expected dps in fcob

Hi all as a PS4 player it pains me to join farm parties for things sometimes, not knowing my DPS after all all I'm here to burn something down asap

I'm currently i123 blm with i130 ironworks weapons dreadwyrm choker i130 all apart from crafted HQ fully melded rings, hands belt

I ask most of the time, bit of a taboo subject in of parties. Recently I've began farming T10, steadily finding ideal positions for maxing deeps

I'm now averaging 500+ Max of 536
Lb2 only

Does lb count towards DPS?

I'm thinking perhaps during add phases to keep in melee range and will now start bringing pots
Am I performing poorly, I take it without echo I am achieving 440-480?

You're doing better than the average BLM, and no, LB isn't counted as your personal DPS.

By comparison, your average DF melee will struggle to break 500 in T10 even if they supposedly have it "on farm". That's a bit weak considering that there is ALWAYS something to hit in T10 and only one mechanic (being the Charge primary target) forces them to stand back from the boss for more than a second.

given your gear it could definitely be higher, but its not low enough to were i would be alarmed, that being said you sound like you havent been farming T10 for months, and spent long hours wiping during progression like some people out there have, so finding ideal ways to handle the various mechanics of the fight probably hasn't sunk in yet.

For your (suspected) gear and weapon, I'd say 540-570+ is a great sign of a good BLM. LBing (3) was lowering my DPS by 30 back without Echo so I suspect that may be impacting too. With the amount of echo in The Final Coil, LB shouldn't be a thing (in add phase), but you know, Party Finder.

mechanics aren't problem I've cleared this around 20 times, pretty much if you don't get hit by lighting you gotta do something. Thanks for the replies, I'll keep working on it )

Make sure you flare the adds if you want a quick boost lol. You can manawall the tailswipe as well, to avoid movement.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skeith-Adeline

Make sure you flare the adds if you want a quick boost lol. You can manawall the tailswipe as well, to avoid movement.

---

Manawalling the tail swipe is one of my favorite things. Everyone else scatters while you keep calm and carry on!

Yea haha. You hear your healers who aren't knowledgeable in the dark arts have mini-heartattacks lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skeith-Adeline

Yea haha. You hear your healers who aren't knowledgeable in the dark arts have mini-heartattacks lol

---

if thats all your after, its more fun doing that on titan with landslides, that or aetherial manipulating directly after the tail slam on leviathan ex when your on the slam side.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Stupiduglytaru

Am I performing poorly, I take it without echo I am achieving 440-480?

---

I think echo adds +15% at the moment. So if you average 500 DPS now, it would have been 425 DPS pre-echo.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by abzoluut

I think echo adda +15% at the moment. So if you average 500 DPS now, it would have been 425 DPS pre-echo.

---

the way to calculate accurately the dps pre-echo is NOT dps x0.85
to calculate pre-echo dps (without factoring all changes like phase timing being off) you divide your dps by 1.*echo*, so in this case, 1.15
500 dps post echo comes out to be 434.78 pre-echo

In addition to what Zamii said, it was aptly noted by Sleigh in another thread that you can't accurately compare pre and post-Echo DPS due to how the Echo changes the timing of phases, add uptime, CDs, etc.

For most turns, 400+ is OK (high is better and leaves less chance for mistakes with mechanics, however). For T13, 500+ is kinda necessary. If the total DPS is too low, it will start with slow pushes, but end with hitting enrage. It sounds like you're off to a good start... >500 is better than some BLMs my group has had recently... just keep trying to push it further.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

For most turns, 400+ is OK (high is better and leaves less chance for mistakes with mechanics, however). For T13, 500+ is kinda necessary. If the total DPS is too low, it will start with slow pushes, but end with hitting enrage. It sounds like you're off to a good start... >500 is better than some BLMs my group has had recently... just keep trying to push it further.

---

If BLM can do 500+ with echo in a group with even halfway competent dps I need to see it. The amount of downtime and how little you can actually aoe in add phase really destroys blm dps. My top run post echo is 515 and that was with dps that weren't good enough to burn the shit out of the adds before I could aoe and we had some downtime between dives and teraflare but not as much as some groups I've been in. Sometimes we wait a good 5-10 seconds between sins and 2nd dives and a good 15-20 between pain and tera

EDIT: Also forgot to mention dps before adds should be around 600-650. 700 if you're lucky on procs and no mechanics. The SCHs I run with are scrubs and like to use eos for fey covenant for gigas and rages though so no glow for me ;-;

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Meleoffs

If BLM can do 500+ with echo in a group with even halfway competent dps I need to see it.

---

I did one day 570 dps with my own smn in some party finder farm group in t13 so I think that 500 dps is not that hard reach for any dps job even if you can not aoe anything or have bit more downtime. Or maybe smn is just op lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Meleoffs

Snip.

---

I did 573 with echo with arguably some of the highest DPS groups in the game. Even with one flare only during the storm part and like 30+secs between Pain and Teraflare. Can probably hit 580+ with Nin+Selene all fight.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunako

I did one day 570 dps with my own smn in some party finder farm group in t13 so I think that 500 dps is not that hard reach for any dps job even if you can not aoe anything or have bit more downtime. Or maybe smn is just op lol.

---

Some jobs lose much more dps if they are forced to move than an SMN (or BRD) does.. thinking of T9 (meteors/thunder/fire-out), T10 (shielding) and T13 (Earthshaker/Megaflare/Flare Star) were I often out-dps BLMs 'cause if DoTs are applied I can just run aroung using Ruin2/Fester.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Neophyte

Some jobs lose much more dps if they are forced to move than an SMN (or BRD) does.. thinking of T9 (meteors/thunder/fire-out), T10 (shielding) and T13 (Earthshaker/Megaflare/Flare Star) were I often out-dps BLMs 'cause if DoTs are applied I can just run aroung using Ruin2/Fester.

---

Movement shouldn't be an issue to any half competent BLM. T13 doesn't require much movement anyway unless you are really unlucky and get every ES during last phase.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Meleoffs

If BLM can do 500+ with echo in a group with even halfway competent dps I need to see it. The amount of downtime and how little you can actually aoe in add phase really destroys blm dps.

---

I should have been a bit clearer... usually I mean DPS before downtime such as divebombs, rather than encounter DPS as a whole. Yesterday we had a BLM pulling 396 in p1 & p2. The group was actually good enough to handle all mechanics and we got to last phase just fine, but we hit enrage.

If you're doing 600+ before DBs... keep on keeping on.

re: adds. Maybe it's just my group but our tanks usually group them up so folks can AoE. I guess, this is not normal then..?

As for SCHs... even with echo, T13 is still probably the most healing intensive fight in the game currently. Granted, it's less difficult if everyone is absolutely perfect, but Eos can go a long way to helping keep the party alive, and the WHM from going OOM.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Meleoffs

If BLM can do 500+ with echo in a group with even halfway competent dps I need to see it. The amount of downtime and how little you can actually aoe in add phase really destroys blm dps.

---

if you look at the DnT dps leaderboard, their highest PRE-ECHO blm was 530 for t13, and to be honest, they hardly ever have the highest parses out there so i wouldnt doubt theres someone higher again, just because you personally cant do it, doesnt mean others cant. just consider the posts you've received on this thread as motivation to push yourself harder.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

I should have been a bit clearer... usually I mean DPS before downtime such as divebombs, rather than encounter DPS as a whole. Yesterday we had a BLM pulling 396 in p1 & p2. The group was actually good enough to handle all mechanics and we got to last phase just fine, but we hit enrage.

If you're doing 600+ before DBs... keep on keeping on.

re: adds. Maybe it's just my group but our tanks usually group them up so folks can AoE. I guess, this is not normal then..?

As for SCHs... even with echo, T13 is still probably the most healing intensive fight in the game currently. Granted, it's less difficult if everyone is absolutely perfect, but Eos can go a long way to helping keep the party alive, and the WHM from going OOM.

---

That's why I don't really like threads like this, because people compare in different ways... Not saying you did anything wrong, just have to be a little more clear.

I can get 700+ DPS as MNK before downtime if I'm lucky, but it much lower at the end of the fight :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zamii

if you look at the DnT dps leaderboard, their highest PRE-ECHO blm was 530 for t13, and to be honest, they hardly ever have the highest parses out there so i wouldnt doubt theres someone higher again, just because you personally cant do it, doesnt mean others cant. just consider the posts you've received on this thread as motivation to push yourself harder.

---

This is another reason I don't like threads like this... You can't always use things like that to compare to your average player. By average player, I don't mean casual players or something, cause it's the same for most hardcore players too.

What I'm talking about is that DPS can be measured in your favor. I don't know if that's the case with those numbers, but it's very common for really hardcore groups that want to push that DPS to the max, to actually do everything possible to increase DPS for one player or something. T10 is the obvious turn to skyrocket your BLM DPS ofc, but you can probably do something to increase it for T13 too. Probably don't get targeted by a single ES either, which increases DPS a ton.

I don't know how low ping some NA players get either, but I'm pretty sure EU on average gets lower DPS because of higher ping, which people have to remember... Not as big difference as Japan though, which is shown in videos by Lucrezia, where they get DPS on some jobs that is literally impossible with the ping in the west.

That being said, T13 is a pretty decent turn for BLM.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Craiger

That's why I don't really like threads like this, because people compare in different ways... Not saying you did anything wrong, just have to be a little more clear.

I can get 700+ DPS as MNK before downtime if I'm lucky, but it much lower at the end of the fight :)

---

Well, a 2 minute dummy parse seems to be the kind of informal semi-standard so usually think on comparable lines to that. But yes, in the future I'll definitely be clearer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Craiger

This is another reason I don't like threads like this... You can't always use things like that to compare to your average player. By average player, I don't mean casual players or something, cause it's the same for most hardcore players too.

...

I don't know how low ping some NA players get either, but I'm pretty sure EU on average gets lower DPS because of higher ping, which people have to remember... Not as big difference as Japan though, which is shown in videos by Lucrezia, where they get DPS on some jobs that is literally impossible with the ping in the west.

---

please dont come crying ping, with the exception of ninja you can perform optimal dps on 200 or less on all classes.

anyways, the OP was asking about min/maxing essentially, which to me sounds like he doesnt want to be just an average player, and its always nice to have a goal to strive for, heck even lucrezia said themselves they were trying to push for a sub 5 min run on t10, which they managed to achieve later on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zamii

please dont come crying ping, with the exception of ninja you can perform optimal dps on 200 or less on all classes.

---

Ping has a noticeable effect on DPS, period.
I can't stack 2 oGCDs without clipping. I can't fit 9 skills in the Berserk/BfB time frame.
If you can't understand why, don't go spouting that nonsense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zamii

please dont come crying ping, with the exception of ninja you can perform optimal dps on 200 or less on all classes.

anyways, the OP was asking about min/maxing essentially, which to me sounds like he doesnt want to be just an average player, and its always nice to have a goal to strive for, heck even lucrezia said themselves they were trying to push for a sub 5 min run on t10, which they managed to achieve later on.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EllPii

Ping has a noticeable effect on DPS, period.
I can't stack 2 oGCDs without clipping. I can't fit 9 skills in the Berserk/BfB time frame.
If you can't understand why, don't go spouting that nonsense.

---

Thanks.

Ping actually makes a big difference in this game when it comes to DPS, much more than it should... And it's probably because they are developing the game with <10 ping in mind, like they have in Japan. The difference in ping that a Japanese player can get compared to mine, makes a big difference in DPS. Even if you make a robot that presses the keys as fast as possible, and does the exact same rotation with the exact same amount of crits etc, the robot playing in Japan would still out-DPS me by a pretty large margin actually.

I don't have 200 ping, but if you compare that to a Japanese player, the difference is huge. It's not the same between NA and EU, and I don't know how low ping the people who get those numbers have, but even if it's not a huge difference in ping, it does make a noticeable difference in DPS. I didn't say those players have much lower, or lower at all, ping than me, I just brought it up as a reason why you can't always compare your DPS to others...

EDIT: Also, from what I can understand, the OP doesn't really ask for what the best of the best FCs in the world can get when trying to get perfect runs with their statics... Doesn't sound like he has a static to begin with, let alone a really hardcore one. No offense OP. Trying to get the maximum DPS in PF isn't really easy, and you have to be really lucky.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zamii

if you look at the DnT dps leaderboard, their highest PRE-ECHO blm was 530 for t13, and to be honest, they hardly ever have the highest parses out there so i wouldnt doubt theres someone higher again, just because you personally cant do it, doesnt mean others cant. just consider the posts you've received on this thread as motivation to push yourself harder.

---

Pre-echo isn't post echo. It's a completely different environment as adds don't get burned down quite so fast. I run with a nin that does 750 dps all the way until tera when we sit forever and he drops to 600. Nor did I ever say I was the best blm. I find it difficult to believe that a BLM could do > 515 WITH echo. I barely beat my pre-echo dps numbers because adds die so fast.

OneWinged, comparing SMN and BLM is absurd as you don't lose ALL your aoe in one GCD when an add you were targeting dies. You have a more reliable and consistent way of doing aoe than BLM does in a high dps echo fueled environment.


Also, 50 ping is worth 15-20 dps. That's a lot. Most western players play with somewhere between 40-90 ping. Worse in EU.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Meleoffs

Snip.

---

Where did I compare BLM to SMN ? I said I did 573 on my BLM.

And lol @ BLM losing more DPS than SMN in a higher DPS group. Having an add die while you are trying to finish a flare cast is just bad chemistry with your group.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Meleoffs

OneWinged, comparing SMN and BLM is absurd as you don't lose ALL your aoe in one GCD when an add you were targeting dies. You have a more reliable and consistent way of doing aoe than BLM does in a high dps echo fueled environment.

---

As SCH I find that my personal DPS takes a significant hit in phases where adds are instagibbed. At least BLM can get a whopping hit or two in; DoT AoE is severely blunted by abbreviated add phases.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

Where did I compare BLM to SMN ? I said I did 573 on my BLM.

And lol @ BLM losing more DPS than SMN in a higher DPS group. Having an add die while you are trying to finish a flare cast is just bad chemistry with your group.

---

My bad I confused with the guy who posted above you. And I suppose thats also true considering I just formed my group like 3 weeks ago.

With lower raid DPS, it was very possible to bloat your numbers to high hell in T13 with incessant AoE during the add phase, so hitting 500+ without Echo isn't implausible. The only fight in Final Coil where bloating really wasn't an option was T11 (which I still think is one of the best fight to truly judge a BLMs worth pre-echo). Also, I kinda see it hard for BLMs NOT to hit 500+ in T13, even with great DPS. Even the times when I come out of Add phase in horrible shape (480s after Tera), I can still leverage out at 525+.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skeith-Adeline

With lower raid DPS, it was very possible to bloat your numbers to high hell in T13 with incessant AoE during the add phase, so hitting 500+ without Echo isn't implausible. The only fight in Final Coil where bloating really wasn't an option was T11 (which I still think is one of the best fight to truly judge a BLMs worth pre-echo). Also, I kinda see it hard for BLMs NOT to hit 500+ in T13, even with great DPS. Even the times when I come out of Add phase in horrible shape (480s after Tera), I can still leverage out at 525+.

---

I suppose the problem lies with me then. I guess its fair to mention I don't use food or pots. Too much of a cheapass at this point and people are hyper overcharging (30k per for flints fml, and 6-7k per int) for things.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Meleoffs

Pre-echo isn't post echo. It's a completely different environment as adds don't get burned down quite so fast. I run with a nin that does 750 dps all the way until tera when we sit forever and he drops to 600. Nor did I ever say I was the best blm. I find it difficult to believe that a BLM could do > 515 WITH echo. I barely beat my pre-echo dps numbers because adds die so fast.

OneWinged, comparing SMN and BLM is absurd as you don't lose ALL your aoe in one GCD when an add you were targeting dies. You have a more reliable and consistent way of doing aoe than BLM does in a high dps echo fueled environment.


Also, 50 ping is worth 15-20 dps. That's a lot. Most western players play with somewhere between 40-90 ping. Worse in EU.

---

my point was it should give a base line to aim for, its not exactly like echo will lower your dps.

anyway, im not overly interested in arguing ping, if people want to believe thats why they do low dps, then be my guest, but if i followed that logic i wouldnt be doing nearly as well as i do.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zamii

my point was it should give a base line to aim for, its not exactly like echo will lower your dps.

anyway, im not overly interested in arguing ping, if people want to believe thats why they do low dps, then be my guest, but if i followed that logic i wouldnt be doing nearly as well as i do.

---

It makes a larger different on some classes than others. Mudras are a great example. With BLM I know for sure it changes when I can slide cast and shortens the distance I can move. Precise muscle memory can make it less of a loss but in general it's a dps loss compared to someone in Japan vs people not in Quebec.

Since we are talking about ping here I would like 2 ask some NA players it is possible do auto attacks between ruin or fire cast if you continue spam it? Or do it work sometimes only because EU servers have such high ping?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunako

Since we are talking about ping here I would like 2 ask some NA players it is possible do auto attacks between ruin or fire cast if you continue spam it? Or do it work sometimes only because EU servers have such high ping?

---

It's usually about every 6-7 seconds. Sometimes around 12s, sometimes 3s.

For me it's usually about 1/3 AA rate between Fires, but obviously procs and after F3/B3 it's far more likely.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sleigh

It's usually about every 6-7 seconds. Sometimes around 12s, sometimes 3s.

For me it's usually about 1/3 AA rate between Fires, but obviously procs and after F3/B3 it's far more likely.

---

Ok pretty much same than for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skeith-Adeline

The only fight in Final Coil where bloating really wasn't an option was T11 (which I still think is one of the best fight to truly judge a BLMs worth pre-echo).

---

This and the thread in general got me interested what you black magicians have gotten in t11 post-echo. 586 is my best so far without food, pots, NIN and BRD. Only ate one Gas.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Waliel

This and the thread in general got me interested what you black magicians have gotten in t11 post-echo. 586 is my best so far without food, pots, NIN and BRD. Only ate one Gas.

---

582 pre echo was my highest and 667 post echo. That's with food, pots, Nin and a bard with two BV'd foes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

582 pre echo was my highest and 667 post echo. That's with food, pots, Nin and a bard with two BV'd foes.

---

Makes me sad that I can't have nice things when I play BLM. Almost always need to play healer in my group of friends, and when I get to BLM I end up with an Eos SCH, sometimes no BRD at all, and often no NIN lol.

I need to hire a pocket BRD and NIN.