Crafters can use a "save" skill when luck trumps skills...

Even the best crafters in the game sometimes get a little bad luck that throws off the craft. When Steady Hand (20%) + Hasty Touch (50%) fails 4 times in a row, it really comes down to bad luck (0.3 x 0.3 x 0.3 x 0.3 = 0.0081) which is not even 1% chance but it happens and it sucks. Perhaps crafters should get a skill that takes no durability but will turn the condition to Excellent so they have a chance to "save" the quality on their craft. It's just disheartening to see touches fail 4 times in a row on an expensive craft.

sh2
/thread

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Yukio

Even the best crafters in the game sometimes get a little bad luck that throws off the craft. When Steady Hand (20%) + Hasty Touch (50%) fails 4 times in a row, it really comes down to bad luck (0.3 x 0.3 x 0.3 x 0.3 = 0.0081) which is not even 1% chance but it happens and it sucks. Perhaps crafters should get a skill that takes no durability but will turn the condition to Excellent so they have a chance to "save" the quality on their craft. It's just disheartening to see touches fail 4 times in a row on an expensive craft.

---

You've been horribly corrupted by the plethora of MMOs that treat crafting like a collection quest.

Chance to fail is a good thing.

Hasty isn't the only touch you have. Steady Hands + Standard = 100% success. You just gotta put some clothes on with lots of CP and manage your points better. They give you lots of time to develop without the skill for a reason. You should be relying on skills that give 90-100% success rates. Personal opinion.

This is what Reclaim is for. If shit is hitting the fan, you can use it, then force yourself to fail the synth and have a 90% chance to get all your materials back.

I have it equipped, but I've never once had to use it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ruinedmirage

Hasty isn't the only touch you have. Steady Hands + Standard = 100% success. You just gotta put some clothes on with lots of CP and manage your points better. They give you lots of time to develop without the skill for a reason. You should be relying on skills that give 90-100% success rates. Personal opinion.

---

Level 50 HQ AF gear all melded and overmelded yields 342 CP. With Inner Quiet costing 18 and Steady Hand costing 44 (2x 22) = 62 you are left with 280 CP before regen. Remember Master Mend II costs 160, manipulation costs 88. Explain to me how you can HQ a 2 star item with Standard Touch. Please kindly enlighten us and walk us through step by step what abilities you use and the amount of CP you have remaining.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Swag

You've been horribly corrupted by the plethora of MMOs that treat crafting like a collection quest.

Chance to fail is a good thing.

---

I am not debating whether or not I should have a chance to fail. I like having those odds of failing. What I proposed is very much luck dependent because even if I have an excellent condition, my next touch can still fail. But at least it's a chance of redemption.

BSM 50, Ingenuity II makes every recipe 47 for 5 steps.
GSM 50, Innovation gives you 50% control for 5 steps. That means more quality per touch.
Crp 50, Byregot's Blessing has the effect of double, even triple quality increase.
Ltw 50, Waste Not II doubles Durability in effect.

Throw in some HQ mats, food and HQ gear, you will find in time, there is no RnG in the crafting. It's rotation and a lot of grind.

What you are facing is short term frustration. By the time you have crawled through the tunnel of crafting, you will find the only real throttles are Pot Ash, Coke and monumental hours of shard farming.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Yukio

I am not debating whether or not I should have a chance to fail. I like having those odds of failing. What I proposed is very much luck dependent because even if I have an excellent condition, my next touch can still fail. But at least it's a chance of redemption.

---

"My next touch can still fail"? Not if you have an ounce of intelligence, it won't. It is easy to set up a touch with 100% chance of success, if that's what you need.

Hasty Touch ... 50% chance of success.
Basic Touch ... 70% chance of success.
Standard Touch ... 80% chance of success.
Advanced Touch ... 90% chance of success.

Anyone with a brain tries to keep Steady Hand, or better yet, Steady Hand 2, up whenever they are adding Quality. With Steady Hand, any Touch that was 80% or higher base chance of success will never fail. With Steady Hand 2, the only Touch that can fail is Hasty.

With the way that Poor halves the Quality gain that turn, Normal keeps it at 100%, Good raises it to 150%, and Excellent raises it to about 400% ... asking to be able to Excellent on demand is asking a heck of a lot. I'm not even working 1 star recipes, and I know *that* much.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Yukio

Level 50 HQ AF gear all melded and overmelded yields 342 CP. With Inner Quiet costing 18 and Steady Hand costing 44 (2x 22) = 62 you are left with 280 CP before regen. Remember Master Mend II costs 160, manipulation costs 88. Explain to me how you can HQ a 2 star item with Standard Touch. Please kindly enlighten us and walk us through step by step what abilities you use and the amount of CP you have remaining.

---

wat? i have 342 cp and am certainly not overmelded or maxed on CP. You is wrong.

Using steady hand is a fail. Steady hand 2, then come back and join the big kid discussion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dragonflyseksparade

wat? i have 342 cp and am certainly not overmelded or maxed on CP. You is wrong.

Using steady hand is a fail. Steady hand 2, then come back and join the big kid discussion.

---

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...80#post1273980

If you are going to be arrogant at least provide the correct information. His figure is correct unless you are on CP food, even then spamming anything but hasty touches is unviable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HealBus

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...80#post1273980

If you are going to be arrogant at least provide the correct information. His figure is correct unless you are on CP food, even then spamming anything but hasty touches is unviable.

---

ok, keep telling yourself that ;)

Please tell me how you can spam anything but hasty touches. Maybe it is something that you picked up by only limiting yourself to one DoH at 50.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HealBus

Cute response, despite getting caught out lying with easily googeable information.

---

You need to work on your condescending responses. Step#1 - you can't be condescending without being right. Perhaps with google you can find my lodestone and see that I now have 345 cp after I added materia to my ring. And I'll have 348cp once I add it to my offhand.

Cheers

My mistake, the max is 351 CP. So no overmelds right?

Anyways I apologise for the condescension. I usually respond in kind when I spot people doing it.

I'm barely materia melded (+6 Craft and +1 CP) on full HQ gear, and I don't use Hasty Touch most of the time. I use macros for my 80 durability company supply runs, 100% HQ chance every time except the rare Excellent GS > Poor BB. NQ materials, no food. Works for everything 50 and under except for a few oddballs with items for ingredients or the ones that take crystals.

For 1 stars it's similar, but my macros only cover about 2/3 of the recipe, plus I use food and Innovation. 100% HQ chance 100% of the time from NQ ingredients. Again no Hasty Touch used.

I haven't tried 2 star recipes, so I can't say if Hasty Touch is needed there or not.

For the CP cap, full HQ base 313+35 melded, that makes 348. At least from what I've seen in game and posts about the melding caps.

Haven't tried non hasty touch spam for 2 star and after making a few vanyas I can't say I want to.

For me, Hasty Touch is just needed for 40 Dura 2 star Mats like Vanya Silk. Though even if I crafted a NQ Vanya Silk, there's is a rotation w/out Hasty Touch that always gives 100% HQ for 80 Dura 2 Star Items.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Whitefall

For me, Hasty Touch is just needed for 40 Dura 2 star Mats like Vanya Silk. Though even if I crafted a NQ Vanya Silk, there's is a rotation w/out Hasty Touch that always gives 100% HQ for 80 Dura 2 Star Items.

---

^ This mostly. With proper gear, cross-class skills, and technique there is some approach to 100% HQ every "finished" product in the game with 0% failure rate starting with full NQ mats.

Just read the 5 inner quiet stack plus blessing nuke to 100% strategy...zzz this is going to be long getting another DoH to 50. Have not failed a hasty touch spam vanyas before so no idea if it is worth it, more worried about 90ks during a synth rather than anything else.

http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen..._let_crafters/

Thats one of the best guides on how to HQ using cross class skills.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HealBus

My mistake, the max is 351 CP.

---

The max is 348 cp.

I hate when get like 94% and still fail to get HQ

With over 100 star 2 crafts and not one finish has been nq except some of the 40 durability basic mats. I'd say markets will crash soon :(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gtasthehunter

I hate when get like 94% and still fail to get HQ

---

Try 98%.
/10chars

There is an ability to give you back most of the materials if it is botched.
Forgot the name though,

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tymora

There is an ability to give you back most of the materials if it is botched.
Forgot the name though,

---

It's Reclaim, level 50 Culinary skills, 90% chance you get the mats back, crystals not included.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dragonflyseksparade

sh2
/thread

---

Here's how my SH2 + HT (80%) went a couple days ago. Ended up getting NQ both times on a L50 80 durability item. Oh and "Good" or "Excellent" never procced.

First Synth:
IQ
SH2
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
SH2
HT (Success)
MM2
HT (Failed)
HT (Success)
HT (Failed)
...

Second Synth:
IQ
SH2
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
SH2
HT (Success)
MM2
HT (Success)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
...

I've also gotten NQ on 98% HQ chance numerous times but HQed with 1%.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raldo

This is what Reclaim is for. If shit is hitting the fan, you can use it, then force yourself to fail the synth and have a 90% chance to get all your materials back.

I have it equipped, but I've never once had to use it.

---

yup. Reclaim is awesome. I'll bail a synth just to try again if RNG is screwing me. Fantastic for HQing those one star/two star items without any HQ materials. I have yet to have reclaim fail on me too (but I've only used it maybe a few dozen times).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rehwyn

^ This mostly. With proper gear, cross-class skills, and technique there is some approach to 100% HQ every "finished" product in the game with 0% failure rate starting with full NQ mats.

---

Very true :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kyronex

Here's how my SH2 + HT (80%) went a couple days ago. Ended up getting NQ both times on a L50 80 durability item. Oh and "Good" or "Excellent" never procced.

First Synth:
IQ
SH2
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
SH2
HT (Success)
MM2
HT (Failed)
HT (Success)
HT (Failed)
...

Second Synth:
IQ
SH2
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
SH2
HT (Success)
MM2
HT (Success)
HT (Failed)
HT (Failed)
...

---

It's amazing how the odds of this happening are very rare but it happens :( , it's why I hate using Hasty Touch.. My highest level of DoH is 35 so I haven't had the pleasure of having to use it much but when I do it tends to fail more often than not