In Game DPS Meter

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Originally Posted by sharazisspecial

I main whm and feel like whm is too similar to blm(but way more extreme). Good aoe , bad single target.

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WHM single target dps is actually slightly higher than SCH if both jobs go all out with no regard to healing. The problem is that keeping that damage up requires constant casting, a lot more MP consumption, and no freedom to do anything else.

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Originally Posted by loldrg

What does this even mean. Nobody needs a parser/DPS meter to see that a summoner's Garuda is killing Renauds/Spiny Plumes, someone is standing in Bind+s incorrectly in T8 and wiping the group, or that a DPS is messing up meteor placement in T9. Your eyeballs gauge that. But DPS's primary way to contribute to a group is DPS, not correctly executing gimmicks that are needed to avoid insta-wipes.

The clearest example of this is in turn 8. It has a very specific AND high threshold that a group needs to reach as a minimum in order to win. If you don't meet that standard you will wipe to the hard enrage. Period. This is where a parser/DPS meter matters. You need to see what EVERY single member of your group is putting in order to calculate whether you meet the threshold needed to avoid a wipe. This is the clearest instance of a DPS meter gauging group contribution, you can see which DPS(es) are getting carried and if needed remove them.

You may be willing to carry someone else by pulling their weight but the fact remains that the threshold is so tight with current gear ilevels that you would also need 3-4 other DPS, a whm willing to effectively solo heal the fight and a scholar willing to play in cleric stance for most of the fight in order to carry that persons weight and most people aren't willing to do that since they often need 5 DPS optimally played DPS and a SCH in cleric stance to beat the fight the first time to begin with.

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LoL when we first beat avatar he was casting his enrage D:. Everyone was playing perfectly too 5 dps 1 tank. But you know Gormogon he is so bad ass he can carry a scathe only blm through turn 8...
As long you manage to do all the straightforward boss mechanics , who cares how little you hurt the boss. What a great mentality for second coil :D.

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Originally Posted by Alkimi

WHM single target dps is actually slightly higher than SCH if both jobs go all out with no regard to healing. The problem is that keeping that damage up requires constant casting, a lot more MP consumption, and no freedom to do anything else.

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Whms dps plummets when they move though. Sch also has long range off gcd 3 per minute energy drain(compared to 2 per minute melee range fluid aura) and selene 50% uptime speed boost over whm. i feel they have more total potency.

Now for coil boss sch has 3 non miss spells .Also how many bosses continue to take dot damage too when they jump that is also a big factor.

Maybe whm can beat sch on dummy and short burst fights? Its similar to smn vs blm.

3 non missable spells? That's wrong. I won't comment on Shadowflare, because it's firstly considered a DoT,a s well as a buff on you and doesn't show in the combat log, but everything else can miss, including energy drain. Of course i'm only talking about damage spells, not something like bane.

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Originally Posted by ispano

3 non missable spells? That's wrong. I won't comment on Shadowflare, because it's firstly considered a DoT,a s well as a buff on you and doesn't show in the combat log, but everything else can miss, including energy drain. Of course i'm only talking about damage spells, not something like bane.

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Bio, Bio II, and Shadowflare are the only arcanist spells without any accuracy requirements (technically Physick, Summon I/II and Resurrection don't have them either but good luck DPSing with them). You're getting into semantics with it being a ground effect and arcanist dots not being proper 'spells'. It's tool-tip refers to it as a spell and it has a cast time. If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck.

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Originally Posted by loldrg

Bio, Bio II, and Shadowflare are the only arcanist spells without any accuracy requirements (technically Physick, Summon I/II and Resurrection don't have them either but good luck DPSing with them). You're getting into semantics with it being a ground effect and arcanist dots not being proper 'spells'. It's tool-tip refers to it as a spell and it has a cast time. If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck.

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Bio and Bio II can both miss, I've personally seen it. I said what I did about Shadowflare, because it doesn't quite work the same way in application. With a DoT, either the whole DoT is applied, or not at all. Shadowflare, working as a buff on you and ground based, is a bit different. So no, not a duck.

I've never seen Bio or Bio II miss...

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Originally Posted by PandaOnAcid

I've never seen Bio or Bio II miss...

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I have. There's also no reason they WOULDN'T miss. They're normal targeted offensive spells. I gave up trying to re-apply them on T8 when they would miss, since it was usually just a waste of time.

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Originally Posted by ispano

I have. There's also no reason they WOULDN'T miss. They're normal targeted offensive spells.

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Yes there is. They are the only 2 DoTs in the game that don't deal initial damage (not counting Shadowflare/Flaming Arrow). The initial damage is the element that can 'miss' with other dots because the DoT is just an additional effect to the initial damage of each DoT. Coincidentally BioII/Bio are also the only 2 dots that can never miss. Please post proof of a SCH missing BioII/Bio before making claims that every other response to your posts is denying.

And again, Shadowflare is a ground effect DoT. ANY enemy that stands in it for 3 seconds or more will get hit with it. It can only miss insofar as the target isn't standing in it. If you are within the area of effect of Shadowflare as an enemy it will hit you.

You have made a compelling argument for a Parser. Which exists.

Now we don't need the in game dps meter. Problem solved.

DPS is the most useless and subjective stat in a parser btw.

Dear Forum Mods,

Despite my best attempts last week this thread has devolved into a discussion about the merits of parsers and has gone completely off topic in regards to coming up with a new usable features to help bridge newer players to end game. Without personally overseeing the conversation this weekend certain trolls were able to take it completely off topic.

Please lock or delete this thread please.

- Tiggy

I think there is still great conversation in this forum post, despite the OP's attempt to direct it.

Let us continue the productive dialogue.