Easiest dps right now

That's right, in ARR I liked to dps as a BLM because it had a simple, fun and satisfying rotation, the expansion messed things up hard, so right now which dps do you folks think has the simplest rotation?

Can't speak for the other jobs, but NIN feels easier than ever since you can weaponskill to refresh your haste buff without dealing with mudra recast / mudra lag. Positionals just require you move one time every 30 seconds so that's not even a problem.

Probably MNK or NIN to play at a decent, consistent level. They're mostly the same as ARR and it wasn't incredibly complex to begin with. Everyone else has new immobility modes or a crapload of variation in their rotations per the fight.

SMN for sure but maybe it's just easy to me because I started as one and know how to play it well. Switching between the pet and your abilities rapidly is like second nature now. Just dusted the old geezer off and ran DV. I forgot how enjoyable it was.

Dragoon without a doubt.

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Originally Posted by Vallhallix

SMN for sure but maybe it's just easy to me because I started as one and know how to play it well. Switching between the pet and your abilities rapidly is like second nature now. Just dusted the old geezer off and ran DV. I forgot how enjoyable it was.

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Your smn is not even 60...

I think most of the dps jobs got more depth to their gameplays so whatever happened to blm happened to pretty much all other dps classes.

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Originally Posted by Sessurea

Dragoon without a doubt.

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With 2 additional skills which require strict positional, I disagree.

I'm leveling as scholar/summoner and... no, its a royal pain to juggle all of the resources and cooldowns. People are complaining about blm dps, but summoner still feels like you're bombarding the enemy with thousands of wet towels.

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Originally Posted by Swordphobic

I'm leveling as scholar/summoner and... no, its a royal pain to juggle all of the resources and cooldowns. People are complaining about blm dps, but summoner still feels like you're bombarding the enemy with thousands of wet towels.

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If you liked BLM's simplicity in 2.0, you'll probably like it in 3.0.
I think you want a class that uses a few big attacks and has a clean, simple rotation, right? BLM is still that way, from the looks of it.
It doesn't have to multi-task as much during the actual rotation, but relies on timing and knowing the fight to minimize movement.
I.e. The rotation is the simplest but it's situationally hard to maximize.

I don't know if BLM has bad numbers now but if you like that play style then you can probably still perform well with it.

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Originally Posted by Sessurea

Dragoon without a doubt.

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Do you even play this game?

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Originally Posted by Allyrion

If you liked BLM's simplicity in 2.0, you'll probably like it in 3.0.
I think you want a class that uses a few big attacks and has a clean, simple rotation, right? BLM is still that way, from the looks of it.
It doesn't have to multi-task as much during the actual rotation, but relies on timing and knowing the fight to minimize movement.
I.e. The rotation is the simplest but it's situationally hard to maximize.

I don't know if BLM has bad numbers now but if you like that play style then you can probably still perform well with it.

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You are correct in saying that BLM has the easiest rotation. This all depends on if the OP means simplest rotation or simplest class to play. BLM is no where near the simplest to play. Very challenging actually.

BLM rotation doesn't seem super complex at level 60, but the trick is (as it was in 2.0) avoiding movement as much as possible. In 2.0 movement sucked because it reduced your damage output. In 3.0 that's still true, but movement can also result in you losing your stack of Astral Fire, or Enochian or having to move out of your Ley Lines. As a result, it becomes even more critical to minimize movement, and more complex when it comes time to recover from moving (e.g. I just had to move a bunch. Is astral fire going to fall off? Is Enochian going to fall off? Is it worth going with a Blizzard 3 + Swiftcast/Blizzard 4 to keep it going? How much longer on the cooldown? Should I drop Ley Lines now or delay it a few seconds so I can stand in it longer? etc...).

From what I understand (and my BLM is only 56 right now, so I may be wrong) at 60 BLM basically breaks down into 3 basic rotations. If Enochian is on, then use your fire4/blizz4 rotation for as long as possible. If Enochian is on cooldown, then use your 2.0 rotation until it's available again. If you are AOEing, then just use your 2.0 AOE rotation.

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Originally Posted by Garotte14

You are correct in saying that BLM has the easiest rotation. This all depends on if the OP means simplest rotation or simplest class to play. BLM is no where near the simplest to play. Very challenging actually.

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I thought I implied that. The rotation is clean and simple but can be hard to maximize during a real fight.

But we're not talking in a vacuum. The OP already said he played BLM in 2.0 and qualified that as a simple class that he enjoyed.
Personally, I don't we need another "hardest dps job" debate. People are just answering the title and not the actual OP.

The OP and his reply showed he's mostly talking about rotation and big numbers.
That's what I was replying to.
He liked BLM and found it simple in 2.0, and BLM seems to have natural additions to the same kind of playstyle.
If he liked that before, he'll probably like it now.

I haven't leveled BLM past 50 though, so I'm not 100%.
But things like immobility clearly isn't what he's talking about in terms of difficulty if he mained BLM in 2.0 and called it simple.

NIN has to be the easiest DPS right now.

In terms of complexity, both NIN and MNK are easy, but MNKs have GL and more positionals to worry about, so in terms of difficulty overall, NIN is the easiest IMO.

They made pretty much all jobs more complex and hard to play, except NIN and MNK, who are staying pretty much the same as before. I play MNK, and there really isn't much to learn for me from 50-60, other than remembering to use Meditation during downtime etc... I really hate it.

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Originally Posted by Swordphobic

That's right, in ARR I liked to dps as a BLM because it had a simple, fun and satisfying rotation, the expansion messed things up hard, so right now which dps do you folks think has the simplest rotation?

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Currently, no one is in a position to give an educated answer to your question because (obviously) no one has intensively played all jobs at 60 yet, which you would need to make a good comparison. All you can do now is make comparisons to your previous experiences.

So far i only played DRG to 60 and imo its much more stressful than anything i have played in 2.0 (which is all jobs). So it depends on how much more difficult the other jobs have become, but i would be surprised if the new DRG was one of the easier jobs.

Mnk is stupid hard to play now....very confusing with Grease L. Form Shift Meditation Chackra....SE over complicated the class now...it seems....muddled

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Originally Posted by Sovereign

If you are AOEing, then just use your 2.0 AOE rotation.

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Actually we can't even do that, because of the lack of potions we can't do a third flare anymore (Flare, Convert, Fire II+Flare, Mega-Ether or better, Flare).

But, at least Fire II got slightly buffed, it costs less mana now so we can do more of em per mana pool.

Probably BLM until you actually have to move.

NIN is pretty easy if you don't count DPS loss as a result of lag on mudra, but honestly their DPS is so high that even with that you'll probably be around the same DPS as other classes.

They also only have one move that you have to move for (Armor Crush) and that's only every 30s since you'll probably be standing at the butt, which is where their other 2 positionals (Aeolian Edge and Trick Attack) need you to be. Just learn the priority of Dancing Edge (Slashing Debuff) > Shadow Edge (Combo DoT) > Mutilate (single DoT) > Aeolian Edge (Normal, Damage Combo). Keep Huton up (3-2-1), use Suiton if possible (1-2-3), Kassatsu into Raiton (1-2), and Huton (3-2-1) Kassatsu Doton (3-1-2) for AoE. It can be daunting at first but with a little practice and memorizing the priorities, it's pretty easy. Just gotta watch the timers on your skills.

Guess I'll keep BLM as my go to dps, now if only I could get a new mouse to bind the extra skills...

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Originally Posted by Swordphobic

summoner still feels like you're bombarding the enemy with thousands of wet towels.

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That is exactly how summoner plays though.

How everybody is finding NIN easy and says SMN is hard ?

It's the same gameplay as SMN, but in much harder ways.

while smn fills with ruin, nin fills with combo.
while smn puts 3 dots in 3 spells, nin uses 2 combos and 1 spell to put 2 dots and 1 debuff, both gameplays require to have thoses buff/dot active always.
while smn has some oGCD and , nin has mudra AND oGCD

I'm main smn and when i finally reached the level 50 with nin, the only thing i though was : nin = hard melee version of smn. In all aspects possible.

It is funny hearing dragoons saying they are complicated cause they got a couple positional abilities. Meanwhile, monk has had many for quite some time. :P

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

It is funny hearing dragoons saying they are complicated cause they got a couple positional abilities. Meanwhile, monk has had many for quite some time. :P

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Its kinda funny that you say that dragoons have always had positionals and last i checked monks didn't lose 190 potency for missing a single move in their combo

Not to mention it's random which positional you get as a DRG.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

Its kinda funny that you say that dragoons have always had positionals and last i checked monks didn't lose 190 potency for missing a single move in their combo

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Plus Monks don't have to deal with RANDOM positional requirements, they always know which position is required up next and get into position accordingly. DRGs cannot plan ahead, as the 4th hit of either IDC ot TTT combo has a 50/50 chance of either requiring us to be on the flank OR at the rear of an enemy. Missing out on that positional requirement will cost a whopping 190 potency.

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

It is funny hearing dragoons saying they are complicated cause they got a couple positional abilities. Meanwhile, monk has had many for quite some time. :P

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The positionals are only one minor aspect really. Its a combination of doubling the amount of positioning, vastly increasing the potency loss for missing one, adding a new buff that needs to be maintained which is similar to greased lightning but more involved due to geirskogul, lenghtening the rotation and further increasing the already high amount of off GCDs.

I really feel that the new drg is not comparable to the old playstyle.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

Its kinda funny that you say that dragoons have always had positionals and last i checked monks didn't lose 190 potency for missing a single move in their combo

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Dragoon didn't even come close to monk in positional requirements until Heavensward. Dragoon had 2, monk had 6, dragoon got what, 2 more? I haven't leveled either but monk still has 6. Monk misses out on a lot of damage also if it doesn't do positional abilities correctly. This doesn't change the fact that both classes are -extremely easy- to play. Trying to act like dragoon getting a couple more positional abilities makes the class 'extremely complex' is funny.

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

Dragoon didn't even come close to monk in positional requirements until Heavensward. Dragoon had 2, monk had 6, dragoon got what, 2 more? I haven't leveled either but monk still has 6. Monk misses out on a lot of damage also if it doesn't do positional abilities correctly. This doesn't change the fact that both classes are -extremely easy- to play. Trying to act like dragoon getting a couple more positional abilities makes the class 'extremely complex' is funny.

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I can tell you you lose far less then 190 potency in your combo let alone in a single move

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

Dragoon didn't even come close to monk in positional requirements until Heavensward. Dragoon had 2, monk had 6, dragoon got what, 2 more? I haven't leveled either but monk still has 6. Monk misses out on a lot of damage also if it doesn't do positional abilities correctly. This doesn't change the fact that both classes are -extremely easy- to play. Trying to act like dragoon getting a couple more positional abilities makes the class 'extremely complex' is funny.

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Do you even read all of what was posted? Yes, DRG has to deal with 'only' 4 positionals, but missing out on the new positionals is a major screwjob on your DPS, as you lose out on 190 potency and basically just perform an auto attack (missing out on monk positional doesn't even come close to losing out on 190 potency). PLUS those new positionals are totally random, further increasing the probability to miss out on them, combined with crazy boss-turning mechanics this basically guarantees you to lose out on a couple of them. As a Monk positionals follow a strict flow and things end up being done by muscle memory. With those random postionals there is no such thing as a flow or muscle memory as you never know beforehand which position will be required for your 4th hit. And besides having to deal with those random positionals we also have an added layer of complexity in handling the Blood of the Dragon buff which is way more of an active thing then keeping up GL, as we aren't only required to keep it up (which comes naturally with performing a MNK's standard rotation btw.) but also to spend some of the remaining time to achieve maximum DPS (so it's a game of gaining and using an additional ressource), which means walking on a thin line to get out the maximum number of GKs without dropping BotD. This is indeed far more complex than the class used to be.

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Originally Posted by Vodomir

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No, I quite understand what you are saying. What I am saying is every Dragoon is grossly overestimating how hard it is to accomplish any of that. Have you played DPS in any other MMO that has random procs that if not used correctly, result in dramatic DPS loss? Cause I can name 2 off the top of my head, one that has atleast 6 of the classes that are like that. I'm sorry if I offended you (or any dragoons, or monks, or anyone) by saying your DPS class is easy.

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

No, I quite understand what you are saying. What I am saying is every Dragoon is grossly overestimating how hard it is to accomplish any of that. Have you played DPS in any other MMO that has random procs that if not used correctly, result in dramatic DPS loss? Cause I can name 2 off the top of my head, one that has atleast 6 of the classes that are like that. I'm sorry if I offended you (or any dragoons, or monks, or anyone) by saying your DPS class is easy.

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It's just that everyone and their dog is discussing job complexity in FFXIV and not in <insert your favorite MMO here>. I'm sorry, but what do other MMOs have to do with how difficult (or easy for that matter) DPS jobs in FFXIV are relative to each other? Besides using random procs (as in either use that proc or lose out on the addtional DPS it would have offered; it results in not using the proc, but not in losing out on a GCD; no random positioning forced upon you) is not exactly the same as a proc forcing you to be in a random position (and not being in the correct position is not only equal to losing out on bonus damage, but actually dropping you below what you would have achieved when just ignoring the proc and continuing with the next move; you essentially lose out on an entire GCD when hitting the skill from an incorrect position). You are merely comparing apples to oranges here. Btw. I have played other MMOs and I'm not saying the class is oh so f***ing complex, just suggesting you blatantly ignore the fact that dragooning got way more complex then it used to be and that it for sure is not the easiest DPS job in FFXIV.

It really is a personal opinion on all the classes for instance for me all the dps classes are easy as hell and I don't find maximizing any of them to be hard (but yes drg got annoying as hell not really hard per say just really annoying at times).

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Originally Posted by Vodomir

Btw. I have played other MMOs and I'm not saying the class is oh so f***ing complex, just suggesting you blatantly ignore the fact that dragooning got way more complex then it used to be and that it for sure is not the easiest DPS job in FFXIV.

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I am not ignoring anything. I just don't find it more complex. You are obviously offended, so I am just going to leave it at that. I find it easy, you don't. I don't find it complex, you do. Just how it is. Lets leave it at that so you can calm your hostility.

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

I am not ignoring anything. I just don't find it more complex. You are obviously offended, so I am just going to leave it at that. I find it easy, you don't. I don't find it complex, you do. Just how it is. Lets leave it at that so you can calm your hostility.

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I do not find it complex or hard or anything the like. It's just more complex than prior to HW and more complex than handling positionals on a Monk (see, this is a relative term, something can be more complex than before but still be considered easy). So for you doubling up on positionals, making those new positionals absolutely random and adding a new ressource to be managed adds absolutely zero complexity over how the class played before?

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Originally Posted by Vodomir

I do not find it complex or hard or anything the like. It's just more complex than prior to HW and more complex than handling positionals on a Monk (see, this is a relative term, something can be more complex than before but still be considered easy). So for you doubling up on positionals, making those new positionals absolutely random and adding a new ressource to be managed adds absolutely zero complexity over how the class played before?

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Yes, cause I have played much, much, much much much (x100000000000000000000000000000000000000) more complex classes not only on FF, but on other MMOs. Astrologian alone is much more complex than dragoon will ever be for instance.

Nobody is calling DRG a hard class to play. Just many of the other DPS are now easier than DRG. I'm talking about DPSing ing a decent way.

Also Geirskogul spam can be tricky. You got one more thing to be aware of.

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

No, I quite understand what you are saying. What I am saying is every Dragoon is grossly overestimating how hard it is to accomplish any of that. Have you played DPS in any other MMO that has random procs that if not used correctly, result in dramatic DPS loss? Cause I can name 2 off the top of my head, one that has atleast 6 of the classes that are like that. I'm sorry if I offended you (or any dragoons, or monks, or anyone) by saying your DPS class is easy.

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Lets compare who's the more technical sportsmen, Tiger Woods or Floyd Mayweather? You can't make an objective comparison like that, as they're both sportsmen of two different sports.

Just because there are more complex jobs in another MMORPG, it DOES NOT invalidate the complexity of a Job in this MMORPG. We're not comparing World of Warcraft, Lineage II, DAoC, Warhammer or Everquest Classes to Final Fantasy XIV Jobs. We're distinguishing the complexities of Jobs within this game and only this game.

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Originally Posted by Ogrumz

Astrologian alone is much more complex than dragoon will ever be for instance.

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Okay? And your point is? This is a discussion between DPS Jobs, not Healers. Again, you can't compare the complexity of a Healer to that of a DPS. They have completely different responsibilities and need to pay attention to different mechanics in an end-game scenario.

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Originally Posted by Dervy

Lets compare who's the more technical sportsmen, Tiger Woods or Floyd Mayweather? You can't make an objective comparison like that, as they're both sportsmen of two different sports.

Just because there are more complex jobs in another MMORPG, it DOES NOT invalidate the complexity of a Job in this MMORPG. We're not comparing World of Warcraft, Lineage II, DAoC, Warhammer or Everquest Classes to Final Fantasy XIV Jobs. We're distinguishing the complexities of Jobs within this game and only this game.



Okay? And your point is? This is a discussion between DPS Jobs, not Healers. Again, you can't compare the complexity of a Healer to that of a DPS. They have completely different responsibilities and need to pay attention to different mechanics in an end-game scenario.

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DERVY WHEN DID YOU FANTASIA

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Originally Posted by Dervy

Lets compare who's the more technical sportsmen, Tiger Woods or Floyd Mayweather? You can't make an objective comparison like that, as they're both sportsmen of two different sports.

Okay? And your point is? This is a discussion between DPS Jobs, not Healers. Again, you can't compare the complexity of a Healer to that of a DPS. They have completely different responsibilities and need to pay attention to different mechanics in an end-game scenario.

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My point is your class isn't some extremely hard to play thing that you need to get all hurt over someone pointing it out? There are several other DPS classes that have things that are 'just as hard' and 'just as annoying' and 'just as complex' as dragoon does. I don't find 2 random positionals adding complexity to a class.