Scholar newb halp!

So im no healing expert and only got scholar cus arcanist is a 2 for 1 deal. So my question is whats the deal with the bonus attribute stats? Ive been buying stacks of keepers hymn to switch between intelligence and mind whenever i needed to change jobs but is that ok? Is it ok to have all 35 points in Intel and be a SCH and just use cleric stance?

Personally, I got tired of all the swapping stats so I just put my points into VIT. Keep in mind, though, that cleric stance swaps your int and mind. So, if you put 35 points in int then use cleric stance those 35 points will be in mind and not contributing to DPS. Otherwise, if you want to keep your points in int for smn and mind for sch, you will have to carry around keepers hymn for when you switch.

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Originally Posted by Metalex742

Is it ok to have all 35 points in Intel and be a SCH and just use cleric stance?

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It is *possible* to heal that way, but I don't recommend it, especially not for scholars since your pet's healing is based on your stats.

...It will also almost certainly make your party salty and fling insults in your general direction. :rolleyes:

Cleric Stance is designed to penaltize healing and buff offensive magic use, which means that a Intelligence build suffers from both lesser healing AND lesser dps.

It becomes really noticable at the post 40 dungeons where healing starts to actually matter and you can't just let your pet carry you.

A good Scholar can dps pretty well with his DoTs by switching into and out of Cleric Stance while Galvanize is up, using the pet to carry the healing while DoT-nuking a single target and spreading said DoTs using Bane.

As a pure Scholar, you're much better of with a full Mind build, as on top of having full benefits from healing, you'll actually eclipse a Summoner (sans pet) in pure dps due to how Cleric Stance's inherent 10% buff works.

So keep using those Hymns, they're worth the seals.

Bonus attributes in INT on SCH and then cleric stance atually does nothing for SCH. Like literally zero. Wasted stats. Cleric stance turns your MND into INT when used, if you put points into INT then use clerics, its contributing to your MND stat when dps'ing, not INT.

Also, dont put them in VIT. I have never ever understood people who think this is a valid option on SCH.

If you run as SCH, its all into MND.

If you run as SMN, its all in INT.

There are no other options. There is no middle ground.

OP what you are doing is correct. When you switch between SMN and SCH use those keepers hymns and switch the bonus attribute points to the relevant stat.

Edit: some clarification on cleric stance. It doesnt just flat out swap MND and INT. It swaps MND and INT, lowers healing potency by 20% and increases damage potency by 10%, so if you stat into INT and use clerics, your heals are nerfed bad. Like seriously bad.

This is why I'm glad I do homework, and from the sounds of things in this thread, I did things right. Of course anyone can correct me.

You reach clerics full potential by packing mnd. So the higher this number is, the higher your int stat will be when you CS, plus you get the 10% bonus to offensive spells. This includes your b&b spell, energy drain. Splitting up your attributes in any way will hurt this.

Vit is worthless for acn/sch. As acn, topaz should be taking all the damage while you solo. As sch, even if you have not unlocked your feisty chocobo, you have free heals, adlo shield, and HoT with whispering dawn to sustain you. If your HP drops below 50% you're probably biting off more than you can chew.

Acn does not have access to CS, sch does. There's a reason for that. If you want to have potent heals as sch, I don't think it's a good idea to interrupt the growth worrying about the int stat for your smn.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

This is why I'm glad I do homework, and from the sounds of things in this thread, I did things right. Of course anyone can correct me.

You reach clerics full potential by packing mnd. So the higher this number is, the higher your int stat will be when you CS, plus you get the 10% bonus to offensive spells. This includes your b&b spell, energy drain. Splitting up your attributes in any way will hurt this.

Vit is worthless for acn/sch. As acn, topaz should be taking all the damage while you solo. As sch, even if you have not unlocked your feisty chocobo, you have free heals, adlo shield, and HoT with whispering dawn to sustain you. If your HP drops below 50% you're probably biting off more than you can chew.

Acn does not have access to CS, sch does. There's a reason for that. If you want to have potent heals as sch, I don't think it's a good idea to interrupt the growth worrying about the int stat for your smn.

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100% correct.

There are some very niche cases in end game where you need VIT on SCH, but to do that you meld VIT into accessories. I currently have VIT in my accessories to raid, and this is soley due to how messy it can get on SCH to replace gear as it drops. At ilvl 220 crafted, you can get to accuracy cap for Midas Savage. Keeping this accuracy cap can get a little messy and awkward as gear drops, as you may have to replace a piece with 5 melded slots of accuracy with a piece that can only take 2 materia. To circumvent this, you tend to hang on to the lower ilvl pieces that can take more accuracy, and compansate for lower VIT/DEF by melding VIT where possible into accessories.

The joys of the messy SCH raider who wants to get to accuracy cap.

Bonus attributes are quite honestly negligible. I split mine 22 INT/13 MND, just because that's when I decided to switch my main job, and I haven't bothered to switch them out since. I'm still a competent healer.

You shouldn't need a stack of Hymns, though feel free to keep them if you really really want to min/max.

There's literally no good reason to spec int as sch, you dps in cleric stance.

I'd say it depends. If you are planning on using both often then it is tough and using hymns would be best if you want to min/max. If you are going to use one way more than the other I would say just focus on that one for the modt part

Outside of endgame it wont make any difference what you spec. So spec for whatever you play more SMN or SCH. Unless you dont mind using the Hymns.

At high level 35 MND is not that "much" in the sense you shouldn't have problem healing with 35 MND off, if you do have trouble that probably because you are lacking in skill and experience, not the MND stats (for most contents anyway, primals ex included. I don't know about savage so if you go savage you might want to switch to full INT/MND base on job every times you go in). So you can put them all into INT for your SMN, and still play SCH without troubles. My friend like to put it to PIE though :))


Just to clarify: 35 INT will worth a lot more for SMN than 35 MND for SCH (due to how healing is in this game). So if you want to play both SMN/SCH without changing stats everytime put it all to INT.

Agree with a few others that posted above me--unless you are pushing savage raiding and/or extreme primals when they are first released, the 35 points won't make or break either class. Either split them halfway or put them all into whatever class you use the most (mind for SCH, intelligence for SMN). Keeper's Hymn is always available if you find you could use the extra points.

I wouldn't use VIT since it will not impact healing OR damage on either class--and most content will not require anymore additional VIT than what you can get on gear (except maybe in savage, where those points would be better utilized in your main stat anyway).

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Originally Posted by DarthVella

Bonus attributes are quite honestly negligible.

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Saying 35 points of a main stat is negligible is one of the most laughable statements you can make. It's like a whole other piece of gear.

No self-respecting scholar will do anything but full mind, and no summoner will do anything but full int. The performance in DPS and healing output is tremendous at 35 points.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

Saying 35 points of a main stat is negligible is one of the most laughable statements you can make. It's like a whole other piece of gear.

No self-respecting scholar will do anything but full mind, and no summoner will do anything but full int. The performance in DPS and healing output is tremendous at 35 points.

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Ikr. Hymns aren't even expensive anymore like they were in 1.0. This thread is like the blind leading the blind.

If you plan to use both Jobs, then INT, otherwise MND if you're only going to use SCH. Losing 35 MND on SCH will not make or break the Job in terms of healing output. It's roughly a difference of ~200HP from Physick casts.

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Originally Posted by FeliAiko

If you plan to use both Jobs, then INT, otherwise MND if you're only going to use SCH. Losing 35 MND on SCH will not make or break the Job in terms of healing output. It's roughly a difference of ~200HP from Physick casts.

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I'm a sch in training. I know 200 HP is different at my level so I'm wondering what the loss in 35 MND equates to in percentage at your level. If your physick hits for 1000 HP then that 200 you mentioned is a consistent 20% reduction in your curative ability. Sounds really significant to me since HoT is pretty important for a healer, especially in drawn out battles.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

I'm a sch in training. I know 200 HP is different at my level so I'm wondering what the loss in 35 MND equates to in percentage at your level. If your physick hits for 1000 HP then that 200 you mentioned is a consistent 20% reduction in your curative ability. Sounds really significant to me since HoT is pretty important for a healer, especially in drawn out battles.

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At i216 my physik heals for 3,5-3,6k, so losing 200HP is not that much. We get about 1100-1200 MND from gears at the moment, so 35MND is like about 3%. Just think of it as you are not over geared while healing. Or do you say you can't heal a dungeon if you are not over geared for it??? People are so worked up for 35 MND, i guess it's hard for them for keep their spot on the overhealing chart.

Also you have to keep in mind this only apply when you want to play both SMN/SCH and switch quite frequently. For SCH you normally take the "off-heal" role so it is better to put your points to SMN. WHM and AST you go full MND and shouldn't have any worry. IMO healing in ffxiv is more about knowing when to/not to heal than constantly spamming medica II and worry about missing some HPS!

/s

@Normalizer,

All I see and understand is a healer who is doing so, less efficiently. I see a healer who is focused on dmg output towards a job currently not equipped. You understand that there is no way around this? Healing for less = less efficient.

200/3500 comes out to a 5% deduction in your healing potency. 5% is nothing to toss into the wind, especially when you factor in MP cost for curative spells and utility. I'm not looking to place a gold star on the 'over healing' chart. I am looking for a legitimate reason why any sch would distribute their attribute points towards INT.

I'm not here to call anyone out. I want to learn. Posters have spoken of hymns. A means to rectify the issue if wanting to play both jobs? If this is available and affordable (used to be 10000 seals, and now 250), then please tell me why you wouldn't utilize them to maximize your job's potential? Before you answer 250/10000 = 2%. Now that is negligible!

Yeah tbh if you plan on playing both often hymns are the best option since they only cost 250 seals each. That is very very cheap

I guess it would take awhile for many to realize unless you go in savage, 200HP off from a 3,5k physik is not significant (And for me it's not 200HP off, only 50-100HP off. You can just test it for yourself). But well, i know many healers are not comfortable if their party ain't at 100% HP with multiple HoTs running though.

The reason why i'm not using hymns? Cause i have better use for seals, and i'm constantly running out of them. It would cost me a lot more if i want to use hymns cause i switch between smn/sch multiple times everyday. And beside, i can heal comfortably on my SCH with 35 MND off without making my co-healer losing his hairs ;)

Anyway i'm out of this :) no point in continue repeating what I and many have said.

Right now I need my seals for another usage than compensating for a rushed implementation.

Why should players playing both summoner and scholar have to use their seals into these talismans ?
And why should they go through the hassle of changing all bonus stats everytime they want to switch ?

Every day I'm playing both smn and scholar, so I should spend like what, more than 1k seals per day ?
No, absolutely not, this should be addressed properly so you can choose bonus stats per-job and not per-baseclass.

Same issue, traits giving intelligence to arcanists should switch to mind when you equip your scholar cristal, or simply give both attributes since it's of little use to have mind as summoner or intelligence as scholar (we dps in cleric stance) !

Suggestion : mind/intelligence bonuses and traits should be merged into only one meta stat : mindtelligence giving both of them ^^

I get it. It's a huge inconvenience to use seals if you're continuously swapping jobs, and you lot would rather take the hit to healing effeciency opposed to DoT.

It is the lesser of two evils. Perhaps SE did derp, and they need to fix this issue for those wanting to play both smn and sch. But as of right now, you have to use the seals if you want maximum mnd or int for these two jobs. I know I personally can acquire 500 seals off my GC levemente, or doing a few fates in probably 30 minutes give or take a few.

For me though, I have more seals than I even know what do with. Most of the stuff I don't want, and next to none is actually needed for what I am currently doing in the game. But I am a much lower level which is why I asked those of that are in the upper levels to explain their reasoning behind a loss in MP efficiency. All I'm getting is convenience though.

Has SE addressed this by chance?

Not yet, we need our voices to reach them on that matter :(

Here we go : http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-SMN-SCH-issue