add an in game parser please!!!

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Originally Posted by Priya

I believe most of the responses since then have been something akin to "please look forward to it."

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I believe there has been a "PS3 limitation" or "hardware limitation" at some point and it sank down in the "one day maybe" abyss

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Originally Posted by Erys

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Going slightly off-topic here, but relevant to the situation here.

Can SE add a parser that goes beyond simply displaying damage and healing. They have metrics for emnity as well, could we have a graph that shows emnity over time and how it compares to others? I tank a lot (or I will be once 4.0 hits most likely, even though I wanna raid as a healer). I want to see how I'm holding emnity over time compared to others, as well as my DPS compared to others.

As far as the parser goes, it's needed. I point blank refuse to use a parser while it could get me banned for simply HAVING one (don't give me all the blah blah about they can't tell, they ban if they catch whiff of you using a parser, I'm not using one while that is the case, not risking it). But at the same time it means I haven't got a freaking clue how to improve (I haven't touched any content since 3.2 came out though, so I'm not sure how S3 stacks up for telling you though). Am I overhealing too much, am I able to do more DPS during healing downtime, or maybe I'm rocking up way too much emnity such that I'm sacrificing DPS in place of emnity.

As i said 10 pages ago i think, dps check is a bad design mentality. But once you implement it into a game you need to provide people with tools to learn/improve/monitor their dps. How else they can pass the dps check.
So im all against dps/engrage check fights in game because of what i said before at page 9 of this thread, but im all for implementing a working parser for everyone since sadly in this game there are dps/enrage check fights.

/peace

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Originally Posted by DarkB

As i said 10 pages ago i think, dps check is a bad design mentality. But once you implement it into a game you need to provide people with tools to learn/improve/monitor their dps. How else they can pass the dps check.
So im all against dps/engrage check fights in game because of what i said before at page 9 of this thread, but im all for implementing a working parser for everyone since sadly in this game there are dps/enrage check fights.

/peace

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There needs to be some kind of enrage, as you could just otherwise go in with three or more healers and outlast everything that does not instantly kill the whole group.

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Originally Posted by DarkB

As i said 10 pages ago i think, dps check is a bad design mentality. But once you implement it into a game you need to provide people with tools to learn/improve/monitor their dps. How else they can pass the dps check.
So im all against dps/engrage check fights in game because of what i said before at page 9 of this thread, but im all for implementing a working parser for everyone since sadly in this game there are dps/enrage check fights.

/peace

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I did not reply to your post in a quote but I directly answered your enrage dilemma pages back. SE caught a bad rep in their first MMO because players refused to set limitations on their own game time, regardless of that nifty "please don't forget your work and family" message when logging in. Pandemonium Warden caused a group of people to fight it for 18 hours straight with no win while incurring some ailments along the way prompting WoW to attack SE in the form of a yahoo article which went viral.

No, please don't.

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Originally Posted by WeekendSoja

I did not reply to your post in a quote but I directly answered your enrage dilemma pages back. SE caught a bad rep in their first MMO because players refused to set limitations on their own game time, regardless of that nifty "please don't forget your work and family" message when logging in. Pandemonium Warden caused a group of people to fight it for 18 hours straight with no win while incurring some ailments along the way prompting WoW to attack SE in the form of a yahoo article which went viral.

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This is the perfect example as to why dps-checks/enrage timers are needed, to avoid situations like these. Not only that, it makes the fights more challenging, fun and faster, with that in mind, dps parser would be quite handy.

I feel like it's time for the age old question for which the anti-parser crowd still has no answer.

Why must dps players not have any responsibilties and be allowed to be as terrible as possible, while healers and tanks get called out for making a single mistake all the time?

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Originally Posted by Mael-bess

This is the perfect example as to why dps-checks/enrage timers are needed, to avoid situations like these.

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I don't see how that avoids anything. If people decide to do something for 18 hours straight no dps/enrage/ or w/e will really change anything.

the game has already dps parsers , Fuast was a dps check , Adds are used as dps checks mostly ( slimes in a3s , same goes for the water ball ) , sephirot with the adds is both dps and heal check.

Midas normal have some dps checks , execution , the dps jail with the add , the cat's hearth

if u fail u wont see who is the "weak" link , and thats working as intended , u just need to ask the whole party to improve without pointing fingers. Something that SE is trying to avoid at all cost.

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

the game has already dps parsers , Fuast was a dps check , Adds are used as dps checks mostly ( slimes in a3s , same goes for the water ball ) , sephirot with the adds is both dps and heal check.

Midas normal have some dps checks , execution , the dps jail with the add , the cat's hearth

if u fail u wont see who is the "weak" link , and thats working as intended , u just need to ask the whole party to improve without pointing fingers. Something that SE is trying to avoid at all cost.

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K drg 1200 mnk 1200 blm 1150 brd 200

Everyone improve please

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

the game has already dps parsers , Fuast was a dps check , Adds are used as dps checks mostly ( slimes in a3s , same goes for the water ball ) , sephirot with the adds is both dps and heal check.

Midas normal have some dps checks , execution , the dps jail with the add , the cat's hearth

if u fail u wont see who is the "weak" link , and thats working as intended , u just need to ask the whole party to improve without pointing fingers. Something that SE is trying to avoid at all cost.

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That's all nice and stuff, but then why are bad tanks and bad healers singled out when they suck ?

Oh right, because they suck. Why should the dps be special snowflakes with no way to tell them they suck ?


Thankfully though, the enmity bar is a preliminary way to see that a dps is horribly bad. Only drgs are sensible cases, but horrible drgs don't use elusive jump usually so the error margin is reduced.

On a general basis though, if you have less enmity than a sch, you suck and you get your scold

I too have never understood why DPS get a free pass compared to Healers and Tanks. Then people wonder why their dps queues are so long compared to them...

As a healer if people die 90% of the time I will get flamed,
As a tank if i lose agro consistently I will again get flamed and told i suck ect
As a DPS? 90% of the time people dont notice and if they do need to be careful what they say because parsers.

Also doesn't take into consideration how easier it is for a bad player to skate by as a DPS compared to a tank or healer.

Can you guys stop using Faust in the wrong way? Him being a dps check has nothing to do with dps meter. He doesn't let you go depending on your dps, you kill him in the right time to avoid a one-shot mechanic. So at no point is he measuring your dps output, he is just programmed to get stronger and stronger the longer he is alive. So you either kill him asap, or you don't. A person putting out their max dps on a static boss may not put out the same amount on any other part, where they have to move or dodge things or do certain other mechanics. So Faust is the poorest example you can give.

Unless it is a critical lack of dps (read: certain afk behavior), as long as they don't make you wipe, you are all good to go. Nothing makes me cringe more than recruitment messages that read; 'low dps will be kicked'. Note this is a farm group, and while I understand that you want it to work out, a guy sitting on 1200 can still make you wipe or getting himself killed because he refuses to move to avoid damage. I once had a group with 2 monks and a dragoon (M4 it was) and they were whoring for dps so bad that we wiped every single time. Not because they had low dps, au contraire, they just refused to move for certain mechanics. Once after 3 wipes we had to dimiss a bard because he just couldn't play and we couldn't clear the last boss in the dungeon. And many a time did I dimiss another healer or tank if they didn't do their job. So it is up to you guys to make the game work, not a meter.

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

On a general basis though, if you have less enmity than a sch, you suck and you get your scold

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It is not uncommon for me to have #1 hate in Expert Roulette as a SCH (yes above the tank). Them SCH Deeps!

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Only drgs are sensible cases, but horrible drgs don't use elusive jump usually so the error margin is reduced.

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Am I misunderstanding this, or are you saying only DRGs DPS is not represented properly by the enmity bar? Also SMN (quelling + pet), BLM (quelling), BRD (quelling), MCH (quelling?), DRG (elusive jump), NIN (smoke screen, shadewalker), WHM (shroud), AST (stances), SCH (pet)

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Originally Posted by Synrin

Unless it is a critical lack of dps (read: certain afk behavior), as long as they don't make you wipe, you are all good to go. Nothing makes me cringe more than recruitment messages that read; 'low dps will be kicked'. Note this is a farm group, and while I understand that you want it to work out, a guy sitting on 1200 can still make you wipe or getting himself killed because he refuses to move to avoid damage. I once had a group with 2 monks and a dragoon (M4 it was) and they were whoring for dps so bad that we wiped every single time. Not because they had low dps, au contraire, they just refused to move for certain mechanics. Once after 3 wipes we had to dimiss a bard because he just couldn't play and we couldn't clear the last boss in the dungeon. And many a time did I dimiss another healer or tank if they didn't do their job. So it is up to you guys to make the game work, not a meter.

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I don't think anyone suggests that having high DPS means you can ignore mechanics. We already can see if someone is ignoring mechanics, we don't already see if they are doing DPS. It's not an either/or, we want both.

Dps checks and parsers go hand in hand! Parsers tell you if the team is putting out enough damage to pass that wall. Anyone can push 1+2+3 but an optimized rotation flutters around like Muhammad Ali, 1+2+alt9+3+5+ctrl7+6+8+alt6+however else you want to put it. Back on point, parsers are meant to enhance gameplay like others have said in previous posts. The guy that does 1200 and wipes the party is like the guy who does 225 and also wipes the party. Thing is, 1200 is doing respectable dps that could potentially get the group past the dps check where as the 225 guy jumped into the party head down, butt up...and we all know how that ends lol. Someone's going to get screwed...and it's the seven others wondering who's Emu.

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

the game has already dps parsers , Fuast was a dps check , Adds are used as dps checks mostly ( slimes in a3s , same goes for the water ball ) , sephirot with the adds is both dps and heal check.

Midas normal have some dps checks , execution , the dps jail with the add , the cat's hearth

if u fail u wont see who is the "weak" link , and thats working as intended , u just need to ask the whole party to improve without pointing fingers. Something that SE is trying to avoid at all cost.

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This really only works if everyone is at a similar level. Doesn't work too well when everyone but one person is pulling their weight. The three other DPS may only have relatively marginal improvements that they can do while that one dps can have an entire world worth of improvement. Diminishing returns, it's a thing. Sometimes you have to point fingers, if someone isn't pulling their weight others shouldn't be pulling it for them.

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

That's all nice and stuff, but then why are bad tanks and bad healers singled out when they suck ?

Oh right, because they suck. Why should the dps be special snowflakes with no way to tell them they suck ?


Thankfully though, the enmity bar is a preliminary way to see that a dps is horribly bad. Only drgs are sensible cases, but horrible drgs don't use elusive jump usually so the error margin is reduced.

On a general basis though, if you have less enmity than a sch, you suck and you get your scold

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*Cough*Shadewalker&Smokescreen*Cough&

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

It is not uncommon for me to have #1 hate in Expert Roulette as a SCH (yes above the tank). Them SCH Deeps!

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SCH dps is at something like 60% of what a dps can do though. And that's by staying 100% of the time not healing at all (which happens only rarely).

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Am I misunderstanding this, or are you saying only DRGs DPS is not represented properly by the enmity bar? Also SMN (quelling + pet), BLM (quelling), BRD (quelling), MCH (quelling?), DRG (elusive jump), NIN (smoke screen, shadewalker), WHM (shroud), AST (stances), SCH (pet)

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DRG is the only dps which can cut his enmity in half. Quelling, smoke screen and shadewalker aren't that meaningful (when people even use them at all...) over a full 5-13 minutes long fight.
SMNs are a bit trickier because of the pet, but they still should have at least more hate than the SCH at equal gear.

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Originally Posted by Sirus222

*Cough*Shadewalker&Smokescreen*Cough&

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Once people use it more than when being begged to (oh, just like goad /s ) I'll count them. Like, seriously. I never see NIN use these unless they are in serious progression mode.

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

SCH dps is at something like 60% of what a dps can do though. And that's by staying 100% of the time not healing at all (which happens only rarely).

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I know haha, but seriously this is a common occurence :\ It's 60% single target though, SCH can have great AoE.

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DRG is the only dps which can cut his enmity in half. Quelling, smoke screen and shadewalker aren't that meaningful (when people even use them at all...) over a full 5-13 minutes long fight.
SMNs are a bit trickier because of the pet, but they still should have at least more hate than the SCH at equal gear.

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I don't think you should underestimate quelling, smoke screen and shadewalker! I think everyone should have more hate than SCH, it just isn't always the case.

You hit the nail on the head here:

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On a general basis though, if you have less enmity than a sch, you suck and you get your scold

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It's just sad that so many people fit into that category :(

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

Once people use it more than when being begged to (oh, just like goad /s ) I'll count them. Like, seriously. I never see NIN use these unless they are in serious progression mode.

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Dunno what kinda chump NINs you're used to but I use Shadewalker and Smoke Screen even in 4-man dungeons. There's no reason not to.

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Originally Posted by WeekendSoja

I did not reply to your post in a quote but I directly answered your enrage dilemma pages back. SE caught a bad rep in their first MMO because players refused to set limitations on their own game time, regardless of that nifty "please don't forget your work and family" message when logging in. Pandemonium Warden caused a group of people to fight it for 18 hours straight with no win while incurring some ailments along the way prompting WoW to attack SE in the form of a yahoo article which went viral.

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Just to clarify this even further. The mistake on that part was SE for releasing a content that intentionally was too hard and people took hours to fight. I could say the same for the actual content we have now. Savage. Put for example a group that has low dps but they are stubborn and keep going for 18 hours, its the same concept.

The mistake is from SE not from players. DPS check/enrage is bad for another reason on top of the one i discussed. It creates division. As i said before, it limits and exclude players (who payed for the game like everyone else playing) who cant pass the dps check (and one major reason of this is lack of tools from SE to improve your dps, so whos to blame?). Nobody subbing should be intentionally excluded from enjoying the content they payed for.
Let me get this straight since i bet many people here dont get this point.

IF you create a game that EVERYONE pay with money to play, you SHOULD make every content in it, cleareable/enjoyable/playable by everyone who gives you money.
By introducing fights with DPS check and enrage, you push and exclude a lot of people from enjoying and clearing the content they payed for. On top of this, you dont help them with an ingame parser (ps users), and you implement a dps check? how are people supposed to check their dps and performance? This is a contraddiction in game design.

Support to what i am saying is Yoshi itself many times admitted savage was too hard and tuned it down. I still believe that many players in here have issues on dps checks simply because the game doesnt help you at all into getting better.
So untill you have a very solid background and tools inside the game, you should avoid this whole dps check/enrage. THis has nothing to do with being in favor or against the dps check thing. Im just saying if you introduce something that put your gameplay on trial, you should give players the ability to fully learn > improve. Not everyone has this at the moment, and again its wrong.

and again before anybody jumps to my throat, im a very well known hardcore raider with dps and parser mindset. I just find very annoying the SE position on this. And i agree with people pretending a decent tool for analyzing| parsing their numbers, simply because dps checks are in game.
You dont want to give people a parsing tool? dont put dps check. Simple. The moment you put these in game, you MUST support it.

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Originally Posted by DarkB

You dont want to give people a parsing tool? dont put dps check. Simple. The moment you put these in game, you MUST support it.

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I completely agree with this: there are so many other ways to make hard fights where the dps isn't required. Having SOME dps checks are ok, but making every fight a dps check isn't what i call fun. I'm no battle programmer or anything but I remember enjoying the old raids (not in ffxiv specifically) for a good reason: it encouraged tactical knowledge and awareness rather than blunt dps checks. And 1-hit deaths.

I mean come on, Karazhan (yes the worst mmorpg of all time yadda yadda) had a chess battle and I loved that raid so much i would pug every week for it (yes, it was possible still), just for the fun factor and because i genuinely loved that raid for how well designed it was. I never felt frustrated while doing that and i don't really recall any dps check in there (if it did, it was so well hidden I never noticed.).

If they want dps checks as the main gimmick for the game, I'm fine with that too: I won't touch any raid content as a result and avoid the struggle of even attempting it. But as DarkB said: if you put dps checks, support a dps parser. If you don't put it, think of something else for making fights challenging. Dps checks aren't the only tactics to go for!

"Must" is pretty strong, it's preferred to have this tool for the current end-game situation but absotelutely having it is another thing.

I'll take your point on 18 hours but the aspect people tend to forget is the enrage/Insta-kill mechanics deter from a consecutive run. So the PW fight was 18 hours of non-stop zerging, buffing, alliance switching, potion popping, focus testing endurance run of nasty, which still was not beaten. Whereas these enrages, although discouraging, promote breaks, moments to eat, moments to use the bathroom, ect.

Those that were apart of that 18 hour non-stop slug fest reported not eating, drinking or using the restroom outside of the casual members of the ls, so just a guess at the matter, at least 6-8 people, on their decision alone, was like I need to stay here and do absolutely nothing else but focus on this fight.

SE is definitely not the first to build a super boss, but haters gonna hate and the big franchise SE got the dirtiest and biggest publicity for it. There are people who would tell tall tells of Everquest and needing to assemble 500 people just to kill one thing.

This is definitely a two way street. Decisions were made on both sides and sadly SE took the blame and incorporated ways to deter ridiculousness.

tl;dr parsers can be awesome to have, people's decisions not always so awesome.

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Originally Posted by Voltyblast

I completely agree with this: there are so many other ways to make hard fights where the dps isn't required. Having SOME dps checks are ok, but making every fight a dps check isn't what i call fun. I'm no battle programmer or anything but I remember enjoying the old raids (not in ffxiv specifically) for a good reason: it encouraged tactical knowledge and awareness rather than blunt dps checks. And 1-hit deaths.

I mean come on, Karazhan (yes the worst mmorpg of all time yadda yadda) had a chess battle and I loved that raid so much i would pug every week for it (yes, it was possible still), just for the fun factor and because i genuinely loved that raid for how well designed it was. I never felt frustrated while doing that and i don't really recall any dps check in there (if it did, it was so well hidden I never noticed.).

If they want dps checks as the main gimmick for the game, I'm fine with that too: I won't touch any raid content. But as DarkB said: if you put dps checks, support a dps parser. If you don't put it, think of something else for making fights challenging. Dps checks aren't the only tactics to go for!

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I agree with this. I enjoy fun mechanics over dps checks.

My biggest problem with this game is endgame stuff seems to be focused around strict mechanical precision in a strict rotation so you can beat an enrage timer. Mechanics that are present are usually (not always) based on stepping out of bad things and failure to do so is a one hit KO (at least there is not a limit on battle rezzes in this game outside the mana cost). I find that more stress inducing than enjoyable.

I would love to see more fun mechanics. World of WarCraft has always easier rotations, fewer one shot kills (they still exist but aren't the focal point of most bosses) but much more varied and interesting raid encounters as a result. Karazhan is fantastic. I was also very fond of Ulduar.

My dream would be to see rotations streamlined, fewer one shot mechanics and bigger, more varied boss encounters to provide the actual challenge. Less "robot precision" more "think on your feet".

Until we see a shift to that sort of design, however, it seems a shame to not give damage dealers tools they need to actually approach the encounters the way they're supposed to. Dummies and similar are fine...provided you ignore that my class exists. Meet the Black Mage. We ignite the atmosphere on dummies but when actual mechanics force us to move like any other class our dps can plummet to sometimes catastrophic levels (I HAD A FRACTION OF A SECOND LEFT ON BLIZZ IV BUT ENOCHIAN FELL OFF WHY DOES-*incoherent hour long tangent*).

I know my own numbers because reasons. I have never and would never throw numbers at anyone else but to me live evaluation is much more accurate and important than the dummy due to how drastically different my class's performance can be on a dummy vs a real encounter.

If you are going to have DPS Checks, you are going to need to make available tool for people to diagnose and improve performance - or not stop others from doing so.
If you aren't going to have DPS Checks, you might as well remove Damage Dealer as a role - because then you just want to bring more healers or more tanks (people that can fill up hp bars, and people that are sturdy vs hits if/when they mess up mechanics)

Healers don't get a pass when they are bad.
Tanks don't get a pass when they are bad.
I shouldn't get a pass if I'm bad.

A parser is a tool. A tool in itself is not good nor evil. A hammer can either help you build a house or bash in a skull.
The hammer itself isn't toxic. So don't tell us we can't have hammers just because your super sensitive self is worried a toxic person is going to use one to hit you on the head with it - they don't need one.

SquareEnix already follows through with reports of people being abusive while using parsing tools - and as far as I am aware, they do a great job at it.
I don't see why that would change.

Leave hammers alone.

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Originally Posted by DarkB

IF you create a game that EVERYONE pay with money to play, you SHOULD make every content in it, cleareable/enjoyable/playable by everyone who gives you money.

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So no hard or expert modes in any other games, because not everyone can clear Dante Must Die, Revengeance, Heroic (or whatever is hard in WoW) or even competitive leagues in CS. Because everyone has to be able to win! YAY! SAFE SPACES!

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Originally Posted by Erys

So no hard or expert modes in any other games, because not everyone can clear Dante Must Die, Revengeance, Heroic (or whatever is hard in WoW) or even competitive leagues in CS. Because everyone has to be able to win! YAY! SAFE SPACES!

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Way to extrapolate text out of context without even bothering to grasp concepts explained for the 3th time now.
I explained that its related to the amount of people NON clearing a content due to being too hard because of dps check, this was RECOGNIZED by the developers themselves which agreed on what we are all saying and tuned them down. So yeah to their eyes, everyone has to be able to win, on top of that especially cause you are paying for it.

Not giving people tools to improve > fail dps check > fail to clear content. Comprende?

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Originally Posted by DarkB

Snippety snip

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I did understand everything you said, but what I quoted seemed so silly that it totally discredited you imo. The same way "taking it out of context" will discredit me in your opinion.

And again in my opinion, not everyone must be able to win everything. You pay for a game, if you are good enough you'll beat the hardest content it has. Was Gordias a fuck up? Probably, but the same rule applies. You dedicate time to it until you perfect it and clear it. The thrive of the best, I haven't cleared SephEx or Gordias A2-3-4S. I have to improve and I will thrive. So should you and every other player.

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Originally Posted by DarkB

Way to extrapolate text out of context without even bothering to grasp concepts explained for the 3th time now.
I explained that its related to the amount of people NON clearing a content due to being too hard because of dps check, this was RECOGNIZED by the developers themselves which agreed on what we are all saying and tuned them down. So yeah to their eyes, everyone has to be able to win, on top of that especially cause you are paying for it.

Not giving people tools to improve > fail dps check > fail to clear content. Comprende?

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The game would be worse without DPS checks; you just need the right balance of mechanics and DPS checks and A3S was simply over tuned (it also suffered from a giant difficulty gap from A2S). Yes, they should have a parser, that part is obvious. However, I don't get your hatred of DPS checks. You say they create a division because people can't meet them, then wouldn't the same be true for mechanics? Plenty of people get blacklisted from groups for repeatedly messing up mechanics, just like how people can get blacklisted from groups for low DPS.

All current content is perfectly clear-able by everyone who pays, they just have to put in the effort develop the necessary skill for it, that includes both meeting DPS checks and learning mechanics.

Enjoyment is another thing that is probably impossible. There are some people who simply do not want to do those content because they only enjoy the game on a casual basis so it is impossible to make all content enjoyable to everyone as there will be people who dislike content being easy and there will be people who dislike content being hard. There are some people who simply do not wish to try in this game, content should not be made clear-able for them just so they can get carried by people who do put in effort. Some content can be made clear-able by people who try but are casual plays and thus have not put in the time needed for the more difficult content. The more difficult content should not be clear-able by people who don't put in the necessary effort for them as it would otherwise no longer be difficult. Difficult content by their definition requires people to put in time and effort, something that more casual players may not have.

Not all content is for everyone, but there can be at least a bit of content for everyone.

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Originally Posted by DarkB

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You pay for Dark Souls and look at how hard that is. Should Dark Souls be tuned down too to make it easier for players and go against everything it stands for? What about Wings of Vi? Sorry, but not all content is clearable by all plays. I haven't beaten any Savage yet. D'ya know why, because I'm not good enough for the game, that's why. I don't expect them to nerf the content to make it easier just so I can clear. Here's the thing, I should just GET GOOD. If I can't (I volunteer a lot, so time is a premium to me), then I just accept that content isn't for me. Doesn't stop me trying. But I don't want every single victory spoonfed to me. You make the game too easy so everyone can clear, the hardcore players will leave. I'm actually of the camp that story content isn't hard enough.

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Originally Posted by Paladinleeds

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Dark Souls isn't the best example, it does have an indirect "easy mode" by summoning NPCs and/or NPC helpers for bosses. The game is significantly easier even with just one other player, the AI just wasn't developed with multiple players in mind. However, I'm not sure why players are complaining. Every player does have the ability to experience the content they help develop. Alexander? Normal mode. Primals? Hard mode. Older raids? Undersized. It's honestly much better than it was in 2.x where you had to get a static or just deal with it, but I'm sure some people will disagree with me and absolutely hate the addition of normal Alexander.

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Originally Posted by Paladinleeds

You pay for Dark Souls and look at how hard that is. Should Dark Souls be tuned down too to make it easier for players and go against everything it stands for?

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Actually it got tuned down quite a bit over the time. Enemies give like 150-200% more souls than they did at the beginning, upgrade items being added to merchants which you had to grind for hours to get them and so on.
Dark Souls isn't that hard to begin with people just tend to play it the wrong way overloading them with heavy armor and giant weapons while light armor combined with the Ninja Flip ring is pretty much easy mode.