We need an AH

I don't understand why people are supporting the market ward. Surely an auction house like other MMOs would be better and easier for us.

pfft, Eve's market system >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all, hands down.

not that we'll ever see something like that in XIV, but I can dream :P

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Originally Posted by Akira_Tenshi

I don't understand why people are supporting the market ward. Surely an auction house like other MMOs would be better and easier for us.

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So you'll be perfectly ok with them putting off much needed fixes and content additions to this game in order to scrap the MW and implement an Auction House? Both systems are similar, they'll be exactly the same when the MW gets a few more adjustments since the only thing the AH does over the MW is:

Buying from Search
Delivery.

That's it. We all know when people scream for an Auction House they're generally referring to the glorified Vendor version and not an actual auction house.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

So you'll be perfectly ok with them putting off much needed fixes and content additions to this game in order to scrap the MW and implement an Auction House? Both systems are similar, they'll be exactly the same when the MW gets a few more adjustments since the only thing the AH does over the MW is:

Buying from Search
Delivery.

That's it. We all know when people scream for an Auction House they're generally referring to the glorified Vendor version and not an actual auction house.

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It's also impossible to play the market in any meaningful way because it will take you weeks to compile all the information if you can access it at all. I guess some people see it as an exploit, but cornering entire item types in the market takes more skill, patience, and risk than any other activity. Margin trading, monopolizing items, and generally bending the marketplace to your will is fun, but it's impossible to do with such a bare bones system like the MWs.

Maybe it's not important to you because you don't enjoy market manipulation, but I always have participated in market PVP in every MMO I've played, but the MW's just kill that idea along with the horrendously bad economy.

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Originally Posted by Raubahn

true we need one atm
and the most reason for it is history and Undercutters
hell i'v been trying to sell my black soles,veloydna carps,northern pikes and lots of other stuff
but seriosly some ppl think that by undercutting their stuff will make their items sell faster but in the end all players selling that same item will undercut their item in order to sell it
in wutai black soles have been reduced from 3.5k > 2.4k and its going down

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Most arguements I can understand. This idealism on the other hand is laughably moronic.

Because you want everyone to sell an item for the amount you want so you can make your top dollar....GTFO.........Someone has an item on sale cheaper then you, so we should revamp the system to accomodate your gil flow.

1) we need an item history, dont care how its actually implemented.
2) interface lag still sucks - this needs to be fixed.

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Originally Posted by Akira_Tenshi

I don't understand why people are supporting the market ward. Surely an auction house like other MMOs would be better and easier for us.

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short answer: community is stupid
long answer: people are stupid

You need an AH?

...


I need you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

So you'll be perfectly ok with them putting off much needed fixes and content additions to this game in order to scrap the MW and implement an Auction House? Both systems are similar, they'll be exactly the same when the MW gets a few more adjustments since the only thing the AH does over the MW is:

Buying from Search
Delivery.

That's it. We all know when people scream for an Auction House they're generally referring to the glorified Vendor version and not an actual auction house.

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While they were wasting precious resources attempting to fix such a flawed system, they could have instead given us a simple marketplace. No matter how many fixes they apply, our current Market Wards will always be inferior to what even free to play games, like Vindictus, receives.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Now for WoW they do have a buy it now but guess what.

Search for item
Buy It Now
Go to Mailbox
Pick up Item

YOU STILL HAVE TO GO PICK UP THE ITEM.

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Yeah but in WoW the mailbox is like a 5 second ride (yes, ride) from the AH. 5 seconds < minutes in the wards.

The #1 reason the Market Wards fail is the Item Search Counter. The issue of pricing from the blind auction system of FFXI hasn't been resolved.

Basically, when supply increases in the economy everyone's time is wasted. Sellers' time is wasted to a greater degree because prices will fall too fast for your item to sell. This clogs up the market wards and prevents higher priced items from appearing in results. This causes more lag since there are more retainers in an instance that can't move on to a different ward.

There is also the problem of needing to be in a central location to buy or sell when there are 3 cities.

There needs to be more automation of the economy, whether it's an auction house like WoW or otherwise.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

So you'll be perfectly ok with them putting off much needed fixes and content additions to this game in order to scrap the MW and implement an Auction House? Both systems are similar, they'll be exactly the same when the MW gets a few more adjustments since the only thing the AH does over the MW is:

Buying from Search
Delivery.

That's it. We all know when people scream for an Auction House they're generally referring to the glorified Vendor version and not an actual auction house.

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Wrong. If you want to sell a list of items you need either:

A) A darn good memory.
B) pen and paper
C) make multiple trips between your retainer and the ward zone

It is a PITA to sell anything with this system. So much of a pain, in fact, that most of the people I know just vendor all their crap because it's not worth the hassle of selling.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

No we do not.

Current Marketward Transaction

Enter wards
Search for Item
Find Seller
Go to ward
Pick up Item

The quickest you can do it is approximately 30 seconds. The longest I've ever searched for a specific item is less then 2 minutes.


FFXI > Blind Auction
Run to AH
Search through item lists for item you want
Find item you want (100 Listed)
Check Item History
Bid for item 10% lower then item history:
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for Item 5% lower then item history:
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for item same as last item History:
wait 5 seconds
fail
Re-check Item History, Recent item has been sold since last checked. 15% more then one before it.
Bid for item same price as new last one sold :
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for item 5% more then last one sold:
wait 5 seconds
Success, Item delivered to inventory.


WoW
Go to Auction House.
Filter through items you want. See that everything in your level is posted for prices that are way above your characters possible gold at your level.
Find one that is decent. Bid on it.
Wait 2 days. Lose Bid.
Look again
Find new item. Bid.
wait 4 hours. Win Bid.
Wait hour for item to deliver to mail box.
Find mailbox to pick it up.


Auctions Fail. The only difference between the Marketward and an Auction house is the marketward has no Auction. Blind or Timed.

Now for WoW they do have a buy it now but guess what.

Search for item
Buy It Now
Go to Mailbox
Pick up Item

YOU STILL HAVE TO GO PICK UP THE ITEM.

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So you like using the wards where people purposely put up items as 999,999,999 & takes a long time to both look up and run to it? It's a waste of time and a major headache to everyone else.

Nobody bids in wow, we just buy out, seriously bids are there as an option, i played wow for 5 years, never used bid once :/

Search item
buy out
pick it 2 steps from AH
profit

:) AH >>> MW

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Originally Posted by XxOstiaxX

Nobody bids in wow, we just buy out, seriously bids are there as an option, i played wow for 5 years, never used bid once :/

Search item
buy out
pick it 2 steps from AH
profit

:) AH >>> MW

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i stil bid in wow, because is cheaper.. ~_~" im so poor in there.. haah

I'll say it again: out of all the bikini and water texture requests the need for an AH wins in popularity even if all other requests were combined.

Why can't SE address this?

I don't want to see another trivial crafting recipe being tweaked before they address the big issue head on.

There is no point to craft anything if the economy is broken.

My vote goes toooooo.... the retainer reference system. Its the retainer system without having to see a few hundred retainers huddled together in a little room.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-Market-Wards.

I once through we needed an AH, not so sure now though.

I think they just need to allow players to access the market ward counter via their retainers, both to check prices and to buy items.

What I would much prefer eventually is to move all retainers to players housing and network them so they can buy and sell from one another via a search menu.

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Originally Posted by Tonka

Lol at making WoW's AH seem like more of a hassle than FFXIV's Market Wards. That is someone you just don't bother to argue with.

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must quote for truth

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Originally Posted by neizero

must quote for truth

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I know, I actually laughed out loud when I saw Cair's desperate attempt to make the AH system seem like any kind of hassle compared to the horrendous ward setup we have.

I had a friend play a bit of XIV with me a while back, it was all going relatively well (he didn't like a lot of things as we all do, but was happy to overlook them for the character and relatively interesting world the game has) until we got to the wards. He was baffled by how awful it was when all he wanted to do was replace his sword. That pretty much killed it, although he said he'd give the game another try when they sort it out.

I don't think he's alone in that kind of mentality, it just drains the fun out of the game because instead of doing things you'd like to you have to go round dark little rooms looking for NPCs to buy from.

I'm sorry, but some of these pro-market ward comments are so sort-sighted. You're taking a few aspects into consideration, exaggerating them, and ignoring the rest. The market wards, as they are now, are a pain for anyone who searches for different items several times a day, buys lots of different items at once, buys items in bulk, etc. Maybe if you only need to buy one item at a time, every so often, then the wards are sufficient, but anyone who crafts a lot, and does a lot of buying & selling, does not simply go buy one item every now and then. I spend hours upon hours in the wards every week.

There's too much running involved, there's too many slow menu screens to click through, there's no quick search function, there's no way to differentiate HQ items from NQ items, there's always a shortage of space for retainers (at least on my server), and there is no price history, thus items become over priced and don't sell because some people aren't aware of the going rate.

I cannot think of a single aspect of the market ward system that works better than a decent auction house system, besides maybe having an unlimited amount of time to sell items.

However, I do agree there are more important issues for the devs to focus on, but for those who act like the wards are somehow better than a good auction house system, either you are someone who is not very involved in the game's economy (i.e. lots of crafting, gathering, buying, selling), or you are unaware, or possibly just ignoring, the reality of the situation, for whatever reason(s).

Maybe i am sick of ward telling me i can't put my retainer there forcing me to put it in another ward. Maybe i am also sick of just how long it takes to buy things. It is a crap system.

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Originally Posted by Khazar

yeah, and that i guess may take 2 o 3 seconds after buying out the item and jumping out of the auction house to click de mailbox that is next to you.

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i was thinking the same thing maybe they were playing a different wow than i was cause i remember next to each AH there was a mailbox not even 5 sec from it ... also the buy option on wow is used at least 80% of the time unless it about to expire then someone will use that bid as a cheaper option if possible. so please give us an AH , wards suck.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

I'd rather take 2 minutes to go pick up an item instantly then wait an hour for an AH delivery system like WoW. Where I have to backtrack to a mailbox once it finally comes in to pick it up.

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Wow you really have no idea whatsoever how XI ah works do you?

Btw that wow AH no matter how completely irrelevant to THIS discussion is does sound like a badly designed mess of a system. Almost as bad as the MW but both are light-years behind XI's AH.

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Originally Posted by Seif

Wow you really have no idea whatsoever how XI ah works do you?

Btw that wow AH no matter how completely irrelevant to THIS discussion is does sound like a badly designed mess of a system. Almost as bad as the MW but both are light-years behind XI's AH.

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LOL you say WoW's "sounds" like a badly designed system, based on something you heard from someone else and then compare it to something you do know, all whilst making the statement "you have no idea".

WoW's AH system is much much better than FFXI's AH and Cair is grossly exaggerating about the mail box system, 99% of cases when you win an auction in WoW are sent directly to your mailbox which is a few steps away from the AH itself. (no waiting)

This is a good example of not believing everything you read on the internetz.

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Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

In FFXIV people are undercutting by an asinine amount opposed to XI's system where people would look up the history and undercut by a small amount. I was selling Pearl Rings for 50k a pop til someone just comes along and undercuts me by 60%. 60 PERCENT!

Like honestly? Honestly?

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Don't get me wrong, but what's wrong with that? What would you do if someone offered you a service for 50€ and the next one for 25€? As long as the other one is making money with it, so be it. Once we have more players you'll see this all the time. That's free market economy, I'd say.

I think there should be an AH just because of the smoothness it brings.

Got not problem atm using market wards, but it just feels clunky. Kind of like
going running with big massive boots instead of running shoes.

Still works, just feels urgh.

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Originally Posted by Payadopa

Don't get me wrong, but what's wrong with that? What would you do if someone offered you a service for 50€ and the next one for 25€? As long as the other one is making money with it, so be it. Once we have more players you'll see this all the time. That's free market economy, I'd say.

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Because a stable economy it does not make.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Because a stable economy it does not make.

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And why is that so? So you basically say everyone else who's smarter than the person selling for way too much must be punished? Just walk into a store. Or search items on the internet. You'll always find price differentiations. lol That's life.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Payadopa

And why is that so? So you basically say everyone else who's smarter than the person selling for way too much must be punished? Just walk into a store. Or search items on the internet. You'll always find price differentiations. lol That's life.

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Because say for example real life is kept in check by profit / competition, granted this takes place to some extent in a video game but there are always those who don't care about making a loss on something just to sell, which then creates an instability in the marketplace.

Its a good reason why the History feature in FF11 works and why there is an addon for WoW which determines the average price of scanned items on the AH.

People want stability it makes it easier not only to sell but to buy.

We don't need an AH, the market wards work just fine.

the only thing I would add to MW is a search for items retainers are BUYING, so we could just go there and sell them the items they want instead of selling everything to the npc.

I wonder if they're going to address this issue in the upcoming event on Tuesday or if it's just going to be them waving and cherry picking easy stuff like bikini and crafting questions...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

No we do not.

Current Marketward Transaction

Enter wards
Search for Item
Find Seller
Go to ward
Pick up Item

The quickest you can do it is approximately 30 seconds. The longest I've ever searched for a specific item is less then 2 minutes.


FFXI > Blind Auction
Run to AH
Search through item lists for item you want
Find item you want (100 Listed)
Check Item History
Bid for item 10% lower then item history:
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for Item 5% lower then item history:
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for item same as last item History:
wait 5 seconds
fail
Re-check Item History, Recent item has been sold since last checked. 15% more then one before it.
Bid for item same price as new last one sold :
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for item 5% more then last one sold:
wait 5 seconds
Success, Item delivered to inventory.


WoW
Go to Auction House.
Filter through items you want. See that everything in your level is posted for prices that are way above your characters possible gold at your level.
Find one that is decent. Bid on it.
Wait 2 days. Lose Bid.
Look again
Find new item. Bid.
wait 4 hours. Win Bid.
Wait hour for item to deliver to mail box.
Find mailbox to pick it up.


Auctions Fail. The only difference between the Marketward and an Auction house is the marketward has no Auction. Blind or Timed.

Now for WoW they do have a buy it now but guess what.

Search for item
Buy It Now
Go to Mailbox
Pick up Item

YOU STILL HAVE TO GO PICK UP THE ITEM.

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Half of what you just said take less then 5min vs the market ward. WoW ah is better then ffxi version so i guess i take WOW AH with a bid/Buy now and then just let us have the item right there and then problem fixed.

We don't really need a AH. They just need to add further improvements to the Market Ward system. They need to let us be able to search for the + qualities of items. The ability to sort items by level or class. Also it would be nice if they showed us what exactly it is what we sold.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zezlar

We don't really need a AH. They just need to add further improvements to the Market Ward system. They need to let us be able to search for the + qualities of items. The ability to sort items by level or class. Also it would be nice if they showed us what exactly it is what we sold.

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Indeed, the MW could be improved in a few ways to make them more user friendly.

I honestly feel that those of you complaining about not having an AH would just find something else to complain about if you got it. The wards are nowhere near as bad as you all seem to think. Sure, items could be easier to find, but as soon as you remember what items are in what ward, it's cake to find what you need.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

No we do not.

Current Marketward Transaction

Enter wards
Search for Item
Find Seller
Go to ward
Pick up Item

The quickest you can do it is approximately 30 seconds. The longest I've ever searched for a specific item is less then 2 minutes.


FFXI > Blind Auction
Run to AH
Search through item lists for item you want
Find item you want (100 Listed)
Check Item History
Bid for item 10% lower then item history:
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for Item 5% lower then item history:
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for item same as last item History:
wait 5 seconds
fail
Re-check Item History, Recent item has been sold since last checked. 15% more then one before it.
Bid for item same price as new last one sold :
wait 5 seconds
Fail
Bid for item 5% more then last one sold:
wait 5 seconds
Success, Item delivered to inventory.


WoW
Go to Auction House.
Filter through items you want. See that everything in your level is posted for prices that are way above your characters possible gold at your level.
Find one that is decent. Bid on it.
Wait 2 days. Lose Bid.
Look again
Find new item. Bid.
wait 4 hours. Win Bid.
Wait hour for item to deliver to mail box.
Find mailbox to pick it up.


Auctions Fail. The only difference between the Marketward and an Auction house is the marketward has no Auction. Blind or Timed.

Now for WoW they do have a buy it now but guess what.

Search for item
Buy It Now
Go to Mailbox
Pick up Item

YOU STILL HAVE TO GO PICK UP THE ITEM.

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WoW have beeter AH that FFXI, seriously market ward is crappy, if you want buy many diferent items, you could take 10 minutes, in wow 3 minutes.
wow AH you can write name of item that you want, you dont need still waste time looking items for crappy menus
ffxi you cant see the real price was wierd

wow ah have good system and people that study economy can explain you the reason

We all now wow if for lowlifes lol :D
I like the market wards. You can find everything you look for in 1 minute.
You just have to know what you are doing.

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Originally Posted by GreatLeviathan

We all now wow if for lowlifes lol :D
I like the market wards. You can find everything you look for in 1 minute.
You just have to know what you are doing.

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So basically man 1 says to man 2, I'm more superior than you because I enjoy struggling and find it exhilarating (ie iz dumb), man 2 shrugs and goes to the WoW AH.

What do you mean we don't need an AH?
Yes, i agree that AH buying has been improved with the search feature. Selling however, is still a major pain, frustration and a seriously unwarranted timesink that offers no value.

Ideal design requires minimal time to do your purchasing/selling. Anything that consumes hours as has been stated by many players, esp. those who who are more involved in the economy, is ridiculous. I as many others don't even bother using marketward for selling coz it's too much of a stupid timesink, many of us just resort to vendoring instead. We need an easy quick hassle-free system to work with.

This needs to be addressed or the game is simply lacking core functionality.

Enough fixing recipe and crafting changes, no point when the economy/market system is broken. SE, please Stop wasting precious time there and setup the AH already..!
It's been ditched for a whole year now. >.< Surely you're past the "examining AH" stage now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gennosuke

Enough fixing recipe and crafting changes, no point when the economy/market system is broken. SE, please Stop wasting precious time there and setup the AH already..!
It's been ditched for a whole year now. >.< Surely you're past the "examining AH" stage now.

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They took the Auction House entry off the table two or three producer's letters ago. It's not going to be added.