Tales from the Dawn #4: "A Question of Death" (Jullus)

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Originally Posted by Lauront

I've no idea what you think it is you're "putting to bed" but...

https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/wiki/Blue_Gold#Dialogue

Granted, this particular merchant changes his plans as to where he intends to source it from, but it's evident from the quest dialogue he is not alone in this interest in ceruleum and its applications.

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That quest and others all the way back in ARR also mention that Northern Thanalan is the richest deposit of ceruleum in the entire region and it’s much closer to the Eorzean Alliance (being that it’s in Eorzea) than Garlemald is.

The XIVth legion couldn’t transport ceruleum to Eorzea and had to source it themselves here. All the way back in 1.0, Ul’dah was mining and refining ceruleum there and the Garleans came in to take it, which is why Castrum Meridianum is located where it is.

Ultimately the biggest goal of the Ilsabard Contingent is the demilitarization of the ex-Garlean Empire, not necessarily a source of ceruleum at the northern tip of a completely separate continent half a world away.

So let me reword it with clarity: a right to feel resentful. And the Eorzean Alliance is sitting in Garlemald itself protecting the Garleans, citizens and soldiers alike. Whether we go into any of the other freed provinces to aid any Garleans in there instead of the non-Garleans (which is what parts of Stormblood, Werlyt, and Bozja we’re about - and even in SB we had that side quest where we helped the townsfolk in Ala Ganni irrc protect a Garlean ex-soldier. And in the patches the Doman prisoner exchange was returning Garlean soldiers). Right now we don’t know what the situation is in these other places still covered by map clouds. If we use the former British Empire- well, there’s enough former colonies, some still symbolically tied via the Commonwealth while others decidedly not. And Japan’s history and how it colors diplomatic feelings in Korea, Taiwan, China, and the Philippines is the Real Life example that I have a feeling the writers are more leery of. This is well-tread ground, story-wise, for XIV because of ….well, all of Stormblood and even patch content of ShB. Honestly my biggest question is if when they get to exploring the rest of Ilsabard what new story beats will be explored. Maybe the 6.3 patch content will turn out to be ‘protect the Garleans in Garlemald from an Ilsabardic former colony coming for revenge’. It’d fit the story beat in the 6.0 MSQ and be that cheesy but feel-good breaking the cycle of abuse. The Garlean Empire was the Garleans becoming their oppressors writ large on a global scale. I want a restored stable Republic for them, not wiped out but not a new expansionist colonizer a generation later trying to redo Solus. *shrug*

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Originally Posted by Denishia

Honestly my biggest question is if when they get to exploring the rest of Ilsabard what new story beats will be explored. Maybe the 6.3 patch content will turn out to be ‘protect the Garleans in Garlemald from an Ilsabardic former colony coming for revenge’. *shrug*

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At best we'll get a full expansion about it. At worst nothing is done with it. I'm hoping for the middle ground at the least, where we get a long drawn out story segment about it that is side content. Perhaps an entire series of zone stuff with it written by Matsuno (since seriously, that kind of political conflict is what he LOVES to write about).

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

Wasn't there a massive plot point in the Garlemald section of the MSQ about how literally everyone wanted to just kill the Garleans and the Scions had to convince them not to? And I'm pretty sure that even though the Eorzeans in the contingent there got over that (and even then, not entirely), you still have... *checks notes* literally everyone else still wanting to.

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Might wanna read those quest again. I know you have trouble with that and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to read it again. Nobody in game said what you said. They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

As for the story itself it was good. I'm more interested in the state and affairs of all the former occupied nations and how they will get on but it is nice to know that the Garleans have some hope.

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Originally Posted by Denishia

So let me reword it with clarity: a right to feel resentful. And the Eorzean Alliance is sitting in Garlemald itself protecting the Garleans, citizens and soldiers alike. Whether we go into any of the other freed provinces to aid any Garleans in there instead of the non-Garleans (which is what parts of Stormblood, Werlyt, and Bozja we’re about - and even in SB we had that side quest where we helped the townsfolk in Ala Ganni irrc protect a Garlean ex-soldier. And in the patches the Doman prisoner exchange was returning Garlean soldiers). Right now we don’t know what the situation is in these other places still covered by map clouds. If we use the former British Empire- well, there’s enough former colonies, some still symbolically tied via the Commonwealth while others decidedly not. And Japan’s history and how it colors diplomatic feelings in Korea, Taiwan, China, and the Philippines is the Real Life example that I have a feeling the writers are more leery of. This is well-tread ground, story-wise, for XIV because of ….well, all of Stormblood and even patch content of ShB. Honestly my biggest question is if when they get to exploring the rest of Ilsabard what new story beats will be explored. Maybe the 6.3 patch content will turn out to be ‘protect the Garleans in Garlemald from an Ilsabardic former colony coming for revenge’. It’d fit the story beat in the 6.0 MSQ and be that cheesy but feel-good breaking the cycle of abuse. The Garlean Empire was the Garleans becoming their oppressors writ large on a global scale. I want a restored stable Republic for them, not wiped out but not a new expansionist colonizer a generation later trying to redo Solus. *shrug*

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The devs aren't leery of real-world parallels, they just see things through rather black-and-white lenses lately which is ultimately a detriment to their storytelling. You'll notice (or perhaps you will refuse to) that I mentioned Yotsuyu, who is a textbook example of a woman mistreated by pseudo-Imperialist Japan (Doma). Can't blame Garlemald for that one~

For as bad as Stormblood may have been, nuance in its storytelling was most certainly NOT one of its primary flaws.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Might wanna read those quest again. I know you have trouble with that and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to read it again. Nobody in game said what you said. They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

As for the story itself it was good. I'm more interested in the state and affairs of all the former occupied nations and how they will get on but it is nice to know that the Garleans have some hope.

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Nice work being a pretentious one, little Sylph. Your information is still yet inaccurate, however. I do believe it would be in your best interest to go back and watch those cutscenes, since you'd realize that Lyse mentions that the formation of the Ilsabard contingent was initially hamstrung by the necessity of the onerous process of weeding out those who merely wanted to go take bloody revenge on what they saw as their oppressors and those who genuinely wanted to help those who would be ultimately revealed as ailing, freezing, close-to-death victims of Zenos' and Fandaniel's monstrous villainy.

For as bad as Endwalker was with nuance, ironically the criminally short Garlemald segment was one of the few points in the storyline that lacked that absent nuance.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Might wanna read those quest again. I know you have trouble with that and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to read it again. Nobody in game said what you said. They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

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Did we not read the same quest text? Because there were definitely several points where individuals in positions of power indicated a desire to deal rather..... harshly, we'll say, with the Garlean survivors.

I want it, because I want the map filled out, I desperately want to see that homeland of skilled Hellsguard mages, I want to know if the neighbor nations the longest conquered by Garlemald are the ones who thanks to that full generation and a half under Garlean rule are most assimilated and maybe will have an amicable tie to New Garlemald or if they’re especially eager to throw off the colonial rule and assert their independence. It’s been especially relevant in the news with Ukraine and the British Commonwealth/former members like Ireland. But as it is something that has been covered so much in the game already, and with the mixed reception that Bozja had…..I’m curious if my questions will ever be answered. And what they could do to make it feel fresh gameplay-wise.

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

The devs aren't leery of real-world parallels, they just see things through rather black-and-white lenses lately which is ultimately a detriment to their storytelling. You'll notice (or perhaps you will refuse to) that I mentioned Yotsuyu, who is a textbook example of a woman mistreated by pseudo-Imperialist Japan (Doma). Can't blame Garlemald for that one~

For as bad as Stormblood may have been, nuance in its storytelling was most certainly NOT one of its main flaws.

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Nobody was blaming the Garleans for what happened to her. If you paid any attention to that section that had more to do with doman culture being the issue that created her. That section is a rather scathing critique on a few real world cultures.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

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Who said that? The scions and their close friends? The people who had to convince literally everyone else in the contingent to not kill the Garleans? Oh wow, I didn't know that, thank you Great Oatmeal. What great information. The people not looking to kill the Garleans and thus went and convinced everyone else to not kill them... weren't the ones trying to kill the Garleans. I was wrong when I read the story that said the Eorzean leaders sent the contingent to Garlemald to help the Garleans but most of the contingent just wanted to kill said Garleans. My apologies, I will be sure to refer to your version of events next time. I gotta say, this is some next level intelligence coming from Oatmeal guys, I think we should try eating some of the oats too, they seem to give lots of intelligence. /s

Gee golly, it's almost like the people IN the contingent didn't share the same opinion as its leaders.

(Might wanna fix the 'Gridinia' spelling. I know you have trouble with spelling it and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to try it again.)

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

Did we not read the same quest text? Because there were definitely several points where individuals in positions of power indicated a desire to deal rather..... harshly, we'll say, with the Garlean survivors.

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Uh, you see, Oatmeal has this special power that when he eats his oats, he can see parts of the story that we mere mortals cannot. His oat vision allows him to see extra lines of dialogue that are beyond our comprehension.

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

The devs aren't leery of real-world parallels, they just see things through rather black-and-white lenses lately which is ultimately a detriment to their storytelling.

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Case in point, Venat. Venat is a morally gray character that can be compared to real world figures that commit horrible crimes against humanity for the 'greater good', yet the writers cannot see things past a very black and white perspective. Ignore the screeching of SannaR as they get mad that someone said the V word.

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Originally Posted by Denishia

I want it, because I want the map filled out, I desperately want to see that homeland of skilled Hellsguard mages, I want to know if the neighbor nations the longest conquered by Garlemald are the ones who thanks to that full generation and a half under Garlean rule are most assimilated and maybe will have an amicable tie to New Garlemald or if they’re especially eager to throw off the colonial rule and assert their independence. It’s been especially relevant in the news with Ukraine and the British Commonwealth/former members like Ireland. But as it is something that has been covered so much in the game already, and with the mixed reception that Bozja had…..I’m curious if my questions will ever be answered. And what they could do to make it feel fresh gameplay-wise.

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Knew this one would come up sooner or later. What an utter bore.

You DO realize that a writer is not obligated to fetishize and glorify tyrannical regimes to reveal that the people native to that regime's locale are also suffering, right? The two are as far from mutually exclusive as the core of the Earth and the planet Pluto.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Nobody was blaming the Garleans for what happened to her. If you paid any attention to that section that had more to do with doman culture being the issue that created her. That section is a rather scathing critique on a few real world cultures.

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Missing the point, my dude.