unfortunately. While I would love to have it miss less on my SCH when I need it, any buff to it would buff it for SMN unless it was a Job-only trait, which we have no idea if that is possible or not.

I'm a main WHM, so for my main healing equips I meld Piety and SPS - piety directly raises my MP management tools since Assize is % based, and SpS makes for good regen ticks and fast healing for when I have to deal with Cintamani-like raid damage alone. Also, with a big MP pull and some spell speed, you'll be the a machine Holy bomber in roulettes.

Or just meld acc in everything.

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

Main Healers don't need the extra piety

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I don't know how good your group is, but oh boy do I need that extra Piety to get some more Raises going... Piety is probably the best stat for healers in progression parties.

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Originally Posted by Fevelle

I don't know how good your group is, but oh boy do I need that extra Piety to get some more Raises going... Piety is probably the best stat for healers in progression parties.

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We share healing allot in our group, I was just expressing that if you ONLY heal and do NOTHING else, MP requirements are lower. If our WHM is not healing, she's DPSing and I'm covering with Aetherflow stacks/Fairy management to keep her DPSing longer. One Stone III is worth more to DPS than my Energy Drain. This requires a large MP pool to sustain. I value Piety very highly on WHM, behind only Accuracy. So yes I very much agree with you!

I was only referring to healers that do not want to DPS in their groups, by instead focusing on solo healing. It is overall a significant raid wide DPS loss, but its security and increased damage from your off healer.

Also, with raises,my whm knows to let them lay for a moment.
As the off healer, if my swiftcast is up, I'll raise them. If my WHMs mana is low, I'll hardcast the raise so she doesn't burden her MP.

Dervy has posted updated 3.4 stat weights. They include healer DPS stat weights for WHM and SCH now, and his conclusion is "If you’re going to be hybrid healing/shielding, I’d recommend prioritising Crit over any of the other secondaries (with the exception of accuracy)". Source is here: https://dervyxiv.wordpress.com/stat-weights

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Originally Posted by Fevelle

I don't know how good your group is, but oh boy do I need that extra Piety to get some more Raises going... Piety is probably the best stat for healers in progression parties.

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Better yet, for real raid progression is to have you, and your DPS meld those VIT Vs on the right side. It's all about playing the more HP = more room for mistakes. Which also means less raises.

When you survive with just a few hundred or less HP to something you should have died to, you already made out like a bandit with that meld cost.

I would meld on my gear, but what's the point in burning so many resources on a gear set that will be outdated in 6 weeks.
I just keep it Vanilla and turn my Materia into gil. :) :)

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Originally Posted by Taika

Dervy has posted updated 3.4 stat weights. They include healer DPS stat weights for WHM and SCH now, and his conclusion is "If you’re going to be hybrid healing/shielding, I’d recommend prioritising Crit over any of the other secondaries (with the exception of accuracy)". Source is here: https://dervyxiv.wordpress.com/stat-weights

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Originally Posted by iDervy;

White Mage DPS ONLY:

WD: 9.128
INT: 1.000
DET: 0.159
CRT: 0.182
SS: 0.135
Acc: Cap it
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Scholar DPS ONLY:

WD: 9.128
INT: 1.000
DET: 0.190
CRT: 0.266
SS: 0.316 – 0.366
Acc: Cap it

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That Scholar Spell speed weight though! Its pretty incredible how high secondaries are worth, compared to DPS classes on Scholar. More proof that SS is a better option than Det for SCH. I wonder if Dervy tested this WHILE spamming embrace, since proccing the enhanced pet action trait would directly affect Crit and Spell Speed.

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Originally Posted by Lulu89

Not after 4.0 there redoing Acc. All the Qq/Bitching over healer haveing to build Acc just to dps will be fited finely

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Thank god. I refused to meld acc on my healers because ishouldnt have to, even though i Dps as much as i can in dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

That Scholar Spell speed weight though! Its pretty incredible how high secondaries are worth, compared to DPS classes on Scholar. More proof that SS is a better option than Det for SCH. I wonder if Dervy tested this WHILE spamming embrace, since proccing the enhanced pet action trait would directly affect Crit and Spell Speed.

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I will just quote what he posted.

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Originally Posted by Dervy

Healer Weights are calculated PURELY for full time DPS. For science only; take these weights with a grain of salt. These weights do not take into account Mana consumption, or ANY form of healing/shielding. If you’re going to be hybrid healing/shielding, I’d recommend prioritising Crit over any of the other secondaries (with the exception of accuracy).

[...]

The reason why the Scholars SS weighting is high, is that roughly 51% of its overall DPS is coming from DoTs. So not only is SS buffing your DPS exponentially due to how it affects your GCD/Casts, but its value is being amplified by also increasing directly affecting 50% of your total PPS via DoTs.

Also, the weighting scholar DPS varies a lot depending on the rotation you use for some reason. It could be an error with my model somewhere handling clipped dots though. Letting your DoTs completely drop, rather than clipping them, boosts the SS weight by 0.5. This is something I’ll be looking into and trying to figure out and does look like it to be a DPS gain, over clipping them.

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These weights only take into account DPS. Dervy has said in the past that Crit may not be as useful for some healers because of the inconsistent nature of Crit for healing and overhealing. I think it is important to not take what Dervy posted out of context, but I am pretty sure that is going to happen anyway.

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Originally Posted by lulunami

These weights only take into account DPS. Dervy has said in the past that Crit may not be as useful for some healers because of the inconsistent nature of Crit for healing and overhealing.

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Read again. He specifically says "If you’re going to be hybrid healing/shielding, I’d recommend prioritising Crit over any of the other secondaries (with the exception of accuracy)." In other words, despite pure DPS weights showing for example SpS having higher weight than Crit for SCH, he still recommends prioritising Crit if the healer not only does DPS but also heals and shields. And this recommendation does not only apply to SCH.

The crap dervy posted can really burn in hell. If I want to only DPS, I play a DPS class and that's the end of it. I like to DPS when the group allows it no matter the content but what ultimately makes you a good healer is not having the perfect stats.

If you can't assess situations, don't have the ability to know when to precast or generally don't care about keeping your party alive - you have the wrong profession.

I main whm and while I play other healers for fun, I don't touch them for raids/extremes. Especially because of the high mana consumption and enbding up solo healing more often than not, I always make sure to meld Piety where I can. Having 100 points more healing doesn't help me if I don't have the mana to cast it.

My meld strategy would me: PIE>SS>CRIT>DET

I don't care about ACC since any DPS I put in is an extra and will not be counted as my main priority.

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Originally Posted by Chessala

The crap dervy posted can really burn in hell.

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It's unbelievable how some healers on these forums react to someone actually posting tested facts. :D It's like they have their own personal healer stat religion and pointing out how earth just doesn't seem all that flat goes right to their feelings. And this seems to apply only to healers - I can't even imagine a DD crying and screaming against someone posting this kind of data to them.

Yes, these stat weights posted by Dervy are tested for DPS, which is clearly announced in the post. This testing done by Av En has been done on healing: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/54f2hu/whm_and_diurnal_ast_healing_formulas_and_more.

They both recommend crit as the main secondary stat (after acc) for all healers. You are free to personally choose differently, of course, but these are the recommendations based on extensive testing and published data and analysis.