Please Share Updates on 8.0 Job Design

Since I no longer care about ff14 as much as I did years ago, ngl I am half amused by the whole situation. Regardless if they're able to deliver the job rework like they've promised us or not, I'll just have fun watching it from the side. It's like a train wreck in slow motion.

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Originally Posted by YovelaLindswood

I remember back before shb released yoshi p said healers were in an unbalanced state and they were going to homogenize them as a baseline and expand them out in the expansion after that. I don't believe anything that man says anymore. Too many lies to believe. I also only resubbed recently for occult crescent and was sorely disappointed. Back before ARR was released yoshi p said in an interview that one of the biggest problems was 1.0 prioritized graphics over gameplay. Which is exactly where we are now where everything looks gorgeous but the content itself is hollow as can be. I honestly have 0 faith in SE. I just hope they don't fail so blizzard still has a reason to improve and be competitive.

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What’s really sad about this was the “unbalanced” part about healers was that White Mage was underpowered because they took a very stubborn stance that White Mage’s identity was pure healing and anything else would clash with that identity, leaving White Mage with nothing to compete with the offensive support and utility found on the other healers. Rather than doing the obvious thing and actually giving White Mage more than just raw heals and damage, they decided gutting the entire role was the only solution.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

What’s really sad about this was the “unbalanced” part about healers was that White Mage was underpowered because they took a very stubborn stance that White Mage’s identity was pure healing and anything else would clash with that identity, leaving White Mage with nothing to compete with the offensive support and utility found on the other healers. Rather than doing the obvious thing and actually giving White Mage more than just raw heals and damage, they decided gutting the entire role was the only solution.

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Honestly I also feel that like other jobs or roles they do consider WhM the "baby's first healer" especially since they simplified it further with the 1.5s casts and whatnot. And judging how the devs consider certain roles to be "baby mode" and balance them accordingly...

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Originally Posted by Derio

If all SMN gets is another version of Bahamut that will tell you all you need to know.

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And, apparently, they added that in response to players' feedback. The same players that had been asking for Alexander, Ramuh, Levi or Shiva por ages. I won't get into the DOTs/difficulty discussion because that's a whole different story.

Thinking they'll listen to feedback is naive at best, but I'm with the OP.

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Originally Posted by Valence

Honestly I also feel that like other jobs or roles they do consider WhM the "baby's first healer" especially since they simplified it further with the 1.5s casts and whatnot. And judging how the devs consider certain roles to be "baby mode" and balance them accordingly...

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It's funny that WHM is considered by them to be the training wheels healer, but Freecure remains a useless noob trap.

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Originally Posted by Derio

If all SMN gets is another version of Bahamut that will tell you all you need to know.

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I seriously don't understand their reasoning as to why they gave us solar bahamut. Tthey already know people are asking for more egi/summon. Leviathan, shiva, and ramuh are right there. 3 elements to replace garuda, ifrit, titan. Surely adding reference of hydaelyn isn't more important as adding other egis? Not like they can blatantly show us hydaelyn anyway, hence why we get reskinned bahamut.

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Originally Posted by Volgia

You're fighting a losing battle there, the game is never gonna be like it used to be. There are Shadowbringer, Endwalker and Dawntrail generation of players who are used to everything being dumbed down. You bring it back to HW/SB levels and then the massive FFXIV decline will really start happening.

They crossed the south bank of the Rubicon on Shadowbringers when they decided to butcher everything down the way they did.

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A little late to this response, but

1) WoW did a lot of simplification. Then they went back to more complicated/unique designed, and everyone preferred it that way.
2) We have at least 4 jobs a role. You can make 1 hard, 2 in the middle, and keep one dumb. You don't need to go to 10/10 difficulty for every job.

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This is the same issue I saw in the early healerstrike thread. Basically 2 groups formed -> 1) we want more engaging gameplay for x reason , and 2) I dont want healers to be harder for x reason

Its like you had to be on one side or the other. Guys, we have 4 of them. You can make at least 1 of them satisfy the first group.
I know im way oversimplifying the healer thread, but it's not all or nothing. We can have a healer do more than glare spam, and have another only glare spam.

8.0 job design, a follow up to a other follow up attacks!

My copium dream, hard reset going back to stormblood era. Make job unique again, bring tank stance dancing/ god awful TP system back and add new skill to enchand the gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Alahard

A little late to this response, but

1) WoW did a lot of simplification. Then they went back to more complicated/unique designed, and everyone preferred it that way.
2) We have at least 4 jobs a role. You can make 1 hard, 2 in the middle, and keep one dumb. You don't need to go to 10/10 difficulty for every job.

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This is the same issue I saw in the early healerstrike thread. Basically 2 groups formed -> 1) we want more engaging gameplay for x reason , and 2) I dont want healers to be harder for x reason

Its like you had to be on one side or the other. Guys, we have 4 of them. You can make at least 1 of them satisfy the first group.
I know im way oversimplifying the healer thread, but it's not all or nothing. We can have a healer do more than glare spam, and have another only glare spam.

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Thing is, group 1 was never against having a more simple healer. Virtually everyone who has actively been against the current direction of healers has agreed that white mage can still be forgiving, accessible, easy to understand, but also be interesting and have options in elements of mastery let players interested in skill expression push just a little further.

Something many in this community don’t seem to acknowledge is that fun and difficulty are not the same. You can have things that are easy but still fun. You can also have things that are boring but also very difficult. That goes for fun and difficult as well as things that are easy and boring. Healer design suffers from being the later. Why can’t white mage be fun and easy? Why does it have to be boring and easy?

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

Thing is, group 1 was never against having a more simple healer. Virtually everyone who has actively been against the current direction of healers has agreed that white mage can still be forgiving, accessible, easy to understand, but also be interesting and have options in elements of mastery let players interested in skill expression push just a little further.

Something many in this community don’t seem to acknowledge is that fun and difficulty are not the same. You can have things that are easy but still fun. You can also have things that are boring but also very difficult. That goes for fun and difficult as well as things that are easy and boring. Healer design suffers from being the later. Why can’t white mage be fun and easy? Why does it have to be boring and easy?

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I get you. And as I said, I was oversimplifying that thread significantly.

The point of my statement was a large chunk of the community went all fire and brimstone when a group stated that they were currently unhappy with the overall place and design for healers, and were for some reason upset that even a mention was a signal for square to " ruin the healer situation" in their eyes. And then both sides ended up arguing for how long?

I do agree that there is some fun in the current healer design. A also agree there is a lot of boring elements in the healer design. But when approached with the reasonable take of " maybe change 1 or 2 of them and slightly change the healing situation overall" was thrown out in favor of throwing fire and brimstone. Just the slight mention that " maybe making all healers dps rotation the same maybe wasn't the best idea" can spawn 10 additional pages on that thread of people attacking eachother. Asking for more uses for the core healing gcds, another 10 pages of attacks.