So, can we just ban damage meters already.

When you've run a dungeon enough times, you can tell things without any type of parser. If I'm tanking, I can tell if the healers not used to their role yet, if I'm DPS I can tell when the other DPS is doing poorly next to me. As a healer, I can really tell when DPS are doing extremely poorly due to how long it takes to clear simple trash mobs or how long it takes to kill a boss.

Most of it stems from people being too stubborn to upgrade gear as they level. Like using level 50 job gear at level 58. etc etc.

Don't need a parser to notice poor performance at all really, just common sense.

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Originally Posted by Vidu

While its not presented in the best way and I would always encourage people to say things in a neutral tone at the very least - "You should do a bit more research on your job and rotation" for example - it makes them at least aware of the possibility that they're doing things wrong so they can sit down, look up a guide or look at their tooltips, ask around for advice, practise a bit on a dummy and actually improve. Bonus: most jobs are actually way more fun when played correctly!

Its not an ideal way to make someone aware of their shortcomings and it should be reported as harrassment, yes. But anyone who does care about not being carried while probably look into their job and improve afterwards - there are nicer ways of saying it and they should be encouraged over insults. But even those can lead to someone improving, if that person cares about their performance at all.

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Most people who get into games care about having fun. Some people enjoy the story and do the mandatory dungeons because they're... mandatory. Nobody enjoys having condescending japes thrown at them; even if you do plan to improve and participate in more than the story.

I wouldn't be here if the majority of what I've been seeing people suggesting other players look into better gear or study up a bit. It's pretty much always some variation of "you suck; you're being carried."

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Politely announcing you're new and asking for advice is fine. It isn't necessary in low level content, however, and most of the time it'll just be ignored. It does speak volumes about this community that this is where you place the responsibility for mitigating fights. I personally would just prefer veteran players not be uselessly condescending in low level content to new players, but whatever.

I think you know the kinds of veteran players I'm talking about; basically the kinds that insult new players for no serious reason. "Hi, I'm new" isn't going to be what magically turns them into good people.

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It is also not necessary for the other people in the run to offer any advice or explantions to you - which you seemed to imply by saying "the ingame message should be enough".
And I dont place the responsibility with the new people, I'm merely pointing out that in my general experience in the game (and in life) you'll run into less fights and less trouble if you're the one getting ahead of it by being polite. I would prefer everyone to communicate in a friendly and polite manner with each other, veterans and newbies alike - that means: no harrassing, but also no "silently sitting around expecting the rest to cater to you".

And obviously this wont when you encounter real jerks - but it might just help when you meet someone whos just having a bad day (we're all allowed to have them) to prevent them from getting snarky and instead being more understanding and maybe even helpful.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Most people who get into games care about having fun. Some people enjoy the story and do the mandatory dungeons because they're... mandatory. Nobody enjoys having condescending japes thrown at them; even if you do plan to improve and participate in more than the story.

I wouldn't be here if the majority of what I've been seeing people suggesting other players look into better gear or study up a bit. It's pretty much always some variation of "you suck; you're being carried."

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Because they need better gear or to research some, it's really that simple. It's not even hard to get gear, just grind same level dungeons if can't craft it/buy it until get decent gear to go onto the next level tiers.

In an MMO, the feeling and emotions of the one do not hold higher weight over the majority of the group. That way in life too oddly. If "you suck" then generally you need to improve your gear or play-style if people are noticing it.

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Originally Posted by Vidu

It is also not necessary for the other people in the run to offer any advice or explantions to you - which you seemed to imply by saying "the ingame message should be enough".
And I dont place the responsibility with the new people, I'm merely pointing out that in my general experience in the game (and in life) you'll run into less fights and less trouble if you're the one getting ahead of it by being polite. I would prefer everyone to communicate in a friendly and polite manner with each other, veterans and newbies alike - that means: no harrassing, but also no "silently sitting around expecting the rest to cater to you".

And obviously this wont when you encounter real jerks - but it might just help when you meet someone whos just having a bad day (we're all allowed to have them) to prevent them from getting snarky and instead being more understanding and maybe even helpful.

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I don't expect anyone to explain anything to me. I don't mind failing to mechanics and learning by doing, instead of reading some shorthand explanation. If the party gives a crap about me dying, though; well they got the warning that I was new when the dungeon started. They're free to make sure I'm up to speed if they really want to. Don't explain nothing then get pissy and condescending if I die, though.

Aside from being experienced and you can tell how people play their class as Vidu stated above there is no other way to know how much DPS someone does unless ure using a DPS Meter,which is in fact bannable so you can report them and the GMs will investigate.

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Originally Posted by Komarimono

Because they need better gear or to research some, it's really that simple. It's not even hard to get gear, just grind same level dungeons if can't craft it/buy it until get decent gear to go onto the next level tiers.

In an MMO, the feeling and emotions of the one do not hold higher weight over the majority of the group. That way in life too oddly. If "you suck" then generally you need to improve your gear or play-style if people are noticing it.

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"You suck" isn't an acceptable way to broach any topic, unless you're some socially inept nerd playing a video game I guess. There's a right and wrong way to communicate; "You suck; you're being carried" is an insult. It's not helpful.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Most people who get into games care about having fun. Some people enjoy the story and do the mandatory dungeons because they're... mandatory. Nobody enjoys having condescending japes thrown at them; even if you do plan to improve and participate in more than the story.

I wouldn't be here if the majority of what I've been seeing people suggesting other players look into better gear or study up a bit. It's pretty much always some variation of "you suck; you're being carried."

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Guess what! The other 3/7/23 people in your run might just be there to have fun aswell and your poor performance might just be whats hurting that right now! The "Its just a game and I'm just here to have fun"-argument is just as bad as "you dont pay my sub!"
Nobody enjoys running dungeons with someone who doesnt care about their performance and the groups-effort either.
Again: I agree that there is no need to be condescending about it, but as already established: That doesnt require a parser and is already reportable.

(...and after that report I'd still consider it a good idea to make the best out of the situation, do a sanity check and see if you're playing your job well or if there was some truth to their claims after all...)

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Originally Posted by Sathona

Aside from being experienced and you can tell how people play their class as Vidu stated above there is no other way to know how much DPS someone does unless ure using a DPS Meter,which is in fact bannable so you can report them and the GMs will investigate.

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I would like to add, be careful reporting people you suspect of it. Someone reported me as using a parser, I proved that I had done no such thing, and used common sense to explain why the boss was dying so slowly, on how they stood in every AoE damned near and refused to listen to anyone's advice.

They ended up being dragged into GM jail instead, letting them waste 7 hours of time until a GM showed up like I had to, so you best be sure when you file the complaint, since someone can file one back if innocent and accuse the accuser of harassment.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

"You suck" isn't an acceptable way to broach any topic, unless you're some socially inept nerd playing a video game I guess. There's a right and wrong way to communicate; "You suck; you're being carried" is an insult. It's not helpful.

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Honestly I feel you're heavily exaggerating the whole situation, since rarely if ever see these type of people you're complaining about. And saying someone sucks is just a simple statement. Even I've been guilty of it after getting tired of a healer dying over and over again on a simple boss mechanic, even after the entire party spent ten minutes explaining it in detail and me calling out when to use what.