NIN is undertuned.

The playstyle, flow, and complexity of NIN is great. I'll start with that. I'm also nowhere near expecting to be a "Top DPS" job, because we still bring insane utility via Trick Attack.

With that said, our personal dps is abysmally low. We were compensated (much like everyone else) due to slashing debuff being removed, but in combination with Dripping Blades being removed, we actually do less damage on some of our skills post-ShB, Aeolian Edge for example.

Bunshin is also an extreme let down. Long cool-down, flat damage off weapon skills, doesn't scale with combos, nothing. There is no difference between popping Bunshin and spamming throwing daggers and doing an AE combo.

I don't mind being on the "lower-end" of DPS at all, but I definitely noticed overall something didn't feel right the more I leveled.

Going off of the Titania SSS Dummy Values, I don't quite understand the devs decision in things like DRG/MNK being ahead of SAM, and NIN being 10-15% behind the other melee at all. Proof: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...mmy_hp_values/

Almost feels like another job with higher personal dps would be better to bring than a Ninja

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Originally Posted by DAILO

Almost feels like another job with higher personal dps would be better to bring than a Ninja

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That's my point. Trick Attack alone isn't going to save us anymore if we're THAT behind other DPS jobs. We don't need to be top-3 DPS, but we can't be this abysmally low either.

We're expected to clip again now that Raiton > Fuma, which isn't helping our cause. We need some potency buffs and Bunshin needs a rework or we may not be sought out after anymore.

Either the Sam calculation is wrong or it's because samurai takes awhile to ramp up.
Our opener is a bit more bursty though than SB.

To be fair, SSS is going to give extremely lopsided results. For example, those evaluations on Ninja aren't accounting for Trick Attack on seven other people. Given the sheer outgoing damage we're pulling off now, I'd estimate Trick providing at least 1,400-1,500 rDPS all on its own if not even higher. Ninja still may need a buff but we'll have to see how dire the situation is once more tests are done in an actual raid setting.

Samurai, on the other hand, is the far bigger issue. It offers no utility, thus its damage won't scale upwards any more than another DPS. This means once you account for Litany and Brother, Samurai is getting utterly obliterated. I don't understand why they're so afraid to give Samurai the high damage a supposed greedy DPS warrants. Do they think it'll upset the other DPS?

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

To be fair, SSS is going to give extremely lopsided results. For example, those evaluations on Ninja aren't accounting for Trick Attack on seven other people. Given the sheer outgoing damage we're pulling off now, I'd estimate Trick providing at least 1,400-1,500 rDPS all on its own if not even higher. Ninja still may need a buff but we'll have to see how dire the situation is once more tests are done in an actual raid setting.

Samurai, on the other hand, is the far bigger issue. It offers no utility, thus its damage won't scale upwards any more than another DPS. This means once you account for Litany and Brother, Samurai is getting utterly obliterated. I don't understand why they're so afraid to give Samurai the high damage a supposed greedy DPS warrants. Do they think it'll upset the other DPS?

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At the moment, from face value, our DPS is fine. Double midare and the midare buff, St guren and the enchanted shifu and jinpu.

Have to wait and see how we do in Savage though.

Ninja was the weakest personal dps job in content in SB, and they are one of the few jobs that didn't get their damage utility nerfed. I'd say it being only ahead of dancer for expected personal dps is very fair.

This is a concern I've had for a while. My fear is that NIN's personal DPS might be so low that even the rDPS bonus from TA will not be enough to put them on par with the other DPS choices. We shouldn't be top DPS by any means but our contribution should be at least on par with other DPS to make NIN worth taking. That said, I don't really have any hope of seeing any actual number buffs until after the first savage tier, so probably won't see anything for at least a month and a half from now.

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Originally Posted by SwarleyMcSwarls

Ninja was the weakest personal dps job in content in SB, and they are one of the few jobs that didn't get their damage utility nerfed. I'd say it being only ahead of dancer for expected personal dps is very fair.

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While I agree that NIN should by no means boast high personal DPS due to Trick Attack, the concern OP and a number of us have is that it might end up being more beneficial to take another melee DPS with higher personal DPS over Ninja. Put it this way, if NIN does 1,000 DPS and TA is an additional 1,000 rDPS, all you'd need is a DPS that can do 2,000 DPS to break even. In Stormblood, even though Ninja had the lowest personal DPS, the difference wasn't too big compared to other DPS and TA made up for this difference, but if TA's bonus and NIN's personal DPS can be matched or surpassed by another job's sheer personal DPS then there'd be little reason to take NIN to a raid.

I wouldn't put too much faith in a chart that says WHM is doing more DPS than tanks.

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Originally Posted by Kaozurei

While I agree that NIN should by no means boast high personal DPS due to Trick Attack, the concern OP and a number of us have is that it might end up being more beneficial to take another melee DPS with higher personal DPS over Ninja. Put it this way, if NIN does 1,000 DPS and TA is an additional 1,000 rDPS, all you'd need is a DPS that can do 2,000 DPS to break even. In Stormblood, even though Ninja had the lowest personal DPS, the difference wasn't too big compared to other DPS and TA made up for this difference, but if TA's bonus and NIN's personal DPS can be matched or surpassed by another job's sheer personal DPS then there'd be little reason to take NIN to a raid.

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This exactly is my primary concern. Thanks for elaborating for me.