Black Mage Sanctuary - A Guide to DPS

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Originally Posted by Xisin

It's hard to pinpoint where you are falling short without watching you or seeing the ACT line chart that displays at the bottom of a parse. Some basic things though, make sure you are squeezing in all 6 fire 4s within the raging strikes timer on pull, the pot should stay on for the first five fire 4s, this makes a big difference as blm is a fairly front loaded job meaning the opener is extremely important to your dps. Use ley lines on cd in faust, no reason not to do so. What is your ilvl? is atleast 180? higher? lower? I need more information to help. The line chart one the bottom of ACT should resemble a heart rate monitor chart, it will level out if you manage to bridge your ice phase with a tcloud however.

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My ilevel is i186 - I am doing everything you just suggested, maybe the food and the potion might be a bit of help.

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Originally Posted by Garotte14

Hmm. I'm consistently between 1250 and 1350 on Faust. Not sure why yours would be so much lower. I would suggest using a Sohm Al Tart instead. You shouldn't have accuracy issues. Also X-potions or Dracanian potions will help slightly if you can afford it. You also shouldn't be using every thundercloud proc. Not saying you you are, just keep that in mind. It's only better if it can tick it's full duration, so clipping it isn't good and you don't need it for movement in Faust.. Other than that, no trick attack from ninja. No crit buff from dragoon.

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And not even Foe from Bard, so..
I will buy the tart and x potion. see if it helps me more. thanks for the suggestion.

could be purely mechanical then, don't use macros, make sure you buffer casts and so on, I don't know what else could be putting you that low.

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Originally Posted by Xisin

could be purely mechanical then, don't use macros, make sure you buffer casts and so on, I don't know what else could be putting you that low.

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No macros - I'll try again with the higher pot and tart

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Originally Posted by CaffeinatedDani

No macros - I'll try again with the higher pot and tart

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Does your tank use a countdown macro? Pre-casting the QS->Shard->Ley->f3 is critical. Also How long are you dead after that number? Could be that you die and parser still counting as encounter. Ask whoever has ACT to reduce encounter time to ~6sec for Faust only. I use 6 on faust and 30sec on Oppressor.

Positioning yourself right and/or tank positioning right is also critical. Any interruption in opener kills your dps.

Been using a different rotation:

(In UI 3, just refreshed Eno) Fire 3, (Enochian here if not up) Fire 1, Fire 4 (Firestarter then Sharpcast if available), Fire 1, Fire 4,(Firestarter if you need to move and if available otherwise) Fire 4 (Firestarter if available), Bliz 3, (Bliz 4 if refresing), (Thunder for filler), (Bliz 1 for filler if skipping Bliz 4 for refresh to recast enochian), repeat.
This is my basic AF + Eno rotation.

It's rather RNG since it can fail you and deal 100 less potency compared to your rotation, or it can grace you and deal 140 more potency compared to your rotation but the biggest thing is the fact that it is SAFE mechanically speaking. The consistent refreshing of Astral Fire means getting picked for mechanics constantly is far less threatening to your Astral Fire stacks dropping off, as well as with a Firestarter more likely being at hand gives you the ever so slight boost in mobility.

Any thoughts on this?

With all the movements going on in practically every encounter be it dungeons or raid, Enochian has got to be the worst ability - mechanically I think I've ever encountered. Since it is so pivotal to our rotation and our DPS, it needs a LOT of work to be anything more then good. It is so unbelievably difficult to get an entire rotation in to maximize the uptime of Enochian because of all the AoE's/movement needed in each encounter.

For starters - Fire IV NEEDS to reapply the Astral fire buff and/or while IN Enochian, give Scathe the ability to increase Enochians duration by x amount of seconds. With all the moving going on, I'm spending more time NOT in Enochian then in it. I get it that were not supposed to be in it full time but there's a lot more downtime then uptime in encounters that has a lot of moving which results in a lot lower dps.

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Originally Posted by Rover1983

With all the movements going on in practically every encounter be it dungeons or raid, Enochian has got to be the worst ability - mechanically I think I've ever encountered. Since it is so pivotal to our rotation and our DPS, it needs a LOT of work to be anything more then good. It is so unbelievably difficult to get an entire rotation in to maximize the uptime of Enochian because of all the AoE's/movement needed in each encounter.
For starters - Fire IV NEEDS to reapply the Astral fire buff. Having to switch between Fire 1 and Fire IV is ridiculous. Maybe give Scathe a CHANCE to increase the duration of Enochian by x amount of seconds. With all the moving going on, I'm spending more time NOT in Enochian then in it..

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Troll or you just want a broken class lol

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Originally Posted by drizzle234

Troll or you just want a broken class lol

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Not trolling. I'm dead serious. Re-read my last paragraph. It makes sense and they're just ideas I'm tossing out there.

Hi guys, I don't play Black Mage but I was wondering how do you guys feel about A1 savage? I've cleared it, and our Black Mage switched over to Summoner due to the higher mobility, multi-dots, strain on the add mechanic, and (in his opinion) overall dps increase. I'm very curious what answer Black Mages have for the moving in this fight, and is there any videos of a POV Black Mage clearing? Thanks in advance! :)

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Originally Posted by AkashiXI

Hi guys, I don't play Black Mage but I was wondering how do you guys feel about A1 savage? I've cleared it, and our Black Mage switched over to Summoner due to the higher mobility, multi-dots, strain on the add mechanic, and (in his opinion) overall dps increase. I'm very curious what answer Black Mages have for the moving in this fight, and is there any videos of a POV Black Mage clearing? Thanks in advance! :)

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I can't answer this question but I can add to it. In my FC, some people who played BLM have also switched to Summoner because of the new Enochian mechanic being a bitch in the raids and that summoners have it easier with mobility with their dmg. In fact, we even have people leveling alt Summoners because of it and I'm not making any shit up. That should tell you the state of the BLM in Alex. Funny thing is - I continued to level my BLM thinking it wouldn't be that bad but now I wish I leveled my Summoner up before my BLM, lol. Oh well.

The situation really is true. Myself i plan on sticking to blm but started levelling my smn past 50 to see for myself.
I really did get destroyed by a smn last week in Alex, but i think it was due to smn multi dotting.
Certain raids, dungeons, etc yes i have also heard it is so much easier as smn.

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Originally Posted by Rover1983

That should tell you the state of the BLM in Alex. Oh well.

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BLMs with a BRD should top the charts in A1, without BRD is still a respectable dps choice. Like any raid it depends on composition.

A1 World First(sch POV but with blm): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWlViWbK4GU
BLM POV 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzH-aGteKNM
BLM POV 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjCcaWxThpQ
BLM POV 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzH-aGteKNM

If you're looking to complain about BLM i suggest trying here: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...in-in-the-neck

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Originally Posted by drizzle234

BLMs with a BRD should top the charts in A1, without BRD is still a respectable dps choice. Like any raid it depends on composition.

A1 World First(sch POV but with blm): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWlViWbK4GU
BLM POV 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzH-aGteKNM
BLM POV 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjCcaWxThpQ
BLM POV 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzH-aGteKNM

If you're looking to complain about BLM i suggest trying here: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...in-in-the-neck

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Summoner will most definitely outdps BLM on A1S assuming similar skill level + same party composition.

Multi dotting for 70% of the fight and AOEing the adds makes this an easy win for Summoners.

So far the only close fight where both of them are equal/BLM slightly outdpsing SMN is A3S.

Hell, I know a godly Bard that can outdps BLM on this turn as well. He ended at 1050 in i184 with a ballad.

BLM needs special attention to consistently beat SMN in A1 IMO. Have SCH drag around his adds post-split for him, mainly, and possibly let BLM ignore the first set in favor of group AoE milking (an area where if not doing that, SMN can solo with minimal ST DPS loss). Otherwise I do believe BLM will lead to faster clear times, especially as we get more gear and the pre-split DPS ramps up in BLM's favor. Thundercloud is basically a whole multi-DoT system on the level of SMN multi-DoTing now, in and of itself.

A2 BLM can't touch SMN. That's a fact.

A3, we'll see who comes out at top. The first half's trouble areas, Hand of Pain and the tornado phase, BLM makes it far easier/simpler/can spend CDs more freely, though next week with weapons I think those trouble areas will be automatically easier and it will be easier to focus on which caster provides more DPS throughout the whole fight, which without multiple clears to see who wins it's just a guess at this point.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

BLM needs special attention to consistently beat SMN in A1 IMO. Have SCH drag around his adds post-split for him, mainly, and possibly let BLM ignore the first set in favor of group AoE milking (an area where if not doing that, SMN can solo with minimal ST DPS loss). Otherwise I do believe BLM will lead to faster clear times, especially as we get more gear and the pre-split DPS ramps up in BLM's favor. Thundercloud is basically a whole multi-DoT system on the level of SMN multi-DoTing now, in and of itself.

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TC is 780 potency, The three SMN dots are 890 . I wouldn't really say they are on the same level. Not to mention TC relying on RNG.

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Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

TC is 780 potency, The three SMN dots are 890 . I wouldn't really say they are on the same level. Not to mention TC relying on RNG.

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The main thing about that is the SMN DoTs require 3 GCDs to apply, BLM merely one. The main point one could make against the point I just made is 3D's existence, but since it lines up with DWT and is used on a ST anyway I don't believe that. Don't get me wrong, SMN is a wrecking ball in A1, especially with some milk (which isn't even really milk so much as it is free, meaningful damage), but I gotta go with BLM on it if he gets taken care of. The sad thing is SMN has a way higher damage cap due to the milk possible so parses won't really be a good indicator of who does more IMO, as weird as that sounds.

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Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

Summoner will most definitely outdps BLM on A1S assuming similar skill level + same party composition.

Multi dotting for 70% of the fight and AOEing the adds makes this an easy win for Summoners.

So far the only close fight where both of them are equal/BLM slightly outdpsing SMN is A3S.

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Missing the point. This thread is called "Black Mage Sanctuary - A Guide to DPS". Not SMN vs BLM and not "I give up on BLM lets try SMN". Its a thread meant to optimize BLM using 3.05 skils,abilities,etc. Don't get me wrong I enjoy SMN but I main BLM and that is where my heart lies.

On a final note I can't comment on whether or not SMN is better for A1. Of course SMN is better for A2, this is a no-brainer. Both classes are relevant in savage, in fact my static is war,pld,sch,whm,mnk,brd, BLM,SMN and for A2 I go SMN. SMN and I fight for top spot in A1 XD

Yea, we already know SMN is #1 mage DPS.

BLM is hard to put down.

I don't see any advantage between SMN and BLM in A1S. I did 1k DPS while failing a missile mechanic with Eos in my party.

A2S, SMN wins because their AoE is stupid.

The only thing we can say for sure for A3S is world first used a BLM and I can see why. Superior support with better nuke for the tornado add phase. That alone is a valid reason to pick BLM over SMN. Summoners may Tri-Disaster, Bane, Deathflare new adds. But this means the old adds are still running and if they reach the water, it's a wipe. BLM provide precise nuke which SMN fails to bring.

A3S is definitely harder to do as BLM than SMN but it's definitely more rewarding to have a BLM imho. I easily perform my 6 fire IV opener with the movement and mechanics and I'm doing 1k+ at 10mins+ mark.

Virus is 90s CD.

Edit: 710 is correct, forgive me.

I need help maxing blm damage consistently, and maxing it in general

Saw a single post earlier saying youll only cast fire 1 once per fire 4 rotation in my mind that means

X-f4x3-f1-f4x2-3-blizzard 3 etc for your rotation and diminished rotation forward.


Sound about right? The only way I can manage 3 f4s is with fire starter proc waiting

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Originally Posted by Psycofang

I need help maxing blm damage consistently, and maxing it in general

Saw a single post earlier saying youll only cast fire 1 once per fire 4 rotation in my mind that means

X-f4x3-f1-f4x2-3-blizzard 3 etc for your rotation and diminished rotation forward.


Sound about right? The only way I can manage 3 f4s is with fire starter proc waiting

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F4 X 3 > F1 doesn't work, F1 will fizzle out AF3 before it gets off. The proper rotation is F4 X 2 > F1 > F4 X 2. That said, you CAN do F4 X 3 as long as it's into a Firestarter, B3, or Swiftcast anything.

I figured as much.

Thanks.

I'd agree with blm in A1 savage, we spend less time maintaining the multidot and well our single target just dumps on smn single target. I think our fire 4 will make up for fact that we're missing some potency on dots, thunder dot tick potency helped a lot in A1, without bard I'm clearing that fight over 1k dps, with bard it'd be far more + I'm handling my own adds, granted add pick up can screw me if i have to cross the entire world to get to my laser.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

Hey you didn't change the Thunder/Thundercloud potencies in your guide, just a heads up. Also, Virus is 90s CD.

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Opps for the Virus. It's been there for a while. Isn't Thunder 1 30 base Potency and Thunder III 70 base potency and DoT is 40 now? Numbers should be fine.

On a side note, the Ninja in my group has a complain that Fire IV blinds him in A3S and he has to turn particle effects off lol.

"If used under Thundercloud proc, its total Potency is 710 Potency."

Should be 780.

Edit: It is in fact 710, carry on, carry on, nothing to see here ... :(

just putting this in here: if ewer used on you in its current form, it is still worth 1 extra fire 4. Also since it ticks for EXACTLY 265 mp then you can flare straight into blizz 3 to avoid having to hard cast fire 3 and you'll have a full mp bar on the next aoe wind up. Super nice.

I have not giving this much thought but wasn't the point of Flare costing 100% of mp is because of how much damage it deals as aoe? Do you think this should be changed or just remain as is? Because I think BLM aoe should be slightly buffed. Not asking for much here, maybe a little increase in F2 potency? What do you guys think?

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Originally Posted by Fallen_Owl

I have not giving this much thought but wasn't the point of Flare costing 100% of mp is because of how much damage it deals as aoe? Do you think this should be changed or just remain as is? Because I think BLM aoe should be slightly buffed. Not asking for much here, maybe a little increase in F2 potency? What do you guys think?

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There is no need to buff BLM AOE.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

"If used under Thundercloud proc, its total Potency is 710 Potency."

Should be 780.

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I just did some testing, and TC is definitely 390 initial + 320 dot = 710 total. 15 minutes of hitting dummy with F3 and thunders.

Highest non-crit F3 = 3269
Highest non-crit TC = 2939

432/390 = 1.108~
3269/2939 = 1.112~

E: It appears there is a bug with ACT and Thunder ticks. No matter what level of Thunder you use -- whether it's a TC proc or not -- ACT will only show and calculate damage for six ticks.

Tested it myself now, you're right, TC T3 damage is definitely 390 potency. Dang.

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Originally Posted by Xisin

I'd agree with blm in A1 savage, we spend less time maintaining the multidot and well our single target just dumps on smn single target. I think our fire 4 will make up for fact that we're missing some potency on dots, thunder dot tick potency helped a lot in A1, without bard I'm clearing that fight over 1k dps, with bard it'd be far more + I'm handling my own adds, granted add pick up can screw me if i have to cross the entire world to get to my laser.

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Yes, and Summoners can do 1.1k without a Bard & Nin. Granted, some of those might be considered "padding"(Although I don't agree with that, since killing the first set of adds faster means the other DPS+healers can get back to the boss faster), It's still 100 more than what a BLM does.

Also, do you have a link for that 1k+ w/o a bard parse ? I am genuinely interested :D

Did you kill it before the third jump ?

Mmm. People use the strat to burn Oppressor to 5% and nuke 0.5 after. Focusing your damage increases the damage gain from TA and such. It definitely works well for BLM but it is not for SMN that prefers to down them equally to multi-dot.

The boss did all of its jumps in that specific fight. Also unless you deathflare + painflare then you don't out potency flare on the add drops. Deathflare vs flare, flare wins on 3 or less targets, by a whopping 6.78 potency. More on 2 targets. This is including DWT and enochian buff on either side. While I havent played smn in A1 savage yet, I kinda would be afraid to death + pain (not sure) due to it killing the adds on either flank. Sorry I do not have a link to that specific parse, you'll have to trust me, I don't often state my parses on the forums anyway.

The set up for the parse was whm sch pld war drg mch mnk blm. I was on the opposite side of the drg (makes more sense to pair drg with mch) as well so I was off and on on getting litany depending on where the adds placed me. The stupid boss also died mid raging strikes... so it could've been higher.

I'd imagine with a bard and nin blm would benefit more than smn due to how front-loaded blm is compared to smn during battle voice.

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Originally Posted by Xisin

The boss did all of its jump in that specific fight. Also unless you deathflare + painflare then you don't out potency flare on the add drops. Deathflare vs flare, flare wins on 3 or less targets, by a whopping 6.78 potency. More on 2 targets. This is including DWT and enochian buff on either side. While I havent played smn in A1 savage yet, I kinda would be afraid to death + pain (not sure) due to it killing the adds on either flank.

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Yes, I deathflare+painflare on the first set of adds. You can also use enkindle+aerial slash each set of adds(Enkindle on the 3rd set. We never saw the 5th set but you can also use it there depending on your group's DPS) for the rest of the fight since they won't tether to you. Simply place Garuda right behind whichever boss you are hitting and you can safely use Enkindle and Aerial Slash each time they are off cd without the melees losing any DPS.

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Originally Posted by Xisin

The boss did all of its jump in that specific fight. Also unless you deathflare + painflare then you don't out potency flare on the add drops. Deathflare vs flare, flare wins on 3 or less targets, by a whopping 6.78 potency. More on 2 targets. This is including DWT and enochian buff on either side. While I havent played smn in A1 savage yet, I kinda would be afraid to death + pain (not sure) due to it killing the adds on either flank.

The set up for the parse was whm sch pld war drg mch mnk blm. I was on the opposite of the drg as well so I was off and on on getting litany depending on where the adds placed me.

I'd imagine with a bard and nin blm would benefit more than smn due to how front-loaded blm is compared to smn during battle voice.

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Have to consider that while Deathflare vs Flare is similar on 3 targets, BLM loses quite a bit of ST damage in that scenario while Deathflare is virtually free and the only cost to it is making your DWT mis-align with 3D. Really though all you gotta do is Bane + pet AoE for even less ST cost - much like a T12 Blackfire situation, you can use free stuff to kill them rather than specifically use things that cost ST DPS. If anyone else puts out some of their relatively free AoE at this time it destroys them. Also, you can delay the Deathflare so it hits them + boss still so it's not on the boss, or drag them into a puddle and then Deathflare them + boss.

Really it's a good fight for both classes. Top of the line if played well, even more so with a BRD. Gotta agree that BLM will be more front-loaded though, which would play a part as we outgear the fight and can really push it down hard before the split.

i try to have a thundercloud loaded for after the flare there, as the the timing of it lines up with enochian refresh from buff. But ya we lose some ST on the flare.

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Originally Posted by Waliel

I just did some testing, and TC is definitely 390 initial + 320 dot = 710 total. 15 minutes of hitting dummy with F3 and thunders.

Highest non-crit F3 = 3269
Highest non-crit TC = 2939

432/390 = 1.108~
3269/2939 = 1.112~

E: It appears there is a bug with ACT and Thunder ticks. No matter what level of Thunder you use -- whether it's a TC proc or not -- ACT will only show and calculate damage for six ticks.

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Can you help me interpret this information? Are you saying that ACT fails to properly account for T3 proc damage?

Also, is it still the case that as long as T3 Proc is allowed to tick for 18 seconds, it's a DPS increase over Fire 4? That's the rule I've been using although I am still not super confident in the dps contribution of thunder.

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Originally Posted by raisetheglass1

Also, is it still the case that as long as T3 Proc is allowed to tick for 18 seconds, it's a DPS increase over Fire 4? That's the rule I've been using although I am still not super confident in the dps contribution of thunder.

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Not really, even if you match F4's potency with a clip so short, you're just devaluing the previous Thunder usage anyway and it can be a DPS loss. Use it sometime after F1 in your rotation for a more certain DPS gain, and even better yet, if you can, save it until after B3.