DEVS: Please consider differentiating Bard and Machinist gear in the future.

Hi, me again. The self-heals for MCH guy.

As you later differentiated Monk and Ninja gear between "X Gear of Striking" and "X Gear of Scouting" would you please consider for future gear differentiating Bard and Machinist gear? Say "X Gear of Ranging" and "X Gear of Sniping" (for example's sake)

While I do love that they currently share gear, it's quite clear that Bards and Machinists have a very different aesthetic; one that current gear tends to cater to the former than the latter. I speak for myself in wanting to see this, but I hope others who might feel the same would come forward and show support for this. Please consider either specific gear between the two like Monk/Ninja, or at least more MCH-oriented gearsets for both in the future.

Agreed!

/10char

I'd love gear to be different but I sure wish they'd do something about our armories. I don't have room for the multiple roles I have leveled as is. Generic gear for multiple roles at least helps. I just don't understand why our armories are so small or why our gear needs to be in them in order to load our gear sets. Something needs to be done to fix this mess.

Tanks , healers and casters share gear too.... anyway im fairly sure the next set will be more MCH than BRD,...please look forward to it! :P

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

Tanks , healers and casters share gear too.... anyway im fairly sure the next set will be more MCH than BRD,...please look forward to it! :P

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That's true, and while they too have their own aesthetics, it's safe to say tanks (generally) wear armor, healers and casters generally wear robes of some sort. But a Bard and Machinist's overall looks vastly differ. Just like a Monk and Ninja. If nothing else, while the jobs play similarly, they need not share the same look (that being exclusively Bard-like), no?

They eventually separated MNK and NIN because one uses STR and the other uses DEX.

Then why doesn't MNK and DRG share gear? pft /shrug mini tanks? Who knows.

Either way they probably won't :(

Ehh. I don't think I want them to have different armors. With most Striking and Scouting gear, they are just slight recolored variations of the same armor. And the primary reason the gear was split up into Striking and Scouting was because Monks use STR and Ninjas use DEX. I also think it would have been easier for SE to just continue using Striking as a catch-all for both MNK and NIN, but I guess they didn't want to have both stats on the same armor for whatever reason.

MCH and BRD, however, use the same base DEX stat. I guess by comparing their Artifact Armor, you can see a bit of visual differences with how they can be perceived, but the same can be said of all three tanks. The tanks' armors still hold the same basic principles though. The same can be said of the sets shared by Bard and Machinist.

With all of this in mind, I think that it would be smarter to continue having one set of armor to be used through both jobs. It IS true that MNK and DRG do not share gear even though they are STR-based jobs, and that is a fair complaint, but I do think that they are different enough to warrant the change in visuals. I can't really say the same for Bard and Machinist.

IMO not to split brd and mch but also let nin share the same gears, for consistency^^;

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Originally Posted by TheGrimace

It IS true that MNK and DRG do not share gear even though they are STR-based jobs, and that is a fair complaint, but I do think that they are different enough to warrant the change in visuals.

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Don't DRG armors usually have a higher armor value than MNK/NIN?

In most cases NIN and MNK armor looks the same except for colours. I think Void Ark is the first different one and in that case its NIN and BRD/MCH which share an armour model which makes even less sense astheticly.

Generally you only get unique class gear designs with Artifact gear. That said, making some Aiming sets that better suit the MCH aesthetic wouldn't go amiss.

Let's pollute the drop pool even further!

No, please. Hell, go the opposite direction - put ninja on brd/mch gear or add dex to mnk gear and put it on that. Dex does literally nothing for MNK now that it doesn't increase parry, and STR does nothing for Ninja, so there's no reason they can't share gear.

Don't think they should separate the two, but they could simply make more 'neutral' looking sets, while on occasion making shared sets that leans more towards one of the two aesthetics, respectively.

If this is all down to looks then there is already a solution glamour \o/

If it's about stats then let them share gear.

It's less a matter of stats and more aesthetics, as was mentioned. They are already too similar in playstyle at the core; shoehorning MCH into the look of BRD gear effectively robs it of further identity. It basically becomes "that other ranged DEX job" that way. And for SE who once reasoned that they didn't want to make gear/glamours universal so as to keep the aesthetics (of DoW/DoM overall) unique, it seems a bit of a step backward to have 2 (arguably) different jobs of a similar type simply mashed together under an aesthetic that particularly caters to one over the other.

Sure, we could arguably say the same for tanks, healers, and casters overall, but I don't believe the aesthetics are as one-sided with those as with the ranged jobs. And to address the (rather valid) comment about loot tables being further diluted, consider if you will that future jobs, as well as movement of older gear to dungeons perhaps (a la Darklight) will naturally dilute the loot tables. It's bound to happen, however much we might dislike that. Not to mention that simply lumping similar jobs together will result in issues not unlike what BLM/SMN constantly deal with, that being when stats cater to one over another.

I think tanks, healers and casters should be getting that focus long before the ranged do...

You think the aesthetics difference between a MCH and BRD is bad? try looking at PLD vs DRK someday. Your aesthetic issues are non existent next to their issues.

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Originally Posted by Belhi

In most cases NIN and MNK armor looks the same except for colours. I think Void Ark is the first different one

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It's not the first, though it's one of the only. NIN shared its Ironworks model with BRD, while MNK shared its model with DRG. There's also one set that most folks probably haven't noticed: Toxotes (from WP/AK Normal) has NIN on it, while the MNK set (the name of which I can't remember) does not.

As for the topic at hand, honestly, there have been a decent mix of "BRD" sets and "MCH" sets in HW, so far at least. Fusillier's from Fractal/Neverreap has a steampunk vibe, which is more fitting for MCH, and the Sky Pirate's Aiming set is also more of a "MCH" style, too. The Alexander gear also looks better on MCH naturally, because of the steampunk stuff. The leveling gear largely favors BRD's aesthetics, and I would say the Lost Thief (i185) is more fitting for BRD than MCH.

In terms of differentiating the two classes, I'd much rather they bring more differentiation to their gameplay than anything. I think style-wise there are enough ways to glamour them so they're thematically distinct.

please not, it would just further increase the amount of rng needed for specific gear pieces............

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Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

That's true, and while they too have their own aesthetics, it's safe to say tanks (generally) wear armor, healers and casters generally wear robes of some sort. But a Bard and Machinist's overall looks vastly differ. Just like a Monk and Ninja. If nothing else, while the jobs play similarly, they need not share the same look (that being exclusively Bard-like), no?

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If it is about look, Monk and Ninja gears share often the same look (just in different colors)

example:

http://img.finalfantasyxiv.com/t/5d6...280abe6_37.png

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Originally Posted by Brannigan

Let's pollute the drop pool even further!

No, please. Hell, go the opposite direction - put ninja on brd/mch gear or add dex to mnk gear and put it on that. Dex does literally nothing for MNK now that it doesn't increase parry, and STR does nothing for Ninja, so there's no reason they can't share gear.

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Agreed. We already have five armor types (Striking, Maiming, Aiming, Scouting, and Casting) for the four DPS slots in an 8-person raid, so a not insignificant portion loot that drops in instances is guaranteed to not be anyone's primary job. Even worse for groups that have both a black mage and summoner sharing the casting drops.

As other people have mentioned, I'd much rather then differentiate their gameplay than gear set; I don't have so much of a problem with their glamour because there have been enough diversity within the shared gear to do something (such as the sky pirates set and such), though I'd really wish they woulds top giving us robes, we don't need more reason to be reminded of how we're a faux caster.

On a side note though, our glamour endgame is still pretty damn lousy compared to the other jobs (esp MCH with the unchangable lunchbox and gauss barrel) because of the said robes, and even down to the crafted glamour. It gets pretty bad when the i160 and i180 crafted recipes (which are generally for glamour at that point since upgraded law was long accessible before the i180 was even added) is not only an old model that was already available to MCH/BRD, but said old model was shared with casters and healers.

http://puu.sh/mo5UK/51f7f85f85.png

Just look at the "shared models". Compared to that, MNK/NIN got something that was previously not available to them (Kirimu Coat which was previously exclusive to BRD/MCH), while casters, healers, tank and DRGs got entirely new models.

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Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

Hi, me again. The self-heals for MCH guy.

As you later differentiated Monk and Ninja gear between "X Gear of Striking" and "X Gear of Scouting" would you please consider for future gear differentiating Bard and Machinist gear? Say "X Gear of Ranging" and "X Gear of Sniping" (for example's sake)

While I do love that they currently share gear, it's quite clear that Bards and Machinists have a very different aesthetic; one that current gear tends to cater to the former than the latter. I speak for myself in wanting to see this, but I hope others who might feel the same would come forward and show support for this. Please consider either specific gear between the two like Monk/Ninja, or at least more MCH-oriented gearsets for both in the future.

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A lot of us NIN/MNKs hate the fact that NIN/MNK use different left side gear considering in most cases they look exactly same. Adding STR or DEX to one set for NIN/MNK wouldn't matter stat wise anyway since DEX/STR don't do anything special anymore.

If anything, we need scouting abd aiming gear to be combined to lessen the loot dilution we see.

Splitting brd and mch won't make the gear aesthetically different, it will just change its color and make getting a specific piece of gear that much harder

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Originally Posted by PArcher

If anything, we need scouting abd aiming gear to be combined to lessen the loot dilution we see.

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I think you mean Scouting and Striking? Ninja share more gear design (post 2.4) with Monk than with Bard

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Originally Posted by Felis

I think you mean Scouting and Striking? Ninja share more gear design (post 2.4) with Monk than with Bard

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They probably went with Scouting and Aiming because both currently have DEX.

Either option would be a step in the right direction though. Either put DEX on the Striking gear or add ROG/NIN to Aiming gear, and remove Scouting.

Until they increase the armory size (they seriously need to for people with more than one job), we don't need more armor sets taking up space.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

If anything, we need scouting abd aiming gear to be combined to lessen the loot dilution we see.

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lol ? so 3 jobs in Aiming while Monk and drg keep their unique armors?

Monk and Ninja sharing gear is maybe better , or Monk + DRG since both use STR .....since raids are usually 2 melee 2 ranged 2 tanks 2 heals.


Gear of Striking , Gear of Aiming , Gear of Casting , Gear of Fending , Gear of healing.

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Originally Posted by dragonkyn20

Until they increase the armory size (they seriously need to for people with more than one job), we don't need more armor sets taking up space.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

If anything, we need scouting abd aiming gear to be combined to lessen the loot dilution we see.

Splitting brd and mch won't make the gear aesthetically different, it will just change its color and make getting a specific piece of gear that much harder

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Originally Posted by Ibi

Agreed. We already have five armor types (Striking, Maiming, Aiming, Scouting, and Casting) for the four DPS slots in an 8-person raid, so a not insignificant portion loot that drops in instances is guaranteed to not be anyone's primary job. Even worse for groups that have both a black mage and summoner sharing the casting drops.

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Originally Posted by ServerCollaps

please not, it would just further increase the amount of rng needed for specific gear pieces............

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All of this. PLEASE don't add more types of armor. I'm so tired of only seeing the variety of dex/str dps gear dropping in groups/raids and no one to loot them. We need LESS dilution, so that EVERYONE gets a chance at loot, not just dps classes that don't want to share an appearance.