Make FFXIV more like FFXI and less like WoW

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

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It would suit a larger audience because people would be able to choose the direction they take in forms of progression. It's common sense, there is a player base for different types of content so the game would appeal to a broader community.

Your claiming more than I said with your post by saying "I want so the majority must want" putting words in my mouth when all I said was the game would appeal to more players because people will have more options.

As long as there is always a portion of the community that wants the kind of content discussed in forums like this there will always be ways to accommodate those players, thus in return making the game appeal to a larger audience.

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Originally Posted by JMadFour

why not, instead of saying "Make XIV like XI is", just go play XI..?

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I checked back with FFXI actually recently. The last expansion change the game: uncapping fights (like how ARR low lvl dungeons are lvl synched, but not anymore), raising the cap all the way to 90, and giving tons of exp; killing 6 man lvl parties. They tried to make the game easier, and more "modern". Seems Abyssea basically killed XI, and can be seen by the fall of players after the release of the expansion:

http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-2.png

No data point for 2010 (which was it's release date), but the year before had 500k players, half a year later it fell to 350k.

Also the devs said it broke the game:

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"It became something a little different than what longtime FFXI players were used to. On the one hand, it was great that people enjoyed it, but there is also the loss of game balance to consider. Now we are going back into existing content to re-establish some balance."

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http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/story.htm...16&storypage=1

Haven't played since so I don't know if it recovered or not. However from ZAM comments it seems it's kinda dead.

So those people don't even have a game to go back to. Interestingly it spawned "pre-Abyssea" private servers though which seem popular.

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Originally Posted by Vandark

It would suit a larger audience because people would be able to choose the direction they take in forms of progression. It's common sense, there is a player base for different types of content so the game would appeal to a broader community.

Your claiming more than I said with your post by saying "I want so the majority must want" putting words in my mouth when all I said was the game would appeal to more players because people will have more options.

As long as there is always a portion of the community that wants the kind of content discussed in forums like this there will always be ways to accommodate those players, thus in return making the game appeal to a larger audience.

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You avoided the meat of my post. Whilst nitpicking. More stuff is coming! They cant make content magically appear because you make bold factless claims based on your own opinions. Do you know what they have planned for 2.4? 2.5? 2.6? etc? Chances are they are working on 2.4 and onwards from a cenceptual point already (how things work in MMO design world, you plan and design upto 1 year ahead).

Lets theorize shall we? Ok, they decide to do the things you say they must do. How long do you think it would take before it is implemented into the system?

Trying to please everyone does.not.work. Your team is split doing too many differnt things which waters down everything for everyone. Those who enjoy CT have to wait till 2.3 for the continuation, those who enjoy coil have to wait till 2.2 for it to be expanded upon. Yet youre asking for even more? so 2.2 coil, 2,3, CT. 2.4 whatever you want for this imaginary crowd that will suddenly appear from nowhere. SOE tried that with SWG, tried changing it to appeal to a wider audience, look how well that did after the NGE. Core base, as has been proven time and time again, are your solid playerbase, those are the ones you try to keep happy. Not by suddenly reversing the direction to a possible new crowd of gamers that, as shown in the past, does not appear.

WoW was a success because it mainstreamed the genre and made it more accessable than what was available, not less. Only played Vanilla, but in comparison to EQ, SWG, EQ2 for the first year. It eased players into the world with its low learning curve and accessiblilty, Albeit I enjoy steep learning curves, this doesnt have it, neither do I ask, nay demand that it should have.

Not all Final Fantasy games appeal to everyone, I only enjoyed upto FF7, so I dont play the others. I dont go around demanding that all should be the same as the ones I liked. I just dont play them.

But, FFXIV is it's own game, different to what came before, as with every other Final Fantasy game. And those who like the style and direction will continue to play.

I'm enjoying the game and with tidbits of information already given for future updates, happy with the direction it is going. If that ever changes, instead of demanding things I'll just move on and find something which does appeal instead. Fallen Earth for example, was with that from friends and family alpha, all the way till they sold out to G2 and the the direction which I'd enjoyed prior totally turned around and lost focus and lost confidence, so I left and moved to something else that I felt I could enjoy instead,

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

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I wouldn't even care if they added cool stuff from XI half a year or more down the road, if they ever added it I would defiantly play that content and there is an audience for it other wise topics like this wouldn't even exist.

Everything seems weird.

You make money by gimping yourself Spirit Binding gear. What kind of backwards game play is that?

Crafting- Best way to make money is to make items to level up other players crafts. Crafting is so easy what happens when everyone gets it done?

So backwards! It doesn't make sense!

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Originally Posted by Vandark

The point is this game is too empty, the game shouldn't need have restrictions on everything

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Then the concept of pacing is lost on you. It's the same reason WoW had daily lockouts on heroics, weekly lockouts on raids and why FFXIV has the myth tome caps as well as weekly lockouts for coil and loot lockouts for CT. In case you feel like mentioning FFXI, it is also the reason why you had limitations on stuff like dynamis currency (since progression with a relic was entirely dependent on how much currency was in circulation and that was limited even more by the dynamis lockout), limbus currency (because of reqs for limbus), NMs had stupidly low drop rates and so on. The intent has always been using it as a pacing mechanism. Speaking for myself, I found WoW's pacing mechanisms a LOT more tolerable than most of what FFXI tried.

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Originally Posted by Vandark

I wouldn't even care if they added cool stuff from XI half a year or more down the road, if they ever added it I would defiantly play that content and there is an audience for it other wise topics like this wouldn't even exist.

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These topics keep popping up due to people's inability to let go of FFXI and whatever strange desire they have to be different from WoW. In certain cases, because people suffer from tribalism. In others you have attention-seeking trolls.

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Originally Posted by Vandark

It's all very possible and I don't believe it's unrealistic, dungeons are just instances like everything else and I already said in previous pages if you read them how if done correctly they could work in ARR. Just because ARR is layed out for the dungeon + raiding type progression doesn't mean other kinds of progression can't be introduced into the same game, just because you lack creativity doesn't make it an unrealistic expectation at all.

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Instead of nit picking posts, you really should just take them as it is. I don't believe people want to neglect ideas from FFXI because it is FFXI, there are good ideas that can come from it. However, a lot that people suggest are things to change the foundation of the game, which will never happen, especially with the success track this game is currently holding. SE has absolutely no obligation to please the FFXI crowd, and anything they do should be considered a luxury. Even during development of 1.xx with Tanaka, he said himself he wanted FFXIV to be different from FFXI to the point that you preferred one or the other. Hell, they even offered a subscription model that discounted both FFXI/FFXIV if you had both activated. As you know, 1.xx failed, however, the idea of preference didn't change. People who enjoy the Everquest, older style of game still have FFXI to play and it is still pumping content. Or you can go on the modern, WoW-like concept and play ARR. Don't pretend SE owes anything to the FFXI community through FFXIV, because you are dead wrong there.

I know this may sound crazy, but do you believe that people may actually like a vertical progressive game that is done through dungeon and raiding? Updating itself every few months? SE just within 2.0 and 2.1 has offered a ton of ways to progress your character and their job. Dungeons, raid, trial fights, treasure hunting, dailies. I actually believe SE has given more to this game in a short period of time than I believed they would. Way I see it, I think there is quite a variety of content in this game, it is simply variety you do not like.

You are free to nitpick and take apart my sentences if you like and twist them around to work in your favor, seems to be a common thing you are doing in this thread. Just know there is a difference between constructive criticism and destructive criticism.

Actually this game could use a lot of improvements that WoW has, to name a few:

1) Being able to melee moving enemies would be nice

2) Token based loot system instead of poorly thought out chests with too many items in them

3) Quest tracker that lets you display the quests you choose, and display more than 5. Seriously, we get 6 daily quests a day but can only track 5? Who let this happen? Pathetic

4) Better UI scalability

5) Display of stats as percentages instead of ratings. What does 500 parry rating really mean? We can find the formulas, but why should we have to?

6) Focus target not disappearing upon death/zone change/etc

7) Better floating text options, its been like 4+ months and we still can't turn off the damage of others? Why?

8) Better cooldown display, when a long CD ability is almost off CD, it looks like it is off CD, just put number display on the bar!



Just some of the few things WoW did right that XIV forgot to copy to our detriment.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

I know this may sound crazy, but do you believe that people may actually like a vertical progressive game that is done through dungeon and raiding? Updating itself every few months?

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when i check the Forums and reading the stuff People write in Linkshell, they are sick of the Elitism in this game already. This is the proof that Ilevel also known as Gearscore create this Kind of Community this is exactly the reason why everyone always cares about hisself when you think farther then to the door which is closed.

Ist not the MMO community they said "hey lets not be helpfull" its the way MMO's turned in, here is a short example outside of XI.

WoW Classic the People builded up a Raid for the first raids and Did it as often as they could do and no1 complained when someone hasnt the best Gear, no1 cared if they had Green Gear and Weapons, no1 where asking for Blue or Violet Equipment and WoW had a stable Community and also People helped People. After releasing the expansions and adding the first stage of Gearscores it turned into this elitism Community. When you log into WoW now with MoP you will see the same Community like we have in XIV now there is not even any difference anymore.

When ARR came out some of the legacys had already some Darklight Pieces, all they did was farming the last Pieces they were missing, and worked towords they first relic and found out how to Speed run things, with the beginning of easy obtainable Gear the requirements to join such a Group got higher to join after the first week "Full Darklight only" after the 3 Week "only with Relic" and after 4 Weeks "only with Relic+1 + DL"

If it is the way that People want (which doesnt seems so) then Keep up with vertical Progression and Ilevel System

ps.: when you going to check EQN and the roundtable its not anymore the minority that wishes some more "harder" and "Long Lasting" aspcets back to the current MMO's sure no1 knows how much People clicked there but i think its not that less because EQN isnt unknown and had already alot interviews on certain Game sites.

Just my 2 Cents