Question to the Devs RE: Spiritbonding

Is there a way to restrict the spiritbonding of DoH and DoL gear to crafting and gathering, respectively?

The reason I ask this question stems from a particularly dodgy run through Castrum Meridianum, in which a WHM was found to have little more than crafting gear and proved utterly incapable of doing much of anything. While everyone else was able to eventually complete the stage, I really feel that that WHM was showing total disrespect for the job and us by gearing in such a way.

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Originally Posted by Hayward

Is there a way to restrict the spiritbonding of DoH and DoL gear to crafting and gathering, respectively?

The reason I ask this question stems from a particularly dodgy run through Castrum Meridianum, in which a WHM was found to have little more than crafting gear and proved utterly incapable of doing much of anything. While everyone else was able to eventually complete the stage, I really feel that that WHM was showing total disrespect for the job and us by gearing in such a way.

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Sadly, the speed of SB while fighting is WAY faster than gathering & crafting. Wish the devs would address THAT. :(

But, CM? The WHM should've been able to hold up even in crafting gear. :/

Personally, I don't mind some right side stuff or a few items here and there just for SB in dungeons, but an entire gear set is a bit much, I'll agree. ^^:

The best way to address it would be to not have crafting/gathering gear count towards the required item level of the dungeon.

Its annoying to do dungeons and have people wearing crafting gear, gathering gear, or gear not meant for their class (bard wearing Int gear, ect.).

There's other annoying things people do in regards to spiritbonding and dungeons, but I won't go down that road.

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Originally Posted by Alysanne

The best way to address it would be to not have crafting/gathering gear count towards the required item level of the dungeon.

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Unfortunately, that won't change much because they would queue with their main gear on, then switch to DoL/H gear once they're inside the instance, thus bypassing the entry restriction.

If they changed it so you can't change ANY gear inside the instance, you'll hear a lot of complaints about that too, like tanks who like to do mass speed pulls in more defensive sets then help crush bosses in more STR-based sets.

The solution to restrict SBing to specific tiers generally does the job, I feel. Though to present an alteration on your idea here, I wonder if there's a way to restrict gear from accumulating Soulbind % in instances if the piece of gear doesn't share a primary stat of your class/job. That might be an interesting work around to get DoH/L gear outta instances for good.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

That might be an interesting work around to get DoH/L gear outta instances for good.

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But this doesn't solve the problem that DoH/DoL materia takes too long to SB otherwise. And these classes NEED the materia, unlike battle classes (besides the relic stage that needs em). Speed THAT up and you'll see less of it in dungeons.

It would be nice if spirit bonding x gear was attached to the game-play rather than make it applicable via combat cause yes spirit bonding through fighting is way faster than it is with crafting or gathering. It shouldn't be that way but because it is you will rarely see people who are willing to spirit bond their DOL/DOH gear through their gameplay design but rather through fighting.

Now this idea just popped into my head for DOL which would mainly work for Botanist/Miners since you can't "control" the choice of what you gather or see while gathering but when it comes to DOL, why not add a "rare" node like "aetherial Energy" and when you gather from that "rare" node you get a huge boost to your spirit bond with the gear you current have on.

But rather than be a "rare" that appears at the start of a gather point you have a chance of it appear with each successful gather at x node. So out of the 4-5 attempts it may pop up and when it does you can choose to gather it and obtain a spirit bond boost.

With Fishermen maybe have a cumulative spirit bond boost the longer they gather/the more they mooch, catch rare fish and heck offer Fishermen perks for catching those legendary, when you catch a big fish big boost to spirit bond, WHen you mooch and catch a big catch boost to your spirit bond. Make it enticing enough where the end game of fishing is more than just a self applaud for catching all the fish but an actual benefit to increasing your spirit bond rate.

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Now with DOH I think the best option could maybe be "aetherial synths" in which you synth to gain spirit energy for your Craft and you don't create any items rather your success and HQ rate determine the amount of spirit energy that attaches to your gear upon completing the synth.

The synths could be based on il wherein you have to do x synth for the proper il so say you want to spirit bond your i60 gear you have to use the i60 spirit synth if you do the i50 your gear won't obtain spiritbond when you complete the synth.

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Originally Posted by Sadana

But this doesn't solve the problem that DoH/DoL materia takes too long to SB otherwise. And these classes NEED the materia, unlike battle classes (besides the relic stage that needs em). Speed THAT up and you'll see less of it in dungeons.

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Yeah, the solution was more of an attempt to get DoH/Ls out of instances in general. With my idea, you'll still be able to SB outside of the instance on a battle job. I tend to be able to SB a full i45+ right side within 20 minutes, I think, on WHM and I'm not even in Urth's Gift doing so.

If they made it more beneficial to SB as the actually DoH/L job, it'll definitely make SBing inside instances non-existent.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

If they made it more beneficial to SB as the actually DoH/L job, it'll definitely make SBing inside instances non-existent.

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Heh, speed it way up on DoH/DoL classes and zero it out in battle. Would we see armies of crafting bots then?
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I don't wanna think about it. ><

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Originally Posted by Sadana

Heh, speed it way up on DoH/DoL classes and zero it out in battle. Would we see armies of crafting bots then?
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I don't wanna think about it. ><

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Make it so when you Quick Synth, you'll always get 1% regardless of ilvl of the DoH? @.@

Dunno what you'd do for DoL though, lol. Maybe just double the amount of SB they get per tick >.>; (I dunno how DoL SB is calculated)

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

Make it so when you Quick Synth, you'll always get 1% regardless of ilvl of the DoH? @.@

Dunno what you'd do for DoL though, lol. Maybe just double the amount of SB they get per tick >.>; (I dunno how DoL SB is calculated)

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Hm, could still be scaled according to level like the new dungeon levels are. So to SB DoL/DoH AF gear, you'd best be hitting the level 50 nodes and crafting level 46+ stuff. And the return is a decent % of SB (whatever that would be, comparable to dungeoning per mob), much more if HQ I guess to counteract botting... Not sure...

This case in particular u could just kick the WHM cause his intent in said dungeon is to spiritbond and not help the group out.

But ye they need to up spiritbonding from craft/gathering if they plan on ever removing such gear from dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

The solution to restrict SBing to specific tiers generally does the job, I feel. Though to present an alteration on your idea here, I wonder if there's a way to restrict gear from accumulating Soulbind % in instances if the piece of gear doesn't share a primary stat of your class/job. That might be an interesting work around to get DoH/L gear outta instances for good.

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Equip gear with craftmanship as a Monk -> meld it with STR materia I -> fixed

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Originally Posted by Felis

Equip gear with craftmanship as a Monk -> meld it with STR materia I -> fixed

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I shall rephrase a little to compensate for this~

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

Though to present an alteration on your idea here, I wonder if there's a way to restrict gear from accumulating Soulbind % in instances if the piece of gear's base stats doesn't share a primary stat of your class/job, therefore Materia stats aren't applicable.

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[ Editted for a bit more clarity on the bolded section ]

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Originally Posted by Sadana

Hm, could still be scaled according to level like the new dungeon levels are. So to SB DoL/DoH AF gear, you'd best be hitting the level 50 nodes and crafting level 46+ stuff. And the return is a decent % of SB (whatever that would be, comparable to dungeoning per mob), much more if HQ I guess to counteract botting... Not sure...

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I could go for that.

dont even make such a silly suggestion of restricting DOH/DOL from receiving SB bonus from battle... beside a couple arrogant and disrespecting people laying the burden on others in Duty runs... most people SB in urths gift. You want to see the price of crafting and gathering materia shoot up past 1 mil if it only SB'ed thorough their respective jobs? IV's would be beyond rare.

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Originally Posted by Sadana

Hm, could still be scaled according to level like the new dungeon levels are. So to SB DoL/DoH AF gear, you'd best be hitting the level 50 nodes and crafting level 46+ stuff. And the return is a decent % of SB (whatever that would be, comparable to dungeoning per mob), much more if HQ I guess to counteract botting... Not sure...

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I think this is already the way it works

DoM/DoW class: SB rate depend on the difference between gear ilevel and enemy/dungeon level
DoH class: SB rate depend on the difference between gear ilevel and the recipe level
DoL class: SB rate depend on the difference between gear ilevel and node (and gathered item?) level

Problem is that there are more places and ways to spiritbound ilevel55+ gear with DoM and DoW than with DoH (mostly only with star recipes) and DoL (mostly only with hidden nodes). It is just easier and faster to spiritbound it with a battle class, if the class can wear it.

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Originally Posted by Devils_Lawyer

This case in particular u could just kick the WHM cause his intent in said dungeon is to spiritbond and not help the group out.

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Well, in the case of a healer or tank, this doesn't really work. Here's a simple flowchart.
1. CM begins! Several pulls go by, with difficulty.
2. People finally start examining each other to figure out why.
3. Bum WHM is identified! Engage kick!
4. WHM is kicked! WHM shrugs.
5. Is gear spritibonded? If not, go to step 6. If so, go to step 7.
6. Sign onto party finder! Go to step 1.
7. Profit!

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

Well, in the case of a healer or tank, this doesn't really work. Here's a simple flowchart.
1. CM begins! Several pulls go by, with difficulty.
2. People finally start examining each other to figure out why.
3. Bum WHM is identified! Engage kick!
4. WHM is kicked! WHM shrugs.
5. Is gear spritibonded? If not, go to step 6. If so, go to step 7.
6. Sign onto party finder! Go to step 1.
7. Profit!

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Well im not saying that the WHM cant go back in to sb in matter of minutes, i was merely pointing out that they do have the right to kick him if hes geared fully in dol/doh stuff.

There is a lovely kick feature that can be used. I could understand if the whm were wearing mind gear... but that takes it to another level. Especially how fast it is to spiritbond at Urth's Gift (sp lol)

Saw a few doing this in CM today as well. It wasn't even just accessories, but all the main pieces, too. We actually wiped on one of the bosses simply because a few of them (healers and dps) had extremely low hp and some new people that didn't know the fights. I don't mind spiritbonding in dungeons etc but sometimes it goes a little overboard.

I'd like to add that I would hope the devs consider raising the spiritbond rate of DoH/DoL gear in proportion to the level of each recipe/gathering target. Spiritbonding through doing one's job needs to be rewarded just as much as, if not more than, DoW and DoM classes/jobs.

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Originally Posted by Hayward

I'd like to add that I would hope the devs consider raising the spiritbond rate of DoH/DoL gear in proportion to the level of each recipe/gathering target. Spiritbonding through doing one's job needs to be rewarded just as much as, if not more than, DoW and DoM classes/jobs.

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They do actually, I tested it myself a couple of days ago, the issue is that the difference is extreme between the DoW/M classes and the DoH/L classes. It can take a single dungeon run (so 10-20 minutes depending on which dungeon and how it's run) to spiritbind the right gear. It can take more than 100 completed recipies or successful strikes to spiritbind crafting gear of the same ilevel difference. The time difference is immense.

Why should only Dow / DoM classes be able to earn Tomes while SB'ing at the same time? I SB daily (crafting gear on right side) in the main mission dungeons and almost always have the top DPS hate. Really people, those dungeons are so low that SB'ing has absolutely zero real impact.

I would support this restriction for the simple reason that it doesn't feel right that battle actions bond you closer to crafting gear. That's just weird. I'm talking about if we ignore all practicalities.

PS: To really stop spiritbonding crafting gear in instanced dungeons, we should really just make battle actions reduce spiritbonding on crafting gear. 8-P

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Originally Posted by Sadana

Hm, could still be scaled according to level like the new dungeon levels are. So to SB DoL/DoH AF gear, you'd best be hitting the level 50 nodes and crafting level 46+ stuff. And the return is a decent % of SB (whatever that would be, comparable to dungeoning per mob), much more if HQ I guess to counteract botting... Not sure...

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For the Miner/Botanist gear, the leves at Saint Coinach's Find lets them spiritbond at a decent pace. But for crafting and fishing, everything's slow.