Fending Accessories Strength Gain

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

Firstly, Direct Hit is no longer accessible by tanks. The strong linear nature of this skill means Tanks will only ever meld this, and thus it removes choice from the matter. Point for point, the early gains of Direct Hit that tanks will never exceed outpace Det, Crit, Skillspeed, and Tenacity to disgusting degrees, and its ability to be melded while clearly being an unsupported stat choice strangleholds tanks into it.

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Your first point will just increase DPS disparity between WAR and DRK/PLD even more unless something is done to current Berserk/Inner Release, just saying.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

Firstly, Direct Hit is no longer accessible by tanks. The strong linear nature of this skill means Tanks will only ever meld this, and thus it removes choice from the matter. Point for point, the early gains of Direct Hit that tanks will never exceed outpace Det, Crit, Skillspeed, and Tenacity to disgusting degrees, and its ability to be melded while clearly being an unsupported stat choice strangleholds tanks into it.

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Not to nit pick but Crit actually is bis for both dark knight and warrior this cycle. Honestly, SE should just cap strength at a lower value (so like 70) on the accessories (assuming as you say the +25 from materia but on all accessories) and then just have strength scale like a normal primary stat like vit. It solves everyone's issue and requires nothing complicated or new rules for 1 jobs accessories. Or they should give up on the false idea that you need two stats to independently tune formula's and have tank damage scale off its primary stat like both healers and dps.

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Originally Posted by Chrono_Rising

Or they should give up on the false idea that you need two stats to independently tune formula's and have tank damage scale off its primary stat like both healers and dps.

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This is the primary issue I see.

You can pick any combination of scaling you want, but odds are you're going to end up at the same Attack Power. Would you really be happier if your Left side gets dumped about 50 strength and that got shifted over to your accessories?

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

This is the primary issue I see.

You can pick any combination of scaling you want, but odds are you're going to end up at the same Attack Power. Would you really be happier if your Left side gets dumped about 50 strength and that got shifted over to your accessories?

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At least BiS would be raid gear instead if pentamelds. It would also make tank drops useful again and not like a wasted run.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

This is the primary issue I see.

You can pick any combination of scaling you want, but odds are you're going to end up at the same Attack Power. Would you really be happier if your Left side gets dumped about 50 strength and that got shifted over to your accessories?

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I’m happy as long as all pieces of gear grow in power over time. We shouldn’t cross our fingers and hope no tank accessories drop. I really don’t get why tank accessories are “special” for no reason when it comes to stat growth.

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Originally Posted by Chrono_Rising

I really don’t get why tank accessories are “special” for no reason when it comes to stat growth.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Q1. Currently some tanks stack STR on their accessories to increase their DPS, are changes planned for tank accessories themselves?

A1. We will be introducing adjustments in Tuesday’s patch 4.05.
We have received feedback from tanks regarding continuing to equip item level 270 accessories.

This puts more stress on the healers, and a lack of VIT may become an issue as we enter Savage. However, top players may be able to clear even under those conditions, so we worry that that will become the norm.

As a result, we have decided to add a minimum amount of STR to accessories.
When level syncing, only tanks will have STR stacked up, but we will overlook this for content up through 3.x.

Item level will increase in coming updates, but STR will not scale the same as VIT, so we would like you to keep that in mind.

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4303186

Basicly, SE just wanted to free healers from the stress healing STR equiped tanks. It wasn't about us tanks getting accessories worth obtaining, but just make them more "appeal" to us than Alex/Proto/Shire STR accessories.

It NEVER was about tanks getting balanced gear.

So, while healers get full attack power from mind, and it's "easier" to heal tanks thanks to new accessories, us tanks have to bear that crafted pentamelded gear is and will be BiS throughout Stormblood.

PS: I am yet to find a post in which SE states they want to change tank gear. They probably never will, just like the past YEARS!

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

This is the primary issue I see.

You can pick any combination of scaling you want, but odds are you're going to end up at the same Attack Power. Would you really be happier if your Left side gets dumped about 50 strength and that got shifted over to your accessories?

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That's the entire point you've been missing. This isn't about 'increasing power'. Its about making all gear slots matter. Bards have lower weapon damage than melee classes. No one cares because they do what they are supposed to do. They are still happy when a weapon drops. Every slot of gear has progression for it. You do stuff, have fun, grow your character. That's the fundamental process in an MMO. That's all tanks want. To do content, have fun, but for half of our gear we automatically skip the grow your character part. This is not a complaint that tanks don't do enough damage. That has NOTHING to do with it.

I cleared sigmascape 1 normal on week one. Got a belt drop. Never need to go back there ever again because accessories. I can completely skip Sigma 1 savage forever because I don't need anything from there. I didn't need to spam lakshmi because accessories are useless. Didn't need to do EX garuda/ifrit/titan either because I already had BIS accessories in 2.x from the AH. I don't even need to farm tomes after about 2 months because I could buy my left side pieces and weapon. No need to waste tomes on accessories i'll never wear so running dungeons is a waste too in short order.

The fundamental design of MMOs of do stuff, grow character is lessened for tanks. I can ignore large sections of content by walking to the AH. Moreso than any other class by a giant margin. That's not fair to broke people who never reach the best gear. Its not fair to rich people that have no reason to do giant chunks of content more than once. Its not fair to raiders who are frustrated when you get tank accs 3 weeks in a row and their team doesn't get stronger. Its not fair to anyone and theres no reason for it to be this way.

Splitting up stats more evenly so that all slots grow is exactly what most tanks want. There are different ways to do it. Literally split our existing stat allocation more evenly would work. Add more str but lower weapon damage to maintain current dps would also work. All we want is to see a ring 20 ilvls higher and think "I want to try to get that" the same way when you see a sexy body 20 ilvls higher, or weapon, or belt. Then go out and fight like hell through eikons or imperials, or demons, or whatever to get it.

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Originally Posted by ArianeEwah

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4303186

Basicly, SE just wanted to free healers from the stress healing STR equiped tanks. It wasn't about us tanks getting accessories worth obtaining, but just make them more "appeal" to us than Alex/Proto/Shire STR accessories.

It NEVER was about tanks getting balanced gear.

So, while healers get full attack power from mind, and it's "easier" to heal tanks thanks to new accessories, us tanks have to bear that crafted pentamelded gear is and will be BiS throughout Stormblood.

PS: I am yet to find a post in which SE states they want to change tank gear. They probably never will, just like the past YEARS!

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This most recent change of adding 50ish str scaling by 1 every 10 levels was for healers. The previous change not mentioned in that post was removing tanks from slaying (str) gear so they cant equip it from 61+. Before they added 50ish str to lv 70 accs, many tanks were using lv 60 slaying str gear because it was stronger than 0str fending lv 70 gear and waltzing into lv 70 content missing giant chunks of HP.

The quoted change didn't have anything to do with WHY they removed us from str gear, only a bandaid to stop us from using lv friggin 60 str gear. The str they added with the higher secondaries roughly equaled the lv 60 slaying gear. So you could get the same damage but also get boatloads of vit.

That was not a change to address the fundamental issues about tank accessories sucking. It just bandaided a problem SE created by removing tanks from slaying accessories which itself is a symptom of SE putting no scaling damage on half of our gear (right side). They just reset us to using lv 70 gear crafted like 2.0. They have made 4 major changes to tank stats about this over the years and we are literally right back at square 1.

Their previous posts about why they changed us away from vit damage scaling or the str/vit hybrid did describe the "we want defense and offense to scale separately". The post you quoted was exclusively to stop people from wearing lv 60 slaying accessories. Not the overarching problem.

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Originally Posted by Chrono_Rising

I’m happy as long as all pieces of gear grow in power over time. We shouldn’t cross our fingers and hope no tank accessories drop. I really don’t get why tank accessories are “special” for no reason when it comes to stat growth.

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So you're fine with being weaker, so long as the raid drop is "better"?

Objectively speaking, that's probably one of the easier ways to 'solve' the problem, but it also feels like a step backwards.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

So you're fine with being weaker, so long as the raid drop is "better"?

Objectively speaking, that's probably one of the easier ways to 'solve' the problem, but it also feels like a step backwards.

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Or keep dps the same and make it scale properly with all our gear.

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Originally Posted by Chrono_Rising

Or keep dps the same and make it scale properly with all our gear.

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(I mean, it does scale properly, but the scaling you just don't care about)

And I know why that is. Defenses tend to be a pretty binary thing in this game, given the power of healing and the nature of encounters.