BLM Buffs Inc!

I would like to hear how you can get 350dps on t6 (seriously, not taunting and saying you can't do it). I try to always have gcd on cd, even if that means i have to cast Scathe. I flare whenever i can hit 2 targets, i use AM to get back to the group, and I do as little movement as possible. And my dps is still llike 240. Is my single target rotation just completely wrong?

These are the factors which contributed to the person having 350 DPS on T6

- Only a 5 minute and 40 seconds battle
- Bards played requiem for about 30-40% of the time
- Contineous nuking of the boss (bards more tended to move when connected)
- Only one bee spawned
- Did not get the honey and as a result didn't get sucked in
- Perhaps didn't have to move inside a branch to avoid getting sucked in.
- Ignoring slimes and continue nuking the boss
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Basically, you're only going to have good DPS when the RNG is mild on you and your team has enough DPS to skip phases.
PS: AM is macrod and it's very easy for me to use it on controller. Also, I don't think you should use flare on two targets when your convert is not up. You're better off just continuing with the normal rotation.

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Originally Posted by ViviAnimus

Also, I don't think you should use flare on two targets when your convert is not up. You're better off just continuing with the normal rotation.

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From my recent testing against 2 training dummies, it's a consistently higher number to do a ST rotation into Flare > Transpose > B1 > T1 > F3 than to ignore the second enemy, around 5% more total DPS. That might not even be an optimal post-Transpose rotation but it has the benefit of starting you at 100% MP.

Halloween we're on the same server, contact me I'll take you into titan or something and I'll help you out with movement casting. Getting the vines doesn't tank dps that hard, the only requiem I get is when you normally would get a requiem (beginning of the fight and after slimes die) You can cast inside the briars but not AM out of them and the loS method isnt a requirement. Vivi your attitude is simply arrogance because you refuse to even acknowledge anything other than your own opinion. Our fights are quick though you are correct in that assumption. We don't ignore the slimes either, sorry. We don't need to make the job easier to play (that is what you are asking for) we just need some single target help.

thanks for trying, xisin. i'm usually at work during the day.

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Originally Posted by Ragecake

A good rule with people in general:
http://img0.joyreactor.com/pics/post...to-268754.jpeg

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I stick with you,...

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Originally Posted by SongJoohee

There's currently 0 reason to take a Black Mage to Coil 6-9 instead of Summoner.

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I disagree.

Turn 6 - You can flare bulbs on tank -> DPS gain.
Turn 8 - You can flare Dreadnaught + boss (Twice if you have convert up) -> DPS gain. Infinite mana!
Turn 9* - You can flare Ghosts + Nael for 1 add burst. Aetherial Manipulation. Manawall/Manaward defensive buff. Multidots spread targets**

*For this turn, only exceptionnal Black Mages can pull their weight. It's not given to anyone.
** Many BLMs don't see the point to multi-thunder more than one add. 3 Thunder debuffs = 3 times 5% chances to get a proc, why wouldn't you do that? Of course it's less damage than Summoner but it's still a DPS gain.

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Originally Posted by Aikaal

I disagree.

Turn 6 - You can flare bulbs on tank -> DPS gain.
Turn 8 - You can flare Dreadnaught + boss (Twice if you have convert up) -> DPS gain. Infinite mana!
Turn 9* - You can flare Ghosts + Nael for 1 add burst. Aetherial Manipulation. Manawall/Manaward defensive buff. Multidots spread targets**

*For this turn, only exceptionnal Black Mages can pull their weight. It's not given to anyone.
** Many BLMs don't see the point to multi-thunder more than one add. 3 Thunder debuffs = 3 times 5% chances to get a proc, why wouldn't you do that? Of course it's less damage than Summoner but it's still a DPS gain.

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I avoided spoiling myself from the t9 boss up to this point. Thank you very much :/

TBH i think BLM single target turreting damage is pretty high, even higher then a similar geared SMN and Monk when the fight is longer then 5 min due to MP/TP management. All blm really need is a buff to movement dps, scathe proccing a crit guaranteed scathe or something, and for a quality of life remove double proccing.

I think Vivi's assumption are correct, as a BLM without RNG on your side and massive group dps to push phases so quickly that there is only 2-3 thorns, it is absurdly difficult to pull 360 dps. I would love to see your fight video to prove that you were handling multiple movement heavy mechanix while maintain 360.

I have a turn 9 video posted already to show how how i move around and maintain dps. I didn't bother to record anythign for turn 6 as its turn 6 and everyone's cleared it by now.... Also blm has the lowest or second lowest single target in the game, didn't think anyone would argue that.

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Originally Posted by Aikaal

** Many BLMs don't see the point to multi-thunder more than one add. 3 Thunder debuffs = 3 times 5% chances to get a proc, why wouldn't you do that? Of course it's less damage than Summoner but it's still a DPS gain.

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I really can't think of a situation where this is a thing.

If the 3 mobs are close together then just use an AoE rotation, if they're spread out then chances are stuff needs to die fast and that won't happen with you taking 7.5-10.5 seconds to cast whatever tier of Thunder on everything.

Thundercloud procs do more damage than Fire, yes, but they still take up a GCD and are far too reliant on randomness. Hence why the only really optimal time to cast Thunder spells is during Umbral Ice phases where you need something to fill the gap while MP recharges.

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Originally Posted by Xisin

I have a turn 9 video posted already to show how how i move around and maintain dps. I didn't bother to record anythign for turn 6 as its turn 6 and everyone's cleared it by now.... Also blm has the lowest or second lowest single target in the game, didn't think anyone would argue that.

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Actually...I would. In my server our dragoon are bad that hitting low dps than blms. But it's probably server issue. I know pro drg who could hit 400+ in T8 but I never seen it in my server so in our server it's like Mnk>Smn>Blm>Drg>Bard
In general I wouldn't aruge it. Even our dps is just a bit low than Drg by 10~20.

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Originally Posted by Alkimi

I really can't think of a situation where this is a thing.

If the 3 mobs are close together then just use an AoE rotation, if they're spread out then chances are stuff needs to die fast and that won't happen with you taking 7.5-10.5 seconds to cast whatever tier of Thunder on everything.

Thundercloud procs do more damage than Fire, yes, but they still take up a GCD and are far too reliant on randomness. Hence why the only really optimal time to cast Thunder spells is during Umbral Ice phases where you need something to fill the gap while MP recharges.

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Thunder II is actually our most efficient spell. the reason you don't spam it under normal circumstances is that it is indeed a dot. On the golems towards the end its best to raging strikes quelling strikes burn the dps golem, then during the ice phase dot the other two. On the second set of golems, you won't have quelling up at all so rather than risking pulling hate off the melee dps (and it will happen if you are close in gear) you can dot each one then start.

Dotting all 3 on the first set isn't a bad thing either.

Thunder 2 potency total = 295 319 mp (this is very important) and a 2.77ish cast time that varies with spell speed.
To give you an idea of that power

Fire = 150 potency * 1.8 Astral fire 3 = 270
flare = 260 potency * 1.8 = 468 - Those golems will never be together for a flare though

thunder on all 3 golems (they will all mostly tick to full duration) = 295*3 = 885 potency

Basically thunder 2 has better damage than a fire 1 in Af3, on top of that each application increases the odds of thunder procs.

3 casts of fire 1 will yield a total of 810 potency in 6.93 seconds. (according to my spell speed) gcd = 2.31
3 casts of thunder 2 = 885 potency in 8.31 seconds

885/8.31 = 106.498 potency per second
810/6.93 = 116.883 potency per second + highly probable thunderclouds.

This is the reasoning behind my personal recommendation of RS + QS on the first set and then dotting the second set to prevent hate draw from the melee + other dps targeted golem.

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Originally Posted by ZeroAmano

Actually...I would. In my server our dragoon are bad that hitting low dps than blms. But it's probably server issue. I know pro drg who could hit 400+ in T8 but I never seen it in my server so in our server it's like Mnk>Smn>Blm>Drg>Bard
In general I wouldn't aruge it. Even our dps is just a bit low than Drg by 10~20.

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You can't compare bad players to good players and say that it's a credible argument in regards to drg vs blm stdps. My statics dragoon beats my numbers on single target situations for the most part. Those dragoons you play with are bad. I know atleast 3 drgs in my fc that beat my blm single target dps, and by a margin of around 20-30 at times.

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Originally Posted by Xisin

You can't compare bad players to good players and say that it's a credible argument in regards to drg vs blm stdps. My statics dragoon beats my numbers on single target situations for the most part. Those dragoons you play with are bad. I know atleast 3 drgs in my fc that beat my blm single target dps, and by a margin of around 20-30 at times.

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Yeah i knew it. So i said it's probably server issue. In T8 I think it's more like Mnk 450/Drg 420/Smn 400/Blm 380/Bard 360 (ilv110)
If your group ask you don't need to move. Then there is a chance to beat both Smn and Drg. But it's for T8 anyway. In general we are the second lowest dps that just a bit better than bard.

the thing is without Peon/Mana, SMN/Mnk/DRG going full dps dries out by 5 min. BLM doesn't have resource issue faced by all other DPS unless you fk up really hard. From a balance point of view a practically resourceless dps should do less then one that requires resource management. However since fight are shorter and shorter, resource becomes less important, and since things like BRD exist BLM comes somewhat behind.

I never really disagreed on BLM buff/adjustment, like i said movement dps needs to be strongly buffed, and removing double procc situation via usable fire 3 stacks or increase damage dealt by double procced fire 3.

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Originally Posted by Xisin

Thunder II is actually our most efficient spell. the reason you don't spam it under normal circumstances is that it is indeed a dot. On the golems towards the end its best to raging strikes quelling strikes burn the dps golem, then during the ice phase dot the other two. On the second set of golems, you won't have quelling up at all so rather than risking pulling hate off the melee dps (and it will happen if you are close in gear) you can dot each one then start.

Dotting all 3 on the first set isn't a bad thing either.


Thunder 2 potency total = 295 319 mp (this is very important) and a 2.77ish cast time that varies with spell speed.
To give you an idea of that power

Fire = 150 potency * 1.8 Astral fire 3 = 270
flare = 260 potency * 1.8 = 468 - Those golems will never be together for a flare though

thunder on all 3 golems (they will all mostly tick to full duration) = 295*3 = 885 potency

Basically thunder 2 has better damage than a fire 1 in Af3, on top of that each application increases the odds of thunder procs.

3 casts of fire 1 will yield a total of 810 potency in 6.93 seconds. (according to my spell speed) gcd = 2.31
3 casts of thunder 2 = 885 potency in 8.31 seconds

885/8.31 = 106.498 potency per second
810/6.93 = 116.883 potency per second + highly probable thunderclouds.

This is the reasoning behind my personal recommendation of RS + QS on the first set and then dotting the second set to prevent hate draw from the melee + other dps targeted golem.

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Technically, fire1 under astral 3 is closer to 130 potency per second, if you include firestarters.
Based on http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen...ue_proc_rates/

EPotency = 150 * 1.8 + 0.25 (220 * 1.8) = 369
ECastTime = 2.3 + 0.25 (2.3) = 2.875s,
EPotency/s = 369 / 2.875 ~= 128.34 potency/s

Just clarifying that without any thunderstarter procs (the Expected value of a thunder including thunderclouds is very volatile depending on when you get it), fire1 casts are stronger. Of course, when in UI3, multiple t2 are still optimal.

those numbers are just for that particular situation, as i mathed out, the main purpose behind it is to simply not peel hate off your dps. Cause if you do peel hate then everyone ends up losing

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Originally Posted by Cherub

I avoided spoiling myself from the t9 boss up to this point. Thank you very much :/

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That's unfortunate :( There's not a lot of BLM that actually do T9 and I'm happy to be one of them.

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Originally Posted by Alkimi

I really can't think of a situation where this is a thing.

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If mobs are stack together it's better to do AoE rotation but there are cases where multiple adds spawn and you can't stack them. Phase 2 of T9 is the best example. You have to kill 3 golems quickly and if you stack them, they merge and wipe your group so multi-dotting is a DPS gain at this point.

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Originally Posted by Halloween

I would like to hear how you can get 350dps on t6 (cut)

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I've been doing close to 360 on T6 the past week with an i97 (lv100 soldiery weapon).

I personally never got targeted by the honey bee so this was a plus for sure , however over this what I personally do is

a) Sprint in precast before chains
b) I abuse the skill cast cheating , you can start moving when your cast bar is at around 80-85%
c) AM always set in macro for long distances
d) Double flares whenever you have 2+ targets (convert or ether if it's down)

On fights like leviathan ex I'm generally always around 350 and this fight has some hard movements too , however the rules above apply for every fight, on T8 I'm going from 340 to 370 , it really depends on the procs/crits rng but usually our MNK is always far away from me even if I do a perfect fight.

My personal feeling is that most of the BLM QQ'ing about the job are the ones that are unable to maximize their movements, however based on the direction they took with the new coil and based on the raw damage on the dummies compared to DRG/MNK /lolBRD's a little boost to the single target damage is something that I approve. A properly used BLM which si 100% skilled should be able to compete with a properly skilled MNK, I'd be more than happy to lower a bit the AOE damage (lolDungeonsFarm) for some more DPS on single target.

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Originally Posted by God_Mode

I've been doing close to 360 on T6 the past week with an i97 (lv100 soldiery weapon).

On fights like leviathan ex I'm generally always around 350, on T8 I'm going from 340 to 370

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No offense, but your parser is broken. Or your monks are near 500 dps if you are 370 on T8. I'm i100, i110 weapon and i'm max 340-350 on T8 in doing almost nothing (bomb pattern) with every buffs u can + staff hits during all fight.

On ACT, our monks are around 400 max, SMN 375 max (and they are pretty good) On T8 we skip last phase (only 3 dreads) and we finish it in 9m20-30. So i need some explanations!

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Originally Posted by ViviAnimus

Black Mages can do 370 DPS when standing still? I do 340 on a striking dummy with iLVL 99 gear. I know my class well. I use aetherial manipultion, I move as little as possible, I manage my procs well, use the few cooldowns we have effectively and such ...

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Thanks, this is reality.

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Originally Posted by xEscaflownex

I Thunder III, Swiftcast Fire III, Raging Strikes, Fire spam (pop convert after first Firestarter or Thundercloud proc to get an additional 2 fires in before switching to UI) for opener, then just normal rotation. You can get two flares in on each dreadknight This keeps me at 370+

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And what parser are you using?
I have exactly the same gear, and i dont see how is that possible to reach 370+ with i100 in BLM on ACT (or maybe have some luck and do 50% crit xD). And when i read your rotation, your opener and what you do on T8: lol.... How can u do double flare on each dread? U lose too much DPS after the second when going ice, and u have only convert on dread 1 and 3. And if you use a mana pot then u are not using intell pot?
Now, with our DPS on T8 i cant even use flare on Dread 1, he is killed too fast, i will lose all my mana of my 3rd cycle. When first dread come, my 3rd cycle just start. I can use only one flare and it's on Dread 2. Dread 3 is instant killed with melee LB3 and we don't even see dread 4, boss already died. So please, explain to me where u get your 30 more dps!

So I have a few questions, for the 380 dps blm, for turn 8.

Do you use poision pots?, my group tells me to use them.

Do you pop towers? I usually pop the first couple north towers.

My FC tells me those numbers are only possible if those BLM ignore mechanics.

That and to stop crying about not being able to hit 380 dps.

It's not crying, it's trying to understand how guys on forums with i96 are 370+ dps with crazy rotations and ig you never see them. That's it. And u can't ignore all mechanics on T8, u will always have a little thing to do and lower a bit your dps.

And first u can lower your accuracy, 493 is really too much... It's a start for you... Buy the legs 90 craft.

I play blm for t6-9 and I do a consistent 450dps on every turn. Even our monks can't keep up they normally only do about 400. Blm has the most single target dps in the game, and if you don't believe it you are wrong.

Oh I know I have too much acc, I would love to lower it.

Im just overall depressed that I go from top dps on turn 5, to complete garbage on turns 6-9.

Im thinking I lose out on dps because Im told to use a poison pot at beginning and pop the north tower.

I would give up and go smn but I got the BLM 110 staff so im sort of stuck being a BLM.

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Originally Posted by RockinFr

It's not crying, it's trying to understand how guys on forums with i96 are 370+ dps with crazy rotations and ig you never see them. That's it. And u can't ignore all mechanics on T8, u will always have a little thing to do and lower a bit your dps.

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You can always ignore ALL mechanics on T8.Only if your party will allow you and your party member to help. Like your healer will step tower instead of dps or monk/smn step mine. So all you need to do is just about DPS and DPS. The only thing that will reduce your dps in T8 is w6 AF. If you don't get it. It's easy to get 350+ as ilv95+ blm.Ofc this need x-mega pot and double flare+ragestirke+foe for dread or spam poison on avatar and gain about 5-10dps. Also your gear is...wrong. So that would explain why you are hitting so low.

http://i.imgur.com/JNuBuv1.png

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No offense, but your parser is broken. Or your monks are near 500 dps if you are 370 on T8. I'm i100, i110 weapon and i'm max 340-350 on T8 in doing almost nothing (bomb pattern) with every buffs u can + staff hits during all fight.

On ACT, our monks are around 400 max, SMN 375 max (and they are pretty good) On T8 we skip last phase (only 3 dreads) and we finish it in 9m20-30. So i need some explanations!

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This was this week's t8 run. I was ilvl 101 at the time. The bard played foes in the beginning and then for short burst later on. Getting 350-370 dps is very reasonable for ilvl95-98 with a 100 / 110 weapon. The monk had a low-ish parse and i pulled the fight with lb.

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Originally Posted by RockinFr

No offense, but your parser is broken. Or your monks are near 500 dps if you are 370 on T8. I'm i100, i110 weapon and i'm max 340-350 on T8 in doing almost nothing (bomb pattern) with every buffs u can + staff hits during all fight.

On ACT, our monks are around 400 max, SMN 375 max (and they are pretty good) On T8 we skip last phase (only 3 dreads) and we finish it in 9m20-30. So i need some explanations!
this is reality.

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No offense but there's 3 people parsering in my team with different parser and I'm always the 2nd behind the MNK, I'll get em take a screen on the next reset and post it here as I'm playing from the ps4.

About the reality quote from ViviAnimus you aren't taking in consideration that on dummies A) you don't have the FOE up and B) You don't have the DN's as multi target. In my party I'm ignoring most of the mecanics and entering in only two towers , but with sprint + AM + procs I don't even stop casting.

On the DN's I'm able to cast 2-3 buffed Flares every time which is a fairly big boost in DPS, and yes those are all done in AF3 , if you don't know how to then you don't know how to maximize the BLM AOE.

We don't use poison pots anymore but from what I know those aren't even counted by the parser.

^ Poiton pot showed by ACT :)

BLM only needs a slight fire buff and scathe to be reverted back to original.

BLM is the only DPS really who can go all out without worrying about resources, we just need longer content.

Ill come back to this in a bit.

I always figured that you would lose DPS when double flaring on two mobs. Well, not two but triple flare maybe. I take it you use ethers?
AF3 - Swiftcast Flare - Convert - Flare - Mega ether - Flare?
I always feel uncomfortable when I have to use transpose, seems like such a waste of time. But I can see it working.
I don't know what would be more beneficial. To double flare, use your mega either or whatever and start casting blizzard III or going triple flare and transpose.

If it is larger groups of mobs i actually flare after mp is low (from Fire 2)
then flare> convert> flare> mega potion> flare
I do use swiftcast in there as well but it varies from person to person on when to use it.
Also lately i have timing my rotations right so that i can use flare and Firestarter :)
You do loose dps from transpose, so you are correct.
Brayflox HM for instance i always 3x flare

I haven't used BLM since early 2.2, but now that I've got i115 and lots of gear I've been putting the time into T6-9. Scored 401 on T6 without Flaring the slugs so it's not THAT bad, though definitely still strictly worse than SMN.

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Originally Posted by ViviAnimus

I always figured that you would lose DPS when double flaring on two mobs. Well, not two but triple flare maybe. I take it you use ethers?
AF3 - Swiftcast Flare - Convert - Flare - Mega ether - Flare?
I always feel uncomfortable when I have to use transpose, seems like such a waste of time. But I can see it working.
I don't know what would be more beneficial. To double flare, use your mega either or whatever and start casting blizzard III or going triple flare and transpose.

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There's actually a method to getting two Flares in a row without doing anything in between. I open with Fire 3 and sometimes Fire 2 twice, then Flare. After that use Transpose. Wait until you get the first tick of MP back, then wait 2 seconds and cast Flare. If you time it right, as soon as Flare goes off Umbral Ice should give you one more tick of MP before it switches to Astral Fire, allowing you to cast Flare again right away. You can repeat this infinitely after that with Transpose>get MP+wait 2seconds>Flare>Flare.

But when you need some serious burst AoE it is nice to get two Flares with Convert in Astral Fire form

Getting 401 DPS on T6 with almost every piece iLVL 110 doesn't seem out of proportion. Does the LVL 115 make a huge difference?

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Originally Posted by ViviAnimus

Getting 401 DPS on T6 with almost every piece iLVL 110 doesn't seem out of proportion. Does the LVL 115 make a huge difference?

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110 weap to 115 is 2 WD increase, its kinda noticeable improvement I guess

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Originally Posted by ViviAnimus

Getting 401 DPS on T6 with almost every piece iLVL 110 doesn't seem out of proportion. Does the LVL 115 make a huge difference?

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I never got the i110 for BLM, so I couldn't tell you. The difference from i95 to i115 was in the range of 40 DPS sustained (without moving of course, less in real fights ST), give or take.

I definetly agree surecast should allow casting while moving. My vote, Sir.

Edit: wow, I was late to the party! XD Didn't notice we were on page... 28.......