Yoshi P talks about Warriors- from Producer Letter Live @ TGS

Like Logic4u said.. Shut up and stop yelling and whining at each other! Christ! Anyway I feel like these comment from Yoshi means he knows the problem and will address it.. Which I hope he does and just makes us even out with paladins.

I wonder if it would be plausible to have it set to where HP gained through self-heals in excess of the HP pool would add to a shield or something of the like. That way instead of needing a means of mitigating incoming damage spikes, Paladins would deflect some of that damage and Warriors would just absorb it.

As it is, Warriors have many tools available but none of them serve as a strong enough mechanic to equate to a Paladin's ability to "take a hit" which seems to be the concept thrown around a lot. If there is balance, without a healer both tanks should die at the exact same point in a fight.

Personally, last I checked, both jobs are tanks and a tank's role is to take a hit. True they're designed to take that hit differently, which is great, but one mitigates that hit with a much more noticeable degree and that is what matters to healers. So, please stop the "better at taking a hit" nonsense. If one is better then the two are not balanced. They should equally take that hit and recover or mitigate the damage through different means.

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Originally Posted by Sudboyz

This touches on the subject of mitigation imbalance (not saying that Warriors are supposed to mitigate as much). We know there is a severe imbalance between the two classes, what if PLD couldn't parry, and Warriors can't block? That would level that out instead of PLD parry+block and WAR just parry. They could tweak the numbers afterwards to the desired effects. IMO, this would reduce a variable between the two classes making them easier to balance. Thoughts?

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Right now a PLD eat about 2.2k damage from Titan HM's Mountain Buster, a WAR eats about 4.5k. So, taking this oversimplified example of 1 attack as comparison where WAR takes 2x damage of PLD, in order to keep WAR the way they are now with no mitigation and PLD with all mitigation, the WAR needs about 2x HP of PLD and also healing potency on WAR must be 2x of PLD. So if your average PLD has 5k HP at endgame, WAR needs about 10k HP. Cure II which heals for 1.1k on PLD should heal for 2.2k on WAR.

In reality, right now WAR has about 7k HP and Cure II heals for about 1.3k.

Do you see the problem here if WAR is going to continue to be a tank without mitigation? The buff to our HP pool and incoming healing potency must be DRAMATICALLY INCREASED for us to be equivalent to PLD. I just don't see Squenix spamming HP and healing potency at us and calling it a day, that's just lazy game balancing. I mean sure if they do that I'll be happy as a clam and I'll go and tank Titan HM and Bahamut's Coil but I still don't think that's quite what they had in mind originally with WAR.

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Originally Posted by Sephirah

CT is not a tier up, it was intended to be released with 2.0. The progression is supposed to be Primals>Crystal Tower>Coils.

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Regardless, there is an issue if 1 tank can tank with gear x, but another cannot with the equivalent tier.

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Originally Posted by Illya

Right now a PLD eat about 2.2k damage from Titan HM's Mountain Buster, a WAR eats about 4.5k. So, taking this oversimplified example of 1 attack as comparison where WAR takes 2x damage of PLD, in order to keep WAR the way they are now with no mitigation and PLD with all mitigation, the WAR needs about 2x HP of PLD and also healing potency on WAR must be 2x of PLD. So if your average PLD has 5k HP at endgame, WAR needs about 10k HP. Cure II which heals for 1.1k on PLD should heal for 2.2k on WAR.

In reality, right now WAR has about 7k HP and Cure II heals for about 1.3k.

Do you see the problem here if WAR is going to continue to be a tank without mitigation? The buff to our HP pool and incoming healing potency must be DRAMATICALLY INCREASED for us to be equivalent to PLD. I just don't see Squenix spamming HP and healing potency at us and calling it a day, that's just lazy game balancing. I mean sure if they do that I'll be happy as a clam and I'll go and tank Titan HM and Bahamut's Coil but I still don't think that's quite what they had in mind originally with WAR.

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They don't need to dramatically increase WAR HP and incoming heals. They just need to change a few skills so WARs actually have a couple of "oh shit" cooldowns. Our best "oh shit" cooldown is Thrill of Battle, but I'd still trade that in for an untraited Rampart anyday of the week.

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Originally Posted by Illya

Right now a PLD eat about 2.2k damage from Titan HM's Mountain Buster, a WAR eats about 4.5k. So, taking this oversimplified example of 1 attack as comparison where WAR takes 2x damage of PLD, in order to keep WAR the way they are now with no mitigation and PLD with all mitigation, the WAR needs about 2x HP of PLD and also healing potency on WAR must be 2x of PLD. So if your average PLD has 5k HP at endgame, WAR needs about 10k HP. Cure II which heals for 1.1k on PLD should heal for 2.2k on WAR.

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I was more getting at the fact giving warriors parry and paladins block for avoidance stats would make balancing that aspect much easier, and tweaking the numbers after the change would adjust for any issues of removing parry from PLD would make.

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Originally Posted by Guammasa

I wonder if it would be plausible to have it set to where HP gained through self-heals in excess of the HP pool would add to a shield or something of the like.

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You mean a Stoneskin/Cureskin or a temporarily boost your max HP for any excess amount?

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Originally Posted by Guammasa

I wonder if it would be plausible to have it set to where HP gained through self-heals in excess of the HP pool would add to a shield or something of the like. That way instead of needing a means of mitigating incoming damage spikes, Paladins would deflect some of that damage and Warriors would just absorb it.

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I like this idea, especially when warriors' self-heals are reactive while paladins' mitigation is inherent

Yoshi's words mean he is going to nerf the Paladin duh.
"You gotta bring up War"
No son, dey gon bring Paladin Down.

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Originally Posted by Illya

I want to ask Yoshi what WAR is supposed to do for Titan HM then. Go as DPS just for that fight, since it's literally 10 million times easier to tank Titan HM as a PLD?
I don't want to be PLD to tank.

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bring an extra healer and quit relying on DF for titan. You don't need 2 tanks, so the extra slot can be for a healer. Sorry but its hard for any tank, this isn't wow where you can go in with shit gear and faceroll through content (amen to that). Get the appropriate gear and try it out (as well as your party)