So what's the general consensus on DPS ranking now in 2.4?

Hello all,

^ topic. Just wondering what all you pros are thinking. I've only played BLM and have always thought that BLM is at the bottom of the ladder, except for aoe, of course. So my ranking is this:

MNK > NIN > DRG/SMN > BRD > BLM

This is, of course, assuming every class plays at their gull potential in current relevant contents.

Thanks.

Should wait for the patch to be released for NIN and DRG to be tested before making tier lists. For now, I would have to say:

MNK > NIN > DRG/BLM > SMN > BRD

This is from pure DPS standpoint in a raid setting only. Most of the fights are long, drawn out training dummies with adds thrown in.

As a Blackmage I am never out Damaged by a bard ever. If a Bard Out damages you then you may have made a mistake in your rotation. Dragoons generally do not do as much damage as me either. I am normally second or 3rd only to Mnk as first and myself and nin fight for second. We put out good dps working on t12.

Right now it's most definitely MNK > Ninja close second > BLM > Dragoon/Summoner (both outperform each other in different coils) > Bard

MNK > BLM > NIN > DRG/SMN > BRD .

This is purely FCoB, btw.

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Originally Posted by Odowla

MNK > BLM > NIN > DRG/SMN > BRD .

This is purely FCoB, btw.

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Nin, currently, should only be outdone by a mnk.

Mnk > Nin > Blm > Drg/Smn > Brd.

In 2.45 it might be Mnk > Nin/Drg > Blm > Smn > Brd.

laughed at the BRD>BLM part....

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Originally Posted by Leonus

Nin, currently, should only be outdone by a mnk.

Mnk > Nin > Blm > Drg/Smn > Brd.

In 2.45 it might be Mnk > Nin/Drg > Blm > Smn > Brd.

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You've clearly not seen the BLM's I've seen. :P

monk > nin > blm > drg/smn > bard
in 2.45 im expecting drg to be up there with ninja

On raid content
Monk > Ninja > Black Mage > Dragoon/Summoner > Bard

Depends on the turn. In T12 and T13 BLM wins right now.

For most turns:

MNK > NIN > BLM >> DRG/SMN/BRD

I play with a very strong BRD and his numbers, with DRG buff, can easily match the levels of DRG/SMN.

I know a BLM who's done 521 on T11, so they're definetly up there.

As a SMN, we are a little weak in FCoB, especially 10 and 11 (at least compared to the last two coils)... because of how much of a manasink those fights are. BLM, on the other hand, will never run into this problem because of how the class is designed. Add to that the fact that most of the newer armor has SS on it (eww), and you'll realize why your mana is drained for SMN even more... I have found that, instead of popping two X-pots of int as I used to since the start of 2.0, I am using one X-pot of int at the very start of each fight, and then popping an X-ether on cooldown. I've *never* had to do this before, and I have the fights memorized to the point where I am rarely using Ruin 2. Of course, that is also due to the fact that our BRD is never using ballad for our healers, because they don't need it, so I don't get the benefits of it either. The only fight before FCoB that was kind of a manasink for SMN was T8, but never this bad. Really, I blame it on the SS overload. I know they're gearing up to improve SS, so maybe that's in preparation for it. Fingers crossed.

Anyway, as far as damage is concerned... it's good, but not amazing. SMN is very useful in T12, especially if you have the SMN managing the redfire mechanics... because dots are ticking during the few seconds when your damage is nerfed. Plus, there's the adds, etc.

When considering which job is 'better', you have to keep in mind the dynamics of the group. Our group has two melee, a bard, and me... so the melee get TP song while I am sitting over here manastarved. Of course in that situation, your damage will be lower. Currently, our MNK is doing the best damage. He also has been insanely lucky with drops. I think he has every single drop out of 10+11, and we are currently working on 12. It is true that bard overall damage IS low by default (or at least... it should be... if your BRD is outdoing anyone, then that is a problem). Yet, when you consider the utility, and the songs they are feeding everyone else... you realize they are strong, too. By playing a song, he is buffing the DRG and MNK's damage output. And, when he can spare it, the foe's requiem helps me too. Indirect effects.

Really, it's all about knowing the mechanics, and how to play your job... and the timing of phases. This comes with time.

For FCoB BLM is up there. Way way up there.

You're gonna get different results from a lot of players... Not every player are as good as the other on their job, so the numbers different, and then there's different fights etc etc.

Don't forget that BLM is heavily reliant on procs, which means the DPS can vary a lot based just on luck...

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Originally Posted by Craiger

You're gonna get different results from a lot of players... Not every player are as good as the other on their job, so the numbers different, and then there's different fights etc etc.

Don't forget that BLM is heavily reliant on procs, which means the DPS can vary a lot based just on luck...

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Yea and a bunch of foes when ya see their numbers get close to mnk/nin

They really arent that RNG. The BLM that did 521 on t11 actually had <40% Firestarter procs. All Skill.

Based on Job's potential:

MNK > NIN/SMN > BLM > DRG > BRD

SE knows it : D
They knew which of those jobs they should be nerf'ing to keep balance

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Originally Posted by Odowla

I know a BLM who's done 521 on T11, so they're definetly up there.

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With two Battlevoiced Foes, a 130 weapon and a shitload of melded gear, wasn't it? Also, Black Mage is totally RNG and also dependend on how you arrange the fight. Depending on the procs I get, it can be a matter of a whopping 50 DPS. The randomness of the class has been so annoying to me that I might switch back to SMN is they fix their stuff.
Also Ninja/MNK - BLM/DRG - SMN - BRD

Clearly a 303 potency attack with a 40% chance to proc for a 432 potency attack is completely RNG. Likewise a 205 potency dot is pretty rng too, you might not be able to cast thunder when you use umbral ice.

If you see the start of the video, you see him at 450 DPS or something whilst in the kill video he was a lot higher (50 DPS actually at the same point of time). My numbers on T13 fluctuate between 530 and 430 with 115 staff and around 480-420 at add phase. It's been like that on every fight but not by such big margins. The BLM will always have a nice fundamental amount of DPS, but to go skyhigh, the RNG such a Firestarters, Thunderprocs and critical hit ratio is a factor. Selene is a factor and getting Battlevoiced Foes is a factor.

Firestarter has 40% chance of procing. Let us say that through the battle you have 30% Fireprocs and at another try you had 10% less Fireprocs. How many Fire I do you think you cast during these fights and how much do you think a 10% less ratio difference in damage output? A lot ;)

You have BLM at the end of your ladder? O.o Bad BLM experience I take it?

I have for FC progression:

Monk, Ninja, BLM, SMN, Bard, DRG.
Reason I have DRG that low is, I'm expecting him to die at one point Kappa

And yes, BLM is extremely RNG dependent.
ilvl 115, solo (no food + pots) 13 minute check at 14% crit - 448
Same conditions, 13 minute check with 32% crit - 481

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Originally Posted by ViviAnimus

Also, Black Mage is totally RNG and also dependend on how you arrange the fight.

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thats same for other jobs too not only blm.

For dungeons and ST my BLM almost every time out-damage any other DPS other than BLM at same lvl skills but since i got BLM at 111 I also got SMN at same lvl that is close or in same DPS as my BLM. This is based on enmity bar seen in PT.

My NIN at 101 and BRD at 105 does really nice damage too!

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Originally Posted by Ruddi

For dungeons and ST my BLM almost every time out-damage any other DPS other than BLM at same lvl skills but since i got BLM at 111 I also got SMN at same lvl that is close or in same DPS as my BLM. This is based on enmity bar seen in PT.

My NIN at 101 and BRD at 105 does really nice damage too!

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Enmity bar is a poor judge of actual damage done.

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Originally Posted by Ricdeau

Enmity bar is a poor judge of actual damage done.

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This. SMN used to be top DPS on stuff like T9 but generates poor enmity due to the nature of dots and the fact that their enmity is split between them and their pet. Doesn't necessarily mean their numbers are bad. MNK and NIN can do crazy numbers, yeah, but have no threat dump so they can be higher on the enmity list than a skilled BLM who uses Quelling constantly off CD or a DRG who has just popped Elusive. Doesn't mean their numbers are top (they usually are, but it's heavily dependent on the encounter).

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Originally Posted by FizzyGiggles

As a Blackmage I am never out Damaged by a bard ever. If a Bard Out damages you then you may have made a mistake in your rotation. Dragoons generally do not do as much damage as me either. I am normally second or 3rd only to Mnk as first and myself and nin fight for second. We put out good dps working on t12.

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Even with the rng involved with being a blackmage I find this to be true. However a large part of our DPS is because that bard is playing Foes Requiem, we get a substantial dps gain and the Bard gets a dps loss. Without the support of that buff I think bard would win out just on mobility, but otherwise they are pretty even when I compare the two. With the right rotation a good blackmage will find himself slightly ahead of a bard though.

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Originally Posted by Zeny

Even with the rng involved with being a blackmage I find this to be true. However a large part of our DPS is because that bard is playing Foes Requiem, we get a substantial dps gain and the Bard gets a dps loss. Without the support of that buff I think bard would win out just on mobility, but otherwise they are pretty even when I compare the two. With the right rotation a good blackmage will find himself slightly ahead of a bard though.

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BRD does not lose any DPS from Foe Requiem. Only Army's Paeon and Mage's Ballad result in a DPS loss.

Monk>ninja>ninja>ninja>ninja>ninja>ninja>ninja>ninja>LAGoon.

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Originally Posted by Zeny

With the right rotation a good blackmage will find himself slightly ahead of a bard though.

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Slightly ? Either I'm really bad or our BLM is really good.
There's no way I'm close to his DPS on Raids, okay maybe in T11 as he is on the sphere with physical DPS.
When he is around 420 I'm barely at 400. But the moment I start singing Pean/Ballad, I fall waaay behind.

What scares me in this thread is that, depending on Turns, I'm above our DRG and SMN. It seems that should not happen :s

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Originally Posted by Necato

Slightly ? Either I'm really bad or our BLM is really good.
There's no way I'm close to his DPS on Raids, okay maybe in T11 as he is on the sphere with physical DPS.
When he is around 420 I'm barely at 400. But the moment I start singing Pean/Ballad, I fall waaay behind.

What scares me in this thread is that, depending on Turns, I'm above our DRG and SMN. It seems that should not happen :s

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Oh it can definitely happen. The difference is you have a DRG, which I'm guessing that most of the people (including myself) don't necessarily consider when ranking DPS numbers. DRG buffed BRD can easily compete with SMN and DRG in many fights, if not destroy their numbers in particular fights. I pegged 2.38 BRD around 400+ without a DRG and anywhere from 430-450 with a DRG, which is about what a SMN and DRG could do back then too on a single target. Taking that into considering, BRD converts better than DRG to T10-13 (I've never seen DRG win), and due to MP issues, BRD can beat SMN in T10, T11, and probably T13.

I'm just hoping there are some SMN buffs along with the DRG buffs.

Another thing that affect BLM damage is that how much scholars use their spellspeed buff and how much BRD will sing foe. That not affect much summoners damage because spellspeed is weak stat for summoners and foe reduce enemy elemental resistance by 10%. Most of SMN damage is "unaspected" damage that is not any elemental. Only garuda is doing elemental damage.

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Originally Posted by Sunako

foe reduce enemy elemental resistance by 10%.

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Wrong. It reduces magic resistance.

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Originally Posted by EdgeFayth

Wrong. It reduces magic resistance.

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http://www.ffxivinfo.com/job/bard.php

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Originally Posted by Sunako

http://www.ffxivinfo.com/job/bard.php

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http://xivdb.com/?skill/115/Foe-Requiem

edit:

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Originally Posted by Mibhas

Pretty sure that's outdated.

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Yes it is. And it was false (even in 2.0). The error comes from a problem of translation JP->EN... Now it is correct (see my link).

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Originally Posted by Sunako

http://www.ffxivinfo.com/job/bard.php

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Pretty sure that's outdated.

Okey sorry. I did not know there was misleading information in that site and never played BRD myself.

lol to those saying blm slightly ahead of Bard.
Must be really bad black mages then.
More often then not i also do more damage then dragoon with my blm
However Bard can do more damage then people actually think, comes down to the player as per usual.