Dawntrail's mediatour dungeon was already cleared without healers.

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Originally Posted by OliviaLugria

It needs a cool name though

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Borders without doctors.

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Originally Posted by Sayo_

Borders without doctors.

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Hahaha

I was just gonna call it "healer-less"

But have a discord, petition, and an excel sheet to track content you've don't without the green dps. Maybe upgrade it into a website that can leach off another tracking site to see clear times, hps, etc

I'm down for a strike. SGE and WHM are the only two that are looking any bit fun and I've been abstaining from AST and SCH since SB. I can just play DNC like I have since the ShB healer changes.

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Originally Posted by Rehayem

First time I hear about that one and now I'm curious. What happened in GW1 that warranted a healer strike?

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It was constant repeated misunderstanding from other professions (jobs), blaming Monks (GW1 healers) for their own shortcomings - taking avoidable damage, not realising that Monks had mana/cooldowns, couldn't be in 2 places at once, etc. The strike lasted for weeks. There was a mission (dungeon) that was notoriously difficult even for half-competent players, Thunderhead Keep. A lot of Monks banded together to do full healer runs of the place. It was great fun. (Monks had several ways to play: Heal, Protection, Holy [dps], or a mix) not to mention cross-class...

When not doing that mission, Monks would just hang around the mission's town dancing/emoting, refusing to join parties.

There might be more to it than I can remember without looking it up, which I might just do... and I have a link which has more details here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/...5_all/ec4315j/

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Originally Posted by OliviaLugria

If you have a party of 4, can you do roulettes on any job choice?

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Yeah, I've done it several times the past, 1 heal 3 dps, popped roulettes. Pretty certain I've also done 1 tank 1 heal 6 dps 8-player roulettes (not Alliance, that'd need 24 premades!)

Edit: not 100% on the actual bonus from the roulette, but we were able to queue for it without a tank!

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Originally Posted by Pandurah

It was constant repeated misunderstanding from other professions (jobs), blaming Monks (GW1 healers) for their own shortcomings - taking avoidable damage, not realising that Monks had mana/cooldowns, couldn't be in 2 places at once, etc. The strike lasted for weeks. There was a mission (dungeon) that was notoriously difficult even for half-competent players, Thunderhead Keep. A lot of Monks banded together to do full healer runs of the place. It was great fun. (Monks had several ways to play: Heal, Protection, Holy [dps]) not to mention cross-class...

When not doing that mission, Monks would just hang around the mission's town dancing/emoting, refusing to join parties.

There might be more to it than I can remember without looking it up, which I might just do... and I have a link which has more details here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/...5_all/ec4315j/


Yeah, I've done it several times the past, 1 heal 3 dps, popped roulettes. Pretty certain I've also done 1 tank 1 heal 6 dps 8-player roulettes (not Alliance, that'd need 24 premades!)

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I'm always down for full healer runs of dungeons and trials. The Full healer runs of the EW raids was the most fun I had with those raids. Dealing with tank busters as healers is funny, just stacking many many shields.

As a tank main I'm absolutely on your side my healer bros' and sis'. This is just not funny anymore. Are we really just the scapegoats so dd's can have fun?

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Originally Posted by LynxDubh

I'm always down for full healer runs of dungeons and trials. The Full healer runs of the EW raids was the most fun I had with those raids. Dealing with tank busters as healers is funny, just stacking many many shields.

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Same! It'd make things a bit more interesting, a bit more fun... taking 3 dps into expert can be a fun time! My friends list is pretty empty these days, though, has been for many months...

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Originally Posted by Enjuden

You can't expect dungeons to actually be difficult when they never have been outside of one instance, yes?

LCDs can't be bothered to hit cooldowns so healing will be harder. Because that's who we should clearly balance toward :) /s

If you don't play content higher than regular dungeons/story, then you're not allowed to have fun in any role. That's just how the game always has been. Again, they cried about not being able to clear Vishap/Shinryu when it was current, so how do you expect them to do harder dungeons, or having content that requires a pulse, let alone a semblance of thought?

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I mean they were never difficult but you used to not be able to do them without healers

I did just check, you don't get the adventurer in need bonus, but you do get the regular daily bonus, so it's totally possible to not run healers in roulette content... but you'll probably have to have at least 1 for trials/normal raid and probably 3 for alliance

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

I mean they were never difficult but you used to not be able to do them without healers

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Nah, warrior/paladin could do that back in Heavensward if they really wanted to. Just DPS was harder to play then, so it was easier to just have healers queue into it, and paladin dps was abysmal if they ever had to clemency regularly. 2/1/2 pulls would be the thing back then.

I'm all for the healer strike, I'm not sure what else can be done aside from making it as annoying as humanly possible for all content to be cleared and force a response with how glacial/tone deaf dev reactions has been for expansions now.

If you make savage unable to be done in PF since all that's left are people who can't heal, and the ones who can are unaware/in statics, then you'll force a response.

and we haven't gotten dungeon hard modes since stormblood. they've cut down the amount of content in each expansion to less than half. less than half the capstone dungeons, no hard modes dungeons... etc.

and then they took away MOST of the healer job identity when shb released "to prepare for a new healing class"

sage released, they stripped more healer job identity, and nerfed combat design to make healers less needed.

and now they're repeating it ad nauseum, because they think the healer shortage is because healing is "too hard" and not because its boring.

i don't think the devs actually read the EN forums, but uh. people don't enjoy playing healer classes because they're BORING.

there's nothing to do. stripping all complexity makes them more boring. making everyone not need a healer makes playing a healer boring.

they need to incentivize healers. by 1) making healing actually engaging, and 2) actually making rewards for healing be at par with what tanks currently have (the mounts and titles for completing a specific number of high end duties as tank should have healer equivalents tbh)

I'm all for a healer strike. While I do think WHM & SGE have taken steps in the right direction, it's still not enough as non-healer sustain in DT has gotten stronger overall. Non-Healer Jobs need to have their sustain and mitigation abilities nerfed so that Healers can heal more.

and yeah, i'm up for a healer strike. might as well. CBU3 thinks my main role isn't neccisary? then i guess i'll just main bard or something. i'd even suggest (jokingly) not playing as rez mage or summoner. make them hurt for people who can rez. make them beg. make them finally have to use phoenix down, and struggle because its a unique item.

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

I mean they were never difficult but you used to not be able to do them without healers

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Some were harder than others to clear, but I can't think of any dungeons that were impossible to clear without a healer. Maybe Wanderer's Palace HM? I can't remember if the last boss's Doom mechanic was unavoidable or not. However, the older the dungeon, the more difficult to clear it without a healer due to abilities that are available.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

Sure, I'll participate in a healer strike, but like, it needs to actually become a thing.

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The immediate aftermath will be a rise in Duty Support sessions because players aren't going to wait forever to do a normal dungeon.

Up-and-coming healers who do not look at social media on a daily basis will be thankful since their queues will be almost instantaneous.

Players who want the rewards from the daily roulette will shake their heads as they only get those up-and-coming healers who've now reached Stormblood dungeon instances.

A number of statics are going to continue laughing at the plebes.

Good luck!

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Not a fan of this guy in particular but I think its pretty sad we're still here in this same boat again.

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Anyone else find it curious that the complaint is about the ease a level 100 Warrior (aka "Max level for Dawntrail") and three max-level DPS had running through a level 91 dungeon instance?

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Originally Posted by OliviaLugria

If you have a party of 4, can you do roulettes on any job choice?

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yeah. I regularly queue up myself + 3 other people and we just breeze through expert/90/leveling/whatever on any comp
only thing where you'd have trouble would be like... alliance raid.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

A coordinated strike does not require a majority. It only requires the bare minimum that it would take to make an impact on the game overall. A coordinated strike would not even need healers who only do normal mode content to participate, only the healers who do EX and above. So the numbers would not be in the millions. I believe the approximate figure is between 2-5% of subscribers do content EX and above? This would need to be confirmed by someone, but whatever it is, roughly 25-40% of those players would need to strike. It would reduce clears so drastically due to lack of participation, and forcing players who normally do not heal to heal in order to obtain clears in EX, Savage, and Ultimate that the dev team would have no choice but to address the problem in one way or another.

Also, healers can still level them up. By all means utilize and exploit all the systems this game has implemented to facilitate single player playability.

Other than that, I agree completely. I am already going to update my sig and adventurer plate in support of a petition for a strike. I see no reason to wait for 7.2 to get this off the ground. Start now, go hard, and be unwavering.

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A #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE? Count me in. I will still Lvl up SCH, but no dungeon besides Trusts. I'll have SMN for the Trials, as well as Pictomancer.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

Anyone else find it curious that the complaint is about the ease a level 100 Warrior (aka "Max level for Dawntrail") and three max-level DPS had running through a level 91 dungeon instance?

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Listen just because the devs forgot what that symbol means doesn't mean you should.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...94caa647fd7cc&

I'm thinking the 'media tour' being here and there's still no actual hype about the expansion, is the real troubling thing.

I'd suggest starting a new thread with "#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE" as the thread title to better collect information about this, maybe include a discord in the future, garner more support and more attention. Naturally, you also want to move it to other places. Reddit, make daily #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE posts on Twitter, etc.

I'll make the thread myself, but I feel it'd be more apt for Gemina to start it since it's her hashtag. If you don't want to, though, I'll do it.

At this point the devs may as well just give healers 4-5 healing abilities and the rest be dps abilities. Just go all in and make green support rather than healer.

When game designers listen to loud streamers and clowns who follow them instead of the people that work on their team, with years of experience.

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Originally Posted by GoatOfWar

When game designers listen to loud streamers and clowns who follow them instead of the people that work on their team, with years of experience.

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This. It's obvious they ride the streamers and that's whom they really listen to; and there's plenty of evidence that's partly why ffxiv's in the situation it's in today. "Give me more ultimates per expansion and make warrior not be worthless." Square enix got some issues when it comes to disecting feedback.

One journalist asked Yoshida if he's willing to change the content formula to make the game less stale. He gave the same answer he's given for the last decade, that there's no plans to change things any time soon and it's easier for the developers this way. My sinking heart already reached rock bottom a long time ago. Streamlined formulaic Yoshida style go brrrr

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Originally Posted by Rekh

This. It's obvious they ride the streamers and that's whom they really listen to; and there's plenty of evidence that's partly why ffxiv's in the situation it's in today. "Give me more ultimates per expansion and make warrior not be worthless." Square enix got some issues when it comes to disecting feedback.

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''Not worthless'' when they turned it into the best job in the entire game with the best version of every single cooldown in its role and not be taxed on anything.
Warrior is overpowered. Get this idea out of your head that we're still in the first tier. It's been clearing ultimates without healers and still was receiving buffs just because it did 4% less dps.
Now it's the default pick for every form of content. It's the single most problematic job in the entire fucking game.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

I'd suggest starting a new thread with "#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE" as the thread title to better collect information about this, maybe include a discord in the future, garner more support and more attention. Naturally, you also want to move it to other places. Reddit, make daily #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE posts on Twitter, etc.

I'll make the thread myself, but I feel it'd be more apt for Gemina to start it since it's her hashtag. If you don't want to, though, I'll do it.

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I'm on it. I'll have it up here in a few minutes. Thank you for the suggestion. :)

Embarrassing design choices.

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Originally Posted by Rekh

I'm just laughing waiting for the 7.2 live letter where he'll go "we apologize we could only work on half the jobs for this patch, the other half will be in 7.3." And let me remind you 7.3 is decemer 2025, but most likely january/february 2026
7.2 itself isn't much closer either, 7.2 is literally 1 full calendar year away from now.

Did they just literally cover their ears for 4 years of endwalker? Why is it only now that the new expansion's going to come out that they're "planning" on making changes?

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Bold to assume they won't just kick the can further down the road when they reveal 7.2. Remember when Yoshida said viera and hrothgar hat compatibility, viera males, and hrothgar females would all be added during Shadowbringers?

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Originally Posted by OliviaLugria

I did just check, you don't get the adventurer in need bonus, but you do get the regular daily bonus, so it's totally possible to not run healers in roulette content... but you'll probably have to have at least 1 for trials/normal raid and probably 3 for alliance

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I have done some healerless normal raid/trial roulette with my FC a few times, it's fun. You need to be lucky though because some duties require healers. For lv90 dungeon/expert roulette (or limited levelling roulette with a high level party) though it's very easy to play healerless, often easier than without.

You're a glutton for punishment if you bought DT, as for Yoshida's comments. He's just stringing you along, a few days ago I saw a PCgamer headline in my news feed that said:
"FF14 director Yoshi-P says 'possibly 98%' of the team are inspired by Elden Ring, but assures players Dawntrail won't be as brutally hard"

To just openly lie like this should tell you something.

The bloated tank/healing kits feel much better suited for encounter design where you are nigh constantly taking moderate to heavy amounts of damage, so why instances of that actually being the case are so uncommon is rather baffling.

Even CDs as long as Temperance often can only cover two hits at most because of how spaced out instances of damage tend to be barring specific mit/heal check mechanics like Harrowing Hell.

People are thinking things are suddenly going to get nasty now that abilities that hadn't been touched in years like Medica II and Succor are getting upgrades but I'll believe when I actually see it.

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Originally Posted by Aluja89

You're a glutton for punishment if you bought DT, as for Yoshida's comments. He's just stringing you along, a few days ago I saw a PCgamer headline in my news feed that said:
"FF14 director Yoshi-P says 'possibly 98%' of the team are inspired by Elden Ring, but assures players Dawntrail won't be as brutally hard"

To just openly lie like this should tell you something.

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So you're claiming that Dawntrail is going to be as hard as Elden Ring?

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

So you're claiming that Dawntrail is going to be as hard as Elden Ring?

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Nope... what Aluja trying to say is "you are fool to believe Dawntrail is going to be as hard as Elden Ring, because CBU3 said so"...

Respectfully, this is rather too soon and a bit silly. Dawntrail isn’t even out yet. You’re comparing the content we have now, to job changes and content that isn’t even out and you haven’t even played, this would be smarter if after DW released and it was the same as now but we have been told content will be harder, more stressful and that we will actually need the extra healing… please remain calm and just wait like 2-3 more weeks. I’m sure half the people in here are the ones who want to Dps more as healer anyway so like… I just don’t get it. I main AST before anyone comes for me

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Originally Posted by Soliz0816

Respectfully, this is rather too soon and a bit silly. Dawntrail isn’t even out yet. You’re comparing the content we have now, to job changes and content that isn’t even out and you haven’t even played, this would be smarter if after DW released and it was the same as now but we have been told content will be harder, more stressful and that we will actually need the extra healing… please remain calm and just wait like 2-3 more weeks. I’m sure half the people in here are the ones who want to Dps more as healer anyway so like… I just don’t get it. I main AST before anyone comes for me

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And then after DT release it's "well you should have said something before release, it's to late now". Just like with the character faces overhaul, or any software really, the best time for feedback is while they are busy working on it.

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Originally Posted by Soliz0816

Respectfully, this is rather too soon and a bit silly. Dawntrail isn’t even out yet. You’re comparing the content we have now, to job changes and content that isn’t even out and you haven’t even played, this would be smarter if after DW released and it was the same as now but we have been told content will be harder, more stressful and that we will actually need the extra healing… please remain calm and just wait like 2-3 more weeks. I’m sure half the people in here are the ones who want to Dps more as healer anyway so like… I just don’t get it. I main AST before anyone comes for me

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>Just wait until skill showcase, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until live letter explanation, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until tooltips release, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until early access, it's not going to be that bad [YOU ARE HERE]

>Just wait until savage balance patch, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until next expansion's skill showcase, it's surely going to be better

>Repeat from start

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Originally Posted by HighlanderClone

>Just wait until skill showcase, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until live letter explanation, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until tooltips release, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until early access, it's not going to be that bad [YOU ARE HERE]

>Just wait until savage balance patch, it's not going to be that bad

>Just wait until next expansion's skill showcase, it's surely going to be better

>Repeat from start

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Reminds me of "wait for stormblood release to see if you should complain about the lillies system." Haha.
Never wait, tell them early and tell them often that they need to change bad design.

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Originally Posted by Rekh

Reminds me of "wait for stormblood release to see if you should complain about the lillies system." Haha.
Never wait, tell them early and tell them often that they need to change bad design.

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The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Complain until the fix it!

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Originally Posted by Oizen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqBWp00XNZs

Not a fan of this guy in particular but I think its pretty sad we're still here in this same boat again.


Guess the healers aren't going to have any engagement outside of ultimate raids again. :rolleyes:

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for dawntrial i wont be bringing any healers in my roulette parties. if we get any of the jobs getting the new broken healers <including me a rpr and bf as a bard> we dont even need 1. last night we did Athena, Endsinger, and Lunar Subtarane without healers. it wasn't easy. but we killed both boses. I solod Durante on WAr in the dungeon after we absolutely bulldozed it. healers are a literal dps loss at this point. and the lack of enrage in dungeons is insanity