What are you guys hoping for in the new "Criterion" dungeons?

With 6.2 coming sooner or later, I just wanted to see what other people were thinking/speculating on what's gonna be in the new upcoming Criterion Dungeons.

I'm hoping for some mildly challenging dungeons finally, maybe some bosses that are on the same level as some of the Bozja bosses.
Player scaling difficulty really sounds interesting to me. It's going to be interesting seeing what real solo dungeon content will be like, rather than entering a DD solo which feels pretty awkward.

What are you hoping for? Are you hyped? Do you think you'll be disappointed?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sazuzaki

What are you hoping for? Are you hyped? Do you think you'll be disappointed?

---

Hope: A high range of progressing difficulty across composition- and member-count-scaled remasters of past dungeons that add unique affordances as metrics for success. Trial of Wind, for instance, might be a speedrun, that adds a few additional mob types, and offers unique tools to that purpose. Trial of Fire might offer accumulating offensive buffs that can make any deaths very punishing for the last boss, but also give some extra tools (Duty Action I/II) by which to keep alive or keep uptime. Etc., etc.

Hyped: No.

Why: Because I think I'll be disappointed, even if I lowered my expectation to just the dungeons being rereleased as is with very basic enemy damage and HP scalars for when entering undermanned.

I expect nothing aside from still being disappointed by the devs somehow screwing it up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Hope: A high range of progressing difficulty across composition- and member-count-scaled remasters of past dungeons that add unique affordances as metrics for success. Trial of Wind, for instance, might be a speedrun, that adds a few additional mob types, and offers unique tools to that purpose. Trial of Fire might offer accumulating offensive buffs that can make any deaths very punishing for the last boss, but also give some extra tools (Duty Action I/II) by which to keep alive or keep uptime. Etc., etc.

---

Man what you said here actually sounds pretty dope. I wish they were more open to things like this.

I ust hope for some nice duo content. This mmo, like many, gives you either group or solo content but never duo content, and I tend to play in duo a lot. So hopefully it will be fun on that side.

I am hoping for mythic plus.

It won't be mythic plus.

What i am hoping for : something that when it comes to difficulty will be a middle ground between everything being too easy and everything one shoting you if you didn't go watch a guide beforehand to understand what is going on. And also where the mobs will use skills randomly, and not always in the same order at the same moments of the fight at the same pourcentages of their life.

What i think is more probable : something totally similar to expert dungeons when done with 4 players, with the mobs hp and damage scaled down accordingly for 1 to 3 players so that they can finish that in the same amount of time than a light party.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sazuzaki

Man what you said here actually sounds pretty dope. I wish they were more open to things like this.

---

The idea of having Trials of Wind/Earth/Fire/etc. by which to augment and shake up content actually comes from the ARR, in response to (A) my really enjoying the way Bonus Light in would rotate around what dungeons people would spam for their relics and (B) a desire for increased content longevity (which I had earlier asked for by giving minimum ilvl runs greater rewards based on the portion of ilvl synced down from expansion cap). Essentially, I wanted to be able to revisit favorite old content, add some spice per party choice, and actually get something out of it.

That would involve a significant up-front cost, but would potentially allow each expansion to (beyond just its brief leveling experience) involve expansions' worth of leveling and endgame dungeons in the roulette experience and the like, with further progressive challenge available, instead of just its narrow handful of added dungeons. In other words, expansions could add, rather than merely replace (often with less), past content.

But alas, the moment you ask for additional ways to challenge content today, and said content happens to include dungeons, you inevitably run into those who can only think of it as M+, despite that being made far later and almost none of its problems coming from its progressive further difficulties or bonus mechanics (the only part that these self-selected challenges would have in common with it), and therefore shoot down ever idea for XIV's being more open to meaningful light-party content with shallow xenophobia/dogpiling.

Hoping for: Not mythic+, anything but M+. That crap absolutely ruined WoW.

Expecting: Unreal dungeons with relic tied to it. Boy if you thought Light farming was bad.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Martynek

Hoping for: Not mythic+, anything but M+. That crap absolutely ruined WoW.

---

Referring to which aspects, exactly? This otherwise would seem about as conflated as arguing that any and all large, open-zone side-content would be awful because Eureka's element mechanic was a waste and Pyros & Hydratos had item bloat.

Is it, for instance...

• That there are multiple difficulty levels of the same dungeon?
• That it allows for dungeons to be a core and rewarding experience within the game?
• That the difficulties levels were particularly fine/granular?
• That the content tended to make use of all but the most flavor/RP-only parts of players' kits (e.g., all but Far Sight, Eye of the Beast, etc.), by providing opportunities for utility to a degree/frequency not typical to raids?
• That even DPS had to chip in in matters of survival?
• That survival often depended on burst damage and coordinated utility?
• That kiting was sometimes a thing?
• That there was no difficulty cap?
• That there was a reward cap (around where they really start getting tough or nearly to "hardcore" levels), thus no longer rewarding those higher efforts except through (sense of) achievement?
• That there were weekly "best clear" rewards?
• That once per week you could get a higher ilvl drop from your weekly challenges via the Vault than you could get by spamming that difficulty level directly?
• That there was a timer?
• That said timer was pretty lenient?
• That failing the timer only downgraded your gear by one difficulty level, without even reducing the number of drops?
• That failing the timer dropped one's keystone to one level easier instead of throwing you again and again at the challenge you'd just failed?
• That there were affixes?
• That the affixes rotated weekly?
• That there were seasonal affixes?
• That certain affixes were annoying?
• That certain affixes were more annoying in some contexts than in others?
• That Tyrannical and Fortified affixes could sometimes overly swing the needle between either trash or bosses feeling like pushovers?
• That the seasonal affixes provided both challenge and reward/boons?
• That you could only enter the dungeons through keystones, forcing one to play more than just the fastest/easiest/most lucrative dungeons and slowing BiS acquisition?
• That you could skip well ahead, provided a keybearer thought you were worth inviting?
• That addons and later the baseline game itself made it convenient to check people's sum of relevant dungeon achievement points (literally just their average level cleared alongside their highest level cleared for the dungeon they're signing up for), acting as sort of a counterbalance against parties inflating ilvl requirements to ridiculous levels?
• That certain specs were considered less meta and might be held to higher scrutiny in terms of achievement points or item level?
• That the upgrade system would introduce higher-geared and higher-skilled players into the lower difficulty levels as they sought quick currency?
• That, as in XIV, there's a paid clear market, even if they're unable to advertise openly or unsolicited without threat of ban/suspension?
• That there was additional/disporportionate pressure placed upon tanks due to their being the most convenient role to make also the leader in terms of target-marking, CD-tracker, pace-maker, and path-setter?

I'm sure there's more I've left out here, but some specifics would be great, since "M+" is as much a matter of externalities as the actual gameplay involved?