What is it with some tanks, healers, and dps?

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Originally Posted by Adire

You accuse me of being an "ableist" despite me saying clearly that physical and mental disability are valid excuses for poor play.

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Pretty sure he called you ableist for equating disability with poor play, and in my opinion it is kind of weird to single it out as a valid excuse. I remember my first run through the Great Gubal Library, the first boss made my computer lag, I got stressed, almost had an autistic meltdown, and eventually did have a minor seizure. The second time I fought the boss, I zoomed the camera in so that I wouldn't have any of those problems and did just fine. I was dead weight because I was new, not because of my disabilities; they just mean I have to learn how to combat whatever triggers might show up. Refusing to learn how to handle your disability isn't any more valid an excuse than any other excuse that's been mentioned imo.

OP, welcome to post-POTD FFXIV. I'd recommend doing what I do and stick with premades. Playing is a lot more fun now.

The game doesn't teach people how to play their jobs properly, and offering advice as a stranger is more often than not met with hostility. You'd think people would be able to read their skill tooltips and do basic maths to figure out that AoE skills, "increases enmity" and shields/HoTs are all good ideas, but apparently not.

Well the question is easy to answer: the game doesn't really give any hints of how to play, since POTD isn't a good place to learn rotations and FATE grinding isn't helpful either. Dungeons are usually an okay way to learn rotations, since you slowly get introduced to new skills but if you're a dps you're gonna have to suffer half an hour of queuing (While tanks or healers might be stuck with dozens of MSQ to catch on). Only other measure for learning stuff is from outside sources (aka sites) but it should be used for basic learning!

Topping all off with no possible way to see the feedback of any kind such as a damage meter and you get a recipe for disaster.

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Originally Posted by AmalonStar

Ok now seems like almost every run I do on my blm either

1) The tank can't seem to hold aggro on groups and I pull mobs off him while I have quelling strikes up and going, or

2) The healer can't always keep up on heals with either groups of mobs or on the boss's or both cases, or

3) the other dps is performing very poorly using spells/abilities in the wrong type of situations like not using thier aoe's on group pulls or using aoe's on single target mobs

I've also been in runs where it's been a combination 2 of the 3 or all three making for avery long and trying run. This has happened while doing the expert roulette, some of the latest content to be released. I know ppl have different skill levels but when they're struggling with basic skills that are taught in the hall of novice how do they get that far into the game and still not know what they're doing?

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Short answer, most people are bad in DF, just takes a bit of effort to notice how much so.

Squishy tank + bad aoe dps = most likey the healer not dpsing at all or people dying because the healer is not used to the tank , taking that much damage.

I had a co heal in dun who refused or did not know how, help raise people, so I had to do it all, who had 270 gear and 275 relic with spell speed and piety as a WHM. This person would sit on 8000+ mp constantly from not knowing how to raise and heal people.

People get carried, and when you try to help them you are flamed, this person called me rude for asking for help to raise and heal because I was explaining I was using all my CDs to help keep mp up while they sat on 8000+ not doing anything. I had to use dissipation and my stacks for drains and healing constantly, trying to save mp for raises. At the end I said I know it is not completely your fault from people standing in bad, but you need improvements. I was called bossy and unkind because of this. if I was unkind I would just slacked off like the rest and let them vote abandon. I do not carry runs to be insulted like that.

There is something wrong with the game if people can be that far ahead gear wise and not know what to do or how to play.

the game just repeats itself. if you are new and did the hall of the novice for your class, you know the basics you need, everything else is just understanding your tooltips and learning on the job. Doesn't matter how fast you level or if you reach lv60 by dungeon, fates, potd or grinding mobs in the field.
that's enough to perform acceptable in the daily content.
those that can't even do that simply don't care.

Players skill is not determineded by the amount of time they spent playing, but the time they spent learning.

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Originally Posted by TitaniumVulpes

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I doubt it. I wasn't even saying everyone who is disabled plays poorly. I myself have severe social anxiety, yet I push myself to excel. Disabilities are oftentimes uncontrollable. If they have a permanent effect on your play, there's nothing you can do. In his little list however, all of those things can be easily avoided if people are simply considerate of their groups.

Unfortunately, it seems some will argue day and night that we should accept that some players won't put in effort. If everyone stopped carrying said players through content, it would be interesting to see the results.

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Originally Posted by Doozer

A problem having a solution doesn't not make it a valid reason for what's happening. You say I'm ignoring reality, but you're saying that because some causes have solutions, that means they should never occur. And you're acting like those things are persistent issues. Like someone being distracted is a valid reason when, for example, they're in a boss fight and someone comes into the room to talk to them, and that diverts their attention for a second too long and they don't move out of an AoE in time. Or something on their computer minimized the game and they weren't able to heal the tank at a critical time and they wiped.

Like are you even trying to understand at all. There are varying reasons that explain why someone might not have done something correctly when you wanted them to. How about you consider other people instead.

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welcome to what I was dealing with. I used my g/f experiences to point out how their behavior/ behavior of others is causing stress and negativity to others, and that people are lashing out with the assumption that everyone is a toxic player. They just gonna talk circles dude. :) I feel ya most of those happen to my g.f and myself one time or another.

to everyone else, take a step back and look how rude you're being, if not a bit selfish.

No excuse how most of you are replying....

From what I've seen most of the time in many content, either 24 man raids or dungeons, Often you happen to fall in an underperforming group, that do not do any mechanics, dying to almost everything, and unable to kill anythings, and suddently a wipe occurs, and... how strange, next attempt, no one die, no one loose barely any HP, and bosses goes down in a blink.

In my opinion there is not that much real "bad" players, but, damn, how much lazy one there is.

Worst of it all, is the game catering to those players instead of considering the ones that actually have to carry them.
If you tag in to duties and expect doing nothing, you should not earn anything.
It is unfair to those who have sometimes to be focused twice as normal to carry others, yet seeing these ones going away with loots and succes.
Worst case I saw : one of the healers in Dun Scaith was in /follow the WHOLE raid, we tried to kicked him several times but it was rejected everytime. The other healer struggled to keep us alive the best he could as he was short on gear.
He got nothing at the end of the dungeon while the /follow one got a Healer loot, and the minion at the end. Do you find that kind of situation normal ? That kind of player should not even had the right to roll on anything. That kind of player should not be able to complete a duty where other players had to play better only to compensate a lazy one.

Yoshida is so eager to have everyone succeeding on everything in the game that it allows players being lazy like this. Is this really what we wants here ?
Efforts being almost less awarded than not playing the game ?