Please make it so that we get exp even if we are dead when the boss dies. Its very frustrating to lose out on so much exp right at the last second because a bunch of aoe's hit me while mid LB.
Please for the love of all that is holy!!!
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06-27-2015, 06:03 PMVesparPlease for the love of all that is holy!!!
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06-27-2015, 06:24 PModie
Dodge better. I've dealt with several DPS already that absolutely feel content to stand in every AOE they can. I, having the power to raise them, will not. Seems mean but I don't like it when people get carried even through 4 player dungeons.
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06-27-2015, 06:27 PMKilyneRead better.Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vespar
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06-27-2015, 06:31 PModie
I don't see how LB is an exemption. When i played as monk I would wait until I knew it was safe for the long cast LB3. Much easier to do with LB1 and LB2.
Just because you LB doesn't mean you should assume you're safe. Anticipate that you know, the fight is still going on. -
06-27-2015, 06:36 PMKilyne
We are talking about new dungeons. The fights are new and most people have not done them more than once. Sure you can anticipate the hits and use LB accordingly, but sometimes shit still happens.
+ you get locked in position for a sec or two after LB is finished. Enough time for AoE to hit you. -
06-27-2015, 06:41 PModie
I get that things happen, but I'm watching and can tell if it's an oops or someone who just simply doesn't care to dodge. I get hit every once in a while too but if I can dodge and still heal then DPS can still move too. If I see an attempt to dodge I cut slack. But back when titan hm was still hard I got my relic by healing DPS ONLY for tumult and the aoe after the heart. Everything else was on them. You can't always just assume the healer is going to fix everything because honestly some of us get tired of watching the same person eat everything.you'd be amazed how fast people learn to dodge when they know you aren't going to fix it. If I'm raising you over and over and over....ill stop.
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06-27-2015, 06:50 PMKilyne
Well that is true, some people refuse to dodge anything. They indeed don't deserve any heals or raises.
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06-27-2015, 07:11 PMreillyblairill be sure to leave any duty i see your name on then lolQuote:
Originally Posted by odie
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06-27-2015, 08:19 PMCUTS3RGet all my likes, as a WHM main i think alike. Im not here to fix people deliberate mistakes.Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
Ill be sure to commend him in any duty i see his name on.Quote:
Originally Posted by reillyblair
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06-27-2015, 08:39 PMloreleidiangeloNon-douchey healer main here popping in to say that I'll raise anyone as long as I feel like I'm not jeopardizing the success of the run to do so (ie, putting myself dangerously low on mana).Quote:
Originally Posted by CUTS3R
I've been in instances where the group has SHEATHED THEIR WEAPONS so that someone can slow-cast a raise with only 1% of the boss's HP remaining.
It's dungeons, people. You're not selling or carrying through Alexander Savage levels of content, here. "That guy now has to go do 5 FATEs in N Than to catch up on the exp he missed! Man, that'll sure teach HIM to dodge better next time! I ain't carrying no scrubs through 1/30th of their exp bar!"
/rolleyes -
06-27-2015, 08:47 PMstardrifterI like this, I main WHM and I try to be the best healer possible, if someone doesn't feel like dodging, I'll pick up the slack! If everyone is up at the end of the fight with health bars full then I guess I did my job.Quote:
Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo
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06-27-2015, 09:26 PMReinhaYeah, shame on him for not knowing when it's safe to LB in these new dungeons.... /sarcasm. How nice of you to immediately assume that anyone who dies does it out of laziness. I guess you never die in any content then?Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
OP I agree with you. Now that the majority of experience comes from bosses they should indeed give you xp even if you die. Just the other day I raised a healer who died and my swiftcast was on cd. When she finally got back some mp to start healing we were all low on health and I died to unavoidable damage just before the boss went down. No xp, thanks SE. I should've just left the healer dead if this is how I'm rewarded. -
06-27-2015, 09:33 PMIzulariaYesterday, I died at the last boss in the Aery. Do you know why? I was trapped in the Sable Price and nobody saved me 'cause the boss was at 4% of his health. I wasn't mad.. but I'm sure there's nothing one can do to avoid being trapped.. So nope, not my fault :pQuote:
Originally Posted by odie
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06-27-2015, 09:41 PMIlitsaThis. so much. I don't main a healer, but I certainly don't act like a dickmonger when I do play as one. Don't want to heal/rez? Don't play the three jobs that do that role, people. Then again people like this above poster replied to, prolly don't see picking up enemies that the healers/dps pulled off them as their job when tanking, either.Quote:
Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo
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06-27-2015, 09:42 PMVelisra
I'm still new enough playing FF that I didn't even know you didn't get xp if you died on a boss. That's kind of sad really. Heck, if you die at the very end, it's not like you didn't do your part for the bulk of the fight, and you should still get some xp.
If this penalty really must be part of the game, perhaps SE could adjust the mechanic so that if a player dies at >75% HP left on the boss, they don't get xp, but if a player dies at <25% HP left, xp is granted. Or just make it a reverse percentage method: as the HP on the boss goes down, the xp awarded goes up. Everyone still alive at the end gets full xp, those dead get a percentage of the full xp based on what percentage of the boss xp was left when they died.
When I did the Garuda encounter for the first time, there were two other completely new people in there with me who had never done it either, and an Astrologian healer who said she hadn't done that encounter in ages. It took us five tries, and I was the last one standing on all but one I think--and that was the very last attempt. The others got Garuda down from about 15% without me, and there was no time for them to raise me. I'd say I definitely did my part, but I guess I got no xp for that? That's a bit crappy, wouldn't you say? -
06-27-2015, 09:44 PMKaedrianLiangI just experienced a group of JP players that did that, the tank sheathed his weapon and seemed like he was intentionally kiting the boss away from me (dps), at first i was like "wtf?" then i caught on and followed their example. The dead guy was very happy at the end which made my day.Quote:
Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo
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06-27-2015, 10:41 PMTyrphisJust gotta say any healer who refuses to heal anyone or rez somebody for any reason is not doing there job and thus if I'm in a duty with that individual I will certainly be having them kicked from the team being as that individual is of no use anyways.Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
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06-27-2015, 11:20 PModieSo you think I should keep raising them? We have a word for them. It's Mana Sponge. Raises are expensive. We can't keep bringing you back because you think we have to. If that person can't dodge and causes me to work harder then it takes away mana that I could use to heal the tank. I should never be working harder to keep a dps alive than I am the tank. Think of my mana as an allowance. When you have used your allowance up, I'm cutting you off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrphis
I will also add that because most healers are quick to react, we may sometimes cast swift cast raise at the same time. That's 2 wasted swift casts and mana from both healers if it's an 8 player run. -
06-27-2015, 11:30 PMHypie
I must agree with the "non-raiser" ppl got lazy because they overgeared content. now they get their ass handed to them if they dont dodge. to die on a dungeon boss midlvling over and over again is a good wake up call that they have to be focused on the fight and it will be harder on 60 even. bismarck ex is a whole "dodge aoe while maximizing dps" check. so if you die over and over again in dungeons don't be mad but you wouldn't get a invite in my bismarck group.
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06-27-2015, 11:50 PMTyrphisto put it bluntly yes because that is what you signd on for when you chose to play a healer. I dont refuse to attack anything when the tank cant hold agro worth spit and im dps. or refusing to pull enemys off dps when they think its ok to attack the mob first while im the tank.Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
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06-28-2015, 12:00 AModieI signed on for a 15 dollar a month good time. That mana isn't yours. I have played this for about 2 years now and I'm not the only one that's gotten tired of those who just can't stay alive. If I keep raising you and run my mana dry and the tank dies and we wipe...and you still don't get better and I keep raising you and we wipe again, then I assure you the rest of the party will grow tired of your nonsense as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrphis
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06-28-2015, 12:46 AMSessurea
just don't lb if it looks risky, fighting the boss for another few seconds wont matter.
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06-28-2015, 04:28 AMCUTS3R
Once again Odie, you get all my likes.
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06-28-2015, 05:17 AMLunaHoshino
Frankly, as a melee DPS, I will not LB unless I am 100% sure it is safe to do so. I've had other party members yell at me to LB before, but you know what? A dead DPS is a useless DPS. I don't care if I have to wait 30 seconds for a mechanic to happen, I'm not going to get myself killed just so I can use the LB right away.
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06-28-2015, 05:23 AMMhikailExpansion just came out and people expect everyone to be Godlike.Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
Some people are not as good as others.
You're a healer, it's YOUR job to rez them and heal them.
Instead of stooping to their level [if intentionally being horrendous]
don't do that. You're screwing the fight for yourself and other people.
Especially we are chattin' 4 man dungeons....really?
Making us healer mains lookin' all bad. -
06-28-2015, 05:28 AMokitaluc
I think staying alive takes priority over lb , so don't use lb in a risky situation.
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06-28-2015, 05:33 AMAshkendorWhen you level healer classes, you'll learn two things: 1) mana is a finite resource and 2) raises are expensive. If you raise someone only to have them walk into the next pretty red circle and die again, it can turn into an enormous strain on the healer's mana pool. Not only that, but failing mechanics can also damage/kill other players, further compounding the problem. At a certain point, you have to basically cut them off. It's definitely more applicable in full party duties but I've seen it in light party as well. I've had to leave players dead simply because their consistent failure at mechanics made it so that I had to choose between them and the rest of the party. It sucks, but it's the truth; some people make it not worth raising them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrphis
As much as I hate to see people missing out on exp, I think that gaining exp while dead would be terribly abusable. Go into the boss fight, eat the first AoE, go afk and make the rest of your team try to finish it. It's not the brightest way to earn exp (especially as things stand now with us not hideously overgearing the content; some of the bosses are downright brutal if your DPS is low) but people would still do it because if there's a lazy way to go about something, someone will. :/ -
06-28-2015, 05:42 AMLemuriaIf they're intentionally not dodging, that's one thing. If they get hit when they clearly had no control over their character (such as in LB, as the OP mentioned) and you don't raise, you plain suck at your job.Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
Understand this much, fellow healers. If you choose the role, you need to fill the role. What you think should or shouldn't happen is irrelevant, because if you don't raise I'm going to assume that YOU are the bad player, not the one who died. If someone is dying repeatedly, then that's a clear exception. If they die once and you can't be bothered to Raise because of your own selfish reasons then you are the bigger problem. -
06-28-2015, 06:20 AModie
Let me make it clear that I didn't say I won't raise you if you fail once. Or if you fail LB. LB is not excusable though
I'm also not asking people to be godlike in their performance. I'm simply asking that the bad players that want to reach 60 and act like they have never seen a red circle on the floor before, figure out that it's bad to stand in it at some point soon. Not raising them doesn't make me a bad healer. You have fun letting the mana sponge be raised over and over. You won't be able to sustain your mana no matter how good you are if you plan on playing the good Samaritan. If you make it clear to me you can't stay alive, you're done. But again I did not ever say that you mess up once then you're screwed. I know a bad player when I see it and will keep them out of the fight if necessary -
06-28-2015, 06:29 AMbraneri1
If you can't understand the concept of triage then you're a terrible healer period. None of this bs pathetic moralizing will change that.
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06-28-2015, 06:31 AMVespar
Well it would seem my thread got derailed fast with arguing. Not surprising.
One of these days people will approach a conversation with tact.
Would appreciate if the mods would lock it since its obviously not going anywhere. /bow -
06-28-2015, 01:03 PMVirusChris
Would it be better if people got half the EXP if they're died when facing the boss as oppose to getting no EXP at all? I mean it could be abusable like Ashkendor said, but I still think we should be reward for the hard work of whittling down the boss' HP.
I think that's a better alternative. -
06-28-2015, 02:25 PMZordragehttp://memecrunch.com/meme/YQL/yo-da...tist/image.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by odie
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06-28-2015, 03:26 PMLTEvil
I thought this thread was about wanting exp when dead? Why are you guys running off on a tangent about what is morally correct and how someone should play?
In any one engagement I believe everyone deserves one raise at least. If the healer doesn't want to raise? Don't die or kick shrug. Tank won't provoke? Don't go over his aggro or kick. I always saw raise as a cushion for bad plays. Stop making bad plays(healers included)Harsh but true. Point is we all pay so we can play how we want. Just remember when you need to get a clear and you can't because you're on the blacklist of those who would help.
No to exp when dead. People slack in dungeons as is. -
06-29-2015, 03:56 AMthunderbreak
I thought this was gonna be a holy buff request thread lol.
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06-29-2015, 04:02 AMAdireSo, if someone does a good job all the way to 15% of a boss's hp, then dies when LB animation lock occurs or even makes a simple mistake, they deserve no credit at all?Quote:
Originally Posted by odie
The people on the official forums never fail to amuse. If it's clear someone is planning on being carried and you don't want to deal with it, kick them. That's what the feature is there for. If you allow them to continue to be carried, you are at fault. -
06-29-2015, 04:26 AModie
Adire, read back further where I said I only do it to bad players. If course I'd raise them if they were doing fine before.