armory system useless? Mythology Cap

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Originally Posted by Tannlore

I'll answer this:

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so you honestly think that its a good idea to make a raid ONLY to gear alts? really?

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Originally Posted by Leadros

so you honestly think that its a good idea to make a raid ONLY to gear alts? really?

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Alts? I plan to gear myself thank you in CT. My alts aren't quite there yet.

Unless you mean, alternate jobs? This isn't WoW/Guildwars/STO/Neverwinter/CO or any other conglomerate of single class/character MMOS.

You need to raise your head up and realize, they are ALL your primary jobs. You just tend to play one with a preference. I play SMN/PLD/WHM in coil depending on what I'm doing. You better as well believe I want them geared and before 9 months pass no less.

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Originally Posted by Osicat

Answer this history boy, if I can get i lvl 90 drops from coil... why do a ilvl 80 instance? Or, if somone capped out in ilvl 90 gear, myth or drops... why would they be happy for the new raid? This is just as stupid as Titan who you do to get relic wep.... drop wep... :)

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Ignoring your poor writing skills I'll answer this gladly. Oh wait I did answer it before...

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If you don't care about more than one class to gear up, good for you...there are dozens of people who actually like playing different classes and would like to get gear for all of them and CT will speed things up.

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But seeing as you have not even one job above 24 bsides your one Lvl50 Job I get that. You didn't even care enough to get all your subclass skills to perform better on your one and only Job for endgame...clearly shows your dedication.

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Originally Posted by Sephirah

As others have mentioned, aside from the initial challenge of trying to kill a boss, why would anyone run coils if you're guaranteed the exact same gear from running AK/WP over and over.

I know casual gamers are where the money is, but please don't forget us old-school MMO-ers that enjoy progression!

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Because getting a Tanking head piece drop frees up your muthology tomes to get something else. By doing coil, you have 2 ways (and much faster) rate of gearing up your character than someone who can only do mythology grind. you also get to see new content and experience amazing/challenging boss mechanics.

You also have a means to gear up 2 classes at once with i90 gear whereas someone grinding mythology will have to focus on one.

That's why.

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Originally Posted by Leadros

are you fucking drunk?
do you think gamblers crown is my main gear?
besides 4 pieces everything i have is lvl 90. and you call ME a troll? you, who judge people because you look at a profile who updates once a day?

im not even maining my dragoon, thats why i dont care about any subskill of it. but why do i even reply to retards like you.

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Well you're missing out on some really useful subclass skills on your PLD as well...so how am I supposed to take any of your "hardcore raiders need new more challenging and higher itemlvl rewarding content" in any kind or way seriously, when you show zero interest in actually progressing through what is served to you right now.

Obviously you care enough about"what gear you log out with", otherwise it would be a strange coincidence to log out in that exact combination of items you did, but not what actually would benefit the progress of your character BESIDES gear...so yeah...I don't even know why I respond to you...can't even take you seriously with how you argue and then claim you don't want to wait 3 months to do what you love in MMOs, but don't even care to prepare yourself to the extent available to you.

PS: I'm not stuttering. B-b-b-but I'm just not an impatient little prick. If the game has nothing to offer to me for 3-4 months that is to my liking...I cancel my sub and wait til something comes up that I'm interested in...you clearly seem to lack the options do something else besides FFXIV, so I feel sorry for you. Your FFXIV<->SWToR comparison is more than I need to hear also...you're definetely on my not worth responding to list now. Why don't you go to WoW...since you prolly came from there at some point before...I heard they are pretty happy with "progressing" on the same raid for the next 9 months til the next expansion comes.

Wow a hardcore I agree with! I'm a casual player btw, don't have all my class abilities but I plan to get them but I'm not rushing. I want to get every class to 50 so I guess I'll get them then.

Tirion please keep posting!

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Originally Posted by Luso

The mythology system is just bad. The majority of BiS gear shouldn't be coming from a token vendor that anyone can run an iLvl50 dungeon to get. At the very least a chain of quests to get parts of the i90 should be in place. Make the achievement of these gears have some meaning. Right now I have a handful of friends who log in just to collect their mythology and coil run. (Myth from WP what a joke.) Myth shouldn't even be rewarded in AK.

New players that join in at any-point are going to be behind. The Current Myth system is similar to the Fatigue system we had in 1.0. It's a limit on how much we can do in game. New players come in and wont be able to grind mythology to their hearts content.

• How does removing a restriction make casuals lose motivation. If not I could see more casuals playing longer.
• Lots of the community already feels fragmented. The current game has locked everything into small isntance groups. 4-8 players are enjoying content while there are FC and LS out there with hundreds of players. Many of these players are getting sidelined because they don't have the room to fit them into current dungeon designs. There are no current world encounters outside of FATE. What happened to a lot of features such as NM's from 1.0. 1.0 wasn't a great game, but it still had some features in it that kept players around.

Yoshida, your argument for casuals falling behind is a weak one. Casuals will get to content at their own pace. If casuals are investing a few hours of week to play then they will reap what they sow.

Reward for challenging content Yoshida; not for the time-sinks.

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I agree wholeheartedly.

This philosophy of progression invests too much faith into the idea that new players can and will find FCs, friends, and groups that are at their level of progress. Even if this were true, it is incredibly discouraging for new players to see players who are permanently ahead of them.

While upward comparison is the central dogma of MMOs, placing new players into what is essentially a lower class is incredibly detrimental to everyone involved. Allowing new players to be upwardly mobile keeps the game exciting, even if the task is daunting. As it stands, they can only look upwards and know that they will never be able to reach that level of accomplishment.

This is especially damaging for players who miss the weekly reset for no fault of their own (real life commitments), or who are currently part of groups that progress together. Missing a week or more could mean that these once-dedicated players need to find a group who is at their now lower level of progression (this is obviously an extreme example). While gear requirements are currently incredibly lenient, encounters such as Turn 4 and 5 of Coil multiply the benefits of higher item level gear due to their precise difficulty. (max HP and defense for tanks, DPS checks, and HP checks for mages due to elevator soft enrage and Twintania fireballs) A week or more in missed gear progression could be a difference of several hundred HP or a dozen or so of your primary stat.

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Originally Posted by ashikenshin

Wow a hardcore I agree with! I'm a casual player btw, don't have all my class abilities but I plan to get them but I'm not rushing. I want to get every class to 50 so I guess I'll get them then.

Tirion please keep posting!

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I wouldn't judge you in the slightest if you don't have all your subclass skills yet. Everyone plays at their own pace and I respect and tolerate that. I'm just having serious problems with "people claiming to be super hardcore and complain about lacking content" when in all their "hardcore'd-ness" they don't seem to be hardcore enough to actually care about anything besides gear. Especially Osicat and Leadros...their arguments are completely void in my mind, cause I wouldn't consider either of them even slightly hardcore...

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There's one key problem with the encounters available in 2.0: the limited number of options leads to linear progression for battle classes, and essentially leaves crafters and gathers by the wayside.

To be more specific, players are being pressured to join a party to play through a limited selection of instances for tomestones; there are few, if any, options for those who wish to collect them leisurely, efficiently, or even alone. Patch 2.1 will serve as a means to resolve this problem, giving players many more options to collect tomestones and play as they see fit.

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Maybe make higher crafted gear too? Why put materia in-game if it's going to be made useless right off the bat by myth gear and Allagan?

I suggest that we get i80, i85 or i90 armor sets (and probably weapon) that can be crafted by lv 50 crafters. But that is bound to them (no selling them possible), and the items for it coming from Crystal Tower and/or Coil. So that the raiders can sell stuff on market, for the crafters, who then in turn "buy" the right to be geared, without the ability to turn a profit over it. Thus no one loses. And it makes use of the money crafters stockpile, gets an income for raiders.

This is to have an alternative over the myth/allagan gear that actually includes materia. Instead of being stuck with whatever stats because STR/DEX/VIT/MND/INT (and damage) is too good to pass on your armor i90 compared to crafted and fully-melded i70.

29 MND and 29 VIT on i90 vs 20 MND and 20 VIT on Vanya Robe of Healing. 63 damage on i70 HQ vs 69 damage on i90. For example.

Even if you can meld more crit and higher accuracy/spellspeed/etc, the stats have so little weight it seems like shooting yourself in the foot. Give a viable alternative that doesn't make me seem like I'm boycotting best gear because I suck, but actually make a choice in progression.

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Originally Posted by Casper

While the explication of Yoshi-P are nice and answer a number of things, they do nothing regarding two major problems affecting a huge number of players

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Well there is always the possibility that the new beast tribe quests and scenario quests could be pretty challenging? How many players is Bahamuts Coil anyway, because 24 people for Crystal Tower seems like alot.

Also werent they supposed to be alternating adding more difficult sections of both the tower and coil with each patch?

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Originally Posted by YuriRamona

Players should each have a capped allotment of mythology tomestomes assigned to them that grows every week by 300/450 starting from the first week of release.

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I totally agree, the myth cap should be Accumulating personal allotment instead of the weekly limit reset, a weekly reset is stupid, guess what I don’t enjoy getting 300 myth. Some weeks I just feel like I want to gather or level and I'm not in the mood to get 300 myth.

By making it a Accumulating limit instead of the weekly limit reset, both player A and B are happy, A gets 450 instead of 300 and B can play the game how there want, without being forced to get myth each week and if limit is increase to please player A again, player B is still happy because it an Accumulating limit.

Just by adding more way to get myth does not fix the problem your still forcing us to get myth each week.

This really needs to be fixed for 2.1, especially now the limit going to be around 450 each week.

/ mis post

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Originally Posted by Zell

Because getting a Tanking head piece drop frees up your muthology tomes to get something else. By doing coil, you have 2 ways (and much faster) rate of gearing up your character than someone who can only do mythology grind. you also get to see new content and experience amazing/challenging boss mechanics.

You also have a means to gear up 2 classes at once with i90 gear whereas someone grinding mythology will have to focus on one.

That's why.

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If you can clear turns 1-4 in DL, the pace at which you gear up is irrelevant when there is no content past Twintania. So we get our gear a few weeks before the "casuals" woo, what then? I knew this game was influenced by WoW, I just didn't realize it was going to go this far down the path, this quickly.

It's FINE if you want to be a casual gamer, and that they make the game accessible for everyone. But there HAS to be something for the end-game or "hard-core" players or there is no reason for them to play at all. And I'm sorry, but I don't think "getting your gear a little faster" is an acceptable reward for putting in the effort and clearing coils, compared to someone running AK, and WP over and over, which are so easy, I run them with my UI OFF! (link to video is in my sig)

Just want to throw this out there since I've seen a lot of people complain about not being able to gear up other jobs since they have to focus on one with their myth caps:

Crystal Tower.

ilvl 80.

Can be grinded to gear out your other jobs and then proceed to Coil and gear them out even more, especially once you've maxed out your main class in ilvl90.

Dear Jesus... I seriously just wish (AND I MEAN WISH) with all my heart that people will stop crying so much over the myth cap... but humans are such faultfinders.

Just my two cents on this, there's no way to make everyone happy. And it seems like the people that are complaining the most are the people who can play the game the most. Since the average casual player doesn't even log into the forums and reads these things or even give their input, we really have no idea how the casual player is.

I think the fact of the matter is we can't say if there are more/less casual players vs "hardcore" players. The hardcore players play a lot and put more time into the game so of course they will be upset with the mythology cap and crystal tower and all that because they have already exhausted their resources/content and they want more to do and be able to do. Casual players like myself have no problems because we don't have the time to put into the game (or maybe we just don't put the time into the game) and so we still have much to do. Myself, for example, I only have my bard and my pld at 50. My bard has only 5 pieces of DL and the rest are mixed ilvl 50-60 stuff. For me, the way the system works now is just fine and dandy because I can get online when i get home from work, jump on my paladin and run some dungeons to get my philo and myths. I would do it more as my bard but i hate the 45 min DF waits. I hate the way the DL pld armor looks so I think it's awesome for me to be able to just save up the myths and buy the AF+1 gear for my pld while I use the philo to get my bard to full ilvl70 and finish my relic quest. For me I don't have a problem with any of these changes. I do have a problem if you make the myths cap per job cause then I can't run DF queues with my pld to help both my bard and my pld out... I'd have to wait out the dps queue which I think sucks! I think a per job basis for Coil might be fine, but I don't know cause I've never ran coil yet.

I'm not saying all the hardcore players are wrong for wanting more content and such but, I mean there's a lot to it than just making a change it. And everyone can't be satisfied so sometimes you just have to suck it up. Making Crystal Tower "harder" so that people who finish Coil can progress isn't a simple task because they have to test everything in there for all jobs to make sure it is as balanced as it can be for the gear it is setup for. And even then everyone won't be happy someone will complain about that too.

I understand why the caps are in place and I understand that it restricts you on getting all your gear. But it is just a mechanism to not only give you options but to also slow down the speed of progression through end-game content. If there were no cap, the hardcore players will get all their ilvl90 gear in like a week or 2 and then Coil would become trivial, or not even be worth playing since you already have ilvl90 gear. And then when new players hit 50, all the hardcore players have all their ilvl90 gear for all their jobs and here we are unable to put that kind of time in that fast and we won't be able to join up because everyone has ilvl90 gear doing the harder content and not bothering with lower content cause they don't need to anymore. At least with how it is now, you can CHOOSE to grind out myths and get the AF+1 or you can CHOOSE to do Coil or you can do both! I would say it's meant to be fun, but for some people, fun is doing it their own way so, I'll just leave that as it is. So yeah, just wanted to put my 2 cents in.

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Originally Posted by Sephirah

It's FINE if you want to be a casual gamer, and that they make the game accessible for everyone. But there HAS to be something for the end-game or "hard-core" players or there is no reason for them to play at all. And I'm sorry, but I don't think "getting your gear a little faster" is an acceptable reward for putting in the effort and clearing coils, compared to someone running AK, and WP over and over, which are so easy, I run them with my UI OFF! (link to video is in my sig)

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Congratulations, you beat the game. Do you want a cookie for your bragging? If you've cleared all content and you have no desire to do everything else the game offers (besides beating coil) then just quit already and move on to a new game. Or take a break and come back for 2.2 when they add more turns of coil.

Just because you were able to do it fast doesn't mean the overwhelming majority of the population can. Square Enix is catering to the majority, not the minority.

poor Yoshi-P no matter what he tries to do there's just no winning.

Problem:
Do something for casuals = Get Trolled by Hardcore
Do something for hardcore = Get Trolled by Casuals
Do something to please both = Get Trolled by Both

Solution:
Do what you feel is right and hope for the best

I had hoped the mythology cap would increase to 495-500 per week, even if it meant the number needed for relic +1 was increased to total 1500. I like the idea of relic +1 taking more than two weeks to obtain, but if I am dedicated enough to run ak/wp/HMprimals no less than 13 times a week, I should be able to gain at least a hands/feet/head slot for that. Yoshida makes a good argument against it, which is time tested, so that's fine, and I think being able to obtain at least an accessory a week is a very good compromise. Next week I will get my Valor Surcoat, but in 2.1 it will take me only two weeks to get the pants, or anothersimilar item. I like it.

Being a casual player, I think the new content will be very welcome, despite still many unreleased quests for me at the moment of the game. But the more the merrier. Congratulations to devteam.

Please amend the weekly cap to be a cumulative total. If you MUST punish the slow/new players just knock off an appropriate amount so non-stop WP farming til cap won't offend the seasoned hardcore at the (still weekly +450) bleeding edge.

I'm surprised it wasn't this way to start with. A plain weekly cap will obviously hinder those casuals you are fishing for. A key part of those casuals, is when life/wife lets them, THEY CAN BINGE on a day off to play "catch-up" to their hardcore friends. It is however hard to casually meet a weekly deadline when irl comes first. I feel like a part of my love for the game dies when I miss something THAT IS GONE FOREVER


EDIT: Why force the hardcores to 1 job and the casuals out of a job? You can have the hardcores multi-classing i90 and the casuals freely earning myth they missed at the rate they please.

P.S. You need to force people to used more crafted items. The market is slow. Why are wool gear selling for no profit and every gear below it is profit? STALE! Spiritbonding is nice and all, but why bother? Materia is subpar to i90.... hell crystal tower will destroy sales for i70 (even after melds) it's dem base stats. Also materia was slimmed down from 1.0 but the ratio of garbage materia to good materia stayed the same. Also the caps of stats on gear has all been posted online, can you just list it on the gear.

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Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

B. Players who feel obligated to hit the cap[/B]

-> “If I don't hit the weekly cap, I’ll fall behind. But having only a handful of dungeons is boring. I just want it over with fast.”

If we were to increase the weekly limit before patch 2.1, players who fall under category B would increase significantly. To satisfy both types of players, we feel it best to prioritize giving players more options.

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Surely a better way to solve this is to have your weekly allowance carry over. For example if I get 300 of my 450 this week I can get up to 600 next week or whenever. It's not unbalanced as you're still getting 900 from two weeks like anyone else, but it allows more flexibility for people who go on holiday for a couple of weeks or simply can't play through enough content for 450 for that week. This allows people who fall behind a way to catch up without disadvantaging anyone.

everything seems interesting and fun in 2.1 but once again eh more grinding for gear which for me gets boring after bit doing same dungeon over and over and over again

For all the people complaining about the fact that there will being nothing to do, have you guys considered switching up the classes you're using in Coil and progressing that way? And/or using those classes for Crystal Tower? Unless you have everything geared in iLvl 90, there's always something to do :)

i think having separate myth cap for all the classes is a pretty cool idea. but then again i have all my combat classes to 50 and the thought of capping them all weekly is not very enticing.

From 300/450 not bad, I guess.After all this game was designed so everyone wins.

hmmm I guess.

Just waiting for the 22nd. :P

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Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

New Main Scenario Quests

- Work together with the Scions of the Seventh Dawn for the sake of Eorzea.

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Yeah that's great... But how about you put the exp you gain from these quest to use? For those of us at 50, any and all exp goes to waste...

Keep it up Nakoi !! and Good luck ! ~
mwuahahah cant wait for the patch relase ! > 3 < !

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Originally Posted by Frost_Trunks

Yeah that's great... But how about you put the exp you gain from these quest to use? For those of us at 50, any and all exp goes to waste...

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Or perhaps there won't be exp, they give you gil or Seals from the Primal Search in the Strongholds. ( Unless this is a hint that they are upping the level cap :P)

I love how all these people are saying Coil is so easy. I have attempted Turn 1 on my Full DL+Relic+1 Bard three times and failed all three times because I could only get into groups that had healers that burnt through mp like it was candy. "You need to use Mage's Ballad" I have been told. I infact use Mage's Ballad but only at the split because it in fact uses my own mp to fuel it. If I use it right off the bat i won't have mp to have it going when it is needed. Also most players that run coil only look for players with exp and by exp I mean have beaten it before.

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Originally Posted by Shinnra

everything seems interesting and fun in 2.1 but once again eh more grinding for gear which for me gets boring after bit doing same dungeon over and over and over again

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You get 3 new dungeons, in addition to the 2 current dungeons, plus all the other new ways they will implement to gain tomes.

That's no longer an excuse, you don't need to grind the same dungeon anymore to gain tomes.

Is Aesthetician the vanity slots?

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Originally Posted by Arasiel

Is Aesthetician the vanity slots?

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No, that is the "Beauty Salon"

To all of you going 'if i'm already wearing ilvl90 gear why would i do a lower level dungeon'

The answer is rather simple isn't it? To complete it. When did new content in a game immediately have to do with gear? wasn't it supposed to be the new experience, the intrigue of the unknown? Yeah, you have Ilvl 90 and are beating turn 5, but you haven't beaten crystal tower yet. And you need a LOT of people to do it, isn't that interesting to you at all?

I don't have ilvl 90 gear, many of us don't. And it's not because i'm not maxed out either, i've been there since 1.0. I don't have a coil static, i don't have full darklight either, Crystal tower is the logical next challenge for me and many, regardless of what gear it gives.

Raising it to 450? Great, that is at most five extra dungeon runs. Forgive me if I'm unimpressed, still sounds like I'll be bored most of the week. Those daily quests are hopefully good though.

I do not see the point in this cap at all. No, you can't just remove it, that would be insane. You need to make it so people actually have to work towards obtaining Mythology, rather than them just being handed out to you at the door, make it so obtaining Mythology isn't easy and then you can remove the cap. Let players get out what they put in. Some people will fall behind, but so what? That's nature. People who fall behind still have something to work towards though, they still have a reason to play. "That player has full iLv90 gear" shouldn't make someone still in iLv55 gear go "I'm quitting", it should make them go "I want to get full iLv90 gear!". The "casual" player in this scenario still has plenty of reason to keep playing, but what about the "hardcore" player? Without a cap they just rush through the content and have no more reason to play, right? Wrong. If the content is a significant enough timesink, such that obtaining full iLv90 isn't something you could just breeze through without a cap (as it would be currently), then that player is now invested in the game. They put a lot of work into obtaining that gear, they're not going to just up and quit because they finally got it. At that point they are hopefully, for lack of a better word, addicts.

Ideally, content should be designed with the "hardcore" crowd in mind. Something that will keep them playing for a while and get them invested. When it comes to "casuals" you want content to be designed such that they can still access it, and thus aren't left out, they can still work toward it at their own pace. Instead, right now we seem to have content designed more with "casuals" in mind. What should be a marathon is instead a 100 meter sprint. On one end of the spectrum, people run down that track and get 300 Mythology on Monday, on the other end, people walk that 100 meters and get 300 Mythology by Sunday. Isn't that fine? Well, I guess it would be if it wasn't 50% of endgame, with the other 50% being pretty much exactly the same (only thing I'll say about Coil is that I wish it was more like Limbus), just another 100 meter sprint... Endgame needs a marathon. It needs something truly challenging you can tackle at your own pace; something the dedicated can aim to win, while others can just aim to finish someday. Hopefully that is what Crystal Tower ends up being... iLv80 gear might be a bit outdated at this point, but if you're working on other Jobs it's something to work towards. Without tomestones and with 23 other people to lot against, it shouldn't be as simple to gear as iLv70 is currently, I actually have a lot of hope for Crystal Tower. That said, it is still iLv80. The marathon should be endgame, end-endgame. The final challenge, the last thing you complete before having nothing else left to do... Fully gearing a Job in iLv80 might be a marathon, but iLv90 is still a weekly sprint... It just seems so backwards...

+1 Sotek

So agree.

Not sure why some people seriously think raid guilds will gather 2-4 times / week, on set times to do content they not gain anyhing in exept the pure pleasure of compleating?

2-3 organiced raid / week IS NOT HARDCORE, its casual rading. We still at turn 5 and its our progress fight atm. I dont see myself or my guild as a hardcore. Most guilds who raid organiced today are at turn 5 in coil, its a wery good fight, dont say other but its the last step in raiding progress. After turn 5 there is a lack and need of a hard place to wipe over and over in. The content patch folowing 2.0 should bring the next step, not take a step back.

The "you have not capped your alts gear" dont work. You lvl your main for sure, then lvl the "shared professions" to gain the cross class skills. Why work on lvl a second 50 alt unless the guild need it? I already lvl'd to 50 and now I want to play endgame. Atm there is NO LVL 50 cross class.

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Originally Posted by Leadros

crystal tower seems useless. Coil can be beaten by using darklight. coil gives way better items (atleast thats what im reading about crystal tower) so why go to the dungeon that gives worse items?
Equipping other jobs can also be done in coil. So what reason is there to go CT besides for vanity items and maybe 1 time for the story behind it?

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So~ you're telling me you've managed to tank Twintania only in darklight When deathstroke alone can hit up to 5.2k? Darklight gives what? 5.6khp?

I wasn't planning on replying or quoting anyone but meh..

Also you're telling me with a 1 week cap on coil, Crystal Tower would be useless~ yeah only if you are playing 1 class which pretty much means you aren't very well equipped cross class wise. It's not up to me to dictate how and what you play, in fact I don't care but your opinion is based on your views and yours alone. Do not speak for the masses if you've not considered other possibilities.

Ultimately I look at all these dungeons and tweaks and quests that are being added that is not "end game" as content to fill the missing voids that made it seem FOREVER to get to lvl 50. Now there is more to do while progressing to a lvl 50 in however many classes you have left to lvl. My (IMO) big drive for end game content for me I think is the PVP. Entirely brand new experience for all lvls (especially lvl 50s). I think it's going to spike the materia function in gear across all lvls and give a decent amount of time to spend for all players to break from dungeon grinding or give something else to do after you capped. I mean at least for 3 months until the next patch comes out....

Of course if you are not into PVP then well....well I feel bad for you but usually that's not the case.

I'm just waiting for the mini games....I want slots!!! Give me slots and gambling!!! PLEASE!!!! PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

the only thing i would like to see is to make BC open and not to wait a week for reset, if i beat T4 and have FC friends on T2 for example i cant go and help. instead this FC friends have to make fail pties with randoms and noobs and never get past to it. At the same time no experience for the harder turns.