You ask me to back up my claim but not absimiliard to back up their claim that the lines of dialogue in question are mistranslated or that the english one doesnt hold the canon meaning when initially acknowledging the quote and only turning after it didnt fit the narrative. Very curious.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyrerus
Also, what do you mean "turn to sarcasm". You act like this isnt my usual MO when engaging with people that are already hard stuck in their opinion as dogma.
Thank you for wishing me good luck tho, i appreciate it in general :D
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02-21-2023, 02:48 AMSaraide
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02-21-2023, 02:51 AMAbsimiliard
How does one prove something is different in another language? Me showing you the original JP text and following it up with a translation isn't going to verify anything for you unless you can already read Japanese. Therein lies the problem. But for the heck of it, here you go:
Hythlodaeus
"Don't be nervous.
The white robe that Venes-sama is entwined with,
Evidence of a fair "unstained person"
Hythlodaeus
"Those who have retired from official positions such as the Committee of Fourteen and still live,
A sign of an adviser that only Elidibus the Arbiter can tangle.
I'm sure your story will be taken seriously."
Venes-sama of course being Venat. Note firstly this clearly says the white robe is not limited to Convocation members. Note also the mention of it representing an advisory position, one which Elidibus seemingly must bestow or take away. I would also point out the phrase of a "fair and "unstained person." As I said before, we can infer the Convocation considers these individuals to be trustworthy and upstanding, elsewise they would not be granted that position, but that is not the meaning of the position so much as a requirement thereof. Nor would such a position protect someone from needing to prove their arguments. -
02-21-2023, 02:55 AMRobynDaBankI can read a little bit, actually. Can try if you'd like?Quote:
Originally Posted by Absimiliard
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02-21-2023, 03:03 AMAbsimiliardヒュトロダエウスQuote:
Originally Posted by RobynDaBank
緊張せずとも大丈夫だよ。
ヴェーネス様が縺っている白いローブは、
公正なる「染まらぬ者」の証・・・・・
ヒュトロダエウス
十四人委員会を筆頭とする公的な役職を下りてなお生きる者と、
調停者エリディブスのみが縺える、助言者の印さ。
キミの話も、しっかり受け止めてくれると思うよ。
You could also get:
Hythlodaeus
"Don't be nervous, it's all right.
The white robe that Master Veness is entwined with is the
The sign of the fair "undyed one""
Hythlodaeus
"A sign of counsel, which only a man who has left his official post, headed by the Committee of Fourteen, and a man who is still alive, and who is not a member of the Committee of Fourteen, can bear.
And only the mediator Elidibus can be a sign of counsel.
I'm sure they'll take you up on your offer." -
02-21-2023, 03:22 AMRobynDaBank
While the parts about the Convocation are 99% the same (Hythlodaeus does seem to say something a little different in the last line: "What you have to say too, I strongly think they will come to accept"), the line about Venat's robes I had to look up a bit, to find out what that kanji in the bracket meant (it means "dyed"/"printed"). The two lines overall say: "The white robes fastened by Venat are, proof of a just person, without [dye]' (which I'm supposing is what's used as "untainted" in the translation).
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02-21-2023, 03:29 AMAbsimiliardThat would be correct. However, one important detail missing from EN (but seemingly present in other versions) is just how these advisory postions relate to Elidibius. The EN text does touch on it, but it does not convey the context properly at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by RobynDaBank
In any case, it was brought to my attention the English text actually does mention the position being available also to those that did not serve as members of the Convocation, which makes the entire point I was making moot. :P Apparently, part of my argument has been against people's headcanon instead of what's actually in the game. S'what I get for assuming people are arguing in good faith, I guess. Pretty easy assumption to make given how much of the game actually is inaccurately translated, whether intentionally or not. -
02-21-2023, 03:45 AMRobynDaBankQuote:
Originally Posted by Absimiliard
Yeah how Elidibus is described here is: "十四人委員会を筆頭とする" - headed the Convocation of Fourteen, "公的な役職を下りて" - retired from his official post, and "なお生きる者" - a still alive person. I don't remember how the English version described him, did it do the same?Quote:
Originally Posted by Absimiliard
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02-21-2023, 03:50 AMMidareyukkiThe same line in English isQuote:
Originally Posted by RobynDaBank
Quote:
Hythlodaeus:
You needn't be nervous around Venat─those white robes mark her as one of fair and impartial reasoning.
Aside from the emissary, Elidibus, such garb is worn only by those who have stepped down from public office to serve as advisors. Whatever you have to say, she will listen without judgment.
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02-21-2023, 10:05 AMDevonEllwood
I wasn't planning on posting this anymore, but the hrothgar (I think) who asked was nice and I already had this typed and saved so...might as well. this is in response to "is there anything you like about endwalker" Ignore name misspellings and typos, I am just not going to proofread. Or don't ignore them, I am not your parental figure.
I don't know if I am one of the guys you are referring to, but I'll answer anyway.
There's some stuff I like in endwalker. It's just that I feel the rest was terrible enough to bring it down to "hates endwalker". What was good, was really good and it just contributes to the frustration as I feel that endwalker "almost had it".
Sharlyan, was completely forgettable to me and frustrating in parts. I don't understand where they decided that this closed off part of the world had people from around the world, sent out assassins to safeguard secrets, but behaved more like Hogwarts. I had high hopes for the place and I just did not enjoy it. I like Thavnir even if the information felt rushed. Anxiety elephant is great, and the 2.0 moments were the highlight. His reflection on his beliefs with the villagers was a good slow moment that had impact. His moment with the baby only to have his confidence in his beliefs completely shatter was amazing. I did not mind Estenien saving the day here as much as some, even though I can understand why they didn't like it.
Enough has been said about Garlemald that I don't need to add to it. My major grievances are most of the moon, Ultima Thule, and Elpis. I am in the minority, but I hated Elpis. I'll use it to segue into your statement "Endwalker was popular and a success". I'm just going to be blunt, but I have been working in a specific environment that has brought my attention that people's comprehension levels are absolutely abysmal and it's embarrassing. People do not read. People do not have patience. People do not give an f-bomber plane about anything beyond surface level. People just want their hand held because it's easier.
Elpis was a frustrating mess for me for the bad dialogue and the pointlessness of conversations. To use an example, the scene where Hades is teaching the critter to fly and Hythlo would not shut up. Look, hes a great person. Look at him helping! I am not joking in that Elpis helped people realize that Hades wasn't always a big meanie pants. I mean, I thought that was obvious in Shadowbringers. That he was a normal person until 12k years of suffering. What's sad is the developers knew this. This is the reason for all the weird dialogue going on in Elpis. Even outside of Elpis we are constantly getting information regurgitated at us in this game and it's exhausting.
I'm going to give another example if you are familiar with the movie Cabin in the Woods. I think it was the director who was interviewed and asked if there was going to be a sequel. He just asked, "did you even watch the movie". Comprehension level of a goat. And even the people say there can be prequels. No there can't. Because the prequel would literally be every other horror movie under the sun. Because that is the point of the movie.
I'm not going to say my comprehension levels are great. People liked endwalker because they saw a pretty game with great music and a neat story. They're not going to look into it much more than that. I don't need my hand held for the story, I don't need it held for the lore, and I don't want it held for the combat.
Yet, the worst part of Endwalker is Yoshida's attitude toward it. Him not knowing people cared about the lore so much. I'm sorry, but he doesn't have an excuse to not understand. Does he just forget about all the lore QandA? Is the game not marketed for its story? Do you not have lore books? A major complaint people had about WoW was the lore being retconned. This and Yoshida clearly wanting to be done with the story so he can "move on" to other stories.
I'm still here because I still have hope that Endwalker was a fluke. I enjoy playing this game with my friends and the other content it has to offer, just not the story. -
02-21-2023, 12:42 PMFlatLinedTo this day I still cant wrap my mind around this statement. It makes him look so out of touch.Quote:
Originally Posted by DevonEllwood