Monks need a projectile!

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Originally Posted by Sorzai

I think that Elixer Field should be a mid-ranged aoe attack rather than how it is now. For one, it gives a better visual who wouldn't want to shoot a Kamehameha?
But just curious why isn't meditation an OGCD? I find it hella annoying to build Chakra.

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Meditation is sort of a pseudo ranged attack while also being the prototype for skills like Meditate, Improvisation, and Umbral Soul. Deep Meditation being RNG undermined that since it made downtime inconsistent, but it's still basically the same. You hit it during your downtime in order to build a resource, but using it when the boss is available to hit is a loss compared to just doing the next step of your combo.

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Originally Posted by acceleratedben

Ah yes, job fantasy in a gameplay/balance thread...

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To be clear, this was never intended to be a balance thread, a lot of people have been taking what I said way more seriously than it was ever intended to be.
I simply made an observation that everyone has something that MNK doesn't have that adds some fun utility I've already gone over, not that it makes MNK unbalanced.

A lot of people seem to be missing the point and think I am saying something that I am not.
All that it was really meant to be was an interesting observation and suggestion but people are almost arguing about this as if I think it's like the most important issue with MNK or something.

I dunno tho I kinda feel like some people have this attitude that everything about a job should be something that is part of the core abilities, it's a really boring way to approach it imo.
Like the bunny fail state of NIN isn't necessary for the job, but it adds some fun flavor to it.
Same with Hyoton, it serves no actual purpose in the rotation but it has fun niche uses if you look for them.

Imo a projectile is just a more iconic thing that fits MNK's thematically more than a lot of the other melee who have one.
I'd probably more describe it as a Job fantasy/ gameplay thread tbh that's why I've brought up fighting games and things like Kikoken.

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Originally Posted by SpeckledBurd

If the topic is mobility, that's something that Monk needs more help with than a ranged attack frankly. Right now it's solidly the least mobile melee since it's the only one that lacks any sort of DPS free or even neutral movement skill. Dragoon can elusive jump even if Spineshatter and Dragonfire are down, Ninja can basically Shikuchi whenever it needs to, and Samurai has Gyoten and Yaten which recoup their Kenki cost as long as you're using them properly (Yaten would be better if enhanced Enpi shouldn't break combos and had a higher potency though IMO). Monk doesn't have anything nearly that flexible, it can Shoulder Tackle but there's a major incentive to use both charges in Riddle of Fire, and its disengage is ultimately just a sprint that requires perfect GCD timing.

Frankly I think it should have something like En Evant for a completely free movement action. A flash step directly forward would perfectly fit something that's supposed to be a high speed martial artist like Monk.

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It's really bizarre to me how NIN have a passive movement buff too while we lost ours when we went back to sitting in FoF, I mean I don't think that it actually makes a difference in positionals but still.
Identity/ fantasy, MNK's are basically athletes meanwhile even the Samurai who are basically Japanese knights have better mobility.
Imo the SSS movement buff is just way too small too.

No reason really why Anatman couldn't recharge at least one tackle charge.

https://gifimage.net/wp-content/uplo...uken-gif-5.gif

Meanwhile blue mages learning the ancient monk technique 'The Rose of Destruction' from the ghost of Ivon Coerulfist himself which itself is a projectile attack learned from coeruls.

Seeing Blue Mage's use that and Suzaku's Phantom Flurry make my Monk heart weep a bit.

Give monks Hadokens

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Originally Posted by lycropath

Seeing Blue Mage's use that and Suzaku's Phantom Flurry make my Monk heart weep a bit.

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Could be fun to see something like that for monks in the future, though.... just because blue mage has it doesn't mean they can't use something similar. Make it operate similar to flamethrower on machinist. The monk can't move else it cancels it, and it just does damage to the group of enemies over the duration it's active.

My take on it:

People who are going "well monk already has three tools for when it's disengaged with the opponent" are going about it all wrong. People talking about balance are also going about it all wrong.

Looking strictly at what makes for a more fun game, it's not really what you have, but rather what it could be. Potential fun to be had or job fantasy to sell. How something enriches the experience... Reduction and balance come after. It is better to look at the options monk has, then imagine alternatives to it, then after that seeing how the existing the theoretical compare. For example, honestly Six-sided Star (in PvE) and Anatman aren't very strong action designs. The former is functional and you might use it a few times in a fight. The latter merits redesign or for the surrounding context to shift. They are serviceable.

Though like, if they could make the projectile attack fun, exciting, more interesting than the ones the game has for other jobs, I'd love to have it. If the design after that point feels redundant, then remove the redundancies that are less appealing or can't be made meaningful. I am basically saying I rather have a fun projectile to use in these contexts more than I would rather be using any of my three other options... You could very well be going whole fights where you never use it, but if the result ends up being something ultimately more fun, or better yet more fun and gets more use, it's a win, and if a job is being reviewed for a big expansion it's a great time to examine these kinds of things.