Last straw

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Originally Posted by Gramul

That will change with the addition of content.

It's only "flavor of the month" because we only get one battle every update. When the game is "complete" we'll have many different battles that will favor different classes. And it's not like Ifrit is gone or anything.

You're not going to be left "behind". You're just not useful for this battle.



But the main feature of the game presented is the fact that you're supposed to change classes to fit whatever situation you're in. No, I don't think all classes should be viable for most endgame fights. I think we should have a wide range of enemies that require different strategies and setups to defeat. Something that takes advantage of the class flexibility we have. If you don't want to level another class to participate in a fight well suited for that class, suit yourself, you don't have to fight it.

I'd rather not sacrifice variety for equality in this case. Especially sense we only have 2 of these fights so far.

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So, what you're saying is that if one wants to experience endgame on it's entirety, he should level all battle classes to cap or risk sitting out (unless he gets into an "alternative" group that "goes against the norm") every few patches, and the developers should keep making content that favors specific classes because that's a "feature" of the game? They shouldn't even bother if the community is just stacking classes against everything they made, and in fact should encourage this behaviour?

Now there's something I completely disagree with.

Not to mention that at this point we don't even have enough content. Or are you just going to tell pugilists, for example, to "wait" until god knows when a PUG-stacking fight is developed or go level something else?

Heck, when that comes I'm pretty sure someone out there will say pugs "need" the moogle weapon to join but pugs "can't" get into a group to kill it because their archer or conjurer isn't high enough


Sure, some fights here and there that require very specific setups are not bad, but until now ALL battles encourage class stacking.

Of course, it's very damn hard to balance everything for everyone and there will always be that one group of classes that perform better than others (and players that leveled all to 50 can use these classes and have an easier time beating said content), but the developers should ALWAYS try to avoid situations like Ogre, Ifrit and Moogle where stacking a single class is far more effective than any other strategy.

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Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK

Suggestion:

Try making a party?

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A solid Idea! He could begin using the AWSOME new search feature. All has to do is search for 30 seconds to find that absolutly no one uses this feature at all, then he can begin the 3 hour adventure that is standing in Ul'dah shouting for random people that may or may not actually have the time needed to go do the moogle fight. Then, when he has 7 of 8, about 2 hours into shouting, some of those people that have been waiting can go "SOrry, but I have to leave" and he can be 4/8. At this point he will spend another 2 hours shouting for another 4 people that may or may not have the jobs he wants to complete this fight. So yeah, just make a party! Its not a total pain in the ass at all!

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Originally Posted by Firon

I agree with NoctisUmbra i have gotten my wins on pgl my ls makes it work and we do well. Even with x4 arc it does not = win. Another problem i think most people have in this game they always have the filter on that shows when a mob readies an attack and the can't dodge then blame it on lag~

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The fight is very doable without archers, no one denies that. But I also doubt anyone will deny that stacking archers makes it far easier, and therefore hurts those that don't have "access" to groups that will do it the "harder" way

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

The fight is very doable without archers, no one denies that. But I also doubt anyone will deny that stacking archers makes it far easier, and therefore hurts those that don't have "access" to groups that will do it the "harder" way

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thank god someone else said it lol

this is the ENTIRE point, if you see page 1 i made a long post describing this, what i said was that if the SE designed fights differently (in this case no high dmg circle AOE) people would be willing to take other jobs BUT the mob would still be getting hit the same as if there were 5-6 archers as it is designed right now.

noctis your argument about jobs are ballanced- being able to absorb damage isnt ballanced with being able to dodge all damage, the mages still have to cure you even if you arent one shotted.. if SE wants to keep circle AOE thats fine but have some attacks that also hit ranged characters.

the reason people stack archers is entirely down to development decisions.

SE will fix this the best thing we can do is just wait and pray that they do been few other posted i seen about this.

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Originally Posted by ssppiikkeeyy

SE will fix this the best thing we can do is just wait and pray that they do been few other posted i seen about this.

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They could always lock fights out to 2 classes per instance but that would suck i guess.

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

The fight is very doable without archers, no one denies that. But I also doubt anyone will deny that stacking archers makes it far easier, and therefore hurts those that don't have "access" to groups that will do it the "harder" way

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Its not so much that it makes the fight easier, but rather ARC is the easiest DD to play in the instance.

Easiest =/= /most beneficial.
Easiest = safest.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Its not so much that it makes the fight easier, but rather ARC is the easiest DD to play in the instance.

Easiest =/= /most beneficial.
Easiest = safest.

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your talking in circles, it amounts to the same thing.

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Originally Posted by Rogue

your talking in circles, it amounts to the same thing.

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What I'm saying is a good player behind a PGL/MRD is very likely going to be doing more damage and or being useful through stuns - which in turn would be beneficial for the fight. What I'm saying is there exist good reasons to pick DDs other than ARC.

What I'm also saying is that those other DDs aren't as easy to pick up and play after 1.20 as ARC is.

Then I am concluding that the reason ARC is being stacked so much is not due to it being OP or classes being unbalanced. It is rather due to ARC being easy to pick up. N00b-friendly.

Essentially, nothing wrong with the game design or the Moogle design atm. Master another DD and you would get better results than straight up going ARC.

Does that clarify things for you?

The moogle primal was probably designed with jobs in mind, so we are playing it without some key abilities. I can note at least one ability on each job list that will make that class perform much better.