No morale in Frontlines?

Can anyone confirm? Had a friend saying they said it on stream

I guess I'm happy cause this might bring in more people to the pvp scene...

But at the same time.. we lose a stat..

EDIT: Nvm all gear synced to i80... Pvp gear still loses a 4th stat. Not sure how melds will work though

There's no way they would do that. What would the purpose in PvP gear be if not to provide a PvP stat?

Edit: Someone else confirmed it here: no morale in Frontlines. This is a slap in the face to the only people who bothered with the game's PvP in the first place. The vision for Frontlines that so many PvPers hoped for was clearly abandoned to appeal to people who win-trade just for glamours. Now we have this bastardized system that punishes the people who actually put effort into the Wolves' Den grind. The PvP gear is useless now! This is pretty much unforgivable...and I've been playing this game since the clusterfuck of a launch that was 1.0.

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Originally Posted by Shake0615

There's no way they would do that. What would the purpose in PvP gear be if not to provide a PvP stat?

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Yeah that's what I'm thinking, but my friend said he heard it on stream I think? Or something IDK, HOPEFULLY was a bad translation or maybe he heard wrong. /pray

No morale in frontline and all player will receive synchronisation to ilvl80 !!!! Nice troll... Like I already say : Pvp for dummies...
I really hope all PVE content will be ilvl80 sync in near future to troll every player

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...XV-Q-A-Updates

Q5: What kind of rewards can we obtain in Frontline?

A5: Essentially the rewards are the same as the Wolves’ Den, but you’ll also be able to obtain war mounts and Allagan tomestones of soldiery.

if frontline rewards are the same as wolves den then morale should count

Yeah that's what really confused me. Why would they give out rewards for PVP that don't work in PVP? Since Wolves' Den will be completely abandoned after 2.3.

i will say this one more time, i think morale shouldnt be erased but! the gear that now exists for wolvesden should only stay in wolvsden not in frontlines, FRONTLINES is a new system s it should have a fresh start, a lot of ppl are joining now because of frontlines and it would be not fair for those who join just now, plus they can make a nother way to get new pvp gear that isnt a grindfest like wolvesden, im sorry to all the ppl who reached lvl 40 rank with no win trades, but its for the best of the game, i would suggest to give some type of reward for being rank 30-40 so ppl dont feel they did it for nothing!

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Originally Posted by KitkatRoll

i will say this one more time, i think morale shouldnt be erased but! the gear that now exists for wolvesden should only stay in wolvsden not in frontlines, FRONTLINES is a new system s it should have a fresh start, a lot of ppl are joining now because of frontlines and it would be not fair for those who join just now, plus they can make a nother way to get new pvp gear that isnt a grindfest like wolvesden, im sorry to all the ppl who reached lvl 40 rank with no win trades, but its for the best of the game, i would suggest to give some type of reward for being rank 30-40 so ppl dont feel they did it for nothing!

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Hell, I mean im pissed that they are removing morale. But another thing is the fact that PvP gear will be missing a FOURTH stat, like c'mon now. I mean I can kinda get what you're saying about the fresh start, but this isn't even a fresh start, we are missing a fourth stat !@!!
=((((

Yay SE! now we can faceroll pros, noobs and newbs.
It's all about who has skill as all stats are synced to 80.
Yeaaaaaaasss

where is the skill in a 24v24v24 fest ?

allready happy to have 4k HP and getting rape by 48 noobs HIGH SKILL REQUIRED for frontline.

If this is confirmed 100% true, this is absurd and we need to speak up about it. I understand there are those that will start pvp with frontlines, but let's basically screw over everyone that actually liked pvp in the first place, just so a few can try it out and then quit later because "this game isn't a pvp game". I'm super outraged, and everyone else should be. Before its released we need to really make this an issue that SE needs to be aware of. Why would pvp gear even exist? If PvE gear will ultimately be better because pvp looses a stat, there is no point and my grind is useless.

I feel like they did not value my time, they did not value the fact that I actually like pvp, and they certainly didn't value all the money spent on materia melding on said gear.

I'm mad, and you should be too.

The fact of the matter is that SE reneged on a promise. The promise was that if we worked for PvP gear then that gear would be useful on the PvP battlefield. With the elimination of morale in Frontlines, we lose a crucial 4th stat on our gear which means that any PvE piece of the same item level is now superior in PvP situations. And with the fact that Glamours do not appear in arena, I doubt that they would work in Frontlines either. If that’s the case then the PvP gear that exists now serves absolutely zero purpose after a long and tiresome grind of trying to obtain them. If morale is no longer factored in, then I expect that 4th stat to be replaced with something worthwhile.

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Originally Posted by Rawk

If this is confirmed 100% true, this is absurd and we need to speak up about it. I understand there are those that will start pvp with frontlines, but let's basically screw over everyone that actually liked pvp in the first place, just so a few can try it out and then quit later because "this game isn't a pvp game". I'm super outraged, and everyone else should be. Before its released we need to really make this an issue that SE needs to be aware of. Why would pvp gear even exist? If PvE gear will ultimately be better because pvp looses a stat, there is no point and my grind is useless.

I feel like they did not value my time, they did not value the fact that I actually like pvp, and they certainly didn't value all the money spent on materia melding on said gear.

I'm mad, and you should be too.

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Well said man. Let's hope they are reading this.... Bring this over to general forums IMO

If this is true, I am very disappointed. I was looking forward to frontlines because objective-based PvP has always been more fun to me. I don't really like arena, but I was doing it to gear up in preparation for frontlines. I suppose they want people to be on 'equal footing' when starting frontlines, but then what is the point of doing it besides the soldiery they said you could get from it?

Without actual confirmation, it's a matter of he said, she said, I'm going to guess if in fact this is to bring up to speed those new to pvp, i'll wager rank caps will be brought in, in future patches. There is also the missing 8v8, have to wait and see.

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

I suppose they want people to be on 'equal footing' when starting frontlines, but then what is the point of doing it besides the soldiery they said you could get from it?

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You get to have fun? I dunno about you but i play the game to have fun not to hoard gear. Most pvp(ie multiplayer) games don't reward you anything like better gear from winning a match all you get is more experience of the mechanics and how to play or also commonly very minor and easy to get upgrades and vanity stuff.
Also keep in mind ranks will still be in effect and so will pvp abilities, so there is that.

our voices should be heard. I am optimistic that if SE notice the uproar in community for this decision they would reverse it or at least modify it so we might get ilvl80 capped but the morale effect would still be there etc.

My first impression, this is a crap because players who are going to wolves' den and playing pvp are not rewarded and SE left us to one side.
Frontlines will bring news fresh meats on pvp, but just players who want stay hide a wall of players and spam theirs rotations meanwhile they are watching a tv serie.

What is the reason to reach rank 40 now, if we haven't the chance to use pvp gear in a pvp scenary(without wolves' den)?

I know, SE doesn't want new players become overwhelmed by others well geared from pvp but play pvp now, sound like a waste of time.

I am upset too.

I would think now on second thought, this would be temporary to get new players into pvp and then just patch it later once more people are geared in pvp so that Morale will have an effect again. but thats just wishful thinking isnt?

Something to consider too maybe there are rank capped frontlines, because Yoshi pointed out that duty finder needed to be overhauled for front lines, I find it hard to believe it would need much work just for one front line.

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Originally Posted by Pibz

You get to have fun? I dunno about you but i play the game to have fun not to hoard gear. Most pvp(ie multiplayer) games don't reward you anything like better gear from winning a match all you get is more experience of the mechanics and how to play or also commonly very minor and easy to get upgrades and vanity stuff.
Also keep in mind ranks will still be in effect and so will pvp abilities, so there is that.

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Other MMOs I have played, you can earn pvp gear through all methods of pvp. That is what I was getting at... some sort of progression for doing frontlines, at least for people who wanted to be super competitive about it. I'm not sure how ranking will work with frontlines (your overall rank will affect arena+frontlines maybe?). There should be some sort of reward system... if you are right, you'll earn marks/exp through frontlines and then use those marks to buy gear you can only make use of in arena...

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

Other MMOs I have played, you can earn pvp gear through all methods of pvp. That is what I was getting at... some sort of progression for doing frontlines, at least for people who wanted to be super competitive about it. I'm not sure how ranking will work with frontlines (your overall rank will affect arena+frontlines maybe?). There should be some sort of reward system... if you are right, you'll earn marks/exp through frontlines and then use those marks to buy gear you can only make use of in arena...

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Maybe frontlines will only reward wolfmarks and no experience and the only way to use pvp gear would be through wolves den which would give xp. Maybe it would give people an incentive to do both.

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Originally Posted by siriussnow

Maybe frontlines will only reward wolfmarks and no experience and the only way to use pvp gear would be through wolves den which would give xp. Maybe it would give people an incentive to do both.

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I don't think so. Frontlines are the first step to enter a "pvp encounter", will be odd to players get seals but not pvp exp.

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Originally Posted by Shake0615

The PvP gear is useless now! This is pretty much unforgivable...and I've been playing this game since the clusterfuck of a launch that was 1.0.

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http://images.t-nation.com/forum_ima...ed_274x300.jpg

So....frontline will not use Morale....this means that the long grind to get the high lvl pvp gear is basically just a grind for vanity gear as it will serve no purpose in frontline. And this means that pvp in wolfsden will remain as dead as it is now. This is complete crap, and here i thought the work i was putting into grinding pvp lately was in preparation for frontline.

Rather then making Morale a complete non-stat, they should have just changed how it functions... Rather than i100 Morale giving you an absurd advantage over PvE players, they should have just made it so Morale provides you a static advantage if you have more Morale than your opponent; that way, PvPers in i70, i90, and i100 would all have the same advantage over PvE players. Getting i100 would simply server to remove any advantage anyone can have against you.

Most important thing about working it like that, is that if the Morale bonus was static like that, they can balance it accordingly. You maintain progression without completely shitting over newbs. To a newb in PvE gear, players in i70, i90, and i100 would all be the same, if the bonus they have over you in balanced it wouldn't be out of hand like it currently would be. There would still be a sense of progression with Morale, having the highest Morale simply gives you an edge, rather than potentially being completely overpowering. You'd want to obtain the i100 Morale gear simply to remove any advantage anyone can have over you, while having the same advantage over everyone else.

Actually, that's a stupid idea. Instead, change it so the game calculates your party/alliances total Morale, and provides a bonus to everyone based on that. If you have someone in your party/alliance with high Morale gear, your Morale is going to be increased as well, right?

Or maybe change it so it works like XIs Sphere stats, where players get the bonus if they're near you. That creates a new dynamic to PvP; trying to separate low Morale players from their high Morale allies.

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

Other MMOs I have played, you can earn pvp gear through all methods of pvp. That is what I was getting at... some sort of progression for doing frontlines, at least for people who wanted to be super competitive about it. I'm not sure how ranking will work with frontlines (your overall rank will affect arena+frontlines maybe?). There should be some sort of reward system... if you are right, you'll earn marks/exp through frontlines and then use those marks to buy gear you can only make use of in arena...

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I'm nearly 99% sure this is only a stepping point and that they will add Frontlines without ilvl sync later on, i can almost guarantee it to you.
Think of this from a designer perspective, they keep making all this adjustments to PvP(gear accessible earlier, abilities for everyone) yet most people don't like it because:

A. They get punished for trying due to not being on the same level gear wise(matchmaking only solved this very partially)
B. They see a huge grind in front of them where they will be punished all the time by people who will always be one(rather several) steps ahead.
C. They find it boring, mostly i believe because of A + B, and feel like they've lost the train to PvP progression.

So what did they do? Well lets introduce this objective based, which appeals to most people way more than arena death-match, and let's make it a fun and accessible place for everyone to progress at first, and when we have a good chunk of the population in actually decent PvP gear, lets let them use it in there. (This is of course what i imagine their thought process was behind this decision)
Also if this isn't a good way to punish the wintraders for doing it to gear up for frontlines, i don't know what is.

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Originally Posted by Pibz

Also if this isn't a good way to punish the wintraders for doing it to gear up for frontlines, i don't know what is.

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It's also a great way to punish legit pvp'ers that enjoy pvp and were excited with Frontlines. At least you can agree its a punishment and surely understand our side.

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Originally Posted by Rawk

It's also a great way to punish legit pvp'ers that enjoy pvp and were excited with Frontlines. At least you can agree its a punishment and surely understand our side.

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pretty much. i wish SE JUST BAN players that exploited the system instead making pvp vanity.

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Originally Posted by Rawk

It's also a great way to punish legit pvp'ers that enjoy pvp and were excited with Frontlines. At least you can agree its a punishment and surely understand our side.

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"Legit PvPers" PvP for the challenge not the gear.

All I hear is whining that some can't roflstomp others based on gear disparity and not abilty to organise and strategise to win.

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Originally Posted by Caly

where is the skill in a 24v24v24 fest ?

allready happy to have 4k HP and getting rape by 48 noobs HIGH SKILL REQUIRED for frontline.

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I can't wait to take on 72 people as a paly.
"COME AT ME BRUH!" *engages alliance* *pops Hallowed Ground*

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

"Legit PvPers" PvP for the challenge not the gear.

All I hear is whining that some can't roflstomp others based on gear disparity and not abilty to organise and strategise to win.

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then you reading these posts wrong. it is not the gear some of us care about, it is the progression. SE have a nasty habit killing all forms of progression in this game beside pve coil. if SE want pvp to be more SKILL based then why have ranks and gear BASED on rank at all? why not just have everything open and make everything vanity with no restriction? the problem here is that SE is trying to have two world that doesnt mix together : pvp gear progresssion and causal pvp skill gameplay.


they have to kill one in order for the other to survive. now if they want to make pvp in the more causal skill based combat, then pvp need to :

1. remove rank based gear
2. nerfed/buff wolf marks needed to get the "vanity" gear


edit


how much "organise and strategise to win" do you need in pvp for this game? all strategies boil down to the most universally recognize strat to deal with the objective. pvp in this game has the most rigid ,plain and obvious "do this and you win" game plan in any mmo i have ever seen. there are rarely any need to deviate from the norm unless the players are really high geared.

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Originally Posted by Edenlys

taken post out of context

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really read the whole post and then response. do not just take a part and respond to it or you look like a fool


edit 2

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Originally Posted by Edenlys

No, you dont know.. Morale and pvp traits work in wolves den pier, dummies dont have morale but your dmg depends of your own stats...


Pvp gear is a long grind to acquire, différence between pve and pvp is experience of arena, it's a placebo effect !!
110 pve is far better than 90 pvp even if fully melded, 110 pve > 100 pvp, but pvp gear reduce damge receive (about 10% more or less) but i110 have huge amount of stat, wp dmg and HP so your dd/heal will be better and HP compense dmg reduction

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what? no ilvl110 pve is NOT better than ilv90 pvp gear. ilvl 115 is though. edlys stop posting incorret info on these forums.

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

"Legit PvPers" PvP for the challenge not the gear.

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Legit PVPers don't PVP in MMORPGs because it's one of the worst places to get truly balanced PVP. People who take PVP TRULY seriously are PVPing in games like Starcraft 2 or DOTA 2. So yes, in an MMORPG, a big reason that players are PVPing is for the gear. You're typically not going to find huge amounts of TRULY competitive gameplay in games that are mostly based on PVE settings. MMORPG PVPers enjoy progression based content, including progression based PVP.

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Originally Posted by zulu_kulu

then pvp need to :

1. remove rank based gear
2. nerfed/buff wolf marks needed to get the "vanity" gear

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You will see, no exp and gear to farm = No pvp.
A content need to have a grinding xp and gear to work as usual... That's why there are still matches in woves den...
Noobs always want all content for no effort....
I want all CT and high allagan gear for free in NPC, Reward of pve should be a single minion or mount like frontline
You're killing me

seems like ppl forget that this is not a pvp game, not even with FLs...

be happy with what u get, ungrateful rabble :P

and more on the main note:

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

All I hear is whining that some can't roflstomp others based on gear disparity and not abilty to organise and strategise to win.

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sapphic is right...most ppl r whining here coz they cant faceroll and cant be OP in Fl when it releases. thats why the PVPers are "farming" (yes some even wintrading) PVP now. To be on top of everyone else. If u farm PVP for vanity, then u r not rly a PVPer...

IMO SE is doin the right thing telling them: nope, if u really luv PVP that much, keep doin wolfs den then, or have FUN with the other 74ppl.

As someone whose rank 30+ in Wolves DenPvP I'm happy to see Moral go. It was a broken stat that only rewarded people who had more matches anywayss :D. Its not fun(or balanced, lol) criting someone for 1k+ as a BARD jus cause they havn't played as much as you. (or botted as much, or lost as much, or win traded as much... lo

...well wait, I can't lie, it is fun to Crit someone for 1k, buuht i feel bad afterwords >~<)

Yay, no moral!

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Originally Posted by Edenlys

You will see, no exp and gear to farm = No pvp.
A content need to have a grinding xp and gear to work as usual... That's why there are still matches in woves den...

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What the hell do you do at max rank, quit PvP? You really seem to like your carrot and stick.