Yoshi P to Mr.Happy "Heal DPS is not mandatory and no expectation for Healer to DPS!"

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Originally Posted by TamurilRains

And here we go "it depends on the content" thanks so much for saying that! So now we have established that a healer DPSing is only circumstantial, what if said content is too much for the healer to cleric stance swap and they feel more comfortable healing? Seriously folks, this whole thing can be easily fixed. Make your own group and don't use the DF if you're going to be so picky about how others play!

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They are removing the requirement to have cleric stance active to be able to DPS, you will be able to do DPS and heal with no problems come storm blood, they are making quality of life changes so people CAN be more comfortable.
That being said in any circumstance trying it is the only way to actually get comfortable and if you resign yourself to never trying you are doing the other people you are playing with a diservice by not trying to give all you can.

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Originally Posted by kattzkitti

Just ugh.

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If you have a job to 60, I expect you to have at least a rudimentary understanding of it, yes.

I don't main healing jobs personally, but when I switch to healer I become - you guessed it - a healer!

You seem to be conflating your opinion with gospel truth with such statements as, "Anyone who advocates healer dps being mandatory is no healer, period."

I've said it at least 6724 times - I don't consider DPS on healer to be mandatory. I consider using more than half of your ass in a group activity to be mandatory. If you are in a dungeon and doing nothing between heals you are playing sub-optimally, "period."

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Originally Posted by TamurilRains

And here we go "it depends on the content" thanks so much for saying that! So now we have established that a healer DPSing is only circumstantial, what if said content is too much for the healer to cleric stance swap and they feel more comfortable healing? Seriously folks, this whole thing can be easily fixed. Make your own group and don't use the DF if you're going to be so picky about how others play!

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Well, depends on content means I cut healers a lot of slack in content I haven't personally healed in because I don't have a basis for true judgement and I cut them 0 slack in content that I have healed in. So far the content that I've personally healed in all had room for dps, even when I get utterly terrible dps or tanks.

More to the point, why is it that I have to be the one to make a group? Make your own sloggy pos group if that's the experience you are after.

Healing not dpsing is like tank not using maim combo.

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Originally Posted by TamurilRains

And here we go "it depends on the content" thanks so much for saying that! So now we have established that a healer DPSing is only circumstantial, what if said content is too much for the healer to cleric stance swap and they feel more comfortable healing? Seriously folks, this whole thing can be easily fixed. Make your own group and don't use the DF if you're going to be so picky about how others play!

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Again, like I how I replied to Chukkaque:

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Originally Posted by Yahallo

So what you are telling me is, they can't bring me down for pulling EVERYTHING, kitchen sink included, as a tank and make it more difficult for the healer to keep me alive as I will be taking more damage, as that is how I like to play as a tank. Like by that logic, if we can't complain about healers not doing DPS, they can't complain when a tank just pulls everything and tanks it all at once and forces the healer to maintain a constant healing up time to keep the tank alive, and that if they don't like it they should form their own party.

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If healers can choose to not DPS as that is the play style they legitimately enjoy; I can, as a tank, choose to pull everything as that is the play style I legitimately enjoy right? I am doing my job by tanking things and maintaining aggro.

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Originally Posted by Arkdra

Well, depends on content means I cut healers a lot of slack in content I haven't personally healed in because I don't have a basis for true judgement and I cut them 0 slack in content that I have healed in. So far the content that I've personally healed in all had room for dps, even when I get utterly terrible dps or tanks.

More to the point, why is it that I have to be the one to make a group? Make your own sloggy pos group if that's the experience you are after.

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Because I don't mind playing with impatient people like you, or people who take their time. However you seem to care so much about how others play as if your very life depends on it, if you don't like it then don't gamble? The tool is there to fix your problem, not my fault if you insist on not using it and still try to force your style onto others.

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Originally Posted by missybee

Moreover, the argument can go both ways. Want to have your own long expert roulette filled with people playing sub-optimally? Form your own party.

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Except it doesn't. When you hit the queue up button in Duty Finder without a full premade group, you implicitly agree to the condition that you accept randoms and their playstyles into your duty. Period.

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Originally Posted by Yahallo

Except it is a rather common strategy to pull everything and then AoE them to oblivion to speed up runs. I am playing the game for what it is. Even right now in dungeons, I do mass pulls. Why? Because I legitimately enjoy it, it's my preferred play style as a tank, and it is more efficient. With the former two reasons being the main argument for Healers only healing. There's no difference other than I have the added reason of wanting to be efficient.

My comment was to show how easy it is to reverse the logic behind so many of these Healers only heal arguments.

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Context and intent. Learn what these are, and then go back and re-read your post.

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Originally Posted by Chukkaque

If you don't like randoms in DF, form your own party.

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The reverse can also be said: IF you don't like randoms expecting more out of you in DF, form your own party

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Originally Posted by TamurilRains

Let me put it to you this way, if DPS players were even capable of healing in a small way, would they be expected to heal others as well as deal damage? I highly doubt it.

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This shows how ignorant you are. If the heals or utilities come at no dps loss for them, yes they are indeed expected to use it. Dps using second wind can be the difference between 1 heal vs 0 heal needed. To expand further, blm using apoc on tanks, smn using virus when sch's is on cd, mnk using mantra, nin using goad/shade/smoke. These utilities don't really belong to their "core" role (dealing damage), but that's one place where the difference between good players and average/bad players can be found.

I'm sure if you ask Yoshi if nin are expected to help tanks with aggro control so they don't have to use tank stance, he'd also say no lol. I don't really care what he thinks we should do, I care about what we can do, and that's where I'll base my expectations on.

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Originally Posted by kattzkitti

you implicitly agree to the condition that you accept randoms and their playstyles into your duty. Period.

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So you are failing to see that can go both ways?