So does every hate new PLD now?

I honestly hate it so much that it's killed all my desire to keep playing. I love a variety of jobs, including DRK, but I still can't be bothered to learn the new ex Trial or even do the new 24 man. Never, since I started this game in 3.4, have I ever felt so little desire to experience the new content on release. I almost don't care if I lose my house at this point. I don't get why it's depressed my desire for XIV this bad, but it has.

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Originally Posted by Rithy255

Why not instead of removing Cover/shield bash we look into how we could possibly make them more useful.

Cover is pretty simple you could 1. Remove it from gauge 2. extend the range 3. Add a healing or small defensive utility towards it.
Shield Bash, Make it a stun that doess 200 damage it stuns in aoe, OGCD has two stacks make gap closers (on all tanks) not do DPS.

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I always thought that Cover should have been a role skill for all tanks and instead they introduce something more interesting in that slot. If PLD have a 50 gauge spender where they can drop a small target aoe for one person to stand in and they take significantly reduced dmg while in it i.e. first person to step in that aoe gets a buff but if they leave they lose it. That would be much more interesting and provide more utility than Cover and provide for interesting and potentially broken mechanic cheese. It would make for tower and stack mechanic shenanigans where you can place the aoe where the tower is and suddenly that one tower is taking less dmg. I'm also sure BLM's will love you for it when they got leylines up.

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Originally Posted by Marxam

I always thought that Cover should have been a role skill for all tanks and instead they introduce something more interesting in that slot. If PLD have a 50 gauge spender where they can drop a small target aoe for one person to stand in and they take significantly reduced dmg while in it i.e. first person to step in that aoe gets a buff but if they leave they lose it. That would be much more interesting and provide more utility than Cover and provide for interesting and potentially broken mechanic cheese. It would make for tower and stack mechanic shenanigans where you can place the aoe where the tower is and suddenly that one tower is taking less dmg. I'm also sure BLM's will love you for it when they got leylines up.

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Well cover is a iconic FF 4 ability (Cecil gains it when he becomes a Paladin)
I feel Cover should be like dance partner.

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Originally Posted by Ayan_Calvesse

Well cover is a iconic FF 4 ability (Cecil gains it when he becomes a Paladin)
I feel Cover should be like dance partner.

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If it's a dps buff? no thanks I really don't like depending on others for damage output really, cover should stay as a interesting utility to me.

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Originally Posted by Ayan_Calvesse

If your level 88 Paladin you do not have the entire blades combo; 3 steps of it are earned at level 90...

I think the issue is that "Good" paladin play just isn't really rewarding; its just lukewarm - but to people who sucked at playing old paladin - new paladin is something they can play "good". The result was the good players being brought down and the low ones being brought up to a very vanilla experience.
Personally I dislike Paladins rework more so because I hate the instant cast "Holy Spirit" animation - it feels awkward and clunky and out of place and not like a "instant" but more like a very fast cast but still far less fast then a swing of my sword - with divine might we are seeing more "Holy Spirit" casts consistantly outside of Requiscat burst so it just makes the entire melee flow feel wrong....and not even sure why we have Goring blade still.
I think people were expecting Paladin to gain a identity from the rework; not be watered down to "Tank with shield" next to "Tank with Axe" and "Tank with Gunblade" and "Tank with Greatsword"

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I think I messed up on my wording for the level 88 part, I meant to say that because you don't have the blades combo at that level that the rotation is "harder" because you have to think to press different buttons and not just spam the same button 4 times.
I definitely agree on the GNB light and Goring Blade comments though. Goring feels like it was designed to be sonic break with no DoT and all damage but it feels completely underwhelming, clunky and out of place to use. Divine Might is alright when doing dungeons for a slightly more interesting aoe combo than just 1-2 (this is the nicest thing I can say that came out of the PLD rework, and it just adds to the GNB light) but for single target HS just feels so out of place to use after an atonement or RA.
I also see your point about good paladin gameplay, I guess it's just my opinion that jobs shouldnt be reworked because people feel obligated to do that most amount of damage for the least amount of effort (even if that wasnt the reason for this update) the jobs were already there and you could use them in sooo much of the games content without knowing a thing you were doing, just press buttons and win. I don't mean that as in I dislike simpler jobs but rather completely stripping jobs of their identity/uniqueness because of it I really dislike. It was the uniqueness and quirkiness of paladin that I loved. P4S phase 2 for example, my group wanted one of the tanks to do the 2nd bait for Act III so i swapped to the less optimal opener and had my magic phase ready. Same as P8S p1, we have a really good BLM who took the front melee spot for easier uptime and I did the same thing there so I could do my magic phase and take the range position. Less optimal? Sure. Was it fun? Absolutely. Little things like that are what made Paladin feel really good to me and now all of that has been replaced with hardcast HS spam.

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Originally Posted by Mithron

I honestly hate it so much that it's killed all my desire to keep playing. I love a variety of jobs, including DRK, but I still can't be bothered to learn the new ex Trial or even do the new 24 man. Never, since I started this game in 3.4, have I ever felt so little desire to experience the new content on release. I almost don't care if I lose my house at this point. I don't get why it's depressed my desire for XIV this bad, but it has.

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Because you experience the game mostly through PLD maybe ? I remember I started to stop playing WoW when Rogue was getting «*updated*» and removed a lot of unique features and skills. Or when the incompetent Fail Wars 2 team nerfed my class for a bunch of crybabies on forums while never nerfing the real OP class that was left untouched for years. This really shocked me how bad «*balance*» or rework updates can be. Really not surprised here.

I was already preparing for this since I moved to GNB & DRK now for tanking.
The WoW meme with a paladin on a wheelchair fits well here lol

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Originally Posted by Lamarcy2699

I think I messed up on my wording for the level 88 part, I meant to say that because you don't have the blades combo at that level that the rotation is "harder" because you have to think to press different buttons and not just spam the same button 4 times.
I definitely agree on the GNB light and Goring Blade comments though. Goring feels like it was designed to be sonic break with no DoT and all damage but it feels completely underwhelming, clunky and out of place to use. Divine Might is alright when doing dungeons for a slightly more interesting aoe combo than just 1-2 (this is the nicest thing I can say that came out of the PLD rework, and it just adds to the GNB light) but for single target HS just feels so out of place to use after an atonement or RA.
I also see your point about good paladin gameplay, I guess it's just my opinion that jobs shouldnt be reworked because people feel obligated to do that most amount of damage for the least amount of effort (even if that wasnt the reason for this update) the jobs were already there and you could use them in sooo much of the games content without knowing a thing you were doing, just press buttons and win. I don't mean that as in I dislike simpler jobs but rather completely stripping jobs of their identity/uniqueness because of it I really dislike. It was the uniqueness and quirkiness of paladin that I loved. P4S phase 2 for example, my group wanted one of the tanks to do the 2nd bait for Act III so i swapped to the less optimal opener and had my magic phase ready. Same as P8S p1, we have a really good BLM who took the front melee spot for easier uptime and I did the same thing there so I could do my magic phase and take the range position. Less optimal? Sure. Was it fun? Absolutely. Little things like that are what made Paladin feel really good to me and now all of that has been replaced with hardcast HS spam.

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Oh no sweat; to be fair under the old Paladin; you generally did not roll right into the blades combo at 90 after requis for your rotation; regardless I still preferred the old paladin gameplay to the new which just feels flat and awkward; having done this tier as Paladin. I used GNB when higher damage was needed and I agree the race against enrage is a frustrating dynamic to compete with; but as a dev I suspect the only alternative would be to have Boss HP pools be determined by party composition (could you imagine? "Well the party is 4 DNC 1 PLD 1 WAR and 2 AST; so P5s boss HP pool is 20m")

Honestly it doesn't even feel like a rework to me and more like a elective surgery to improve paladins place in the 2 min meta and reduce the issues with dot damage.

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Originally Posted by Ayan_Calvesse

Oh no sweat; to be fair under the old Paladin; you generally did not roll right into the blades combo at 90 after requis for your rotation; regardless I still preferred the old paladin gameplay to the new which just feels flat and awkward; having done this tier as Paladin. I used GNB when higher damage was needed and I agree the race against enrage is a frustrating dynamic to compete with; but as a dev I suspect the only alternative would be to have Boss HP pools be determined by party composition (could you imagine? "Well the party is 4 DNC 1 PLD 1 WAR and 2 AST; so P5s boss HP pool is 20m")

Honestly it doesn't even feel like a rework to me and more like a elective surgery to improve paladins place in the 2 min meta and reduce the issues with dot damage.

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It's also funny because they nerfed the job significantly from where it was before in trying to make it fit

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Originally Posted by Lamarcy2699

It's also funny because they nerfed the job significantly from where it was before in trying to make it fit

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But it's at the same time going to be way easier to balance it out in the future now that it fits into burst windows.

I actually don't think it's a nerf in general 6.2 PLD was a clunky mess that was offensively weak (performed lower) but also really struggled defensively, right now you can at least say current PLD is decent defensively compared to the other tanks.

It was a nerf for solo/Dungeon/casual play where you have no/few raid buffs during your burst.

It is a slight buff in 8 player group's with aligned buffs during Burst.