Billing...

Change the billing for XIV, please! Before the game gets to the point where we have to worry about paying for it. Even if the game became great by tomorrow, the billing sucks so hard that a lot of people wouldn't even want to play. I have never seen a more ridiculous, convoluted billing system in my life.

Charge us the exact amount, none of this Crysta nonsense. Charge us directly, why do you even need a 3rd party involved? I honestly didn't think it was possible, but SE has found a billing system with even WORSE customer support than FFXI.

What Kiroh said, the current system is so messed up, I am in Australia and we can't even use Crysta so why have that system in place if everyone can't use it.
Please go to the a system like FFXI has with direct pay that is easy to set up and use.

same, i pay through my friend's credit card, if i had to pay it directly.... i mostly wouldnt. it was a pain to get it to work.

I would like to bring this topic up again as this a critically important part of any business, doubly so for an MMO.

Having had issues in the past with never before heard of 3rd parties when it comes to paying for things, I would greatly appreciate it if SE moved to a reputable, WELL KNOWN company to handle payments.

And no, not Paypal.

Surely a company like SE can work something out with SOMEONE the community has heard of. Visa? Amex? Amazon? I'm fairly sure they offer online billing services to companies, and I'm certain Amazon does.

Further, I would also like to point out that the biggest issue I have getting friends or guild mates from other games to try FFXIV is the billing system.

The moment they run into this crysta business, or the company which handles credit card billing, their interest turns sour.

Pile onto this the fact that they are limited to a single character slot, and additional fees are levied monthly for adding more? I've gotten maybe three people to get past setting up an account and actually log into a server. And this is from a pool of friends and a fairly large gaming clan.

Agreed the pay system for SE products are extremly a pain in the ass. To play this game you need what like 3 seperate accounts for it. Ya its a pain.

If i remember right the JP get a way to pay them straight up like FFXI. Which in ffxi they had other way to pay them beside using credit card. I seem everyone beside JP get the end of the stick again. So yes i wish we get better payment

@phenidate: Sadly if you more then one Character you have to pay the 3$ which = 15.99 so about 1$ and 99 cent more then any mmo out there. If they give you 2-3slot for free they wont make the $ they would have made.

Really the only point having other Slots Characters is for RP and other reasons but not enough to really say oh ok they really do need other free slot.

If and when it goes back to a pay to play monthly fee, I would greatly appreciate a more streamlined approach.

We have what, 3 or 4 sites now?

We have SE's site, which has its own community account. This one is unrelated to FFXIV in any way.
There is the FFXIV account site, where I can set up billing. There account I have here is at least used on the lodestone site.

We have the Lodestone site, which doesn't let me get to the billing, but has all the information I need to get started or
keep up to date on the game. I can log in with my game account.

And then we have finalfantasyfxiv dot com, which used to be the teaser site and is now some useless publicity page that doesn't link to anything important other than the SE community site useless to anything about FFXIV.

That last website right there should BE what the Lodestone is PLUS the account management site. When I type in the games name I should go to an actual, useful website. It should get me to billing, to the 'lodestone' and the official community sites.

I don't want to have several sites book marked so I can check up on game updates, manage my account, and take care of billing.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

@phenidate: Sadly if you more then one Character you have to pay the 3$ which = 15.99 so about 1$ and 99 cent more then any mmo out there. If they give you 2-3slot for free they wont make the $ they would have made.

Really the only point having other Slots Characters is for RP and other reasons but not enough to really say oh ok they really do need other free slot.

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Square-Enix is the ONLY company that does this. There is no real justification beyond "because". If they can make a profit on the, what, 12.99 a month? They should be fine if I can make two or three characters. There is no additional strain on their servers to do so, I am not playing them simultaneously.

It could be there are several servers we want characters on.

Maybe we just want a the option of having two different races for change of pace.

We could look at it based on the current stat system. Considering the dev team has everything set up so we don't have to spend all day to accomplish anything, the point respec system seems to fly against all of their reason. Have a character set up to do physical stat classes, and another in magical stats would be a reasonable justification for atleast two character slots.

If and when they include PVP, there is the possibility of having PVE and PVP servers. I certainly would like a character on both kinds of servers for when feel I want to go kill and be killed, or just cooperate.

Eventually, you're going to get to a point where your classes are leveled to high for you to play with a friend who has just started on the server (not to cap per say, but high enough, it would be unfeasible). It'd be great to have the option to roll an alt and help them catch up without incurring an obnoxious fee, and have that alt ready should you need to do so with another friend.

This last option would be particularly helpful when FFXIV becomes popular again and people start to join up. All of us are at risk of hitting this point during our free to play period, unless you plan to play a DoH or DoL with their DoW.

i find this issue to be irrating as well.. current billing system rejects every single of my credit card because this 3rd party bullshit doesnt have service at my region and doesnt accept crysta, i had to ask my friend to help me for payment with their credit card..

do i really have to go through all this just to play this game? there is not much problem now since its still free, but i can see a hell lot of trouble in the future when SE decided to charge me..

Customer Service basically tells me gtfo there is nothing we can do to help you when i ask if i can change my country origin to the one that provides crysta, cmon.. i just want to pay for your game.. SE's customer service got to be one of the worst.

/endrant

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Phenidate

If and when it goes back to a pay to play monthly fee, I would greatly appreciate a more streamlined approach.

We have what, 3 or 4 sites now?

We have SE's site, which has its own community account. This one is unrelated to FFXIV in any way.
There is the FFXIV account site, where I can set up billing. There account I have here is at least used on the lodestone site.

We have the Lodestone site, which doesn't let me get to the billing, but has all the information I need to get started or
keep up to date on the game. I can log in with my game account.

And then we have finalfantasyfxiv dot com, which used to be the teaser site and is now some useless publicity page that doesn't link to anything important other than the SE community site useless to anything about FFXIV.

That last website right there should BE what the Lodestone is PLUS the account management site. When I type in the games name I should go to an actual, useful website. It should get me to billing, to the 'lodestone' and the official community sites.

I don't want to have several sites book marked so I can check up on game updates, manage my account, and take care of billing.



Square-Enix is the ONLY company that does this. There is no real justification beyond "because". If they can make a profit on the, what, 12.99 a month? They should be fine if I can make two or three characters. There is no additional strain on their servers to do so, I am not playing them simultaneously.

It could be there are several servers we want characters on.

Maybe we just want a the option of having two different races for change of pace.

We could look at it based on the current stat system. Considering the dev team has everything set up so we don't have to spend all day to accomplish anything, the point respec system seems to fly against all of their reason. Have a character set up to do physical stat classes, and another in magical stats would be a reasonable justification for atleast two character slots.

If and when they include PVP, there is the possibility of having PVE and PVP servers. I certainly would like a character on both kinds of servers for when feel I want to go kill and be killed, or just cooperate.

Eventually, you're going to get to a point where your classes are leveled to high for you to play with a friend who has just started on the server (not to cap per say, but high enough, it would be unfeasible). It'd be great to have the option to roll an alt and help them catch up without incurring an obnoxious fee, and have that alt ready should you need to do so with another friend.

This last option would be particularly helpful when FFXIV becomes popular again and people start to join up. All of us are at risk of hitting this point during our free to play period, unless you plan to play a DoH or DoL with their DoW.

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SE would never Add open pvp they would add the same PVP from ffxi. They would never make PVP worlds only that for sure so no need to worry about that. There really no point beside you want to be other race the level up with a friend thing they could easy add so you level down to your friend level there fix your problem. Really 12.99$ for 1 char does it all it pretty dam good to me.

But i could see the need for the very few who do want other slot. maybe they could make it so your 2# slot is 1$ and everything else would be 3 that would not be so bad.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

If i remember right the JP get a way to pay them straight up like FFXI. Which in ffxi they had other way to pay them beside using credit card. I seem everyone beside JP get the end of the stick again. So yes i wish we get better payment

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Um. My account is Japanese, but we have the same Crysta system that needs to go through a credit card.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

There really no point beside you want to be other race the level up with a friend thing they could easy add so you level down to your friend level there fix your problem....


Quote cut short, my reply is already approaching wall of text length~Phenidate

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Leaving aside how long it took them too actually add anything like a rank down system in FFXI...

Speaking from my own desire here. I have played FFXI. I have also played many other MMOs, and am what is called an altoholic, it started in FFXI, and it drove me to WOW because of how SE handles it. Too be charged for wanting to play a different character or race; to me, it's ridiculous and a slap in the face for wanting to do it. I don't RP. It doesn't factor into my desire too play multiple characters. Any MMO you go to play, you'll find plenty of people like that.

That aside, I think this is getting to far off the topic of how billing itself is handled. The main reason it was brought up was because of how SE decides too split its billing.

Moving back to the mess that is billing right now, I'd remembered how they split up the billing charges needlessly.

They have the 'basic' service, which from what I can tell, earns me the right to let them charge me for the sake of charging me. I have to pay a smaller fee to have any character at all on the server.

These services fees should be combined into a single fee like any other MMO out there. FFXIV can be a unique flower in the MMO market, but here it should be standard like the rest.

no one really had an issue paying the character fees

since you guys are so smart, did it every register that unlike other mmo which has a flat fee, ffxi and ffxiv are one of the only few mmo that lets you use all classes/job as 1 character. Most with flat time fees are 1 character 1 class. the reason I say this is due to most mmo with 1 character 1 clas, you end uo having to lvl up other character. So they don;t charge you for it. Where With ffxi/ffxiv you don't need to make a new character. most ppl made mules on ffxi which is why retainers are $1

Also correct me if I'm wrong, but there are 2 ways to set up crysta. CC or through a point card you can pick up at any gamestop or other places. This its like the ultimate gamer card or something?

I think you guys are complaining to complain. And the reason for multi accounts is for security.

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Originally Posted by Kilta_Firelotus

I think you guys are complaining to complain. And the reason for multi accounts is for security.

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really now? i really have the urge to bash you right now, but i will give u benefit of doubt that u didnt read my post.

im reposting what i said so you can read

Quote:

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i find this issue to be irrating as well.. current billing system rejects every single of my credit card because this 3rd party bullshit doesnt have service at my region and doesnt accept crysta, i had to ask my friend to help me for payment with their credit card..

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That payment processor that escapes my mind now (the one that charges monthly) is incredibly shady from what I've heard, doing things like not letting people cancel MMOs because "they signed a contract" and requiring the player to block the payments with their bank--which the company will even contest sometimes. I haven't had too much issue getting Crysta what with the UltimateGameCards being easy to come by, but the billing system is still way overly complex, and the requiring payment for extra characters thing should be reconsidered.

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Originally Posted by BotenAnna

That payment processor that escapes my mind now (the one that charges monthly) is incredibly shady from what I've heard, doing things like not letting people cancel MMOs because "they signed a contract" and requiring the player to block the payments with their bank--which the company will even contest sometimes. I haven't had too much issue getting Crysta what with the UltimateGameCards being easy to come by, but the billing system is still way overly complex, and the requiring payment for extra characters thing should be reconsidered.

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They are called Click and Buy, and from what I've found they are extremely difficult to contact when anything goes wrong with their service.

You have a card that doesn't work with their system? Good luck finding one in your region that will then.
You canceled your account? You may find out you're still being charged. Good luck contacting them to stop.

Seriously, we had a billing system that worked with FFXI for YEARS and continues to work. Why can't we use that? There was no issue with Direct Pay.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Phenidate

Leaving aside how long it took them too actually add anything like a rank down system in FFXI...

Speaking from my own desire here. I have played FFXI. I have also played many other MMOs, and am what is called an altoholic, it started in FFXI, and it drove me to WOW because of how SE handles it. Too be charged for wanting to play a different character or race; to me, it's ridiculous and a slap in the face for wanting to do it. I don't RP. It doesn't factor into my desire too play multiple characters. Any MMO you go to play, you'll find plenty of people like that.

That aside, I think this is getting to far off the topic of how billing itself is handled. The main reason it was brought up was because of how SE decides too split its billing.

Moving back to the mess that is billing right now, I'd remembered how they split up the billing charges needlessly.

They have the 'basic' service, which from what I can tell, earns me the right to let them charge me for the sake of charging me. I have to pay a smaller fee to have any character at all on the server.

These services fees should be combined into a single fee like any other MMO out there. FFXIV can be a unique flower in the MMO market, but here it should be standard like the rest.

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it's clear that you just want to play more then one Char then you should play wow or one of it's clone. FFXIV and FFXI is build around one Char level it up there no need to play other race if you can't pay 1 or the 3$ for it then play something else there not much you can do about that issue really.

The reason they using this billing because many players dislike the POL payment and want other way to pay for the game and now it seem we want just to pay them with CC then buying crysta and what not.

APB had this issue and believe me thats one game you dont want to be sharing issues with.

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Originally Posted by Mikita

Um. My account is Japanese, but we have the same Crysta system that needs to go through a credit card.

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that what i heard the jp had other way to pay i never said it was there but i did hear this around the starting of FFXIV so i don't know if this was true or not. This is when FFXIV was not going to be a F2P and SE was about to bill everyone and they was getting mad about the click and buy. I hoping onces we have to pay again they give us other way to pay i dislike the click and buy to many step to set it up and cancel it.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

that what i heard the jp had other way to pay i never said it was there but i did hear this around the starting of FFXIV so i don't know if this was true or not. This is when FFXIV was not going to be a F2P and SE was about to bill everyone and they was getting mad about the click and buy. I hoping onces we have to pay again they give us other way to pay i dislike the click and buy to many step to set it up and cancel it.

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At least on the subject of Click and Buy and how they have the system set up we can agree on.

Bringing attention to it now and how difficult subscribers find it to use, understand or deal with. When they resume billing for the game, it will be that much harder to change the system.

If anything, I'm sure SE doesn't want a country they released this game to be unable to play; because the 3rd party guys handling the billing side are to incompetent to accept this regions payment methods.

Lets move back to how they did it in FFXI, or something else that's better than right now.

They can keep the Crysta thing. I see nothing wrong with alternatives to using a bank or credit card to pay. But Click and Pay or Buy or what ever needs to go.

Click2Buy is fucking dumb. I'm not signing up for that shit.

Square-Enix... Please listen.... You don't want to run your own credit card service?? Fine. Here's the solution:

https://checkout.google.com/sell/?gl=US&hl=en

I'm agreeing with this. Lol, it's hilarious honestly. You'd think the the paying page would be the EASIEST and most efficient part of the game. Make it SIMPLE for me to GIVE YOU MY MONEY.

Out of curiosity, can anyone who is familiar with international regulations answer the following?

Is it possible that the reason we have this convoluted system is that we're essentially purchasing a service from another country? From what I've read in this thread so far, Japanese players aren't required to jump through these hoops (though there seems to be some dispute about this); however, NA players are essentially paying for a service based entirely in a separate country. Even if Japanese players do have to buy crysta, they would still have one less system to traverse than us.

I don't understand the Crysta system.

Why go through 3 different things when you could just go through 1?

Dreamer, Square-Enix has US bank accounts.

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Originally Posted by BelgianRofl

Dreamer, Square-Enix has US bank accounts.

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They also appear to have European bank accounts. They do not seem to have Australian ones or I would not be experiencing the following problem.

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Originally Posted by XyonicS

What Kiroh said, the current system is so messed up, I am in Australia and we can't even use Crysta so why have that system in place if everyone can't use it.
Please go to the a system like FFXI has with direct pay that is easy to set up and use.

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Like Xyonics, I also have no way around using my credit card on click and buy. What Xyonics has neglected to mention is that we Australians will also be forced to pay in Euro. That's foreign currency conversion fees on top of a currency with an exchange rate that is not in our favour. So Australians will be paying up to 50% extra for the same service as North Americans depending on how the economy is feeling.

On top of business hour alignments probably making it difficult to get in touch with a European arm of click and buy during a waking hour. I'm not looking forward to having to contact click and buy if they mess up my billing, given that I'm down to pay for myself and two housemates who had no other payment method than to borrow my card that have since stopped playing.

So yeah, multiple layers of problems for Australians in this department...

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Originally Posted by Catapult

They also appear to have European bank accounts. They do not seem to have Australian ones or I would not be experiencing the following problem.



Like Xyonics, I also have no way around using my credit card on click and buy. What Xyonics has neglected to mention is that we Australians will also be forced to pay in Euro. That's foreign currency conversion fees on top of a currency with an exchange rate that is not in our favour. So Australians will be paying up to 50% extra for the same service as North Americans depending on how the economy is feeling.

On top of business hour alignments probably making it difficult to get in touch with a European arm of click and buy during a waking hour. I'm not looking forward to having to contact click and buy if they mess up my billing, given that I'm down to pay for myself and two housemates who had no other payment method than to borrow my card that have since stopped playing.

So yeah, multiple layers of problems for Australians in this department...

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you can't buy "Ultimate Game Cards"? or they don't sell it there? If i remember right they are now selling at "EB Games" try and go and see if they selling it there that only 20$. you have enough to buy more char or npc lol.

pro tip : not every country provides/accept crysta.

i believe australia being one of them.

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Originally Posted by Chardrizard

pro tip : not every country provides/accept crysta.

i believe australia being one of them.

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oh that right :( that suck then. i know for one wont be paying with crysta i be paying with dumb click and buy. I dont' want to waste more then i have to on i just want to pay my 12.99 :(

Sad case is that my country(Malaysia) is not listed in the option; thus not only i didnt get my Certificate; i was told to choose the closest which is brunei; which also does not have Crysta and which also does not accept my Debit Card; which i have to use my friend's credit card while i'm waiting for my own Credit Cards; which i also heard so many players from my country unable to bypass with their credit cards; which in terms make me worried for the future for me to pay.

I prefer paypal.