Why is RDM invisible right now? Where is the outrage?

"Outrage" is a big word to use for something like this. Is it bad? Yes. Not like there needs to be a community uproar over the badness to know it's bad.

Im now rly rly much confused ( had a long break of this game) and i consider to play RDM cause of fix failurs and still do damage ....

But i have this strange feeling to play RDM lemme sit in the supply closet, and this doesnt sound fair to me, cause how often and much do Devs have to tell the community that every class/job in every constelation can beat every content?!
And what on earth do ppl think, they are smarter than the ppl which made the game?

Rly this closemindet position make me sad , cause it doesnt feel u have to freedom to choose.

Part of the World First E8S clear alongside SMN, MNK, BRD as DPS. Consider that for a moment.

Ok, I'm back from a very long break and started a RDM and if I understand, RDM has a poor DPS because he can Cure and Raise and nobody cares about the Cure but a bit about the Raise, so RDM is useless in endgame contents?

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Originally Posted by Nephisto

Ok, I'm back from a very long break and started a RDM and if I understand, RDM has a poor DPS because he can Cure and Raise and nobody cares about the Cure but a bit about the Raise, so RDM is useless in endgame contents?

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RDM just got buffed, and while they're not as strong as BLM or SMM they're close enough that your group isn't at a disgusting disadvantage if you run RDM over the other 2.

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Originally Posted by Billythepancake

RDM just got buffed, and while they're not as strong as BLM or SMM they're close enough that your group isn't at a disgusting disadvantage if you run RDM over the other 2.

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Just to add a bit
RDM is mostly useful during early prog when people die a lot and the rez can allow your group to push a bit further the mecs and see more of the fight. RDM also requires overall less time learning a fight than a BLM for optimal damage which is definitely a plus.

RDM downside is just lower maximum damage output. However, as it's been said, groups have already cleared E8S on first week with a RDM, so that mean the extra damage from BLM isn't necessary. You can always clear any content with a RDM. This will be more true as time will pass and we'll all get better gear (thus damage).

So I wouldn't worry.

New player here and I am working my way up to getting Red Mage so I can main it and this last response gives me some hope that I won't be just left behind as a Red Mage come endgame. Then again... I tend to play lesser classes in all MMOs and make the best of it.

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Originally Posted by VarkingRunesong

New player here and I am working my way up to getting Red Mage so I can main it and this last response gives me some hope that I won't be just left behind as a Red Mage come endgame. Then again... I tend to play lesser classes in all MMOs and make the best of it.

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World first Eden's Verse used a RDM in a double-caster comp. which is RDM's least advantageous comp.

RDM's not in a bad spot at all now.

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Originally Posted by Gruntler

World first Eden's Verse used a RDM in a double-caster comp. which is RDM's least advantageous comp.

RDM's not in a bad spot at all now.

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I hit 50 and switched over to RDM and holy crap its like having to start over at level 1 again. So many skills and abilities I need to learn and keep up with. I've been all over discord and reddit trying to find solid rotations so I am not just noobing it up the whole time.

New jobs tend to have all their most important skill on the get go.
While this may seem overwhelming at first, it is really useful because by the time you reach a few more level, you will actually have nailed down 90% of the end game rotation.

The same cannot be said with some other job. For instance, a BLM reaching level 60 literally has to learn a new rotation. Thankfully the new lv72 spell isn't as game changing.

Back to the redmage.
Your bread and butter will be all the spell you already have. Which are jolt, ver-thunder/aero/fire/stone and your melee combo.
The rest will mostly be filler barely changing your rotation.
Lv52 you'll learn moulinet, which is just an aoe version of your melee skill (great for dungeon but nothing new per say)
Lv54 vercure: mostly unused in raid
Lv56: contre sixte, juste another ogcd like fleche. Press when available (again nothing actually changing your rotation)
58 is just a raidbuff
60 : manafication. Will change a tiny bit how you play once every 2min.
62-66nothing but new rank the Rez
68-70: your combo finisher. Yet again, doesn't change your gameplay in the grand scheme of things. Your melee combo just has a fourth step . (With a special rule for a small dps boost)
And from 72-80
Well... A melee version of disengage
And an instant that burns a bit of black and white mana... Which you aren't suppose to use all that much beside when you can't cast .(very situational stuff basically )
And Lv 80? Well another melee.combo finisher, with no special rule. Justboress the shiny button ...

So basically , from 52 to 80, in term of ''core'' rotation change, you'll get
1 ogcd and a 4th and 5th button for your melee combo.
That's it

The rest are just fluff, new rank, and 2 cd.

Which means that, you currently have your full ''core'' kit. The way you play now, is 90% similar to the way you'll play at Lv 80.
So as long as you out very little effort into actually reading your spells, once you reach Lv 80 you should have a rather good understanding on rdm rotation

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Originally Posted by Sylvain

New jobs tend to have all their most important skill on the get go.
While this may seem overwhelming at first, it is really useful because by the time you reach a few more level, you will actually have nailed down 90% of the end game rotation.

The same cannot be said with some other job. For instance, a BLM reaching level 60 literally has to learn a new rotation. Thankfully the new lv72 spell isn't as game changing.

Back to the redmage.
Your bread and butter will be all the spell you already have. Which are jolt, ver-thunder/aero/fire/stone and your melee combo.
The rest will mostly be filler barely changing your rotation.
Lv52 you'll learn moulinet, which is just an aoe version of your melee skill (great for dungeon but nothing new per say)
Lv54 vercure: mostly unused in raid
Lv56: contre sixte, juste another ogcd like fleche. Press when available (again nothing actually changing your rotation)
58 is just a raidbuff
60 : manafication. Will change a tiny bit how you play once every 2min.
62-66nothing but new rank the Rez
68-70: your combo finisher. Yet again, doesn't change your gameplay in the grand scheme of things. Your melee combo just has a fourth step . (With a special rule for a small dps boost)
And from 72-80
Well... A melee version of disengage
And an instant that burns a bit of black and white mana... Which you aren't suppose to use all that much beside when you can't cast .(very situational stuff basically )
And Lv 80? Well another melee.combo finisher, with no special rule. Justboress the shiny button ...

So basically , from 52 to 80, in term of ''core'' rotation change, you'll get
1 ogcd and a 4th and 5th button for your melee combo.
That's it

The rest are just fluff, new rank, and 2 cd.

Which means that, you currently have your full ''core'' kit. The way you play now, is 90% similar to the way you'll play at Lv 80.
So as long as you out very little effort into actually reading your spells, once you reach Lv 80 you should have a rather good understanding on rdm rotation

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You are beautiful. I do what I can to get my magic to 80/80 and then burn my melee combo and rinse repeat right now. Sounds like I can tweak it a little but I am on the right path.

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Originally Posted by VarkingRunesong

You are beautiful. I do what I can to get my magic to 80/80 and then burn my melee combo and rinse repeat right now. Sounds like I can tweak it a little but I am on the right path.

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Bear in mind, he's dismissing the value of vercure in raids (boss downtime to set up a dualcast, this is part of our skillcap kit), dismissing the value of enchanted riposte (used to balance mana to guarantee proc going into a melee phase, used for movement when swiftcast is down, used to sneak in an attack when the boss is about to go downtime and we don't have enough time to cast, used to dump mana when we're at the end but we don't have time to get our finisher combo in). So, yes, your basic rotation and plan is the same, if you want to play at a higher level then you have a lot of ways to eke out more dps by using these situational stuff.

Basically, you start with your 'Easy to learn' parts of your kit, and then you start getting the 'hard to master' parts down the road. Which is exactly what a good learning curve should be.

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Originally Posted by Gruntler

Bear in mind, he's dismissing the value of vercure in raids (boss downtime to set up a dualcast, this is part of our skillcap kit), dismissing the value of enchanted riposte (used to balance mana to guarantee proc going into a melee phase, used for movement when swiftcast is down, used to sneak in an attack when the boss is about to go downtime and we don't have enough time to cast, used to dump mana when we're at the end but we don't have time to get our finisher combo in). So, yes, your basic rotation and plan is the same, if you want to play at a higher level then you have a lot of ways to eke out more dps by using these situational stuff.

Basically, you start with your 'Easy to learn' parts of your kit, and then you start getting the 'hard to master' parts down the road. Which is exactly what a good learning curve should be.

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Ah...I never considered some of the tricks your suggesting for Enchanted Riposte. I need to keep them in mind.

Balance discord has a good guide linked for Red Mage.
http://rdm.akhmorning.com/guide/

It's hard to call Rdm Jack of all trades when they came tank. Inst

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Originally Posted by RydiaFey

It's hard to call Rdm Jack of all trades when they came tank. Inst

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Everyone can tank, just not very well.

Oops didn't mean to post that. Anyways what I was trying to say is that Rdm has the black and white magic down, martial skills are pretty good, but they lack any real tank abilities.

I know they are diff games, but in 11 they could tank to an extent, and were esp good at SELF-enhancing buffs, making them able to absorb a limited amount of hits here and there.

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Originally Posted by RydiaFey

Oops didn't mean to post that. Anyways what I was trying to say is that Rdm has the black and white magic down, martial skills are pretty good, but they lack any real tank abilities.

I know they are diff games, but in 11 they could tank to an extent, and were esp good at SELF-enhancing buffs, making them able to absorb a limited amount of hits here and there.

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They can't heal either. Vercure doesn't count. A true RDM would be able to slot in to replace a healer in 5 DPS/1 healer comps (4 DPS + RDM + 1 Healer). Doesn't anyone else find it gross having 2 dedicated healers in parties that have a Red Mage? That should never happen.

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Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty

They can't heal either. Vercure doesn't count. A true RDM would be able to slot in to replace a healer in 5 DPS/1 healer comps (4 DPS + RDM + 1 Healer). Doesn't anyone else find it gross having 2 dedicated healers in parties that have a Red Mage? That should never happen.

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No, because there's plenty of FFs where a RDM is not a good healer replacement (FF5, for example) and instead rely on using double-cast.

Like FF14's does.

Last thing I want to be doing as a RDM is supplimenting healing; if I wanted to do that I'd have gone green.

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Originally Posted by Maero

Balance discord has a good guide linked for Red Mage.
http://rdm.akhmorning.com/guide/

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Thank you for the shout out. We'll be working on further additions and improvements especially for more beginner materials, however, the majority for 80 play is present and accounted for!

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Originally Posted by Gruntler

No, because there's plenty of FFs where a RDM is not a good healer replacement (FF5, for example) and instead rely on using double-cast.

Like FF14's does.

Last thing I want to be doing as a RDM is supplimenting healing; if I wanted to do that I'd have gone green.

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RDM was never going to be your only healer. Not sure why you're putting words in my mouth. There is no accurate depiction of red mage in which multiple full-time healers are needed and the RDM's only role is to be a shittier black mage. That flies completely in the face of what red mage even is.

Furthermore, just because *you* do not want to play a true Red Mage doesn't change what red mage is and should be. A Red Mage would and should make 2 healer comps pointless assuming the RDM player is skilled enough to fill the role of a versatile caster/healer/melee attacker adequately. The fact that this game has chosen not to create a true red mage is a disgrace.

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Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty

They can't heal either. Vercure doesn't count. A true RDM would be able to slot in to replace a healer in 5 DPS/1 healer comps (4 DPS + RDM + 1 Healer). Doesn't anyone else find it gross having 2 dedicated healers in parties that have a Red Mage? That should never happen.

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As far as I know, most groups that go for a solo-heal challenge take a RDM to act as a pseudo-second healer.

Besides which, I don't find it gross. This is Final Fantasy XIV's Red Mage, and I enjoy it quite a bit.

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Originally Posted by Nemekh

Thank you for the shout out. We'll be working on further additions and improvements especially for more beginner materials, however, the majority for 80 play is present and accounted for!

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Your welcome, your work you have done for the community is worth a shout out :)

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Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty

You shouldn't have to switch jobs. Why is Red Mage the only job in the game that has to deal with people telling them they "should" switch or calling them "training wheels"? That is such a BS mentality and I refuse to accept being kept down just because some people have this warped perception of my favorite job.

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I agree. Heaven forfend you raid with a job you like.

Stormblood i wanted to raid on my main of 4 or so years which was blm and was asked to go as Nin.
This expansion i switched to DNC as a main but am doing Savage on Red Mage.

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Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty

They can't heal either. Vercure doesn't count. A true RDM would be able to slot in to replace a healer in 5 DPS/1 healer comps (4 DPS + RDM + 1 Healer). Doesn't anyone else find it gross having 2 dedicated healers in parties that have a Red Mage? That should never happen.

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They should've given Blu the ability to pick from a large list of abilities or a more simplified "tank/healer/Dps ability set" to allow them to fill in for any role.

Then designed Rdm around being all three roles at once, but not specializing in any of them.

Then allow those two classes to party up with a broader amount of classes. Allowing more "hybrid" party comps to play with and avoid the 2 healer+rdm setup you were talking about.