Teach me how -SMN-

Hello.

my name is Reeses. I have no level 50s yet. but plan to make smn/sch my first.

but for smn, which I plan to have as my main, I want to make sure I do it right. so I have a few questions.

I have read a few things, but any advice is openly welcome as I want to make sure im the best I can be at my job.

as for questions.


Garuda and Ifrit. im lvl 43 so ill have garuda soon. whats up with them. since they are both dps, is garuda just all around better? or just situational. I ask because ifrit gets his own summon button but garuda takes over emeralds summon. I want to make sure im using the proper smn for the proper situations.

also, titan, is he ever used in endgame party things? or just on my own/dungeons with fc friends that don't care?

and gear.

I hear a lot about acc. gear. whys that? I mean I know you need good acc to hit in general. but I swear I see more things about smn having good acc than most. (maybe its just me?)

that's all I can thing for now. ill probably have more later.

Titan -- solo content and low level dungeons when tank disconnects
Ifrit -- Takes out trash mobs very nicely. Use in low/high/expert dungeons where contagion would go to waste/be overkill.
Garuda -- Endgame: coil/primals. Notable for contagion (extends your dots by 15s).

You'll want Raging Strikes from ARC and Swiftcast from THM.

You need a higher accuracy cap because your pet gets a slightly diminished acc stat in comparison to yours. So for you AND your pet to hit 100% your accuracy needs to get an extra boost.

Obviously make sure to keep dots up as much as possible, but also dot as many enemies as possible (minus the ones you shouldn't attack like Spiny plume). Dotting is always better than casting ruin. When everything is dotted...cast ruin. Haha.

There's more but I don't want to write pages. =

going through a similar thought process myself atm lvl 46 smn (no garuda egi just yet b/c waited till 45 for some AF1 and DF has been letting me down), however i will share my opinion and hope its not too far off base.
My understanding is with everything said and done it does depend on mob fighting but garuda with contagion will put out more damage a lot of the time (not all) and ifrit is melee so aoe tends to hurt him more, that said if garuda is not kept under control she can be weak w/o telling her when to use what etc.
Titan will not put out nearly enough dps and will pull hate off any party situation - advise only solo use or for random group for fates (ie no tank)(or with companion)
My understanding for gear is from forums and looking at endgame gear - int>det> (crit or acc) depending on your stats if you dont hit a lot of high lvl mobs throw a bit of acc gear on or materia something you have and use

Here's my take:

- Garuda is better to use than Ifirit for more DPS. If you have it on Obey, it will do good DPS itself by spamming just the auto-attack and you can time Contagion for when you need it most (It's best to use when you have all 4 DoTs up, both Bios and both Miasmas). Don't worry about the icons that appear on your hotbar, they won't indicate what's truly better.

- Titan is useful if you are in need of a tank but dont have one. E.g. You're 3/4 in a dungeon missing the tank. Or you're soloing on a high level FATE and would die with hate.

- You may hear ACC being stressed because Pets's acc is dependant on your own, but they require a higher amount to cap than you do. It's best to look up what endgame fight you're doing and the associated pet cap for it.

- Remember to keep all your ranged DoTs up as much as possible. Most agree a good rotation to follow is Bio2 -> Miasma -> Bio 1 (and if you have Contagion available then Miasma 2 -> Contagion following that. Don't bother with Miasma 2 otherwise unless you have a group of mobs to AoE down.)

- The real magic of SMN is learning to get into a rhythm of using up all your abilities so they're not wasted. This typically makes use of what's called "weaving" which is where you use an ability off your global cool down, while waiting for the GCD timer to finish. An example would be using one of the following following your Bio/Miasma/Ruin casts:
Aetherflow, Energy Drain, Rouse, Spur, Enkindle, Fester, Contagion, Raging Strikes (learn this by levelling ARC), Swiftcast (learn this by levelling THM)

When it comes to aetherflow stacks ideally you should have used up all 3 stacks before the next aetherflow charge is ready (unless you have some major DPS check coming up perhaps). It's usually best to avoid using Energy Drain unless you are really desperate for MP (to the point where you can't even cast DoTs for example). Normally you should find that Fester is used whenever you have single targets and Bane for the introduction of an Add(s) next to a target you have DoTs up on already.

- For Ruin/Ruin2, it's best used as one of your GCD abilities once all the standard DoTs are up. You can push with Ruin2 spams when you need to take something down quickly and don't mind the extra MP loss, otherwise for long term fights where you need to keep a good supply of MP, stick with Ruin1.

- It's good to keep a good stack of HQ ether items for when you have some major MP loss (like if you are die, or you have to resurrect someone else)

Hopefully that helps. I'm no master SMN, so there may be better tips out there.

titan-egi can be used in a few trials, but their few and far between, most notable right now is moogle extreme and levi extreme

Things I had to learn the hard way:
- Don't forget to reassign your pet's target, keep obey and sic hotkeys handy. I was really annoyed by SMN at first because I couldn't burst things down when necessary...I was casting dots while my pet was still plinking on its original target.
- Use Rouse spur every time unless you're saving them to stack with enkindle.
- The only time you shouldn't use Fester every time it's ready is when you're using bane instead.
- Always be casting.
- Ruin1 should be your default spam after dots and fester unless you're trying to move or hit Fester right when it's ready.
- Use shadow flare.
- Garuda on Obey always. I've added slash to miasma2.

Saved cooldowns are wasted cooldowns.

Always use garuda, it is the only viable pet come end game, you could use ifrit for trash pull with Sic, but its makes very little difference, so stick to garuda.

Learn how to use contagion make or break a summoner. It is possibly the most overpowered CD in the game. Contagion works on every dot you have, including potent poisoning potion.

Dot potency depends on your initial application, which means Raging strikes/Int pot have to be used before dots, and contagion after.

Ruin 1 should be spammed for general dps, ruin 2 is for movement, or you need to use off-GCD abilities such as fester/bane/energy drain. Never use off-gcd ability after ruin 1, always add a ruin 2.

Mana management is important in endgame, so energy drain is just as important as fester.

SMN has raise, dont make you healers hardcast it.

for stats: iLVL>>>>>>>>>>crit/det>>>>>>>>>>spell speed. Accuracy for T5 is 450, T9 is 491.

Ifrit is a melee based egi. He deals high short term burst damage to an enemy, and is good for burning down a boss who is nearly dead or even at the very beginning of a fight to help you do immediate damage while you apply your dots.

Garuda egi, is a range dps over time summon. She is a what I call a support summon. What she lacks in damage she makes up for in resources. Her contagion adds time to your dots so you can do other things.

She is best used during the grind of a boss fight. When those damage over time dps are important to beat enrage timers. She can do some decent AOE's but really her calling is one vs one fighting.

Titan egi - Solo content, or be a OT to a group. He is good for crowed control. When the tank takes a lot of heat, Titan can elevate that damage onto himself which will help the healer.

Don't be a one egi summoner, learn to use them all at different times, and make yourself into a swiss-army knife.

Be a swiss army knife when your only job is to slice through butter and you take out the corkscrew.

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Originally Posted by Seobit

Be a swiss army knife when your only job is to slice through butter and you take out the corkscrew.

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Only if you are a dull knife.

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Originally Posted by NovaUltimatum

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You may not be a master SMN, but I am and what you said is on point!!! I agree with everything he said :)

I do have SMN to 50, with an extreme weapon and not much else. I have 2 accessories left to finish i90'ing my SCH, then I will be focusing my Myth on SMN so that I can have a Tank, Healer, mDPS, and pDPS on the same char : D

I have been messing with SMN in some HM dungeons and stuff (I'm at like loli65 with 3 i90 tank accessories or something, just because I don't even have darklight casting ones). I get the dot rotation and up-time management and I understand MP management with Ruin/Ruin2, what I am having trouble with is managing Garuda just because I didn't play SMN AT ALL from 35-50, so I have Enkindle, Spur, Contagion, and Sic that are all pretty much totally foreign to me. I understand weaving abilities and all that, and I'm fairly comfortable with managing aetherflow on my Banes/Festers/Energy Drains.

My questions:

- Will contagion'ed DoTs be baned with the original duration, or will the extended duration be applied?
- When is the absolute "best" time to use contagion (I'm assuming when Bio is about to wear off?), and what do I do with that extra time? Just Ruin1 spamming, using a Fester if applicable, Virus, Eye for an Eye, etc? I always feel like I'm left with not much going on as a SMN with only 3 (and a pretty situational 4th) dots to apply.
- How do I manage Enkindle/Rouse - besides: "Use it when you are in X situation, always" how should I intermingle Rouse/Spur/Enkindle?
- What other pet micro management should I be aware of? I play on PS4 and I really only like to use 24 hot-buttons (1 X-hotbar and another 8 buttons accessible by holding both triggers down), but if I need to add another set to be able to not be a sucky end-game SMN I will : D

Thank you for reading through my ignorance, and thanks OP for starting this tread!

@Ehayte

1. Yes, extended duration will be applied.
2. It varies depending on situation. Most of time I use Raging Strike > Apply Bio II, Miasma, Bio > Fester > Miasma II (If you close to enemy) > Contagion. This rotation will make your DoT hits harder with longer duration.
3. On my SMN, I tend to use Rouse+Spur when they're not on cooldown to maximize damage output from pets. Some are pretty situational, example is to use Garuda-Egi's Enkindle on large mob pulled or need slight burst damage (Example : Titan heart phase). Make sure Spur+Rouse is up to maximize Enkindle damage output.
4. You want to put Obey on your hotbar, as well Contagion so Garuda doesn't derp and use Contagion at wrong time. I made a macro for Contagion so I don't need to spam Contagion key in order to apply it to the enemy. You might want to experiment with your hotbar more so you feel comfortable to control your summons.

I am just wondering about when you summon your pet, its stats are calculated on your base stats including gear (potions has no effects)

So I am trying to get jewelry sets for different summons. For Garuda, obviously no need but wondering how good Ifrit would be with more str.
That would be to do before a fight and switch back to SMN jewelry.

The drawback is that when you cast ROUSE/SPUR then the stats are calculated again to what you are currently wearing

Probably tested somewhere :)

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Originally Posted by NovaUltimatum

- For Ruin/Ruin2, it's best used as one of your GCD abilities once all the standard DoTs are up. You can push with Ruin2 spams when you need to take something down quickly and don't mind the extra MP loss, otherwise for long term fights where you need to keep a good supply of MP, stick with Ruin1.

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I think it's important to note that there is no dps difference between Ruin and Ruin 2. The only times Ruin 2 would dps something down faster is in conjunction with a fester or if you are on the move. Otherwise, the only difference is that the Ruin 2 damage comes out at the beginning of the GCD rather than the end. If you are simply spamming Ruin 2, you are only wasting MP.

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Originally Posted by Zike

I think it's important to note that there is no dps difference between Ruin and Ruin 2. The only times Ruin 2 would dps something down faster is in conjunction with a fester or if you are on the move. Otherwise, the only difference is that the Ruin 2 damage comes out at the beginning of the GCD rather than the end. If you are simply spamming Ruin 2, you are only wasting MP.

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No, that's mistaken. Spamming ruin II at close range means that you get extra auto-attacks on top of the ruin damage (you auto attack while waiting on the GCD). It's not a waste of mp when you combine it with auto-attacks, because it's more damage. And if you stack on the boss anyway and mp isn't an issue for the particular fight, then that's what you should be doing.

It would be a waste of mp to spam ruin II while standing far away from the target the entire fight (Turn 7).

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Originally Posted by AarinEphemera

1. Yes, extended duration will be applied.

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As a newish SMN, one thing I'm curious about is the 15% chance that Bane'd dots will have their duration reset to full. If you use Contagion, then Bane, and that 15% kicks in - what happens?

Option 1: Nothing. Any dots at or above full duration are unaffected. I think this is most likely, but don't know, so that's why I'm asking.

Option 2: It will it REDUCE the duration of your dots to their normal full duration. This would suck.

Option 3: It will treat the Contagion as an increase to the full duration of the dot - meaning dots would be reset to their full duration plus 15 seconds. This would be awesome!

Anyone know which of these is the real story?

Also, when that 15% kicks in, does it reset all dots, or does each dot have its own 15% chance of reset?

They fixed that already LineageRazor. The bug was that if, by chance, the 15% chance effect happened, it would reduce the contagion'd DoTs to their original duration. So to answer your question, option 1.

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

Also, when that 15% kicks in, does it reset all dots, or does each dot have its own 15% chance of reset?

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If you only have a few seconds left on your dot duration and Bane, there's a 15% chance the Bane-d dots will be applied at their normal full duration. I don't rely on this, personally, as the bane cooldown timer with large packs lets me cast a full set of dots and miasma2 on an un-dotted mob before casting bane again.

I just view this bonus as an ok passive way for us to close the gap with BLM's big AoE casts.

Crit BiS
Prerequisite:
Garuda-egi
1 stack Aetherflow (with Aetherflow off the cooldown)
HQ Deviled Eggs for Coil
HQ Buttons for Extreme Primals
HQ Mega-potion of Int
HQ Potent Poisoning Potion (optional)

Opening Rotation: – (skills in parenthesis are off the global cooldown)
( Raging Strikes ) Bio II >> Miasma >> Bio > ( Fester ) > Ruin II + Move to CLOSE RANGE >> Miasma II > [optional] HQ Poison Pot >> ( Swiftcast ) Shadow Flare + Contagion >> ( Rouse ) > Ruin II >> ( Spur ) > Ruin II >> ( Fester ) > Ruin > [varies in fights, read below] ( Enkindle )

Why use Miasma before Bio II??
- Miasma applies a slow, and it is crucial in some fights like Dreadknight to apply a slow immediately. Other than that, it is all the same.

Shadow Flare:
It doesn't matter if there is only one monster. Use Shadow Flare every time. Think of it as an extra DoT, so keep refreshing it. Pre-cast it on places where monsters will be.

What makes you a pro summoner is the ability to do the opening rotation correctly, when to use Enkindle, and of course.. to know when to clip your dots.

Lesson 1: Opening Rotation
Make sure to cast TWO Fester for each Raging Strikes
Use Miasma II every time Contagion is ready. Miasma II requires you to move in, so make sure to use Ruin II while moving. Never use Miasma II if Contagion is not ready since it's a waste of MP.
HQ PPP is optional, but it gives you a DPS boost.
Weave in Off-the-GCD skills always and use it with Ruin II

Lesson 2: When to use Enkindle
Always use Enkindle with Spur and Rouse pet buff up. Enkindle has a 300s cooldown but hits like a truck and is an AOE, so it is imperative to use it at the right time at certain fights:
Twintania: Use it in your opening rotation to kill Drakes faster, and use it again during Snake phase right after using LB, then use it off cooldown.
Ifrit EX: Use it in your opening rotation, then again during the last nail phase. Use it where there are two nails beside each other (also Bane there).
Titan EX normal-speed: Use it in your opening rotation and then again when first set of adds are up (also Bane there).
Titan EX Speedkill: Save it until add phase. Use Bane and then Enkindle.
Garuda EX: Use in your opening rotation, and again for plumes phase (don't hit Spiny).
Coil T1-T4: Use if off cooldown.

Lesson 3: When to clip your dots
By "clip your dots", I mean 'refreshing the dots before the timer runs out'. The right time to do it is when your DoTs are about to go below 12 seconds, and when (in 6-7 seconds):
The monster is about to "jump", for example: Titan. After doing the fight countless times, you will notice the exact times that he will jump – depends on group DPS, but you will know the HP % by then.
You know that you might be "frozen", for example: (i) Twintania Conflagrations, and (ii) Titan Gaols.

Extra Lesson: Festers and Bane and Pet
Please, for the love of Eorzea, never use Energy Drain over Fester in any circumstance. You might run out of MP, but that's why Aetherflow gives you MP back. The only time you can use Energy Drain is when Fester is down, and you wanted to Ruin II + Energy Drain combo a monster to get the killing blow.

Bane:
The function of this skill is self-explanatory, but the right time to use it is tricky. Whenever you want to Bane, make sure that the DoTs are Contagioned. Best times to use Bane:

Twintania:
Use on the Drake Adds right after you put all 3 DoTs with Raging strikes buff up, and use it again on a contagioned Number 2 Drake Add to reapply the DoTs.
Use on Conflagrations (manage aetherflow stack well here), Snakes, and Dreadknights (but reapply Miasma to slow it).
Ifrit EX:
Use on the nails that spawn right next to Ifrit.
Last nail phase: Use on the nails that are next to each other.
Titan EX Speedkill:
Use on gaols that the BLM is unable to do Double-Flare with.
Garuda EX:
Never Bane the Spiny Plume.
Use Bane when Garuda and a sister are right next to each other.

Which Pet to use and how to micromanage it:
Garuda-egi all the way, and Contagion + Miasma II every minute.
Make a macro with ALL your skills to add:
/pac "Wind Blade" <t>
Have your "Obey" skill on an easily-accessed button. I have mine on "F".
Position Garuda-egi where there is less chance that she will get knocked back.
In some cases like Ifrit AOE Pushback and Titan Landslide, you will have to manual move Garuda back in range for DPS. Otherwise, it will only sit there idling. The easy fix for this is to spam your "Obey" skill on the monster as it will go into range by itself.
Whenever you want to Enkindle or Contagion, make sure that Garuda-egi is on "obey" on the monster you want to use the skill on.

Credits goes to Artemis

source http://shinra.guildwork.com/forum/th...ow-to-summoner

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Originally Posted by AldoVonAlexandros

stuff

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A lot of what you said is not optimal. For example, in the opening rotation you should be using your pet buffs first + enkindle as you run to the boss before raging strikes (this way you are already "CLOSE" for auto attacks and miasma 2 in advance).

You should never cast miasma first, there is no reason to. Even with dreadnights you can simply bane your dots from twintania onto it, which is what a "pro" summoner should be doing in the first place (assuming the tank knows where to be).


Clipping dots that have 6-7 seconds left is terrible, and wastes MP. It also results in less DPS overall. If you are going to "clip" your dots, you should be timing it so that you clip exactly as the timer on it runs out (goes from 1 to nothing, before the dot disappears). This is because your dots get a final tic as the timer disappears.


You seem to have a grasp on playing summoner, but I don't think you're ready to give lessons yet.

Contagion or not, I'd rather use my pot CD for an X-Potion of Int instead of a poison potion but that's just me...

About Garuda vs. Ifrit
Even without Contagion, I still prefer her over Ifrit just because her style of her AoE. Ifrit's is really narrow and initiates around himself while Garuda's goes off around the selected target - helps a lot in large pulls.
Shadow Flare + Miasma II + Garuda AoE + Summoner's attacks can dish out some pretty decent AoE damage. (+ Enkindle of, WHEN it's up that is >_> , dat 5min cooldown)

Also - Any idea where Ifrit's Radiant Shield is useful?

Still, I'd say the true mastery of this class comes with a lot of practice and dealing with all kinds of people and classes/jobs. You'll have to adjust yourself to every situation accordingly and communicate with others to get the most out of your dps (like telling others to lure adds to the boss for bane or move close to Titan when they are about to get jailed).
You're might be able to pull out super duper dps if you do brayflox HM speedruns all day but I'd take the more fun, unpredictable situations any day - there's where I truly shine as SMN.

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Originally Posted by Shikiseki

Contagion or not, I'd rather use my pot CD for an X-Potion of Int instead of a poison potion but that's just me...

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X-Potion of Intelligence and Potent Poison Potions are on separate CD timers. You can use both.

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Originally Posted by xxalucard

You should never cast miasma first, there is no reason to. Even with dreadnights you can simply bane your dots from twintania onto it, which is what a "pro" summoner should be doing in the first place (assuming the tank knows where to be).

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The heavy effect of Miasma does not apply off a bane, it only apply the dot as heavy is an additional effect of Miasma. In Twintania, you are correct in baning your dots over, but even then, you need to apply miasma AGAIN in order for the heavy to apply, then get garuda onto it and dps it down

I made a guide for smn dps- for lawlz (its mildly inappropriate)

Singe Target: http://24.media.tumblr.com/f7138cb19...o9so1_1280.png

Aoe DPS: http://24.media.tumblr.com/80f0fbfe7...o9so2_1280.png

plz don't ban me se!!!

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Originally Posted by Adeline

I made a guide for smn dps- for lawlz (its mildly inappropriate)

Singe Target: http://24.media.tumblr.com/f7138cb19...o9so1_1280.png

Aoe DPS: http://24.media.tumblr.com/80f0fbfe7...o9so2_1280.png

plz don't ban me se!!!

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Leet aoe dps strategy: put down normal cast Shadow Flare...wait until the tank moves the mobs out of it a few seconds later then swiftcast shadowflare.

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Originally Posted by Kirinichibon

Leet aoe dps strategy: put down normal cast Shadow Flare...wait until the tank moves the mobs out of it a few seconds later then swiftcast shadowflare.

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o right, those gais

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Adeline

I made a guide for smn dps- for lawlz (its mildly inappropriate)

Singe Target: http://24.media.tumblr.com/f7138cb19...o9so1_1280.png

Aoe DPS: http://24.media.tumblr.com/80f0fbfe7...o9so2_1280.png

plz don't ban me se!!!

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Best guide evaaaar!

So, I'm really enjoying the class at the moment, but I'm kind of wondering if I'm doing this right. Right now, only 42 SMN, but I use carbuncle in place of Garuda. What I usually do is DoT up one target (Miasma/Bio II/Bio), use Shining Emerald (DoT extender), use Aetherflow and then Bane, Fester, Energy Drain and Ruin II. I then check to see if there's any targets missed by Bane and DoT them up, then go back and just cast Ruin/Ruin II while waiting for DoT timers. Does this seem about right?

Bio2 first
Only use Ruin. Ruin 2 is only when you are moving long enough to use the GCD time or when you need to use off-GCD abilities
Don't get into a habit of using energy drain regularly. It doesn't really matter right now, but later on you'll want to use all 3 aetherstacks on just bane/fester. ED is just for buttclinch final 1% killing of something or if you just got ressed and need MP badly. You may find yourself using it for MP towards the end of some fights like T5 while you're learning it, but eventually you won't.