"gogogo" might make me quit this game.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

This honestly needs to happen more. Not aggressively. But some people don’t know they are bad unless told they are bad. But as soon as anyone speaks up 2 things happen.
1: they are called toxic, a buzz word that gets thrown around so loosely it has zero meaning
2: someone speaks up and says something along the lines of “they are doing fine”
No. No they are not doing fine. They are barely passable, and are often times getting carried.
I had to kick a BLM once in expert roulette because the only thing they were casting was thunder. On literally every pull, every mob. Tried explaining a rotation and got told I was toxic. Put up the vote kick and was told they were doing fine. Vote kick passed btw. But had enablers not been defending bad play for so long, maybe said blm would of had half an understanding of how to play their job.

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Ppl being bad isn't really a problem it has been like that for years now but gosh those white knights "no no he's doing fine" while the dude is terrible is truly something else.
Dunno why they must lie like that all the time, even if you're asking basic stuff there will be always someone like that in any group they must defend the poor dude that's being "harrassed" smh.
It helps no one when you do that, and no being fake and lying to ppl doesn't make you a good and kind person.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

This honestly needs to happen more. Not aggressively. But some people don’t know they are bad unless told they are bad. But as soon as anyone speaks up 2 things happen.
1: they are called toxic, a buzz word that gets thrown around so loosely it has zero meaning
2: someone speaks up and says something along the lines of “they are doing fine”
No. No they are not doing fine. They are barely passable, and are often times getting carried.
I had to kick a BLM once in expert roulette because the only thing they were casting was thunder. On literally every pull, every mob. Tried explaining a rotation and got told I was toxic. Put up the vote kick and was told they were doing fine. Vote kick passed btw. But had enablers not been defending bad play for so long, maybe said blm would of had half an understanding of how to play their job.

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I've noticed that, as well. Hell, I had a CLL run where I was running as WHM. I had another WHM in my party who was dying to everything and essentially refused to heal aside from an occasional medica II. Couldn't even heal themself when rezzed. They weren't new to the content, either. I had asked as much to see if they needed any mechs explained. And the response I got from a fellow party member was "Leave them alone, they're doing fine."

So I decided to leave party. And that party was dead for the entirety of the last two fights. But yeah, they totally were doing "fine".

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

This honestly needs to happen more. Not aggressively. But some people don’t know they are bad unless told they are bad. But as soon as anyone speaks up 2 things happen.
1: they are called toxic, a buzz word that gets thrown around so loosely it has zero meaning
2: someone speaks up and says something along the lines of “they are doing fine”
No. No they are not doing fine. They are barely passable, and are often times getting carried.
I had to kick a BLM once in expert roulette because the only thing they were casting was thunder. On literally every pull, every mob. Tried explaining a rotation and got told I was toxic. Put up the vote kick and was told they were doing fine. Vote kick passed btw. But had enablers not been defending bad play for so long, maybe said blm would of had half an understanding of how to play their job.

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It's not just the players enabling though, the game should be hard enough those types of players shouldn't even be able to succeed past the early levels of the game to begin with. If they took the time to figure out the math for the average damage that a group playing optimally can achieve in that dungeon, and then set DPS checks to roughly 50% of that, so that people are required to at least be outputting half the damage their job is actually capable of I think those types of players would cease to exist, it would also leave room for deaths and recoveries and I don't think that is an unreasonable request.

The problem is that you can sit for hours at a boss soloing it because it will just repeat mechanics over and over again until its dead instead of failing. I guarantee you that if failure was an option due to a reasonable damage check enablers would cease to exist because they literally wouldn't be able to get past the content, and like stated previously this isn't supposed to be some savage or extreme level stuff, just average to encourage job learning in game.

They could also mitigate the healer dying issue in 4 person dungeons by allowing the phoenix down to be used in combat, with the same cast time, so its a punishment for using it (slowing you down) and a 10 minute cooldown or something to prevent people spamming it. That way groups could recover from healer deaths, and it would create a market for phoenix downs.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

If you pull as a dps because the tank isn't going fast enough instead of maturely asking him to go faster you are actively griefing. Get better social skills and grow up. Learn to communicate in ways that achieve positive results instead of getting reported.

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If the entirety of your party is ahead of you, most people have the common sense enough to realize they're going too slow.

But common sense is lost on most people who play this game, I know.

My favorite example of people rushing comes from Palace of the Dead where players will ignore chests that are literally right next to them, then just stand and wait in the exit for everyone else to clear it and spam gogogo as soon as the exit's lit up and get increasingly mad if it takes people in other rooms more than like three seconds to reach the exit - and god forbid someone stop to grab a chest, silver or otherwise, or track down one of the pieces of treasure hidden about. Just the other night I had a group where all three players just stood in the exit room refusing to move waiting for me to clear the enemies to unlock the exit, then when a spawn trap hit just stood there watching me die rather than moving to help and complained it took too long.

Looks like you play BLM (your profile says THM but I hope you equipped the job stone). BLM is pretty notorious for being slow since they have to stand still for long periods to cast their nuke spells.

I say... just take your time. If people rush past cutscenes, let them. It's only going to slow them down. If people sprint all over... just jog normally.

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Originally Posted by Dewslam

My favorite example of people rushing comes from Palace of the Dead where players will ignore chests that are literally right next to them, then just stand and wait in the exit for everyone else to clear it and spam gogogo as soon as the exit's lit up and get increasingly mad if it takes people in other rooms more than like three seconds to reach the exit - and god forbid someone stop to grab a chest, silver or otherwise, or track down one of the pieces of treasure hidden about. Just the other night I had a group where all three players just stood in the exit room refusing to move waiting for me to clear the enemies to unlock the exit, then when a spawn trap hit just stood there watching me die rather than moving to help and complained it took too long.

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Not worth the mimic, or getting blown up. Most people are just there to level. Sometimes it's faster (and safer) to just revive someone who dies to several mobs, than pull those mobs. Though, them just waiting there at the exit after not clearing enough enemies, while relying on others to do so, sounds like it is just people being semi-afk in PoTD and trying to get levels. They really shouldn't expect it to go fast, if they aren't bothering to clear it enough to leave.

I don't want to sound insensitive, or dismissive of toxic players, but I don't think this is anything to quit the game over. Everyone should be respectable towards others, but ultimately it is the internet. Being quick to quit the game, call a GM, or escalate the situation even further are all emotional and impulsive responses. I wouldn't call it behavior that takes a higher road.

Experiences with dungeons are by far the most diverse in the entire game, and it's largely in part due to the fact that is the content that encompasses the entire playerbase. Everyone from casuals, to anglers, to omni crafters, to PvPers, to hardcore raiders all run dungeons. As such they range from very enjoyable experiences to some of the worst toxic environments I've witnessed in any mmo.

If you want to run a dungeon without worry of the randomness of randoms, you have to run them with buddies or utilize the PF. Otherwise, be prepared to gogogo.

I havent played since April and just came back. I was suprised when in my first dungeon the tank pulled A LOT. I can handle it as healer but I prefer a slower and steady paste.
I don't recall having the problem earlier.. is it due to all the wow players flushing in?
I hope they wont influence the game much. I prefer it the way it was.. not rushing.

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Originally Posted by VanyaMirya

I havent played since April and just came back. I was suprised when in my first dungeon the tank pulled A LOT. I can handle it as healer but I prefer a slower and steady paste.
I don't recall having the problem earlier.. is it due to all the wow players flushing in?
I hope they wont influence the game much. I prefer it the way it was.. not rushing.

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It's been like this for a while. People I've talked to who've played since 2.0 did w2w pulls quite early on. I only joined in like nov/dec of last year, and w2w pulling was the norm then too.

Before walls people used to speed run by preforming the group with a BLM, and then pulling all of the mobs to the boss entrance, sleeping them, and then fighting the boss only. The mobs would get locked out, and deagro due to the aetherial barrier lol.

Can safely say that FFXIV players have always desired GOGOGO!

Also I initially thought this thread was going to be about Gogo fight from Masked Carnivale. Kind of disappointed lol

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Originally Posted by VanyaMirya

I havent played since April and just came back. I was suprised when in my first dungeon the tank pulled A LOT. I can handle it as healer but I prefer a slower and steady paste.
I don't recall having the problem earlier.. is it due to all the wow players flushing in?
I hope they wont influence the game much. I prefer it the way it was.. not rushing.

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WoW has nothing to do with this. It's just that single/some double pulls can be done by even a non-tank job that it makes tank's job barely needed if one decide not to wall pull.

It's just that (laughably) easy to do.

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Originally Posted by Puremallace

I played Rift and Aion with very similar types of game play and that was like 2012.

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Sorry for the late reply. I have played Rift and I was a part of a guild granted but we were small so when we did raids we had to join in with another guild and I feel the mentality of those two guilds when it came to raiding was about the same as here.
I can not remember much of my time doing dungeons in Rift but overall I did have a good time so it could not have been as bad as in WoW

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

Before walls people used to speed run by preforming the group with a BLM, and then pulling all of the mobs to the boss entrance, sleeping them, and then fighting the boss only. The mobs would get locked out, and deagro due to the aetherial barrier lol.

Can safely say that FFXIV players have always desired GOGOGO!

Also I initially thought this thread was going to be about Gogo fight from Masked Carnivale. Kind of disappointed lol

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Between that and sacrificing the tank. I think a lot of that started though because dungeons didn’t drop Gil. So people saw no point in killing trash.due to repairs, it was actually more expensive to kill the trash than to not

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

Between that and sacrificing the tank. I think a lot of that started though because dungeons didn’t drop Gil. So people saw no point in killing trash.due to repairs, it was actually more expensive to kill the trash than to not

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Yeah, I was told that Square Enix made it so that no gil would drop in dungeons to try and combat gil sellers. People would often gear down as to not break their expensive tome gear. I've heard about sacrificing tanks, binding enemies, and I believe that's why so many people skip the mobs in the beginning of Praetorium. It was ingrained in them due to bad game design over Square Enix's poor decisions on how to handle bots.

From what I was told, you always chose the gear reward from quests as there was no Need or Greed options on loot, just "roll" or "pass". By the end of ARR MSQ you had only accumulated around 100k gil. And on the server my husband played on, the weapon and materia you needed to complete your relic weapon could easily cost you 70k gil. And that's without tipping players to help with melds. So with money so hard to come by, and repairs so costly, players found the fastest way to complete content while skipping the most mobs possible.