Marriage Quest finally on the horizon! Yay!

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Originally Posted by Naunet

I've seen lots of people in this thread and the ones that came before it explaining how gender restrictions in a marriage system would impact them. Stop making stuff up.

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MOST does not equal all.
The percentage of people that actually use marriage in MMOs is tiny. The percentage of people that have strong views on this topic is much higher.

Good job taking half my post to make me look like I am on one side or the other.
I'm on the side of keep marriage out of the game so that part of the games population doesn't become polarized over a heated political topic.

Feelings are entrenched on both sides and a MMO isn't the place to resolve them.

I am an openly gay man, but I also hate conflict when diplomacy can be used. Honestly, I think we shouldn't even have any kind of a marriage system at all because there's no real need for it. We're adventurers, we're not supposed to be settling down and starting a family. We're supposed to be defending Eorzea. I'm also a roleplayer and I enjoy the act of roleplaying, and I honestly don't mind seeing married couples who are adventurers, and there is nothing that says that they cannot say they are married.

My problem is when an actual, serious marriage SYSTEM gets implemented. Because then, if people get excluded, the excluded people will lose their minds. On the other side of that, if everyone is included, then the people who want exclusivity will lose their minds.

And then, you have the people who are asexual who will be completely overlooked by this design, and you have the polyamorous individuals who will feel shortchanged. I am neither asexual nor polyamorous, but I am well aware that people who fit into those categories and they are largely ignored or ridiculed for who they are.

I don't want any kind of a marriage system because of the controversy it brings. The cons, to me, just far outweigh the pros.

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Originally Posted by Mcshiggs

This quote wins the internet.

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I live in Texas too XD

I think it's funny how I haven't seen a single poster on this thread against gay marriage irl...and we're still arguing XD
(If you're against gay marriage I respect your beliefs even if I don't agree, just stating that as far as I can tell after reading the whole thread, there is no one here that doesn't support gay marriage.)

I don't understand why there's so much of a fluffle about gender restrictions on marriage. I feel like it would be silly to limit it to male character/female character marriages due to there being reasons that have nothing to do with real-life orientations. (since I feel like that argument is just running in circles of people mad at eachother)
Content is content. Marriage content is content people want to explore. If their best friend in the game has the same gender character as them, that's quite frustrating- now they need to hunt down someone else who might not even explore the reaches of the marriage content with them because the aforementioned content-hunting friends both have female characters. My best friend and I always got married in games with the function, because it was fun! It was a huge bummer if the game didn't allow us to hitch up just because of a gender block. So much content we couldn't play with :<

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Originally Posted by shanvhere

One of the dumbest things to put into a video game.

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If anything, you can do it for the perks that will no doubt come with being married and marriage housing and stuff along those lines. Just pick someone in your FC that has the same idea about it and shack up with them.

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Originally Posted by Pylfer

If anything, you can do it for the perks that will no doubt come with being married and marriage housing and stuff along those lines. Just pick someone in your FC that has the same idea about it and shack up with them.

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Exactly. I'm hoping there will be perks to marrying, such being able to teleport to your partner. One of the people in my raid group already agreed to marry our characters if there are perks.

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Originally Posted by Pylfer

If anything, you can do it for the perks that will no doubt come with being married and marriage housing and stuff along those lines. Just pick someone in your FC that has the same idea about it and shack up with them.

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That sounds just like real marriage.
As a male you do it for the "perks" (I'll let you decide what the perks are) but regret your decision when you realize all the perks were front loaded to sell you on the concept, your partner wants you to change FCs because they don't like your guild mates, and then they use a pandora potion soon after the ceremony changing the character design enough that the loss of "perks" doesn't really bother you.

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Originally Posted by Jewelfox

Straight people flaunt their sexuality enough without having yet another thing they can hold over everyone else.

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You mean like Straight Pride parades we hold every year, or how we have shouts in game either advertising or looking to join hetero friendly FC's? It's not like we never see shouts requesting LGBT friendly FC's. Just play the damn game!

I think its funny how the game will secretly endorse gay marriage since many people who play females in game are males.

Perhaps Square should just do another player poll asking if people want same sex marriage ingame. I'd give it a thumbs up!

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Originally Posted by Gnova

That sounds just like real marriage.
As a male you do it for the "perks" (I'll let you decide what the perks are) but regret your decision when you realize all the perks were front loaded to sell you on the concept, your partner wants you to change FCs because they don't like your guild mates, and then they use a pandora potion soon after the ceremony changing the character design enough that the loss of "perks" doesn't really bother you.

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Most of the people in my FC are friends and the people that would be marrying one another, should there be more benefits than the surface "ha-ha-ha, I married you, now we'll never really have any reason to bring it up or do anything with it", we would probably just marry one another.

That being said, perks could include things like, as stated by Elim, free 30min CD teleports to your partner, or perhaps +% exp when leveling in a party with partner, to more mundane things like joint private FC rooms/housing.

I have to assume that they will be adding perks. For those people who are playing the game and take the marriage system in the game very seriously I am all for it (especially couples in real life). I have the hardest time with people who "hookup" in game and get "serious" and then fall out of touch or have the things you said happen... not that it matters. I'm all for legit marriages AND people doing it for the possible benefits.

But see the real question is will people still play with that player if they were in a same sex marriage? The implication here is that people still think the same way they do irl even in a video game or evidently this thread. Imho Marriage is a bad idea, like sands through the hour glass so are the days of our lives....

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Originally Posted by Pylfer

I have to assume that they will be adding perks. For those people who are playing the game and take the marriage system in the game very seriously I am all for it (especially couples in real life). I have the hardest time with people who "hookup" in game and get "serious" and then fall out of touch or have the things you said happen... not that it matters. I'm all for legit marriages AND people doing it for the possible benefits.

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Adding perks to being married over and above something like a title is a very bad idea.

Think of the drama potential when someone's RL partner finds out that you are married to someone in the game that they secretly hate you play because you are spending time in the game instead of with them.
Good luck explaining that you only did it to get a free teleport to them so that you can play with your in-game spouse even more.

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Originally Posted by Gnova

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I think you're taking a fun and non serious feature and making way too much out of it... It's no different than housing, it's just side content.
It's not like people who marry in game automatically vow to each other IRL. In game it will mostly be between normal friendships and not lovers (In fact I think the majority of married couples in game will actually won't be couples outside the game) Getting married will probably go like this:
"omg let's marry!1"
"kk! w0t do we get outta it?"
"idk I heard the customes are cool and maybe some X Y Z"

Not many will take it more serious than that and the ones who do (drama queens) will find their ways to make drama even without that system lol

I'll probably marry the first funny person I meet lol

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Originally Posted by HakuroDK

And then, you have the people who are asexual who will be completely overlooked by this design, and you have the polyamorous individuals who will feel shortchanged. I am neither asexual nor polyamorous, but I am well aware that people who fit into those categories and they are largely ignored or ridiculed for who they are.

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Asexualls can want to marry. They can still feel romantic love towards a person. I have an asexual friend and she would want to marry and even have children in the future. She is just simply not interested in the sexual aspect of a relationship.

And I am polyamorous and I do not feel so offended by a mono marriage system. Sure, would be awesome if I could marry several people but I can see the problems in a system like that. I see infront of me how all of Eorzea is married to one another just because they can be and that the new epeen will be how many catgirls you have in your harem...

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Originally Posted by Gnova

Think of the drama potential when someone's RL partner finds out that you are married to someone in the game that they secretly hate you play because you are spending time in the game instead of with them.
Good luck explaining that you only did it to get a free teleport to them so that you can play with your in-game spouse even more.

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...its a game. Any marriage in a game should not be taken seriously, actually anything in a game should not be taken seriously.
There is nothing wrong with marrying a stranger in a game for marriage's perk.

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Originally Posted by Bladeglory

"a very good reason to not allow"... Same Sex Marriage, or marriage at all?

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It's why some games don't have marriage at all. LOTRO was originally planned to have marriage relationships, but specifying that they be opposite-gender offended one group and not specifying that offended a different group. They ended up taking the whole thing out as being too controversial either way they did it.

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Originally Posted by Caselia

it would be in SE"s best interest to scrap the word "marriage" as marriage is a practice of a religion that doesn't exist in Eorzea.

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Actually, marriage has been a legal contract since well before religions decided to usurp it.

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Originally Posted by LalaRu

... but unique to the game, and maybe attached to lore, will be great.

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If they're going to be lore-appropriate, Seeker of the Sun Miquo'te shouldn't be pairing off into couples. They're polygamous with a typical ratio of 10 to 50 females for each breeding male.

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Originally Posted by Razzle

Explains the amount of Yuri, Yaoi, Lolishoujo, Lolishota and more stuff I don't even know about - That they produce in their culture materials on daily basis lol

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I was a bit surprised it took so long for anyone to bring this up. It is true that the Japanese are very conservative in terms of what people actually do (or at least what they publicly admit to doing), but they aren't nearly as bothered by gay relationships in fiction as some western countries are. A video game is fiction. If this game were being produced exclusively for a domestic Japanese market, it's unlikely that SE would bother putting in rules to exclude same-sex in-game marriages.

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Originally Posted by KhalidTheGreat

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

Changing the name wouldn't have made any difference in how it was perceived.

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It would have if they didn't mention the word marriage in the first place.

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If it involves pairing people off into lasting two-person relationships, and has any of the trappings of a wedding ceremony, then the players are going to be calling it "marriage" whether SE calls it that or not. To avoid this controvery, they'd have to eliminate any resemblence to marriage, but at that point it wouldn't be satisfying the people who wanted a marriage system in the game in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Luxx

ive never in my life seen a straight person brag and nag abt them being straight, hell i never done it.

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You've never heard a straight man mention his wife or girlfriend, or heard a straight woman mention her husband or boyfriend? When a gay person does those things, they're regarded as bragging about thier orientation.

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Originally Posted by Elim

Exactly. I'm hoping there will be perks to marrying, such being able to teleport to your partner.

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Any perks they add will just inflame this controversy even more. If they exclude people who have the same gender characters from having a title it's one thing. If they exclude people who have the same gender characters from being able to get meaningful in-game perks it's something more. So I really hope they don't add any perks to marriage until after they've eliminated the opposite-genders rule on who can get such perks.

They should just make it a BFF system, to avoid this controversy.

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Originally Posted by ItzKris

...its a game. Any marriage in a game should not be taken seriously, actually anything in a game should not be taken seriously.
There is nothing wrong with marrying a stranger in a game for marriage's perk.

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I agree with you 100% but try telling the same thing to a non-game playing spouse.

(zzzzzzzzz)^10

this is only a good idea if by contract your new spouse has to send you irl nudes. they better add polygamy too so i can reap all the benefits being the handsome hunk with the big ween i bought for 7.85 on amazon that i am.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

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What an absurd generalization.. I mean you can throw your hands up and claim that you're not against it at all, but when you make statements like that you're express the opposite. The behavior you're describing isn't inherent with gay people, it's in people in general. Some people enjoy making a show of themselves, some don't, some are normal, and some are lurid and flamboyant. You only notice the ones flaunting because well.. they're flaunting, they're doing things to grab your attention -- And if it were a straight couple getting buck wild in public you can bet your bottom dollar it'd grab your attention too -- but for every gay person that enjoy making a show of themselves there is like 10 of them who don't enjoy it. So do you think it's right for you to judge 10 people for the actions of 1 person? That's just outright stereotyping.

What it seems like you're against isn't anything that is stemmed from gay individuals specifically, but PDA in general.

All you people arguing about trivial things... I just want a harem for my lalafell :V

You're all just afraid of PDA emotes lolz

つ ◕_◕ ༽つEQUAL OPPORTUNITY OR RIOT ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ

eh, worth a try... :3

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Originally Posted by KyahAlmasy

What it seems like you're against isn't anything that is stemmed from gay individuals specifically, but PDA in general.

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Hmmm, let me see...

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Keep it private, and if you can't be in public with your partner without being able to control yourself then stop going out in public with them. Again...that applies to everyone.

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Yea, pretty sure she covered that. Even tho it has nothing to do with SSM in game, she still explained her point.
Geez that was hard.. :p

How about everyone just stop attacking everyone & go play the game you're all being ridiculous.

I don't understand what the point of the restrictions would be. There are no restrictions that a male player must have a male avatar, and a female player must have a female avatar, so why would there be a restriction on these characters joining? Perhaps my mate chooses to play a female character because he does not like the male character. I also play a female character because I prefer to represented as such in the game. But my character marrying his is disallowed because of some perceived gender in... pixels?

This should be left out of the game entirely if it will have such restrictions. They make no sense in a modern world where people have the choice of what kind of character they wish to play.

All SE really needs to do is state they aren't taking a stance on the social aspect of it, and open it up to any two characters. If asked, they would respond simply with "We do not know the real life gender of any one individual character and we cannot police this. Since we cannot prevent same-sex couples from picking opposite sex characters and using this system, we feel that there is no reason to place this barrier in between opposite-sex couples who may have already leveled their chosen characters."

Very simple. Spin it so that the opposite sex RL couples are the focus and allowing them to enjoy the game with the characters they may already have is the most important thing. The rest of the community getting to participate is just a side effect.

I've said this on other threads, and I'll repeat myself now. If SE won't treat everyone equally.. if they're choosing to discriminate. then marriage should not be added to the game at all.

Content should never be made to exclude a population of the game. We should all have the same opportunities.
If the word 'marriage' is such an issue, it could be called something else.

I will lose all respect for SE if they choose discrimination over equality.

The only disadvantage to allowing same-sex marriage in the game is offending bigots. Nothing of value mechanically is lost, other than possibly the economic profitability of male-exclusive wedding outfits. (The game has many more female than male characters, as evidenced by the Valentine's day event chocolate prices.)

The current Marriage system as written as well as the mechanics of the Valentine's day event make it clear, though. Square (and their predominant culture in general, honestly,) is all right with two catgirls blowing kisses at each other and doing their suggestive /pose all day, and female NPCs can incidentally flirt with my female character when I do quests for them, but "real" romantic relationships (as set forth by game mechanics of marriage and the intended format of candy exchange to complete the Valentine's event,) can only be between men and women, according to them.

(On a separate but related note to my previous post, I will also note that restricting marriage to only heterosexual couples actually requires more development time than allowing any two characters to marry, as systems with more restrictions tend to be inherently more complex. Source: I'm a professional freelance coder, dammit, and I have to do estimated hours to make literally every bid I do. Apologies for the double post, but the character limit here is garbage.)

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Originally Posted by Gemma

Hmmm, let me see...



Yea, pretty sure she covered that. Even tho it has nothing to do with SSM in game, she still explained her point.
Geez that was hard.. :p

How about everyone just stop attacking everyone & go play the game you're all being ridiculous.

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From what I got by that post is that she's under the impression that gay people are more prone to being "in-your-face" about their sexuality, as if it were some predisposed characteristic of homosexuality. That they are held to some higher standard and that every time a gay couple decides to involve themselves in pda, it can't be for any other reason than being gay. This is what oppresses them as people, that whenever their significant other goes in for a kiss in public they worry whether or not it will perpetuate a stereotype. That's like saying whenever a black person robs a store, it's because they're black.

It's just people generalizing over stereotypes, which is quite honestly ridiculous. I'm a straight woman, but even I can see how silly people can get with their comments.

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Originally Posted by KyahAlmasy

she's under the impression that gay people are more prone to being "in-your-face" about their sexuality,

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A lot of people feel this way, unfortunately...but it's not because gay people are any more likely to be exhibitionists than straights...it's because our culture accepts people shoving their straightness in everyone's faces as a matter of course, so it's not something you notice.

It's kinda like how you're more likely to notice a redhead in a crowd than a brunette, or someone wearing bright yellow than beige...your brain registers it as unusual, and draws your attention to it.

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Originally Posted by Lukha

it's because our culture accepts people shoving their straightness in everyone's faces as a matter of course, so it's not something you notice.

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You don't have all the information then, where I come from if a person "shoves their straightness in someone's face" they usually get a restraining order, jail time, and have to register as a sex offender.

I think it is fairly safe to say that people posting in this thread come from countires where same sex marriage is either legal or close to legal.
There are a lot of countries where same sex marriage is not legal and are no where near to being legal.
If SE added SS marriage into the game they would be seen to be pushing the SS marriage "agenda" on Countires/cultures that are still wrestling with the idea.

It is a ridiculously hot topic and SE were foolish to ever discuss bringing it into the game after the media storm that accompanied SW:TOR when they were putting the mechanic in the game.

Sell "wedding rings" at a vendor that allow them to be given to another with the givers name on it.
Sell dresses/tuxes or whatever else they want to add cosmetically.
Let the role player's role play and create the rest themselves.
That way someone can "marry" whoever, or whatever they want with no restrictions.
Want to be a polygamist, sure. Want to marry your Chocobo, sure.

...When people claim someone is shoving their sexuality in someone's face, they typically mean things like gratuitously announcing it, or engaging in public displays of affection with their significant other (anything from innocent hand-holding to making out in public), none of which would actually qualify for legal action, at least in the USA.

So either you're from a much stricter country, or you're mistaking the term 'sexuality' for 'sex organs'.

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Originally Posted by Lukha

So either you're from a much stricter country, or you're mistaking the term 'sexuality' for 'sex organs'.

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Yes, your words they confuse me, if you don't mind, could you answer another question I have. I see people keep bringing up sexual orientation, but to me it doesn't matter, I prefer to face North, but I can make do if it isn't very accommodating to the situation at hand.

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Originally Posted by Ashgarth

There will be, it's already been said.

Because two female lalafells together is an abomination, but a female lalafell with a male roegadyn is completely normal.

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Actually strictly speaking from a in game lore perspective... I believe there is actually a Roe in game who actually comments about wanting to court a Lala (exactly that relationship). I don't remember where I saw it, but I did see it.

Also it is subtly hinted at that Silvairre from the Archery Guild in Gridania had romantic interests in Pawah Mujuuk (or vice versa). Point is, interracial romance exists in the lore. Same gender romance not so much. Though there is at least one effeminate (potentially gay) person in the game world. Jandelaine the Aesthetician.

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Originally Posted by Tharian

Point is, interracial romance exists in the lore. Same gender romance not so much.

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SE has explicitly stated that Eorzea doesn't discriminate when it comes to romance.

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Originally Posted by Tharian

Point is, interracial romance exists in the lore. Same gender romance not so much.

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In Whitebrim, there's a couple of male NPCs sitting on the bunks in the barracks, and if you walk by them, you 'overhear' one asking the other to join him in his bunk...Not to mention all the times when female character hit on your PC regardless of gender...so both same-gender and interracial relationships definitely exist in the lore.