Women and Armor!

I think this video speaks ever so true. It's about gear for Men and women.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saW9SaUx2aM

That gave me a good laugh. Wasn't expecting the ending.

If this was a WoW forum it would make more sense, but in FFXIV both men and women can wear skimpy armour.

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

If this was a WoW forum it would make more sense, but in FFXIV both men and women can wear skimpy armour.

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Consider it the background to why we have the armour we do.

What you should really be doing is looking at the date that video was uploaded. The topic has just gotten ooooooold. :p

I've seen plenty of styles in the game that cover female avatars completely. If people choose not to use them, that's up to them.

Also, if it's really such a problem, don't play the game. :p

Yeah... not seeing the issue here. This isn't the Conan MMO. There's only a handful of skimpy armors and only one or two are level 50. The rest are level 1 and the coliseum sets at level 44. And the coliseum sets are unisex so that's shot down be default as being differentially skimpy (same with those rare level 50 armors). XIV is very unisex with exceptions far and few between for reasonable reasons (most of the time).

I don't see where the issue is...

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a2...psa9103106.png

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Consider it the background to why we have the armour we do.

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Not really. I heard FFXI is VERY skimpy towards the Mithras and I seriously doubt they are doing the conservative stuff because some people don't like it rather that they choose to.

Have you played XI? That was the very definition of conservative. Yes, mithra had alot of subligar for leg armor, but subligar could be worn by all races and genders so equality for all! And the swimsuits were practically designed after 1950s swimwear. And the smallclothes in XI... people wear attire like that at the gym, there was nothing 'smallclothes' about it. But, that said, this isn't XI and I'm kind of glad we have some genuinely sexy attire, even if you can count it all with just your hands.

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Originally Posted by Hito-Shura

I don't see where the issue is...

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a2...psa9103106.png

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http://img.pandawhale.com/51394-Geor...y-gif-fXlS.gif

Nice video! I found it amusing and poignant. :)

I might have to agree with some folks, though, that FFXIV is not really a big problem in this regard. Almost all the caster gear I've seen shows basically nothing of my (female) character's body. Even the skimpier/sexier outfits in this game are quite tame compared to most other MMOs. Not that I'm against sexy armor/costumes in games, but as it is so impractical (and possibly even embarassing/demeaning), it should be an option the player can choose to apply rather than a default design that is enforced on female gear as a rule. Like, rather than have all female armor be the stereotypical "chainmail bikini," design armor where the player can choose if they want less or more pieces of it to show and expose their character's body -- whether it is male or female. If it still ends up that there are just a bunch of bikini-clad female characters running around, fine -- at least it was chosen that way on an individual basis, not forced.

Meanwhile, games like Scarlet Blade received a lot of negative press for its sleazy, pandering design choices, and probably turned a lot of potential customers away from the game. And where is it today?

And then there is TERA, which was only a little better in that aspect, where I seriously felt embarrassed for my character a lot of the time. The costumes were designed so that every time she took a step, you got a flash of her butt/panties from most angles you'd realistically be playing from. I really felt bad for this person, having to wear this stuff, like "I'm sorry, I did not design this outfit, don't blame me for this..." While it's not the main reason I quit playing, it was ironically a turn-off, and it made me apprehensive about recommending the game to friends.

AFAIK, the only piece of gear that has issues is the DRG AF chest, which on men has chainmail covering the chest where women have their chests bare.

But other than that, FFXIV has done very well on the equality side of things.

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Originally Posted by HakuroDK

AFAIK, the only piece of gear that has issues is the DRG AF chest, which on men has chainmail covering the chest where women have their chests bare.

But other than that, FFXIV has done very well on the equality side of things.

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You mean Ninja AF.

Dragoon AF has the tummy showing on ladies. You know, instead of armor plating it's just a big STAB HERE sign?

And don't get me started on the boob windows for things like the Evenstar coat or ST robes. Or how on women most "slacks" and "pantaloons" end up being skirts and thigh-highs.

Or how on men everything is slacks or shorts but on ladies they're panties with frills.

BUT NO, PLEASE. KEEP LINKING THE GLADIATOR SET AND SAYING THERE'S NO PROBLEM

I am so done with people and this topic.

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Originally Posted by Dotsusama

Dragoon AF has the tummy showing on ladies. You know, instead of armor plating it's just a big STAB HERE sign?

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I prefer to think mine has abs of steel. :3

I'm mostly happy with the direction FFXIV has gone in regarding armor coverage...A great deal of the armor is very practical, and most of the skimpy stuff is that way for both genders. It's a far cry from my experience with other MMOs, where not only was female armor typically more revealing, but also far more detailed, so that it was actually pretty hard to make a male character look halfway decent, let alone sexy.

The only change I'd make to FFXIV's armor design is to add a toggle between 'normal' (i.e 'male model') and 'sexy' (e.g 'female model) modes for items with significant differences. This way you could choose whether you want to see your dragoon's midriff, and whether you want to be wearing a miniskirt (Short-shorts for guys?) or actual pants and so on.

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Originally Posted by Dotsusama

You mean Ninja AF.

Dragoon AF has the tummy showing on ladies. You know, instead of armor plating it's just a big STAB HERE sign?

And don't get me started on the boob windows for things like the Evenstar coat or ST robes. Or how on women most "slacks" and "pantaloons" end up being skirts and thigh-highs.

Or how on men everything is slacks or shorts but on ladies they're panties with frills.

BUT NO, PLEASE. KEEP LINKING THE GLADIATOR SET AND SAYING THERE'S NO PROBLEM

I am so done with people and this topic.

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New armor for all characters, that doesn't objectify anyone and still offers complete protection!

https://blogs.lt.vt.edu/architecture...etal-Cube1.jpg

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Originally Posted by Canadane

That gave me a good laugh. Wasn't expecting the ending.

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totally same to me xD

I just... I just want dragoon AF that covers my belly ._. I would glamor that instantly if I could.

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Originally Posted by Lukha

The only change I'd make to FFXIV's armor design is to add a toggle between 'normal' (i.e 'male model') and 'sexy' (e.g 'female model) modes for items with significant differences. This way you could choose whether you want to see your dragoon's midriff, and whether you want to be wearing a miniskirt (Short-shorts for guys?) or actual pants and so on.

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Why can't guys wear skirts?
Also, so what if the female armor has boob windows? There are male pieces of clothing that are just a set of pendants, or that show the ENTIRE chest.
As far as MMOs go, FFXIV is pretty equal as far as ridiculous armor designs for both genders. People complain about the window on the dragoon armor without realizing they shouldn't be able to sit down in the damned things.

I don't see the issue. The only reason for a female miqo'te to exist is to satisfy fanservice. It's pretty much a species engineered for that sole reason.

Developer 1: "Hey, let's put a catgirl race in the game, but let's NOT make it fanservice!"
Developer 2: "what"

too bad Developer 1 was probably Yoshida and Developer 2 some peon.

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Originally Posted by Dotsusama

Or how on women most "slacks" and "pantaloons" end up being skirts and thigh-highs.

Or how on men everything is slacks or shorts but on ladies they're panties with frills.

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I see no problem here. I think they should let Soken design armor for the game, personally. :p

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Originally Posted by Martin_Arcainess

I think this video speaks ever so true. It's about gear for Men and women.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saW9SaUx2aM

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I was expecting in game footage to offer a comparison. This video is just typical American animated crap.

Am more fed up that nearly all high end gear for my BLM are dress's seriously I do NOT enjoy my dude dressing up like a woman why must i be subjected to all this female BLM gear?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with skimpy armor.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with sexy armor.

I seriously can't believe people get upset over a naked human(oid) body yet none of these people seem to be speaking up about some of the extreme and graphic violence depicted in games. It's completely backwards.

Have to throw this one out it was my favorite video of the same idea lol Female Armor sucks!

I dress both of my characters skimpy male and female..
I grew up with 80's cartoons.

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Originally Posted by Amused

There is absolutely nothing wrong with skimpy armor.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with sexy armor.

I seriously can't believe people get upset over a naked human(oid) body yet none of these people seem to be speaking up about some of the extreme and graphic violence depicted in games. It's completely backwards.

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Indeed.
Girls need to be proud of their body and show it, not hide it under layers of metal!

You, yes you, you are beautiful! Let the world bask in your glory!

(DISCLAIMER: this message does not apply to lalafells and roegadyns).

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Originally Posted by Amused

There is absolutely nothing wrong with skimpy armor.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with sexy armor.

I seriously can't believe people get upset over a naked human(oid) body yet none of these people seem to be speaking up about some of the extreme and graphic violence depicted in games. It's completely backwards.

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B-b-but naked bodies are either sexists to women or slutty or a sin against god!

I want some frickin thigh-highs and skirts for my guy but they just keep giving me weird looking tights. I love putting my beautiful elezen male in skimpy clothing!
http://i.imgur.com/7iRcUaX.png

I've played the game long enough to remember when all the gear was equal for both genders.

Then they added the coatee set: Formal suit and pants for man, miniskirt with stockings and epic cleavage for woman.
Then they added the AFs: WHM: Men get bagy shorts, women get a mini-skirt that changes to panties depending on what you wear, DRG AF has the inexplicable belly window.
Then with 2.0 they relesed the mini-skirt starter RSE.
They've since added Ninja AF with the cleavage for women.

I was a bit disappointed with the coatee set and have become a bit more disappointed with each subsequent addition.

I suppose I was just spoiled coming from XI where there was a lot of the less "ooh, we can make these girls look slutty *giggle*" attitude that's common with other developers. I expected a bit more maturity, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

I've played the game long enough to remember when all the gear was equal for both genders.

Then they added the coatee set: Formal suit and pants for man, miniskirt with stockings and epic cleavage for woman.
Then they added the AFs: WHM: Men get bagy shorts, women get a mini-skirt that changes to panties depending on what you wear, DRG AF has the inexplicable belly window.
Then with 2.0 they relesed the mini-skirt starter RSE.
They've since added Ninja AF with the cleavage for women.

I was a bit disappointed with the coatee set and have become a bit more disappointed with each subsequent addition.

I suppose I was just spoiled coming from XI where there was a lot of the less "ooh, we can make these girls look slutty *giggle*" attitude that's common with other developers. I expected a bit more maturity, I guess.

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Emphasizing femininity is perfectly fine. Females of all ages do that in real life as well, so what's the issue?

I think we can all agree on one thing.

We do not care if the attire is sexy or not. We only wish for the option to place it on all sexes and races.

Good luck Character assets team. Hop to it.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

I suppose I was just spoiled coming from XI where there was a lot of the less "ooh, we can make these girls look slutty *giggle*" attitude that's common with other developers. I expected a bit more maturity, I guess.

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While the RSE and the Highlander smallclothes are admittedly showy, 'slutty' isn't something this game says. Not at all. You want that, there's games that make this one look like it's run like Catholic Boarding House. In a previous post of mine I mentioned the Conan MMO, where women not only had 'stereotypical' armor but also pornstar proportions. Several Korean MMOS are especially guilty of this only following the anime porn angle. Heck, there's one where you can buy the option to be just plain old naked, no smallclothes at all!

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Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Emphasizing femininity is perfectly fine. Females of all ages do that in real life as well, so what's the issue?

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TIL Panty Shots are 'emphasizing femininity' not 'borderline creepy'

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Originally Posted by Gilraen

While the RSE and the Highlander smallclothes are admittedly showy, 'slutty' isn't something this game says. Not at all. You want that, there's games that make this one look like it's run like Catholic Boarding House.

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This game originally had a much more gritty, practical aesthetic (Avoiding the word 'realistic' because we ride chocobos and fight gods). My issue is not solely about the gender dimorphism it's also the other things that we lost when we ditched that aesthetic: goodbye realistic weapons and practical armour, hello glowy axes of doom larger than my character's torso and shoulderpads of epicness.

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Originally Posted by Gilraen

In a previous post of mine I mentioned the Conan MMO, where women not only had 'stereotypical' armor but also pornstar proportions. Several Korean MMOS are especially guilty of this only following the anime porn angle. Heck, there's one where you can buy the option to be just plain old naked, no smallclothes at all!

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Damning with faint praise. I'd hope we set ourselves to a higher standard than that.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

TIL Panty Shots are 'emphasizing femininity' not 'borderline creepy'

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Precisely. Panty shot are cute. Especially if they are striped ones.

Some slut shaming going on in this thread.

Talking to my sister who's taking sociology, her bigger beef is how all the characters are basically "perfect", which spreads a false image of what "normal" is. However I argue that the point of an MMO is escapism, to be something you are not (as most games are).

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Originally Posted by Magis

Some slut shaming going on in this thread.

Talking to my sister who's taking sociology, her bigger beef is how all the characters are basically "perfect", which spreads a false image of what "normal" is. However I argue that the point of an MMO is escapism, to be something you are not (as most games are).

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Really.

Going by this logic, I guess we should believe that catgirls, lalafells and roegadyns are "normal", and we should all strive to resemble them in real life.

Well, I would not mind meeting some female Miqo'tes, but in general I believe that any sane person has a clear idea about what's real and what's not.

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Originally Posted by Magis

Some slut shaming going on in this thread.

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I wouldn't say so. It seems to me the gist of the complaints is not that people are wearing this armour, but that the armours in question appears to be designed by a puerile, juvenile designer who feels that it is not sufficient that armour traded between two characters should remain generally the same, but that it should change depending on gender.

I don't see why I can craft a nice evening suit set for myself, craft the exact same recipe and, when given to a female friend, it becomes a mini-skirt, stockings and about an acre of cleavage other than because some designer thinks women should be showing displaying their boobs and thighs at all times.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

I wouldn't say so. It seems to me the gist of the complaints is not that people are wearing this armour, but that the armours in question appears to be designed by a puerile, juvenile designer who feels that it is not sufficient that armour traded between two characters should remain generally the same, but that it should change depending on gender.

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They did that with the Noct Lorica. Result? Cute girls with abs.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...1CVlBwLvQlHmLw

People complained (and rightly so).

Style is important, in a FF game.

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Originally Posted by Gralna

New armor for all characters, that doesn't objectify anyone and still offers complete protection!

https://blogs.lt.vt.edu/architecture...etal-Cube1.jpg

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I just heard that all aestheticians dropped cosmetology courses and took up Blacksmithing.