Samurai - Kaiten Issue

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Originally Posted by Eliadil

This is why peoples are asking for some de-bloating of Sam's toolkit. Merciful Eyes should be fused with third eye, changing to it whenever you get a proc. The same should be done for Shinten and Seigan tbh, with Seigan replacing Shinten every time you hit a Third Eye proc... Or simple Guren/Senei, which are the same skill but with a different animation. Or just Shoha and Meditate... Or Hagakure and Ikis-... Well, we'd like that to happen. :rolleyes:

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All that I would be cool with, and have requested since 4.0.

I do, however, hate when people use "button bloat" and "ability bloat" interchangeably, as seems too often the case across threads like this one. "Let's remove Seigan (as an unnecessarily separate key)!" quickly becomes just "Let's remove Seigan!"

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

All that I would be cool with, and have requested since 4.0.

I do, however, hate when people use "button bloat" and "ability bloat" interchangeably, as seems too often the case across threads like this one. "Let's remove Seigan (as an unnecessarily separate key)!" quickly becomes just "Let's remove Seigan!"

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I'm 100% okay with removing Seigan. It's not interesting enough on its own. "I'm Shinten but stronger!" isn't a great identity to carve for itself.

Maybe if it worked like foresight slash in MHW, we'd be cookin'. Turn Seigan into a weaponskill that refreshes Buff durations by about 10s or so and counts as a combo progressor for any of the finishers?

Gimmegimmegimmegimme.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

I'm 100% okay with removing Seigan. It's not interesting enough on its own. "I'm Shinten but stronger!" isn't a great identity to carve for itself.

Maybe if it worked like foresight slash in MHW, we'd be cookin'. Turn Seigan into a weaponskill that refreshes Buff durations by about 10s or so and counts as a combo progressor for any of the finishers?

Gimmegimmegimmegimme.

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Agreed on replacement (or, ofc, consolidation) -- not so much on outright removal. We have little enough even going on in SAM's toolkit, if we just got rid of the button- (not ability-) bloat.

Nit-pick: We can't use it as a combo-progresser over Step-2, since the paths diverge at and only at that point, and I'd expect it'd rather... off... if usable only two-thirds of GCDs as a dynamic flow skill. Moreover, refreshing 10 seconds as often as every 15 seconds would mean our already kind of absurdly long durations would then be extended from 40 seconds to, effectively, nearly 2 minutes.

Seigan is supposed to be one of those things that separates average players from great players and adds some skill gap to the class. I use it all the time, but the returns on it are definitely minuscule at best that most people wouldn't even be able to tell it's not being used.