Any updates about fixing mudra lag?

I recall SE saying that they were working on something to ease this problem, while I'm glad EU players are getting their servers, this isn't a universal fix for everyone, or close to everyone really.

I'm just wondering why they haven't done anything when the solution seems incredibly simple. It's as simple as letting us just click the Mudra itself and skip the signs altogether, click it and the animation plays out, hell they can even have a cast bar for it if that would solve any balance problems (which it wouldn't, since Mudras were designed to be cast with very log ping... as seen by videos of Japanese players, and the NPCs that cast them during the Ninja quests).

I'm genuinely baffled as to why they haven't done anything yet. :confused:

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Originally Posted by Colorful

I recall SE saying that they were working on something to ease this problem, while I'm glad EU players are getting their series, this isn't a universal fix for everyone, or close to everyone really.

I'm just wondering why they haven't done anything when the solution seems incredibly simple. It's as simple as letting us just click the Mudra itself and skip the signs altogether, click it and the animation plays out, hell they can even have a cast bar for it if that would solve any balance problems (which it wouldn't, since Mudras were designed to be cast with very log ping... as seen by videos of Japanese players, and the NPCs that cast them during the Ninja quests).

I'm genuinely baffled as to why they haven't done anything yet. :confused:

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They did its called armor crush and its all we'll get unless they redesign the game or the ninjutsu system

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

They did its called armor crush and its all we'll get unless they redesign the game or the ninjutsu system

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But that's not a solution. Even with a rather small 150-200 ping when my connection's going excellent + WTFast I get slight clipping with Fuma Shuriken, and Raiton is out of the question unless I want to use at the detriment of my DPS. Trick Attack can be especially annoying.

Now that they're not doing 3 classes per expansion anymore, surely they could devote a very minor amount of that time into fixing the Ninjutsu system? This has to be one of the worst implementations of a class ability, and they give more updates about something like the Summoner's pet glamour? I'd take anything at this point, even if it's a "we're figuring out how to solve it". I want to know if they've given up or not. You'd think their priorities would lie with fixing genuine issues first anyway. They don't have to redesign the entire system, they could remove the signs entirely if they really had to and make it so the Jutsu's are castable every 20 seconds and place the animations before the cast.

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Originally Posted by Colorful

But that's not a solution. Even with a rather small 150-200 ping when my connection's going excellent + WTFast I get slight clipping with Fuma Shuriken, and Raiton is out of the question unless I want to use at the detriment of my DPS. Trick Attack can be especially annoying.

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Call your provider to solve the latency or move to a town closer to the datacenter.
Ping is not the problem of SE. If animation and function is working fine there is slightly nothing they can do about it beside of redesign the whole class...

Example: Remove mudras and enable a "chakra" bar which is filling while the ninja is doing his dmg. Once full he can do one ninjutsu and the animation of the ninjutsu is the fast mudra action + cast

Ha... I kinda like that Idea... I mean no one gives a shit how th mudras look like.... and with a ninjutsu bar it would still feel like a ninja

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Originally Posted by Colorful

But that's not a solution. Even with a rather small 150-200 ping when my connection's going excellent + WTFast I get slight clipping with Fuma Shuriken, and Raiton is out of the question unless I want to use at the detriment of my DPS. Trick Attack can be especially annoying.

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I would say 150-200 ping is actually very high, especially with a tunnel-service like WTFast and it's no wonder you're having problems with them most likely designed for a -50ping connection. We'll (or probably I will) be looking at 30-50 ping, depending on where EU servers will be once they are implemented and we'll do the mudra's like they showed off in the HW skill demo vid.

If the problem still exists by then, a fix would be nice yeah. Like the mudra's staying client side until the Ninjutsu skill is cast... or something. Other players can just look at a set animation playing of my char combining mudra's depending on how long I am combining. xD

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Originally Posted by Lantia

Call your provider to solve the latency or move to a town closer to the datacenter.
Ping is not the problem of SE. If animation and function is working fine there is slightly nothing they can do about it beside of redesign the whole class...

Example: Remove mudras and enable a "chakra" bar which is filling while the ninja is doing his dmg. Once full he can do one ninjutsu and the animation of the ninjutsu is the fast mudra action + cast

Ha... I kinda like that Idea... I mean no one gives a shit how th mudras look like.... and with a ninjutsu bar it would still feel like a ninja

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Unfortunately the option of up and moving from Australia to Canada isn't an option for me at the moment, nor would I restructure my entire life over an MMO. Ping isn't SE's problem, you're right, but the way they designed it to be so reliant on ping is. I do like your idea though.

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Originally Posted by Valenth

I would say 150-200 ping is actually very high, especially with a tunnel-service like WTFast and it's no wonder you're having problems with them most likely designed for a -50ping connection. We'll (or probably I will) be looking at 30-50 ping, depending on where EU servers will be once they are implemented and we'll do the mudra's like they showed off in the HW skill demo vid.

If the problem still exists by then, a fix would be nice yeah. Like the mudra's staying client side until the Ninjutsu skill is cast... or something. Other players can just look at a set animation playing of my char combining mudra's depending on how long I am combining. xD

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That's the best I can get with my distance, I've asked around and with different ISPs it can get down to around 130 ping with WTFast, but I don't think it's worthwhile to switch for that minor difference. I am thankful for WTFast though, 330 ping to 150 is amazing. It wouldn't hurt SE to change the system for us AUS players, and SEA as well. We do make up quite a large population, not near the size of EU sure, but I'm not asking for servers located here, just a fix for this.

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Originally Posted by Colorful

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Ai, Australian? Playing on EU will most likely bump your ping even higher then once they move servers :(

While the solution is simple, they would have to nerf NIN's DPS significantly if they introduced what you proposed. NIN's DPS is based around being a "technical" class, and what that means is that people have to learn to execute Mudra combinations properly, both with proper speed and sequence. Your solution would remove this technical aspect (which is not unlike removing Greased Lightning's timer for MNK), more than likely prompting SE to rebalance the class from the ground up.

While I will agree that they should have done testing on subpar connections while designing the class, they aren't really responsible for connection issues, which is what Mudra lag is.

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Originally Posted by Alahra

While the solution is simple, they would have to nerf NIN's DPS significantly if they introduced what you proposed. NIN's DPS is based around being a "technical" class, and what that means is that people have to learn to execute Mudra combinations properly, both with proper speed and sequence. Your solution would remove this technical aspect (which is not unlike removing Greased Lightning's timer for MNK), more than likely prompting SE to rebalance the class from the ground up.

While I will agree that they should have done testing on subpar connections while designing the class, they aren't really responsible for connection issues, which is what Mudra lag is.

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I think you're overestimating how difficult Mudras are to execute, you can learn all the Mudras in less than an hour, or maybe a little more if you have memorisation issues, and the speed is entirely reliant on your ping, nothing else as far as I'm aware... unless of course someone in incapable of hitting one button after another, in which case they're going to be severely gimped with OGCD abilities regardless. The Ninja class was designed with Mudras being executable almost instantly with developers having extremely low ping, they balance the class around how they play it, as Yoshida once stated in an interview about the MCH. Regardless of all that, isn't Ninja currently the lowest DPS melee at the moment?

But that's also the reason I suggest a cast bar, if you get hit or move, it's interrupted. Another idea would be to keep both systems in place, if you were to manually cast the signs the potency would be the regular amount, otherwise it'll be slightly lower.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

They did its called armor crush and its all we'll get unless they redesign the game or the ninjutsu system

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Until Armor Crush prevents you from getting clipping on your Suiton or Raiton, it's not a solution in any sense of the word.

If they have to redesign the Mudra system to be fair to everyone, then they should. It's not right that some people can't play the class to its full potential (or at all in some cases) just because they don't live in Japan.

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Originally Posted by AlphaDragoon

Until Armor Crush prevents you from getting clipping on your Suiton or Raiton, it's not a solution in any sense of the word.

If they have to redesign the Mudra system to be fair to everyone, then they should. It's not right that some people can't play the class to its full potential (or at all in some cases) just because they don't live in Japan.

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No doubt but they won't do anything about it even if they do until the next expansion Their solution they were talking about was armor crush when they mentioned the lag before HW release.

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Originally Posted by Alahra

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Sure... press 1,2,3 or num1, num2, num3 or f1,f2,f3 or any other keys in a combination is killing you and making you slow....

I have a ping of 50-100ms and to cast two mudras is taking more then the global GCD and nope I can press up to 30 buttons in the time the GCD is working.... thanks.
I see no different to press 3 buttons in 1,5 secs every 20 secs or to wait filling a bar with my attacks.
Which would be, what a suprise, even technical as I need to do constantly dmg!

Think first before posting....

I hope they fix it soon. I just unlocked my second madra and if I hit both madras and then ninjutsu as fast as I can I get Fuma Shuriken. From what I can gather, the server updates the ninjutsu skill as it receives madra inputs. So if you press the ninjutsu button before the server receives and verifies that it receives the second madra, you just get a shuriken.

So it should works something like

Press Ten ---> Server receives Ten --->Server changes ninjutsu to Fuma Shuriken-->Press Chi--->Server changes Ninjutsu to Raiton --->Press Ninjutsu=Raiton is used

but what happens with madra lag is

Press Ten ---> Press Chi ---> Server receives Ten --->Server changes Ninjutsu to Fuma Shuriken ---->Press Ninjutsu=Fuma Shuriken is used

Honestly, this is really killing ninja for me.I really want to play the class but I can't simply because I'm Australian. I'm no expert at this game but no other class I've tried so far has had nearly the same level of lag induced frustration.

edit: This all could be fixed so easily by having ninjutsu calculated client side. Destiny does a huge amount of stuff client side and it feels butter smooth because of it. I realize that SE is cautious of potential hacks but I really think they need to prioritize usability over minor exploits.

Otherwise they need to make the system much more lenient by doing things like not having weapon skills break the madra chain.

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Originally Posted by Stormblessed9000

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I highly recommend using WTFast, it's mostly fixed the problem of my Mudras not going through, although the main issue that remains in that rather large clipping into my GCD.

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Originally Posted by Colorful

I highly recommend using WTFast, it's mostly fixed the problem of my Mudras not going through, although the main issue that remains in that rather large clipping into my GCD.

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Thanks for the recommendation. I'm afraid that I'm already using it though, so no luck for me.

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Originally Posted by Stormblessed9000

Thanks for the recommendation. I'm afraid that I'm already using it though, so no luck for me.

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Ah, that sucks. =/ Tends to happen here when my ping spikes too, but otherwise it's fine for the most part... All the more reason they should just change the Mudra signs to animations imo.

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Originally Posted by Valenth

I would say 150-200 ping is actually very high, especially with a tunnel-service like WTFast and it's no wonder you're having problems with them most likely designed for a -50ping connection. We'll (or probably I will) be looking at 30-50 ping, depending on where EU servers will be once they are implemented and we'll do the mudra's like they showed off in the HW skill demo vid.

If the problem still exists by then, a fix would be nice yeah. Like the mudra's staying client side until the Ninjutsu skill is cast... or something. Other players can just look at a set animation playing of my char combining mudra's depending on how long I am combining. xD

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California to east coast isn't going to get <50 ms even with a tunnel so designing it for that and then putting the server in a redundancy filled business cloud in bfe has to be the most asinine idea ever and the one that thought of it needs tarred and feathered.