Live Letter Thoughts

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Originally Posted by Lauront

The GCBTW in action.

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Remember, the modern MMO fosters a hivemind mentality. The XIV hive is too healthy and there are plenty of workers to defend the base, it's your fault really for suggesting that SE is anything but perfect! :^)

Accurate description here.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...73/942/c29.jpg

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

Accurate description here.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...73/942/c29.jpg

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You're right. The forums are just a dead meme we just can't let go of for some reason. lol

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Originally Posted by Lauront

The GCBTW in action.

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That's your GCBTW moment? Not the fact that they were playing armchair psychologist because they looked at the other person's lodestone and decided to heavily imply they have a psychological issue bcos they have their character maxed? lmao

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

Or worse: AwesomeJr44 may be psychologically addicted to FFXIV, needing the sense of achievement the game is designed to provide.

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Originally Posted by Raoabolic

You're right. The forums are just a dead meme we just can't let go of for some reason. lol

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Well, it practically is just 1 big meme at this point that every thread in some way, shape, or form devolves into.

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Originally Posted by Padudu

That's your GCBTW moment? Not the fact that they were playing armchair psychologist because they looked at the other person's lodestone and decided to heavily imply they have a psychological issue bcos they have their character maxed? lmao

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I somehow missed that one. But not in the least bit surprised!

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Originally Posted by Padudu

That's your GCBTW moment? Not the fact that they were playing armchair psychologist because they looked at the other person's lodestone and decided to heavily imply they have a psychological issue bcos they have their character maxed? lmao

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Honestly, pretty much everything that person says is very GCBTW.

Anyway to move on from the last few pages of nonsensical anime filler. I'm currently trying to speculate whom the mystery reaper lady could be. Its very much leaning towards "this is the human form of Zenos's voidsent, restored" and the community keeps speculating that Zenos made a pact with the voidsent of the 13th Azem shard.

So going off from that, Ive been seeing theories that reaper lady looks vaguely similar to Meteor's 1.0 female counterpart. I wonder if thats the case.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Hmm maybe we should put more fun and engaging battle content in the MSQ to improve the player experience rather than leaning too much into the visual novel sort of gameplay.

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Wasnt it you who created a few threads about how to make the "visual novel" better? With probably countless of hours of thinking and writing about that?
This is not meant to be mean, just curious. For me it makes no sense that seemingly the story part of the MSQ is not that improtant while we have a over 600 pages thread about the story of Endwalker.

Shouldnt there be more of a huge thread about the mechanics and gameplay features of the MSQ then?

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

I honestly have been running into this same problem with a few individuals too. People keep picking something I said, rather than focusing on the main points I share to further the discussion

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Lol I know how this feels all to well.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Anyway to move on from the last few pages of nonsensical anime filler. I'm currently trying to speculate whom the mystery reaper lady could be. Its very much leaning towards "this is the human form of Zenos's voidsent, restored" and the community keeps speculating that Zenos made a pact with the voidsent of the 13th Azem shard.

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Yes very much what me and my wife said - especially as their weapon is the same.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

People keep picking something I said, rather than focusing on the main points I share to further the discussion and its just a non-stop bringing unnecessary attention to it

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People are focusing on what you're saying. You can't say 4 different things, give each point equal weight, and then retroactively label one of them as the 'main point' that deserves all of the attention, and that everyone else must ignore everything else you said. If you're making a bunch of points you don't want people to respond to, don't make said points and people won't respond to them.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Lol I know how this feels all to well.

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Because you and him are very similar in a lot of ways.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

I don't think you can talk about "But thanks for making it about me... " - When you elected to try and play internet psychologist.

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It's all about rules for thee but not for me.

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Originally Posted by Kuroka

Yes very much what me and my wife said - especially as their weapon is the same.

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To be honest, while I'm excited for getting a new NPC into the story, I'm a little sad that it looks like Unukulhai and Cylva arent going to partake into this void adventure since you know.....they were the first people we knew who came from the 13th shard? Even having a whole epilogue void quest story regarding to opening a path to their original world and find a means to save it.

Im jumping to conclusions of course and Im sure they'll be involved somehow but it would most likely be a side quest where it'll be like "oh yeah hey we sorta just delved into the 13th and junk, thought you guys might want to know".

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Originally Posted by Padudu

LMAO this thread is actually a shit show

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Normally is in a thread made by the OP. I'm actually surprised they made a post that had positive points in it. Since a lot that we learned from the LL was a lot of things they've stated more than once they don't like, enjoy or want more of. While using language that is easy to take to imply that they speak for a huge swath of the playerbase. And that the devs better listen to them to them or the game is going to go to hell in a handbasket next Tuesday. That the game's story needs to be the darkest and grittiest stuff out there. And that the content better take you half a day or longer to complete, with new stuff coming soon after they've finished it. Cause that's how offline single player games are, kupo.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

To be honest, while I'm excited for getting a new NPC into the story, I'm a little sad that it looks like Unukulhai and Cylva arent going to partake into this void adventure since you know.....they were the first people we knew who came from the 13th shard? Even having a whole epilogue void quest story regarding to opening a path to their original world and find a means to save it.

Im jumping to conclusions of course and Im sure they'll be involved somehow but it would most likely be a side quest where it'll be like "oh yeah hey we sorta just delved into the 13th and junk, thought you guys might want to know".

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Considering you have to have 1 Physical DPS, 1 Casting DPS, 1 Healer, and 1 Tank leveled along with completing the 4 role quests and Cylva's quest to learn that she's a former denizen of the 13th shard, chances of her and Unukulhai getting anything more than a passing mention are slim at best.

It seems kinda hard to recover from the discourse this thread has taken. I tried, but people prefer to argue and attack each other rather than have a proper discussion on a LL.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Normally is in a thread made by the OP. I'm actually surprised they made a post that had positive points in it.

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Aveyond tends to be a lot more honest than some would like, and there's a certain group of people who like to come into his threads and derail them out of spite. It apparently didn't matter if this thread was positive or not as they showed up to screw up the discussion regardless.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

It seems kinda hard to recover from the discourse this thread has taken. I tried, but people prefer to argue and attack each other rather than have a proper discussion on a LL.

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Maybe because you're one of the people who likes to come into Aveyond's threads and derail them. Your group of derailers succeeded in doing so, but you didn't like where it went so now you suddenly care about the original topic. Everyone can see what you're doing.

I mean this thread was doomed when someone somehow mistook it for the 578th thread about samurai. His threads would probably get derailed less if the language he used made his opinion come off as a strongly worded opinion and not come off as an opinion that's meant to be taken as a fact as they seem to do. That and he doesn't do himself any favors by being hung up on Hamburger eating animation.

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Originally Posted by BaconBits

Considering you have to have 1 Physical DPS, 1 Casting DPS, 1 Healer, and 1 Tank leveled along with completing the 4 role quests and Cylva's quest to learn that she's a former denizen of the 13th shard, chances of her and Unukulhai getting anything more than a passing mention are slim at best.

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Yeah and since you have to go so much out of your way for them, its most likely they wont show up in msq at all. And that sucks, wish this game put some bit of effort to having slight alternate paths for stuff like this because those 2 really feel like they're supposed to be relevant for this kind of thing. 6.1's main story beat was a re-tread of what we did during the Void quests.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

That and he doesn't do himself any favors by being hung up on Hamburger eating animation.

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Well, as dumb as it was, that whole line of conversation was a good time.
Im still laughing about it XD
Guess even if the thread lost its meaning, it was at least entertaining. Something this Forum need is some good humor.

Are we allowed to have humor? Seems like people around here hate that.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Well, as dumb as it was, that whole line of conversation was a good time.
Im still laughing about it XD
Guess even if the thread lost its meaning, it was at least entertaining. Something this Forum need is some good humor.

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Oh for sure, it was part of why I even kept up with that thread in the first place. Let alone occasionally replied to posts inside of it.

Anywho I'm excited for everything and wished so many things weren't till 6.25. I'm surprised they seem to have moved up Island Sanctuary from 6.25 as part one had said we'd be getting it in 6.25 instead. I would have to take another look at the trailer, but I swear the reaper lady didn't have anything unique about her except for her hair and facial features as she looked like any other reaper. I also must have missed a non child Varshaun. Course I also didn't notice a washed up Urianger during the post 5.0 credits cutscene until someone pointed it out in a comment section of a video of someone else going through that part of the MSQ. I do wonder if Haurchefant is keyed as tank and dps for duty support. Though if he's only a dps then that would um explain why he ah had trouble dealing with that post Vault attack.

Nobody likes humor here.
Unless its to insult somebody/something.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Are we allowed to have humor? Seems like people around here hate that.

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No humor allowed. Only dark and gritty. No happy ending, only meaningful sacrifice.

I don't think anyone posting here has an issue with humour so much as the very one sided, samey humour as well as more and more side content being dictated by it.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I don't think anyone posting here has an issue with humour so much as the very one sided, samey humour as well as more and more side content being dictated by it.

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Agreed. There's absolutely nothing wrong with humor or lightheartedness, but it has a time and place, and when it is used outside of that time and place it loses its effectiveness. It's really almost ironic, if you try to be funny all of the time, even in the wrong time and place for it, you're typically one of the least funny people around as people will get sick of your humor very fast.

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Originally Posted by Kazhar

The conclusion comes from reading the text. The Scions officially disbanded and only a few of them seems to be involved in the current story (Estinien and Y'shtola). Whether that'll be permanent remains to be seen, but this is not in any way an objectively incorrect read of the current events.

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But Vel is correct that there's been nothing official saying we would never see X or Y Scion used in the story again. None of them have officially retired in the storyline. They're off on their own pursuits and our paths could cross again as they did with Y'shtola and Estinien and G'raha. I also remember the interview with Krile and Thancred's VAs on it where they did say that those two would have more involved roles in the future. That hasn't come to fruition yet. So just because we haven't seen Thancred now doesn't mean they don't have something percolating, for instance. All Vel was pointing out was the definitive format of the statement was wrong. It wasn't "They appear to be retiring" but that they had and treating it like an absolute fact. Which there is nothing in the storyline or from any official sources to support that idea. I also wouldn't find something like that likely. They can keep someone off on their own pursuits indefinitely and have freedom to bring them back in if they find a place for them in the story. That seems a lot more the type of thing they would want to do, because it keeps their options and flexibility open.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

But Vel is correct that there's been nothing official saying we would never see X or Y Scion used in the story again. None of them have officially retired in the storyline. They're off on their own pursuits and our paths could cross again as they did with Y'shtola and Estinien and G'raha. I also remember the interview with Krile and Thancred's VAs on it where they did say that those two would have more involved roles in the future. That hasn't come to fruition yet. So just because we haven't seen Thancred now doesn't mean they don't have something percolating, for instance. All Vel was pointing out was the definitive format of the statement was wrong. It wasn't "They appear to be retiring" but that they had and treating it like an absolute fact. Which there is nothing in the storyline or from any official sources to support that idea. I also wouldn't find something like that likely. They can keep someone off on their own pursuits indefinitely and have freedom to bring them back in if they find a place for them in the story. That seems a lot more the type of thing they would want to do, because it keeps their options and flexibility open.

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heck we've seen this happen multiple times in previous msq with some of the Scions being out of action. What the story is doing right now is literally nothing new in terms of not having every Scion present for the current story.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

heck we've seen this happen multiple times in previous msq with some of the Scions being out of action. What the story is doing right now is literally nothing new in terms of not having every Scion present for the current story.

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Such as nearly the entirety of Heavenward. We were traveling with our set little party.

Until Shadowbringers, the only time we really had the entire group of Scions around were in patches. And even then, we usually focused on two to three at a time.

At first, I thought they were disbanding as well, but there is line at the end of it spoken by Alphinaud that implies it's a deception.

"We are disbanding the Scions of the Seventh Dawn."
"At least...that is what the story will be."

I still took that and the New Adventure direction to imply that we would get some different people to adventure with. The last thing you would want in a new adventure is for it to not feel new.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Until Shadowbringers, the only time we really had the entire group of Scions around were in patches. And even then, we usually focused on two to three at a time.

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Yeah, but let's be honest: when you can easily predict when you're traveling with Alphinaud, chances are pretty high that, regardless of what you'll be doing, someone is eventually going to be getting an earful of the usual out of place, out of touch speech. It gets very tiresome.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I still took that and the New Adventure direction to imply that we would get some different people to adventure with. The last thing you would want in a new adventure is for it to not feel new.

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It looks like we are now, though. And they laid the groundwork for it narratively to make sense, such as Varshahn joining us. Even Big Varshahn makes sense because IIRC he mentioned some side project he was working on. That is probably his adult simulacrum though it could be something else. I'm sure we'll find out.

I think the dissatisfaction of so many stemmed from the idea that they didn't get all new people immediately but that would have destroyed the narrative. We needed a reason for others to show up.

And as others have said, we're just returning to pattern from before Shadowbringers where we have one or two of our usuals with us at a time.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

All Vel was pointing out was the definitive format of the statement was wrong. It wasn't "They appear to be retiring" but that they had and treating it like an absolute fact. Which there is nothing in the storyline or from any official sources to support that idea.

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But at the same time, they were losing their shit over it and started screaming that they weren't retiring the Scions, which is also wrong. The only objective truth here is we don't know what's their plan, so it's pointless to police other people over their own interpretation of the story, and in my opinion, the complete opposite of what an healthy discussion should be about.
I don't mind if someone say "this is unconfirmed", but this isn't what they were doing. They were being a hypocrite by contradicting aveyond's unproven statements with more unproven statements, which is the reason I'm convinced all this "objectivity police" which happens here is not done in good faith.

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Originally Posted by Kazhar

But at the same time, they were losing their shit over it and started screaming that they weren't retiring the Scions, which is also wrong. The only objective truth here is we don't know what's their plan, so it's pointless to police other people over their own interpretation of the story, and in my opinion, the complete opposite of what an healthy discussion should be about.
I don't mind if someone say "this is unconfirmed", but this isn't what they were doing. They were being a hypocrite by contradicting aveyond's unproven statements with more unproven statements, which is the reason I'm convinced all this "objectivity police" which happens here is not done in good faith.

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Originally Posted by VelKallor

...says who?

Where? Who said this? When? Source?

Nothing I saw in any liveletter or any other announcement even REMOTELY mentioned this...so where did you get that conclusion from? I watched the entire liveletter last night, fully translated, no one said anything like that.

No one.

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Where in that is an unproven statement? I only see a question asking for evidence of a declarative statement made about the retirement of the party.

I also watched the live letter and the official confirmation of retirement of any of the Scions was not mentioned. And you yourself responded to this and said the aveyond's conclusion came from the reading the text. But now you say aveyond's conclusion was unproven? Which is it? You seem to be contradicting yourself here.

They're never getting rid of the Scions. Y'shtola is never going to actually die. This is a fun romp fantasy adventure - the same it has been since ARR. The stakes don't matter, and we're always going to kill god like JRPG's finest.

These characters have no actual agency and exist for our entertainment. Not to act in some neo-Dante's Inferno.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Where in that is an unproven statement? I only see a question asking for evidence of a declarative statement made about the retirement of the party.

I also watched the live letter and the official confirmation of retirement of any of the Scions was not mentioned. And you yourself responded to this and said the aveyond's conclusion came from the reading the text. But now you say aveyond's conclusion was unproven? Which is it? You seem to be contradicting yourself here.

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No, you just seem to be convinced that I'm taking a definite side on the subject when I never did. I think aveyond is allowed to make their own interpretation of the text and assuming that they're retiring the Scions is not an uncorrect read of it, it's just unproven. In the same post you quoted earlier and all the following ones I aknowledged the possibility that it could be wrong.
Only thing I'm against is the stupid outrage over someone not saying "IMO" once again, especially when in this case, this is not even factually incorrect, just unproven for now.

And the hypocritical stuff happened later with VelKallor, not the first post I answered.

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Originally Posted by Kazhar

Only thing I'm against is the stupid outrage over someone not saying "IMO" once again, especially when in this case, this is not even factually incorrect, just unproven for now.

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Aveyond has a habit of making these declarative statements. Which wouldn't be an issue in and of itself so much, but then they (and certain others) make these snipey little passive aggressive comments that this is the viewpoint of those "who care about the game" or "want to see it succeed". You talk about not promoting healthy discussion. Trying to shut down any viewpoint but your own by insulting those who don't share yours isn't really promoting healthy discussion.

We ALL care about the game and want it to succeed or we wouldn't be here. That's why it's important to put our opinions forth as opinions and respect that others may think differently. That is how you promote healthy discussion.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

It looks like we are now, though. And they laid the groundwork for it narratively to make sense, such as Varshahn joining us.

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Yes and there wasn't really doubt in my mind that they would bring new characters in for a new adventure, it just takes time to bring us to the new characters without rushing.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

I'm choosing to highlight this specific part of your post because of how much it stood out to me. This is not a message that I feel does justice to the issues surrounding loss and grief. I expect better care for topics such as these from the story.

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Most of what you say about "forge ahead" doesn't make sense to me, but based on this it seems like one of your biggest problems is with how people experiencing grief and loss simply turn into beasts or get calmed by the scions.

Again, that is just something that happens in Endwalker and people most likely won't turn into beasts under those circumstances in the next expansion. It doesn't necessarily happen in sidequests or future expansions, yet your concerns extend to future expansions.

The story isn't about the grief of all these little people. I'm sure some of them will get support. In fact, when you do the sidequests you find out that some of them do get support from the community, such as the people of Palaka's Stand and the foster parents of the baby. Yet, you come across people who weren't so lucky to get support from others, who are orphans in the MSQ and turn to stealing.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Aveyond has a habit of making these declarative statements. Which wouldn't be an issue in and of itself so much, but then they (and certain others) make these snipey little passive aggressive comments that this is the viewpoint of those "who care about the game" or "want to see it succeed". You talk about not promoting healthy discussion. Trying to shut down any viewpoint but your own by insulting those who don't share yours isn't really promoting healthy discussion.

We ALL care about the game and want it to succeed or we wouldn't be here. That's why it's important to put our opinions forth as opinions and respect that others may think differently. That is how you promote healthy discussion.

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Aveyond has no such habit. What they DO have a habit of is not putting "this is my opinion, I want to make it extra clear you know that" before every sentence they write. It's unreasonable to expect this on a forum, and it most certainly is not the fault of Aveyond for not doing so. As far as I'm concerned, on a forum one should assume that someone is stating their opinion before reading what they posted instead of assuming they're bulldozing in here with what they believe to be objective fact like so many here seem to be wont to do.

It becomes clearer and clearer every day that some here have built up little headcanons and mental images of certain other posters and come out swinging right out the bat with the worst possible interpretations of other's intent when they come to post. Frankly, it's rude and very, very tiring and maybe if you want others to apparently be "nicer" or some such you should be brave and ignite the little spark that initiates the change yourselves.