Suggestion: healer-based incentives/rewards

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Originally Posted by Penthea

If you want to go down that route you could say the same about tanking. Or dps. Or anything really.

I have seen plenty of tank stance tanks who did little other than stand around and get hit, seen plenty of dps who did mediocre damage at best and used no role actions, and seen loads of healers have the group at low hp all the time despite their large mana pool. So then if easy content often allows players of any role to do the bare minimum, why should only tanks get access to role-based rewards?

Also are you somehow unaware that people can make content more difficult by doing things such as chain pulling mobs, being undergeared, or simply playing badly? Don't underestimate how much reckless and/or bad players can change how content feels.

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Originally Posted by miraidensetsu

Nor tanks, much less DPS. On easy content, DPS could even ignore mechanics if the healer is good enough. In those contents, tanks can tank without using any cooldown and an ice mage can do an alrighty damage if he keeps the GCD rolling. They will clear that easy content.

But that doesn't change the fact that an healer that just heals, an tank who don't use cooldowns and an ice mage are the example of players who don't do even the bare minimum. The bare minimum for healers is heals+support+mechanics+DPS. The bare minimum for tanks is manage aggro+cooldowns+positioning+mechanics+DPS. The bare minimum for any DPS is doing their rotation (which means do damage)+mechanics. And if someone does anything less than what I described, people will notice, because that will make that content harder. Specially for the healer. For instance, healing Sastasha (the easiest content) with a tank that is using ilvl 1 equips is... Quite challenging. Specially if he don't know how to use Flash, Shield Lob, Overpower, Tomahawk, Unleash, Unmend or even Rampart. All of those available by level 15. And a dungeon that a SCH could do without casting Physick not even once (just EOS's embraces would do) can be a nightmare.

And I say that as healer main who always heals pugs.

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Oh believe me, I'm one of the first ones defending people doing their best. But let's not fool ourselves. You're both just arguing this to prop up the healer role. Funny how you both usually are on the side of people who don't do their best on other threads, but once someone even seems to suggest healers usually aren't theheroes you both seem to think they are, here comes the flip-flopping.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Oh believe me, I'm one of the first ones defending people doing their best. But let's not fool ourselves. You're both just arguing this to prop up the healer role. Funny how you both usually are on the side of people who don't do their best on other threads, but once someone even seems to suggest healers usually aren't theheroes you both seem to think they are, here comes the flip-flopping.

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So it's flip flopping to defend people not doing their best, and then to correct someone when they claim healers usually have an easy role? Uh...I regret to inform you that these two things are not always related. One is defending people who may not be in a favourable situation, the other is correcting someone making a false assumption.

But sure make them the same if it makes you happy.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

So it's flip flopping to defend people not doing their best, and then to correct someone when they claim healers usually have an easy role? Uh...I regret to inform you that these two things are not always related. One is defending people who may not be in a favourable situation, the other is correcting someone making a false assumption.

But sure make them the same if it makes you happy.

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But it is, in most basic content, which is what was said.
I know, I heal occasionally, in every roulette. I DPS, I pre-shield any tankbusters, I top up people in preparation for raidwide AoEs. But I don't have to fully use my kit, I've never even touched Rescue. Because most basic content is just that easy.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

But it is, in most basic content, which is what was said.
I know, I heal occasionally, in every roulette. I DPS, I pre-shield any tankbusters, I top up people in preparation for raidwide AoEs. But I don't have to fully use my kit, I've never even touched Rescue. Because most basic content is just that easy.

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As if the use of Rescue is an indication of how difficult content is.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

As if the use of Rescue is an indication of how difficult content is.

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No, but apparently pretending most basic content is as hard as an Ex Trial or Savage is.

At this point of the game, healers have more than completely spent their martyrdom credits. No one's buying that act. You're essential, but not at the cost of the other roles.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

No, but apparently pretending most basic content is as hard as an Ex Trial or Savage is.

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Please direct me to where someone said this. It's the first time I have read it in this thread.

Wasnt the last census showing where healers where only 1-2% higher than tanks. So I see no reason they shouldnt get incentives rewards.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

Please direct me to where someone said this. It's the first time I have read it in this thread.

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Why did you present worst case scenarios as an example that healers do a whole lot of stuff then, if not to illustrate that most of the basic content is harder than it actually is? Because otherwise, like the other poster said, usually healers just have to heal and do mechanics in most of the basic content.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Why did you present worst case scenarios as an example that healers do a whole lot of stuff then, if not to illustrate that most of the basic content is harder than it actually is? Because otherwise, like the other poster said, usually healers just have to heal and do mechanics in most of the basic content.

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So in other words you cannot direct me to where someone said basic content is just as difficult as ex or savage if you're a healer because no one said it. Good to know. I thought I missed a post.

Also why are you implying really horrible scenarios can't happen outside of ex and savage? Most of the worst wipefests I have seen have been in 24 man content.

EDIT: and please note I simply said "wipefests" not "wipefests while playing as a specific role".

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Originally Posted by Penthea

So in other words you cannot direct me to where someone said basic content is just as difficult as ex or savage if you're a healer because no one said it. Good to know. I thought I missed a post.

Also why are you implying really horrible scenarios can't happen outside of ex and savage? Most of the worst wipefests I have seen have been in 24 man content.

EDIT: and please note I simply said "wipefests" not "wipefests while playing as a specific role".

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Really horrible scenarios neither show that most basic content is hard, nor that healers doing more than healing and mechanics is essential to deal with them. You're the one trying to push both notions.

That's called backpedalling, because earlier you implied healers were essential in preventing/dealing with wipefests. Just because you're changing your argument now doesn't mean you didn't say so earlier in the topic.