New crafting rotations

Hello

I was wondering if you could share your crafting rotations for these new diff/dura items.

As you know theres quite a few different difficulty and durability numbers and I'm a little lost on what rotations to use for hq's.

Anywhere from 421-641/80, 697/70, 376/35, and 752-919/70

I have some good tried and true rotations for all the old items but nothing for the new. I'm not very good at "winging" crafting rotations and need some solid sequences to use.

I have been using some of the old rotations that kind of work but getting into the higher ones I definitely need something different. I have all crafts to 50 and did get gsm to 60 by just doing autocrafts.

So any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!!

I have not had any need for new rotations just due to the reduced durability (40 and 80 down to 35 and 70).

80->70 Durability just means, literally, one fewer move. From 80 down to 20, or from 70 down to 10, is the same number of moves, and handled the same way. Master's Mend 2, and you're back at full Durability. Then, instead of 80 Durability's 6 moves before having to do a Byregot's Finisher, with 70 Durability you only have 5.

40 Durability vs 35 Durability pretty much has no difference. You cannot do a WN->SH2->5HT rotation, but you can still use one move (CS2 or something) then use SH2->WN->4 moves then restore Durability, either MM1 or Manipulation. The change from 40 Durability down to 35 has had literally zero impact upon my patterns.

its really annoying having all my 80 durability macros become invalid tho, stupid 70 durability recipes, jerks :D

If you use Muscle Memory at the start of each 70/35 recipe, the durability lines up perfectly for any old 80/40 durability and both master mend skills for perfect full durability recovery.

Can someone spell out the 35 durability rotation for me? I don't think my brain woke up when I did. If anyone does, thank you!

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Originally Posted by Shyluv

Can someone spell out the 35 durability rotation for me? I don't think my brain woke up when I did. If anyone does, thank you!

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35 is exactly the same as 40 durability, provided you are not using WN or WNII.
If you are using WN/WNII: its still exactly the same if you use an even amount of touches during the buff (2,4,6,8), otherwise you will have 1 less durability loss move to perform.


As such 35 dura recipes can be considered a direct nerf to WN 'durability skipping'.
Not sure why, WN was rarely used anyway.

I am glad someone posted this - I was about to post a similar thread myself. I have always been an avid crafter, and lvlled all my crafts to 50 before I tackled any hunting classes, right back at the start of the game. Thing is, I then got very ill and had to stop playing for nearly a year, and I didnt manage to get any of the upgraded craft tools/gear before I fell ill :( So, I went into Heavensward with just basic crafting greens and the first blue tool, for each class. I didnt really notice anything until I hit about 53-54 and changed into a set of the new 53-54 gear and tools.

Cont in next post...

Cont from last post....

Now, I can just about craft 40 dura items using an old old macro, but forget about hq'ing :/ But an 80 dura item? No way. My old macros fail every time, Ive tried all of Mithrie's, all fail by running out of dura. Can someone PLEASE actually type out new 40 and 80 macros, as I am still too poorly for my brtain to actually work all this out myself, and that aint going to change :( I feel so frustrated by this that Ive actually had to stop crafting for now, until someone can help me with this. Goddess knows how a newbie dressed in the same gear, will manage.

Please, someone help an old fart out? :P

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Originally Posted by Tamianth

Cont from last post....

Now, I can just about craft 40 dura items using an old old macro, but forget about hq'ing :/ But an 80 dura item? No way. My old macros fail every time, Ive tried all of Mithrie's, all fail by running out of dura. Can someone PLEASE actually type out new 40 and 80 macros, as I am still too poorly for my brtain to actually work all this out myself, and that aint going to change :( I feel so frustrated by this that Ive actually had to stop crafting for now, until someone can help me with this. Goddess knows how a newbie dressed in the same gear, will manage.

Please, someone help an old fart out? :P

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The main reason why old macros dont work anymore is because of the increased amount of progress required. Since this heavily depends on your level compared to the recipe level on top of craftmanship differences; there isnt really a set rotation we can give you.


Unless you are very experienced with writing macros I would not advise using macros at all for leveling.
Try to remember how you crafted items before you reached level 50.
Leveling to 60 requires much of the same kind of crafting.


For making a leveling macro: First build it up towards progress. Only use abilities that allow you to finish the craft.
Once you have that down, use the remaining CP to add in touches and abilities for quality.

It's very hard, maybe even impossible, to do a "perfect for all" crafting rotation.

Your gear and your level in comparison to the recipe level GREATLY affect the rotation.

(example: you may need Ingenuity2 to finish the progress of a lv55 craft in 2 steps if you are level 52-53, but if you are lv55+, you can totally skip Ingenuity2 and still finish the progress in 2 steps. In fact ingenuity2 would be a waste of CP in these cases)

I'm sure someone will come up with 60* and 60** rotations for those with lv60 BiS crafter gear, but right now with people still leveling and gearing up, that's not gonna happen for the lv51-59 recipes.

No one should need macros for lv 1 to lv 49 crafts.
It's the same for lv51-59 now.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

35 is exactly the same as 40 durability, provided you are not using WN or WNII.
If you are using WN/WNII: its still exactly the same if you use an even amount of touches during the buff (2,4,6,8), otherwise you will have 1 less durability loss move to perform.


As such 35 dura recipes can be considered a direct nerf to WN 'durability skipping'.
Not sure why, WN was rarely used anyway.

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My 35 and 40 durability rotations are exactly the same. The ONLY difference is in the 1 Synth to finish.

1 Synth to finish :
40 Durability - Comfort Zone, Inner Quiet, Waste Not, Steady Hand 2, Hasty Touch, hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Manipulation, Steady Hand 2, Waste Not, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Byregot's Finisher, Careful Synth 2.
35 Durability - Comfort Zone, Inner Quiet, Steady Hand 2, Waste Not, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Manipulation, Steady Hand 2, Waste Not, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Byregot's finisher, Careful Synth 2.

2 Synth to finish :
Comfort Zone, Inner Quiet, Careful Synth 2, Steady Hand 2, Waste Not, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Manipulation, Steady Hand 2, Waste Not, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Byregot's finisher, Careful Synth 2.

3 Synth to finish :
Comfort Zone, Inner Quiet, Careful Synth 2, Steady Hand 2, Waste Not, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Careful Synth 2, Hasty Touch, Manipulation, Steady Hand 2, Waste Not, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Hasty Touch, Byregot's Finisher, Careful Synth 2.

Now, these are not macro'able because of Tricks of the Trade and Precise Touch. I will not take a Tricks while I've got WN or SH2 running, but I WILL use the Tricks that I can take to replace those Goods/Excellents with Precise Touch, or if no such opportunity presents itself, to replace the last Hasty Touch(es) with Basic touch(es). Also, on the 3 Synth to finish pattern, the timing of that middle CS2 varies depending upon condition. If I get an Excellent right off the bat, I'll use the CS2 on the following Poor. If the third move after WN is Good, I'll Hasty/Precise and use the CS2 on the fourth move.

If people remember what they did prior to the "Macro Craze", they won't have any problems crafting the stuff now. If they don't know, or never learned how to craft by hand, there's no time like the present to learn.

One thing I'm learning on the way to 60 is that macros are evil. You really need to drive your crafting yourself, especially now with skills like precise touch.

Rotations can be very easy to create for yourself. You first need to know how to 100% finish the progress of the craft in the minimum number of moves. Once that is done, you then manage your CP around creating the most opportunities for building control stacks for Byregot's.

Once you have the rotation, then you need to drive. Know when a ToT can be done without affecting critical buffs. Know when you can do a precise touch to get that sweet extra stack of control.

The difficult thing for me is the first step - determining what you need to do to 100% reliably finish the craft progress. I used to use http://www.ffxivcrafter.com/ but it hasn't been updated with HW changes.

Does anyone have a link to the math behind crafting? In particular, the math behind progress. Once you know that, you just optimize for the max number of control stacks. Knowing the math behind quality helps determine what initial quality you need.

I see alot of unnecessary stuff here....... I'vemelded my bis gear aside from offhands and mainhands to get721 crafts 688 control.....

I never get to refresh Comfort Zone . Flat out easy..... CZ IQ (TOT) STII (good/ex precise touch manage CP!) hasty touches otherwise ....... MM1, repeat if you want another IQ stack or two and have 200CP just STII hasty 3 times MM1 (ifSTII runs out at15 just hasty it) odds areyou may get a TOT for CP, close it with *8*stacks on 90% of my 40/35/durability crafts from 0to100% with innovation and Byregots after great strides regaardless of good.688 Control = 100%quality in 8 stacks

get these stats you are on the easy road.... 720+ crafts 680+ Control and meldCP on everything you can...... Precise touch allows you 8 to 11 stacks in a small amount of steps; with these stats 8 inner quiet will 100%HQ anything on the level of Chimerical Felt, Ampheptere Leather etc .. 70 Durability you want to usually Muscle Memory start your rotation, Rapid, hasty / precise ........ MMII at 10 careful II basic touch/ precise touch to 20 finish it and careful 2 to complete. easy as cake.

Guys how are you using the new abilities and special skills to craft new items?
I'm culinarian lvl 59 I would optimize my rotation to get HQ food without using HQ materials,
can you help me please?

did you read what i just posted? in addition, get all cross skills. k CZ IQ ......... (assuming you have the craftsmanship) Careful II ...... HASTY ALL NORMAL, PRECISE ALL GOOD/EXCELLENT TRICKS ALL GOOD/EXCELLENT @ 10 or NEAR THE END IF YOU NEED CP.

When hitting 10 Durability (after you make sure one caerfull II will finish and using hasty/precise touches) masters mend ; and repeat this till you have 8 to 11 inner quiet stacks ........ you need 20 Durability to finish STII most be up, Great Strides (IF GOOD/EXCELLENT BYRRGOTS) . innovation .... Byregots blessing FINISH HERE WITH CAREFULL SYNTHESIS II

I started HW with lucis for all crafts and fully melded artisans and found myself able to basically use the same rotations I have always used.

40/35 durability I used a lucis hand in rotation, just making sure to keep in mind how much progress I got from a synthesis (alternating between rapid>CS2 and CS2>CS2 depending on the synth). WARNING: CP heavy

Basically it goes CZ, IQ, SH2 3x hasty, master mend.... repeat, making sure to tricks every good/excellent proc, and refreshing CZ once after the first CZ wears off. This has never failed me in being able to HQ (short of RNG being a cow and failing all my hasty)
When you hit around 100CP left, do a BB finisher. I did tend to do the rapid at the beginning if I needed one to ensure it wouldn't blow up in my face at the end.

70 durability I have used the 4* rotation (no WN/WN2) with a modified start depending again on how much progress was needed vs amount gained. I found usually either rapid>rapid>CS2 or rapid>CS2>CS2 was sufficient. I've stopped using PbP for everything except lv60 1* furnishings as I usually get the same amount from a rapid, without the CP cost.

Biggest piece of advice I can give regarding progress and not ending up short (if you are really unsure and not comfortable/confident in winging it): have reclaim set and do a rapid and note down how much progress it gives, then do a CS2 and note down that value. Reclaim and blow the item up. Now, knowing how much progress you get, you can figure out (mathematically) how many progress steps you need to make items of that level. You may also wish to note down the values given with Ing2+rapid/CS2 if you are really short on craftsmanship (in which case, you may want to look at upgrading your gear some to make it easier on yourself)

OR.. just leave an extra step at the end in case your CS2 doesn't quite finish.

Any crafters on behemoth wanting help/gear made.. feel free to send me a tell and I'll help if I am able/not too busy

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Originally Posted by Mayoyama

Biggest piece of advice I can give regarding progress and not ending up short (if you are really unsure and not comfortable/confident in winging it): have reclaim set and do a rapid and note down how much progress it gives, then do a CS2 and note down that value.

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I think you can calculate the effectiveness of CS2 based on the amount of progress that rapid synthesis gives. For a new craft, I always use rapid synthesis first and then take note of the progress gain. CS2 can be calculated by dividing that amount by 2.5 and then multiplying by 1.2. This is, of course, assuming that you're using RS and CS2 under the same conditions (eg. with or without ingenuity 2, etc).

When working with new types of recipes that I'm unfamiliar with, I usually keep a calculator on hand.

one thing I will say is that you don't need a rotation for any of the new recipes. a guideline sure but rotation no.

35dur recipes can be pretty much guaranteed from nq mats at my current stats and im not fully melded bis just yet or probs will bother with melds.

70 dur recipes is easy you can use 5x cs2 if you want at no cp cost or use some cp and reduce the progress steps down a few. but really its not needed as precise touch makes getting 11 stacks crazy easy and any good after getting 11stacks will 100% for sure and if excellent youlll get quality pushes well beyond 15k

all current recipes can be done without needing comfort zone or any crazy tricks to hq. heck id say you can even practically use basic touch every time to get the stacks and not worry to much but id have to test that alittle when im in bis before saying so for definite.

if you know how to craft this current stuff is a joke to hq in unmelded bis and without food. you want need more wiggle room use food and hq mats and meld that gear.

I'm having some troubles crafting lvl 60 food HQ with nq ingredients, can you share yoour rotation for 80 Durability recipes?

Exactly what Chidarak was saying, there is no specific rotation, just guideline. Unless you are using really bad gears and very bad luck on hasty touch, you should have pretty high HQ% even using NQ material.

How about share what you've been doing?

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Originally Posted by KairiLionheart

Exactly what Chidarak was saying, there is no specific rotation, just guideline. Unless you are using really bad gears and very bad luck on hasty touch, you should have pretty high HQ% even using NQ material.

How about share what you've been doing?

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ok, atm I'm Culinarian lvl 60. I have the best gear (all HQ), the primary and secondary tool (HQ). My average item lvl is 137. I'm very unlucky with HT. Anyway I've been doing this for 70 Durability like morel salad HQ:

Muscle Memory

Comfort Zone
Inner Quiet
Waste Not
Steady Hand II
Hasty Touch x5

Manipulation
Ingenuity
Innovation
Steady Hand II
Hasty Touch x3
Great Strides > Byregot's Blessing

CS II

I haven't PBP and IngII.
What am I doing wrong?

You will want to avoid using Ingenuity on anything that isnt 1*. Additionally, save Innovation for buffing Byregot's Blessing. Cover other touches with it if you got the room, but make sure it atleast covers BB.

Are you making sure to use precise touch whenever you can?


Also on 80 dura recipes you can use comfort zone more then once.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

You will want to avoid using Ingenuity on anything that isnt 1*. Additionally, save Innovation for buffing Byregot's Blessing. Cover other touches with it if you got the room, but make sure it atleast covers BB.

Are you making sure to use precise touch whenever you can?


Also on 80 dura recipes you can use comfort zone more then once.

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Yes, when I can I use Precise Touch.
Should I use Comfort Zone at the beginning of the second "rotation", before Manipulation?

Use it after it falls off. Its best to use when steady hand isnt up and you wont lose dura regen from manipulation, but otherwise you can use it during steady hand. If you get a good or excellent condition use that first.

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Originally Posted by lordparanoia

ok, atm I'm Culinarian lvl 60.
What am I doing wrong?

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Let me see if this helps you:

695 CR
699 CN
371 CP
133 ilevel

Deep-Fried Okeanis (same difficulty as your salad) - no HQ mats.

CZ, IQ, SHII, RSx2, HTx2 (Good proc, ToT), CSII, Manip, SHII, CZ, HTx4 (Good proc, ToT), Manip (Good proc, ToT), SHII, HT (Good proc, ToT), HTx2, Manip, SHII, HTx2, GS, Byregot's Blessing - 11stack, CSII.

Progress 100 Quality 100, 5 CP remaining. I had 2 failed HT's.

This is a pretty typical synth rotation when I'm being super conserving of CP and using no crafting food.

Well, al the moment i'm fine and i can craft everything in Hq. Thanks for your suggestion.

My rotation (for 70durability live morel salad) is:
CZ
IQ
WN
SH2
Hasty touchx5
Manipulation
CS II
COMFORT ZONE
CSII
MASTER MEND
CSII
STEADY HAND II
HASTY TOUCHX5
Great stride and byregot blessing
CSII

Il you have suggestions to optimize it i will Thank you.
Of course i will try Nanga's rotation :) Thank you

MaM WWYW [any Good in the following steps is to be taken
CZ FS 8 times [if you take Good, replace a FS with TotT; FS is only good with MaM
-If Whistle = 9) CSII CSII Sat [take Good with TotT if Sat step and if Good on the first CSII, skip past first
*If Whistle =/= 9) skip
CZ IQ SHII [if CZ is off, fit in another whenever, not necessarily before IQ - free to take any Goods with TotT until SHII]
HT until 10 dur (if Whistle was 9) or HT until 20 (if Whistle was not 9) [replace all HTs with PT when Good / Excellent
-If dur = 10) MMII [free to take any Goods
*(If dur = 20) CSII MMII [free to take any Goods
CZ SHII HT [until around 30 dur, replace all HTs with PT when Good / Excellent
-If Whistle was 9 earlier and If Whistle > 3) NW SH GS Ing/Inn BB CSII [be mindful of Goods / Excellents, if Inn mind your CSII progress
*If Whistle < 3) NW SH GS Ing/Inn BB CSII til full [again, be mindful of Goods/Excellents, if Inn mind your CSII progress

That was my personal developed specialist rotation for 70dur. FS turns depend on Difficulty.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lordparanoia

Well, al the moment i'm fine and i can craft everything in Hq. Thanks for your suggestion.

My rotation (for 70durability live morel salad) is:
CZ
IQ
WN
SH2
Hasty touchx5
Manipulation
CS II
COMFORT ZONE
CSII
MASTER MEND
CSII
STEADY HAND II
HASTY TOUCHX5
Great stride and byregot blessing
CSII

Il you have suggestions to optimize it i will Thank you.
Of course i will try Nanga's rotation :) Thank you

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i noticed you're using Masters Mend and Manipulation. That costs 180CP whereas one masters mend II costs 160 CP. try to drop those 2 and add a masters mend II :). Should save you approx 20CP

my personal opening rotation for 70dur crafts is as follows:

CZ (If my alch was 50)
IQ
SHII
HTx5 (using precise touch when available)
1 CSII
Masters Mend II (gets you back to 70dur)

The reason I'm doing the above is because SHII lasts 5 steps while you have 60 dur when you can get max effect out of MMII. So I HTx5 and then CSII so I dont waste a step of SHII :).

And then once I'm at 70DUR, I'll finish my craft depending on how many CSII's or RS's I need.


EDIT: Feel free to change the synths as needed depending on what you deem the best way to finish your craft. I always like to end on a CSII because it's the only 100% reliable way to finish. So right now the best way to gain large amounts of progress is through SHII+RS. If it's a craft where you can get multiple RS's off do so.

Comfort zone - Inner Quiet - Steady Hand 2. All tricks procs up to steady hand 2 are used to buy basic touches In place of hasty touch.

Tricks proc right after SH2 use precise touch then waste not. If not, then waste not. All good or excellent procs are used on precise touch, otherwise hasty touch 4 times replaced with basic touch for each ToT prior to SH2. I usually alternate HT and BT.

By this point, on 35 dur, i am at 15 dur.

Manipulation - CS2 - SH2 all procs to tricks.

That puts me at 25 dur with one charge of manip. Insert 2 BT/PT/HT as CP and procs allow.

I then do great strides, check for proc. Any proc between last touch and strides i ignore. If excellent proc, immediately byregots. If good, judge current quality, typically innovation then byregots unless over 20% or 9 plus IQ stack. Finish with CS2.

Now the above assumes you are In the 2 CS2 range with craftsmanship for that recipe. If not, save 21 cp for name of/brand of element or for gsm open w/ mark.

Raves, just so you know, in all my note taking, Good trumps over having Innovation up.

Steady Hand.
Check condition. Excellent - Byregot's. Anything else, continue.
Great Strides.
Check condition. Excellent, Good - Byregot's. Anything else, continue.
Innovation.
Check Condition. Excellent, Good - Byregot's. Anything else, continue.
Fish for a step. Observe, Ingenuity, whatever.
Byregot's.

Now that you mention it, that is probably the case. typing this out on my phone from memory after an 8 hour drive into the mountains, then cobbling my verbose post to fit char limit, i prolly goofed. what you lined out stands as the better approach. I will say i dont have room in 35/40 dur crafts for any fishing at the wnd as sh2 runs out, but typically byre is enough.

On a string of bad luck i will fish for brow, or on 70/80 dur crafts i will have one step of sh2 available for fishing.

If i remember right, i think blessing overcomes brow at higher than 7 stacks? Or is it 6?

Anyway, point to the OP is that where it matters, manually managing procs is best at the moment. There are skills i havent played with much, like all the whistle structure, and only a few crafts including inno touch. They all just seem to add more rng than they are worth if you have omni xclass already.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nanga

Let me see if this helps you:

695 CR
699 CN
371 CP
133 ilevel

Deep-Fried Okeanis (same difficulty as your salad) - no HQ mats.

CZ, IQ, SHII, RSx2, HTx2 (Good proc, ToT), CSII, Manip, SHII, CZ, HTx4 (Good proc, ToT), Manip (Good proc, ToT), SHII, HT (Good proc, ToT), HTx2, Manip, SHII, HTx2, GS, Byregot's Blessing - 11stack, CSII.

Progress 100 Quality 100, 5 CP remaining. I had 2 failed HT's.

This is a pretty typical synth rotation when I'm being super conserving of CP and using no crafting food.

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You are using all this 100% unnecessary stuff here and Not using PRECISE TOUCH which is what you want to USE.. Manip twice? Wastenot? WHY? good lord after / during progress precise/hasty to 10, MMII basic/precise to 20 and finish

Raves, yours was the only 35 or 40 dura rotaion I actually got to work, at my lvl and gear. So could you please help this old fart with no brain out, and actually type out what you do for the 7o and 80 duras, just like you did for the 35 and 40's? Please? With a cherry on top and some extra whipped cream? *Flutters eyelashes* :P

Edit: I am at lvl 53 with ONLY the lvl 53 craft gear from Heavensward, none of the pre-expansion stuff.

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Originally Posted by Roth_Trailfinder

40 Durability vs 35 Durability pretty much has no difference. You cannot do a WN->SH2->5HT rotation, but you can still use one move (CS2 or something) then use SH2->WN->4 moves then restore Durability, either MM1 or Manipulation. The change from 40 Durability down to 35 has had literally zero impact upon my patterns.

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Lol exactly. The amount of moronic thing i have seen people say about WN. You literally just swap the order of WN and SH2.

Quote:

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If i remember right, i think blessing overcomes brow at higher than 7 stacks? Or is it 6?

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Edit 6 forgot about the CP cost.

When IQ shows 5, or less, Brow is better than Blessing.

When IQ shows 6, then both are equal.

When IQ shows 7 or higher, Blessing is better than Brow.

Since you do not have makers mark or name of element yet (lvl 54), you will want Careful Synth 2 and Ingenuity:

CZ IQ SH2 - any procs you spend on tricks. I alternate HT and BT to use SH2 stack. Always use procs on precise touch while in this stage. Every tricks you had before buys you a BT in place of HT. This way you can stay on course with your CP.

Now after last touch, look for any procs up to next SH2. These will all be tricks. this buys one more BT in place of HT as follows

Manipulation - SH2 - HT

By now you should have 30 dur, 1 manip charge, 4 SH2 charges. An excellent proc here with good IQ stack and quality can be used in blessing/brow depending on your control.

Great strides if good/excellent blessing or brow. If not

Inno then blessing or brow.

You should have enough left for Ing 2 then three CS2 to finish. If you do not, use more HT to bank it. Basically after last touch you should have 106 CP? To finish.

Thank you SO much, Raves :D Will try this out once Ive finished gathering. I was getting so disheartened by not being able to find any working kind of rotation, that I was about to give up. Us old farts (also dosed up on too many meds every day) sometimes dont have the brainpower any more to work it all out by ourselves, so need a bit of help :)

No worries. If you were on Gilgamesh i could give more onthe spot guidance. I think once you spin through it a few times you will see where adjustment is needed. It really is not far removed from what Pathfinder and others have posted.

Will I be able to keep with this rotation, the higher I level? Or will I need to insert new skills, if so, where?.....sorry for all the questions, I am really grateful for the help :)