The question of whether or not each job should have their own weekly allocation of tomestone caps has been brought up before and previously answered by the devs. Why not raise the weekly cap to 750? It's not a large increase, but enough to buy a 495 piece in one week instead of two and still keeps body and leg items from being bought in one week.
With the amount of options for obtaining currencies increasing, it just feels like you cap tomestones faster and end up logging out until the next reset or until it's time to attend an fc or ls event. Raising the weekly limit would keep content prolonged while allowing players to fully utilize the Armoury System to play more than one job on a single character without having to create alt characters or feel confined to 1-2 jobs when the amount of jobs increases in future expansions. Think this is an acceptable compromise?
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05-06-2016, 04:27 AMAntaniasProposal for Weekly Currency Limits Ahead of New Job Releases
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05-06-2016, 05:45 AMJpec07
The only difficulty I have with this idea is my compulsion to cap every week. 450 is a nice amount, because if I do nothing but my Expert Roulette, I can get it knocked out in six days. If I add my trial roulette and beast tribe tomestones, as well as Gordias runs and Void Ark, that number gets even shorter, to where I could easily knock it out in four days with decent play participation (but capping only requires 20-30 minutes a day, if even that). If the cap were raised to 750, they'd either need to raise the reward from Ex roulette, or they'd need to make some other means by which players could easily earn tomestones.
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05-06-2016, 06:01 AMADVSS
Well before the expansion poetics was raised to like 900 a week with no increase in the rewards per day, and I dont think i ever capped that mark weekly once, came close a few times, seems that to me an amount in that area with no changes to bonus would probably alleviate some of the stress people are having with either capping too soon or want to get at least a big piece or at least just one piece a week, especially with the addition of new jobs and things like the mentor system, i can see a need to at least double the rewards at some point,
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05-06-2016, 06:03 AMKaurieIt was? Do you have a link for the dev response? This is something I've been advocating for some time, but never seen any sort of official response. Thanks =)Quote:
Originally Posted by Antanias
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05-06-2016, 06:31 AMMugenMugetsu
I think a cap of 750 would be far better than what we have now. However, I'm against caps on tomestones. I don't think it serves any other purpose than to gate content and I honestly feel that the cap is imposed on us due to fear of losing subscribers and to give us incentive to continue to remain subbed due to being unable to achieve the goals we wish to achieve. In fact I'm 100% positive that it's part of the business model. Rather than rely on the fact that the game has enough fun content to keep people interested in playing, SE would have us be limited in how much we can accomplish in a limited time frame so that we'll keep playing so we can finally get the number of tomestones necessary to acquire the gear that we want for any jobs that we're interested in playing.
I understand the reasoning behind this. I understand that other MMOs do the same thing. I just don't agree with it. I don't feel that we should have to invest almost all of the Lore tomes that we are able to acquire in a 2 week period on one piece of gear that can only go to one job, for example. This tome cap doesn't make sense with an Armoury System designed to allow players to play as multiple jobs on one character. It takes away the player's freedom to enjoy all of the jobs that they wish to enjoy for no other reason that to attempt to keep us motivated to play the game.
I sincerely feel that the cap on tomes needs to be looked at and either raised, or removed. It doesn't serve a purpose that benefits the enjoyment of the playerbase as this is exemplified by the countless number of posts on these forums by players indicating that they feel that grinding tomes to cap is a "chore" and isn't "fun" and some would prefer to log in for 30 minutes run DR EX, log off, and go do other things. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that the tome cap is hindering player enjoyment rather than adding to it.
Also, I've seen very many posts that indicate that people really don't feel a sense of reward, or accomplishment, when they acquire a new piece of tome gear due to the fact that approximately 98% of the content that rewards Lore is faceroll content. I hope that one day we see a change to the current system, or if nothing else, and I say again, an increase in the tome cap from day 1 of a new tomes release, or the abolishment of the tome cap period. -
05-06-2016, 06:52 AMVictoria_Silverdawn
They already increased the weekly cap... when 2.0 was released it was 300... so it took 3 weeks to get a body or pants part... but 2 to get the rest... That was a worse grind because we didnt have the roulettes at that time... They shouldnt increase it because that would mean ppl get everything week one... and no point in the raids... which is what they dont want to happen...
The tome gear is basically to help people get ready for raids... and for casual players to upgrade their gear for content...
And feeling confined to 1 to 2 jobs... well its not as likely that you will be using all 13 plus jobs at once, you will have your main one. then maybe an alternate job or two that you would use the most. and since all the armor after the initial AF sets are shared armors... so it would only help for those sets... but thats my opinion
A thread like this appears all the time... each job will have its own set at the begining of each expansion... but because of glamours and our lack of space no one can have all the sets... and use them after the first few expansions... -
05-06-2016, 06:54 AMADVSS
has anyone ever mathed out how many tomes it would take to get every piece of lore available including weapons? then divide that by 450.... youll probably see why the amount currently is insane 13000 for all weapons, 11900 for pants and body , 10290 for smaller left side pieces and 15750 for belt and accessories(2 rings each) 50940 tomes thats roughly....1132 weeks to get every piece of lore available itd be 7.0 by the time wed have aquired all of the gear at this current rate...that sounds a little bit in the high range even for keeping subs, and considering every 2 major patches the gear gets scrapped for more powerful gear its a highly unrealistic amount to achieve in an inflated time limit that will never get met by the time its obsolete
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05-06-2016, 06:56 AMPence
If they remove the tome cap, then they will have to balance raids around players having full i230 set (or there about), with no access to further gear unless actually clearing the raids. Players would also be expected to have full i230 before entering a raid.
Having tomes on a weekly cap slowly alleviates stress in raids over time by increasing a players perimeters, making them easier without actually nerfing the content.
As it is now, it benefits both non-raiders by continually giving non-raiders gear progression over the length of a tier (if you remove tomes, you essentially end gear progression for non-raiders in the first week of a tier) and gives raiders a slight buff to help with their raid progression. If you put progression in between tomes and raids? Then it'll have to be capped again. Then you'll have people coming to ask for that cap to be removed and so on and so on. A line needs to be drawn. -
05-06-2016, 07:05 AMEidolon
We've been slowly getting the devs to give us more and more uncapped tomestones, tbh. <_<; I mean it was originally, what, 300? And they've kinda raised it, and also decreased the cost of certain items in relation to their weights. I feel like we're at a good place if we're gonna HAVe to have a limit.
Really, the point is - it doesn't matter how big the limit is, so long as there is a limit, it's always gonna be annoying. -
05-06-2016, 07:11 AMWhocareswhatmynameisYou do realize that you can still play the game w/o having every piece of lore gear right? K, just checking.Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVSS
The solution is to wait till the next tomes come out then you can have all the lore gear you want. Tomestone gear is beyond easy to get, so they limit it. I don't see an issue with it personally. People should prob just be happy u can get within 10 ilvls of max w/o having to do anything challenging. -
05-06-2016, 07:12 AMAltanas
They could have different caps for Disciples of War and Disciples of Magic,
Or to be really generous, different caps for Tanks, DPS, Healers -
05-06-2016, 07:24 AMAshkendorYou do realize that when the new tome and raid gear are rolled out, Esoterics will go away and Lore will be uncapped, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVSS
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05-06-2016, 08:14 AMAlipoprocksThat's fine for a person that only ever wants to raid with one job. Or someone who never raids.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whocareswhatmynameis
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05-06-2016, 08:16 AMAlipoprocksI think you missed his point. He's enumerating how many tomes it would take for someone to get every piece of gear and why the caps are unreasonable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashkendor
If you only ever play pld and don't care to play anything else, then I guess the caps are just right. -
05-06-2016, 08:18 AMAshkendorHis point isn't much of one when those tomes get exponentially easier to get once they're unlocked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alipoprocks
Plus, the gear's also typically made much cheaper. Currency doesn't stay capped forever.
http://puu.sh/oHGEh/3d395086a8.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Alipoprocks
Lol, ok. -
05-06-2016, 08:18 AMElky
So I have to do the same two dungeons even more? I hate capping already, that much might put me on suicide watch.
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05-06-2016, 08:19 AMWhocareswhatmynameisSo few people raid that Yoshida is looking for ways to build a cross server raid finder. So people can actually form a team of EIGHT..... nice counterargument though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alipoprocks
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05-06-2016, 08:19 AMElkyHis point, difficult person, is that when the NEW tomes are released, that the cap is LARGER. He is not talking strictly about lore tomes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashkendor
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05-06-2016, 08:22 AMbass9020Whats wrong with using crafted gear or Alex face roll gear? Theres other options out there, granted they may not be the best but its something.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alipoprocks
Id love for other options that weren't tome related. In another game I am currently playing you can get gear in so many different ways and its all up to the player. Craft the gear, buy the gear using a minigame, farm world bosses for loot bundles, daily boss scrolls, buy from the AH. Instead of just resorting to upping the tome cap they should work on more exciting ways to get gear. -
05-06-2016, 08:25 AMAshkendorAll he does is talk about Lore and throw a bunch of irrelevant numbers around. o.OQuote:
Originally Posted by Elky
Where does he even say anything about new tomes? -
05-06-2016, 08:26 AMAlipoprocksBut by the time the cap is removed, new tiered gear is out. Like, who is buying eso gear now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashkendor
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05-06-2016, 08:29 AMAshkendorPeople that want to gear alts faster than they can gear them with Prototype Midan. Newer players as well. I've still got several classes using Esoterics and Void Ark gear. I'd upgrade the rest but my Esoterics is currently going toward my 5th relic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alipoprocks
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05-06-2016, 08:33 AMBrill_
As far as gearing up multiple jobs, I am ok with where they are right now. Tome gear for my primary job. Alexander normal for my secondary job. Soon I'll get void ark gear for my 3rd.
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05-06-2016, 08:36 AMAlipoprocksI would like to see them all at 230 plz, k?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashkendor
And alt = alternate character, btw, not other jobs. ;p -
05-06-2016, 08:41 AMAntaniasI can't remember if I saw this covered in a translated interview or a live letter after searching my hardest for the source, but it was brought up someplace.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaurie
My assumption is that with each expansion that accomodates a level cap increase, we'll get a roulette for each set of capped dungeons (ie. 4.0 comes out, level 60 roulette gets made). I had previously suggested that DR: Expert contain the two latest patches of dungeons, to no avail though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elky
Which will get replaced by Weeping City of Mhach gear (betting that gear is i230) on a weekly limit. I was initially going to suggest that we could roll on two items per week, but left it alone due to crafted armor/accessories and with the suggestion in mind ^^Quote:
Originally Posted by Brill_
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05-06-2016, 08:43 AMAlipoprocksYes, this cycle we get to use crafted gear! I think it has been about a year since we last got to use crafted gear.Quote:
Originally Posted by bass9020
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05-06-2016, 08:53 AMADVSSvery aware of this because at that time youll be farming tomes of...whatever they call it for that sort of set amount of time, which sort of makes the original time gate a little unnecessary in my opinion, it doesnt have to be infinite tomes, double still wouldnt scratch the surface of having all sets by the time new stuff gets phased out which is my point. We can debate about the raids if thats really a concern but getting 1 piece a week is better than waiting 2 weeks for a single piece, whose upgrades are locked in raids initially anyway, and even as stated them being tuned so that the difficulty is alleviated by aquiring more tome gear, well does 1 piece really make the raid easier if its not the weapon on initial launch?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashkendor
Furthermore, that weekly gate never stopped world first from getting crafted gear week 1 to "beat" the weekly gate from launch so i really dont see why 1 piece a week is hurting anyone of us or a raids purity. also we all know that you only have 1 full set of lore spread out from those jobs, your i levels being as high as they are came from outside of lore alone, or upgrades from midas, we all know this. Without this your i levels would be about 20 lower each job -
05-06-2016, 12:27 PMAshkendorI don't care about having them at 230, though. I care about having them geared effectively for what I use them for. I don't see a reason to get Lore just for the item level when they're perfectly playable in a mix of Lore, Midan, Prototype Midan, and crafted gear. i220+ is more than playable in any other content in the game. In some cases, melded i220 crafted is actually better than the Lore gear, so I don't understand people's need to have a full set of Lore gear for everything. Glamour, I guess?Quote:
Originally Posted by Alipoprocks
Let's not nitpick here. Alt = alternate = not my main. Whether you want to call it an alt job, an off job, a secondary job, it's all the same. It's not what I'm in a static with, so it's not what I'm primarily working on. I do also have an alt character. *shrug*Quote:
And alt = alternate character, btw, not other jobs. ;p
That was exactly my point. Another poster basically insinuated that I only play Paladin and that's why I'm fine with the Lore caps, but that's not the case at all. I raid on Paladin so that job is my priority, but I play Scholar, Warrior, Monk, and Bard in much of the game's other content with a fair amount of regularity. Between i220 crafted (which in some cases is actually better than the i230 Lore), Midan (lucky greed rolls ftw), Prototype Midan (super easy to get, some pieces are great gap fillers), and Lore gear, the first 3 are more than playable in any content in the game. That includes Savage, though I only raid on Paladin. I'm to the point where I've started spending Lore on Scholar now. I've cleared Sephirot EX as PLD, SCH, and MNK so far.Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVSS
It's silly to me how people are hellbent on getting Lore pieces that are absolutely awful for their class just to have the item level boost. The tank pants are a prime example - 106 parry is utter shit and I'd sooner use the Prototype pants to avoid losing a huge chunk of secondary stats that way. Yet I see people running around with Tier V materia melded on to them all the time. The gauntlets are just as bad. Both Prototype and Lore have Parry/Acc so I'm using pentamelded i220 crafted. The healing body is also a good example - a pentamelded i220 beats the pants off slapping all that piety/det on a SCH. It seems like a lot of people are just more concerned with item level than anything. Or maybe they just want to glamour all of the primal sets, who knows.
The fact of the matter is, SE wants us to get the (insert current tome here) gear at a certain pace to start with, so they have a weekly cap on the currency. This does two things: keeps people playing their game, and keeps progress at what they feel is a manageable speed. That cap has remained static since Mythology was raised from 300 to 450, so it seems like they're happy with it. Basically, we can sit and talk up one side and down the other until all of us are blue in the face but ultimately the reason we can't get tome gear faster is because the Powers That Be don't want us to, and that doesn't show any sign of changing. -
05-06-2016, 06:53 PMrandysquirrelWho raids as EVERY job though? and in lore tome gear? many of the crafted items were vastly superior to the lore gear, so why are you talking about needed every single lore piece? Plus the fact that if you are raiding, you'll be getting gear from that, so you won't need all the lore pieces anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alipoprocks
An important part of the cap design is you have to plan out which pieces to get, and when. -
05-06-2016, 07:05 PMReinhaYou are not supposed to gear up all jobs with the highest tome gear within one major patch. There are two reasons.Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVSS
1) One patch is about 14 weeks long. If you were able to gear up everything with tomes, that would be 1 job per week. What are those people, who only play 1-2 jobs and don't raid, supposed to do for the rest of the patch? And there would also be no gradual nerf to savage through gear increase, because it would have to be balanced with full 230 in mind from the start.
2) There are other sources of gear you are meant to utilize. If the latest tomestone gear was so easy to get then crafted gear, Void Ark gear, Midan gear esoteric gear would be useless even for alts. -
05-06-2016, 08:35 PMElkyBecause those are the current ones that are relevant. He didn't say it bu it was implied.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashkendor