The 'Minion Enthusiast' that's a part of the Yokai Watch event has an inaccurate translation in English. The NPCs can be found in New Gridania, (12.3 , 12.3) and Limsa Lominsa Lower Decks (9.9 , 10.9)
In English:
(Grid)
Minion Enthusiast: You're asking about my curious collectible? Well, he's...uh... I actually have no idea what he is. But I'm assuming his armor is based on some sort of ancient relic, and that makes him a good deal rarer.
(Limsa)
Minion Enthusiast: Isn't he positively adorable? ...What is he, you ask? Erm, well, judging by the crescent moon and his ice blue armor, I think he's supposed to be a guardian of Menphina or some such?
In Japanese:
ミニオン好きの冒険者 : えっ、私が連れてるミニオンが気になるって？
だったら、ウルダハに行ってみるといいわよ。
きっと、手がかりが見つかるはずだから。
(Lit. Minion-loving adventurer: Oh, you're curious about the minion I have with me?
Then you should go to Ul'dah. I'm sure you'll find some clues there.)
The JP text actually serves a purpose, directing curious players to a specific location to take part in the event.
The EN text is just useless flavortext that serves no functional purpose and fails to adequately inform the player.
Please, SE, consider fixing this by replacing the EN text with the literal translation, and lay off the pointless revisionism!
Awful translation for 'Minion Enthusiast' - PLEASE FIX!!
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04-27-2024, 07:31 AMTelkiraAwful translation for 'Minion Enthusiast' - PLEASE FIX!!
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04-28-2024, 11:36 AMRongwayThe JP text might sound more direct and purposeful, but it's boring. The EN text has much more flavor. And since it doesn't matter in the end that the text doesn't explicitly direct you to Ul'dah like the JP text does, I prefer it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Telkira
There are very good reasons we have a localization team and not just a "literal translation" team. This is one of them. Direct translations from other languages are, by and large, flat. Boring. Matter-of-fact. Because direct translations are often mapped to plain English, which is all those things. Flavor in English comes from being less plain in one way or another, using purposefully chosen words to convey character, tone, and intent. We do not need more direct translations. They would only make the game staler. -
04-28-2024, 04:28 PMTelkiraIt's not boring, though, and it does matter. An NPC (especially an event one) designed to rouse interest, acknowledge said interest, and tell the player how they can partake is a pinnacle function in terms of NPC design. That's literally their purpose.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rongway
The JP translation is also better, in that it's simple, has personality, and actually serves a purpose - acknowledging the player's interest in their minion and directing them to where they should go. The EN text serves no effective purpose, genuinely. It's just bloated text.
The localization team shouldn't be taking liberties where they deviate from the intent of the original text. Localization apologists know this is an issue but try to spin it with preferences when it's very clear that not everyone shares that same preference. You can still have flavor but still retain that intended function, and this failed spectacularly at that. I wouldn't be so mad if the NPCs still told you where to go, but it's flavor with no substance.
If you want 'flavor' that deviates from the source material and fails to serve a legitimate purpose, then you don't want what's best for a foreign game. You want WoW or something, go play that and stop supporting what are ultimately marketing practices masquerading as artistic/design ones. I want to play a JRPG.
I understand that SE chose to go with localization with regard to EN but that approach is very much controversial and prone to mistakes. This is one of them. They should do right by the community and revise the text to carry forth and preserve the original intent of the JP script, which was to inform the player.
Edit:
Here's the FRE one:
Férue des mascottes : Ma mascotte vous intrigue, pas vrai ? Héhéhé ! Vous n'êtes pas le premier à m'approcher pour savoir où je me la suis procurée. Comme je ne suis pas vache, je vais vous donner un petit indice : allez enquêter du côté d'Ul'dah.
(Lit. Mascot enthusiast: My mascot intrigues you, right? Hehehe! You are not the first to approach me to find out where I got it. Since I'm not stupid, I'll give you a little hint: go investigate near Ul'dah.)
Like.. it doesn't make any sense why the EN localization is so bad. -
04-29-2024, 08:31 AMVyrerusWhat are you on about? All the EN text does is show me two idiots that don't know what they have. The flavor is idiocy, and it's not amusing. The JP text has the guy imply he knows all about it, and knows where you can also find out all about it. The JP text actually kind of stirs the imagination, because it also makes you wonder how he knows.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rongway
And like Telkira said, that really does matter with regards to doing something that has an objective. No one is playing XIV to get lost and try and stumble around figuring it all out on their own.
Localization teams' job is not to add flavor. It is to convey intent. This sometimes means they have to be non-literal with translation to convey idioms or societal in-jokes. It is not, and should not be, their job to just add jokes and "flavor" for the sake of it. That's how you get things irrelevant to the characters or game at large, gumming up the EN text. Or how you get lore that's only present in a single language.
It's a very good case for the EN team needing an oversight committee. Preferably one made of people they do not know closely, who will not allow them to just insert whatever they feel like. -
04-29-2024, 01:23 PMTelkira
Regardless of how you feel about localization vs. faithful translation, this is bad. You can't sit there and say "oh but the translated text is boring!" when that's a very subjective point of view that also compromises utility.
I wouldn't have that much of an issue with it if it were faithful to the source material. It was fine the way it was, that's why the FRE and GER translations are better, objectively. -
04-29-2024, 06:42 PMEnkidoh
Ugh, not this tired old arguement again? The localization team have outright stated in the past they prefer to make an English language version with a narrative that is more interesting from a narrative viewpoint rather than a pedestrian straight translation of the Japanese version.
You can disagree with them, but it won't change anything. The localization will continue as it always has.
Also the English and Japanese versions are developed hand in glove anyway so the Japanese version isn't really the 'source material', as both versions draw from each other (for instance, it's the English language version that brought in concepts like the Twelveswood also being known as 'Black Shroud', and why Nald'thal is a twin god.). -
04-29-2024, 07:58 PMTelkiraYes, this old argument again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Enkidoh
Not everyone is happy the EN script as it currently exists. A lot of players prefer consistency and faithfulness to the source material (which it objectively is, that's why the FRE and GER languages are more in-line, if not consistent, with it) and want to feel assured that what they're seeing isn't some revised or censored account that could have been better for everyone. That's why this issue keeps coming up.
The Localization team didn't say that.Quote:
The localization team have outright stated in the past they prefer to make an English language version with a narrative that is more interesting from a narrative viewpoint rather than a pedestrian straight translation of the Japanese version.
They stated that they made a point to ensure consistency with the intent and meaning across languages. They admit to taking liberties, but have always tried to assure users that faithfulness was their mission. As pointed out earlier, it's these deviations can best be summarized as 'flavor but no substance', the substance being the practical purpose. Even if the sentences are different, the overall intent has always remained the same with very few exceptions.
Also, there's nothing 'pedestrian' about the Japanese script. It's not boring, nor is it devoid of narrative value. I don't get where localization apologists get this idea that faithful translations are 'boring' or devoid of character. They do have character, I'd argue, in that it doesn't overload the player with bloated flavortext that ultimately fails to entertain the player and allows other artistic elements of the game to set the tone and mood for you.
I've seen what direct translations look like for the game's JP content, both done using tools like DeepL and gtranslate, and even seeing what bilingual players say.
The JP script is so much more satisfying to read, carries the point across, and entertains me, and quite frankly, if it were presented as such without all the arbitrary flavor that the EN script has, you and all the others would still appreciate the game all the same, just like the French and German players do.
Until they release a second EN option that's a direct translation of the JP script for players to choose in the launcher, they can very easily step in and correct these issues. I wouldn't even have made a complaint if these lalafell NPCs simply mentioned Ul'Dah, since that would direct the player where to go. The French dialog is so pleasing in that regard, it CONFOUNDS me why they didn't just translate that into English and stick with it!Quote:
You can disagree with them, but it won't change anything. The localization will continue as it always has.
Yes, they both partake in writing the script together, but the JP script is considered the 'canon' script or the 'master' script.Quote:
Also the English and Japanese versions are developed hand in glove anyway so the Japanese version isn't really the 'source material', as both versions draw from each other (for instance, it's the English language version that brought in concepts like the Twelveswood also being known as 'Black Shroud', and why Nald'thal is a twin god.).