An Open Letter to Yoshida-san: Please Slice One Zero Off the Housing Prices

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

Two things that would make Small more attractive is adding a basement and the ability to resell a lot.

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Yes. Very yes. A small house would be fine if it had a basement.

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Originally Posted by LiadansWhisper

I don't think your tables would fit into your house. >.>

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Have you been in any of the small houses on our server? There's a couple, and they're pretty decked out. Table, chairs, couch, bed, hot tub, wall decorations and more. I agree that every house should have a basement, but a small house isn't as small as you might think.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

And they're practically bursting at the seams, they're so crowded.

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And that's why they need a basement. But they're hardly non-functional.

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

Have you been in any of the small houses on our server? There's a couple, and they're pretty decked out.

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And they're practically bursting at the seams, they're so crowded.

I've seen inside G.I.O's small on Balmung. They've done quite well with it. But if crafting tables and other feature items are coming, there's just no room. But that's not just an issue with small houses. People with even large houses are saying they've hit the limit on number of items (furnishings & walls). Even though they visually have space to put more things, they can't. We just have to hope SE has allowed for future expansion.

I went to one of the neighborhoods and found a Medium house bought, to my surprise, in Balmung. The outside was quite decorated, but that's not what called my attention. What did was the FC message when I examined the Company: they sell HM and EX Primal fights. No wonder they got enough money to get it!

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

I personally feel prices should be

small: 500k. Something anyone could afford. Small fcs could have their own house.
medium: 3 million. Something few could afford without people pitching in. Would require a decent size fc
large: 10 million. Something 1% could afford. Requires a very large fc with many rich members willing to contribute

These would be non legacy prices.

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You're joking right?

500k is literally nothing. That should be the price for individual housing, not FC housing (and honestly, I'm of the opinion that small houses should be for individual players not FCs, since they're so tiny).
3 mil requiring several people to pitch in and a decent sized FC? Before housing prices were announced I had 1.2 mil just by progressing (albeit slowly) through the story. Ever since then I've actually been concentrating on making money for a house and I have over 4.5 mil now (and I'm not even 50).
10 mil isn't something that only 1% could afford, it's something that every FC could afford if their members actually saved up gil and contributed to the housing effort, but alas, no one really wants to make an effort.

Though I do admit that making money on the new servers might be easier than on the Legacy servers.

NOTE: I'm not saying that houses shouldn't be cheap like that. In fact, I believe that prices should be like that with the key difference that the small houses should be reserved for individual players since they're so tiny. I just chuckle at the argument that saving up 3 and 10 mil would be difficult for FCs. It certainly isn't on Phoenix.

More so when the game actually has a big potential gil fountain with treasure hunt alone (which is the same as on Legacy servers):
- 1 Peiste chest is, roughly, 1600 gil per person which is a guaranteed 12800 gil with a party of 8 players.
- 8 maps per day would be roughly 100k per day for the FC.
- And some chests actually drop 5k per player which would be 40k for a single map.

You see now why I consider getting 500k nothing? It would be 5 days "work" for 8 people.

I'll just post a copy of what I translated on the JP translation thread just now here.

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I'll just post this one for now, working on any others still out there for today but thought this one is semi important (in a way)

Rep Post 01/17/14 - Housing - Land cost for S size adjustment

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Originally Posted by Lastygalle

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Sサイズ。
ん、Sサイズだけなの？
MやLは？
S size... S size only? What about M & L?

poster talking about the announcement they made regarding S size housing land prices.

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これまで全ワールドでの土地の売れ行き状況を確認してきましたが、
「Sサイズの土地」と「Mサイズの土地」の需要の差が価格差に見合っていないと判断し、
今回の価格調整を行うことにいたしました。

今後も状況を見ながら価格の調整は行っていきます。
We have been observing all worlds land selling situation, and have decided that the cost isn’t meeting it’s demands between S size land and M size land, therefore made the price adjustment.
We will continue to observe and make adjustments to the cost.

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I'll just translate the first two responses from JP players after that post...

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Originally Posted by Potikun

つまり、みんなMほしがってて、S買ってくれないから安くしましたってことね。
そうじゃないんだよ！そうじゃないんだよ！！
So basically, everyone wants M size and since no one buys the S size we made it cheaper.
That’s not it! You’ve got it wrong!!

(reworded)

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Originally Posted by m_gen

つまりなんだろう、Sサイズは需要がなさそうだから値段下げても売れないだろうし、値下げしますね？って事かな？

MやLは需要があるから、まだ下げるつもりは無い、はやくギル回収に協力してくださいってことかな？
So what, since even if we lower the price on S size since there isn’t much demand it won't sell, so we’ll lower it? That what this means?
M and L size has demands for, that’s why we have no plans to lower it, we want you to participate in gil sinks, is that what this is asking us for?

(reworded)

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Originally Posted by Reinheart

... the first two responses from JP players after that post...

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Oh, LOL, I guess we're all of the same mind here, JP and EN. What I posted on your translation discussion:

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Originally Posted by ArkhamNative

... Many small FCs seem to be saying small is too small and medium is too expensive. Making small cheaper doesn't really address the issue.

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Thanks for the translations!

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

Have you been in any of the small houses on our server? There's a couple, and they're pretty decked out. Table, chairs, couch, bed, hot tub, wall decorations and more. I agree that every house should have a basement, but a small house isn't as small as you might think.

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Um..lol. Yes, I've seen every single small house on the server except the newest one. They're so cramped and crowded that I can't spend more than a minute or two inside them before feeling incredibly claustrophobic. They are not Free Company housing. It's the size of house I'd expect for an individual, not a guild of 10+ people.

Please do not try to sugar-coat poop, dude.

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

You're joking right?

500k is literally nothing. That should be the price for individual housing

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That's the point. That's why I said "anyone can afford"

Content should never be limited. Anyone should be capable of buying a house for their FC. May be a dinky tiny house but a house nonetheless. Housing shouldn't be some look at me I'm so elite thing. It's a thing that all players should be able to enjoy.

Also, a couple million may not seem like much for a FC but it is. Very few are going to be willing to cough up even 100k to fund the house. Because people are greedy and the house won't personally benefit them. The majority of the player base has around 200k gil. (non legacy) Saying you've had over a million before means nothing. You're the exception not the rule.

The content isn't limiting, it requires some diligence in earning gil... it's accessible to everyone regardless of price.

500k is pathetically low.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

The content isn't limiting, it requires some diligence in earning gil... it's accessible to everyone regardless of price.

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I think you need to go look up the word "accessible" and get back to us. *pats*

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500k is pathetically low.

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On this I will agree. However, have you seen the small houses? >.> It's really difficult to argue for a higher price after having seen one.

Checked small house... they should be free. Smaller than my room in RL.

Here's a temporary fix: pick one of the NPC buildings in Coerthas, and start staying in it. It has all the necessities of home, and it's free. $$$$

No, it won't be customizable, but it's free. $$$$

No real perks for the FC, but it's free. $$$$

http://assets.diylol.com/hfs/0a3/259...ait-9a64d3.jpg

Yes, get gil, it's accessible. Not that hard to comprehend, look it up.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

Yes, get gil, it's accessible. Not that hard to comprehend, look it up.

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*sigh*

Housing on some servers is NOT accessible. It's not that hard to comprehend, look it up.

Check the prices on Durandal, my server, and come back in here telling me that it's accessible.

Urgh, go away ><

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Originally Posted by LiadansWhisper

Um..lol. Yes, I've seen every single small house on the server except the newest one. They're so cramped and crowded that I can't spend more than a minute or two inside them before feeling incredibly claustrophobic. They are not Free Company housing. It's the size of house I'd expect for an individual, not a guild of 10+ people.

Please do not try to sugar-coat poop, dude.

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"Also would it be possible to add a basement to Small Free Company Housing? Many believe it's just too small for several people to fit in." I posted this on the Ask Questions for Letter from the Producer LIVE Part XII! (General). Not sure how they chose what to ask but it wouldn't hurt to like and let them know the community wants the floor planning on Small changed.

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

That's the point. That's why I said "anyone can afford"

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You apparently skipped my point.

Group of 8 people doing TH using Peiste maps.

Using your prices at max it would take this group:

5 days to afford a Small house.
30 days to afford a Medium house.
100 days to afford a Large house.

And that's just by doing Treasure Hunt.

I agree that getting a house should be accessible to everyone (and I did mention that I agree with your suggested prices), but I'm not going to pretend that raising 10 mil would take much effort.

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

"Also would it be possible to add a basement to Small Free Company Housing? Many believe it's just too small for several people to fit in." I posted this on the Ask Questions for Letter from the Producer LIVE Part XII! (General). Not sure how they chose what to ask but it wouldn't hurt to like and let them know the community wants the floor planning on Small changed.

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I'd just have to ask...where they would fit the stairway down? :-\ It's so tiny, I don't see where they could put it. :-\

They can probably make a small hole Harvest Moon: Back to Nature style..the ones in the mines.. it wouldn't take up too much space..

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Originally Posted by LiadansWhisper

Um..lol. Yes, I've seen every single small house on the server except the newest one. They're so cramped and crowded that I can't spend more than a minute or two inside them before feeling incredibly claustrophobic. They are not Free Company housing. It's the size of house I'd expect for an individual, not a guild of 10+ people.

Please do not try to sugar-coat poop, dude.

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You are so rude. I'm done talking to you.

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

You are so rude. I'm done talking to you.

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But not done camping out in people's hottubs I bet! :)

Also, in terms of rudeness, I somehow think that you calling anyone and everyone who has a problem with the housing prices "entitled" and saying we just "don't want to do any work for it" is a sight more rude than me calling you on trying to call a pile of poop a diamond.

Just sayin'.

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

You apparently skipped my point.

Group of 8 people doing TH using Peiste maps.

Using your prices at max it would take this group:

5 days to afford a Small house.
30 days to afford a Medium house.
100 days to afford a Large house.

And that's just by doing Treasure Hunt.

I agree that getting a house should be accessible to everyone (and I did mention that I agree with your suggested prices), but I'm not going to pretend that raising 10 mil would take much effort.

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The majority of people aren't going to do this.

You also assume that people would be willing to give up all the gil they make towards the house.

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

The majority of people aren't going to do this.

You also assume that people would be willing to give up all the gil they make towards the house.

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But um, I mean the methods to actually generate gil is there, isn't it? It's just up to people whether it's worth their time or not to farm and then buy a house...right? Just because they don't want to doesn't mean it's not affordable..? (Although I do agree legacy prices are mad.)

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Originally Posted by Laf

Checked small house... they should be free. Smaller than my room in RL.

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Smaller than mine too.

I refuse to spend my company's money on the small house. It's a waste, imo.

small house should be free of charge for every fc to get to level 8 imo

I am infinitely baffled by responses to the thread that says "Prices are fine, people just need to work for it, want things to be handed on plate and etc etc."

1. Clearly doesn't know how it feels like to be treated unfairly.
or
2. Have that awesome ability to tell self to suck it up and deal with it when being treated unfairly and gets shortchanged for something that one didn't even do or involved in.


We won't get a house anytime SOON™

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Originally Posted by RUcio

1. Clearly doesn't know how it feels like to be treated unfairly.
or
2. Have that awesome ability to tell self to suck it up and deal with it when being treated unfairly and gets shortchanged for something that one didn't even do or involved in.

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I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "treated unfairly" or "didn't even do or involved in". Could you expand on that?

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Originally Posted by RUcio

-snip-

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SE disagrees with them. they already started adjusting prices to lower values for the more expensive worlds.

http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...86c0e6bc48426c
http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...8f97ffcc0455ce
also they are reducing the cost of small housing.
http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...8de0140df31567

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Originally Posted by Gramul

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "treated unfairly" or "didn't even do or involved in". Could you expand on that?

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Just saying that it is unjust to treat the whole server a 'rich' server (Legacy) and jack up the price for house plots (For gil sink or w/e purposes) just because a small amount of players carried a large amount of gil, moreover when prices in other servers are a lot cheaper than the one you're in.

Then comes people who kept calling for others to grind for the gil if they want a house probably didn't even realize that most of us are actually working for the gil even before 2.1 hits.

And SE expect us to pay B amount when they told us it's A amount for a piece of land, amount that I don't even think it's reasonable to begin with.

It's hard to please everyone but it's even worse to treat everyone as if they're all on the same bandwagon and that's what SE did.

Not tying to start an argument or something, just my 2 gil thoughts.

Disclaimer: I agree Legacy Housing is crazy expensive and I too believe Cottage size houses need to be bigger. Having said that...

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

The majority of people aren't going to do this. You also assume that people would be willing to give up all the gil they make towards the house.

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So basically the "majority" just wanted to be handed a house without actually doing any work to earn one. Gotcha ya.

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Originally Posted by RUcio

I am infinitely baffled by responses to the thread that says "Prices are fine, people just need to work for it, want things to be handed on plate and etc etc." yada yada yad..
We won't get a house anytime SOON™

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Just checked the prices over at odin and giving everything, the price on Tuesday will be roughly 5.1 million. If your FC can't afford that than they haven't been working to earn money, plain and simple. My FC did a few event, not a lot but we have 5million in the bank and ready to buy our house on the 21st.

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

Disclaimer: I agree Legacy Housing is crazy expensive and I too believe Cottage size houses need to be bigger. Having said that...
So basically the "majority" just wanted to be handed a house without actually doing any work to earn one. Gotcha ya.

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I actually think the point she was trying to make is that players don't want to feel like they have to give up all of their gold for a house that they don't even own.

That's the big sticking point - they do not own the house. And if the FC leader decides to boot them all out of the FC for whatever reason (or no reason at all), they're left out in the cold - with no house, and no money.

I think most players were thinking they could contribute part of their earnings for a house. But expecting people to contribute all of their hard-earned money is a bit much.

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Originally Posted by LiadansWhisper

I actually think the point she was trying to make is that players don't want to feel like they have to give up all of their gold for a house that they don't even own.

That's the big sticking point - they do not own the house. And if the FC leader decides to boot them all out of the FC for whatever reason (or no reason at all), they're left out in the cold - with no house, and no money.

I think most players were thinking they could contribute part of their earnings for a house. But expecting people to contribute all of their hard-earned money is a bit much.

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You need to re-read the conversation then because it was in response to a guy tell her one way a FC can have a FC event and donate the money toward the housing fund. At no point did he say a player should empty their coffer and give everything to the FC.

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Originally Posted by AmnesiaHaze

small house should be free of charge for every fc to get to level 8 imo

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One more piece of proof that I'm not a liar.

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

One more piece of proof that I'm not a liar.

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Then perhaps just a bit overzealous with the hyperbole?

The very few people that feel housing should be free, or require no work, are either obvious trolls, or statistical outliers. To use these few on the fringes as the basis of an argument or as a blanket statement directed towards everyone in this thread is a bit much, and probably won't/shouldn't be taken seriously.

I think we're taking this a bit too far into specific individual statements.

Let's bring the thread back to the core issue. Housing prices on Legacy servers are unfair, lock people out of the content, and are just plain ridiculous. Even with the recent 'adjustments' housing is still out of reach for many players, including players that have spent time since launch saving gil.

First: Unify housing prices across all servers.
Second: Let us know if all size houses will be able to take advantage of all housing activity to come. (Such as chocobo raising, crafters workshops, etc.)

Well, if nothing else, SE is headed in the right direction. Take Balmung (Legacy, NA) medium plot pricing, for example:

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/40/iqor.png
("Actual" is shown through Jan 25ish.)

(I also posted a chart showing Small pricing on Balmung compared to Ultros (New, Tier 3) pricing.)

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

One more piece of proof that I'm not a liar.

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Have you been in a small house? I'd feel cheated by it at any cost They need to make that thing bigger.

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Originally Posted by RUcio

Just saying that it is unjust to treat the whole server a 'rich' server (Legacy) and jack up the price for house plots (For gil sink or w/e purposes) just because a small amount of players carried a large amount of gil, moreover when prices in other servers are a lot cheaper than the one you're in..

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Ah. Alright. I didn't realize the housing was more expensive on Legacy servers. I haven't played on one in ages.

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

So basically the "majority" just wanted to be handed a house without actually doing any work to earn one. Gotcha ya.

Just checked the prices over at odin and giving everything, the price on Tuesday will be roughly 5.1 million. If your FC can't afford that than they haven't been working to earn money, plain and simple.

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You're assuming EVERYONE who wants a house but refused to work for it, better yet, you're thinking every existing FCs works the same, that everyone is a capable million gil grinder.

I can tell you that my FC has collected up to 5m as of now, we worked for the gil when we heard about the feature, but paying 4,832,400gil for Group A worlds (as estimated by the Japanese players for 21st Jan fix) for a shack-sized plot (not including house) does not make any sense, much less for an obscenely higher price in Legacy worlds for that very same size.

-Plot price doc, link provided by Reinheart-
http://tinyurl.com/pna2xuz

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Originally Posted by saber_alter

SE disagrees with them. they already started adjusting prices to lower values for the more expensive worlds.

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Those "price adjustments" are nothing but joke, INSULT to all players and most of all stalling tactics. FFS - YOSHI! Stop hiding and be a MAN - say we f-ed up, have no server capacity for housing, scrape the whole thing and re-launch it when ready for a realistic and of course even prices across all servers. STOP this nonsense - you're only embarassing yourself and making the whole SE looks like fools ...

S/M/L => 1 Mill / 4 Mill / 10 Mill - simple as that.

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

Before housing prices were announced I had 1.2 mil just by progressing (albeit slowly) through the story.

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No you didn't.

If you JUST followed the story and used side-quests and FATEs/dungeons to fill in the missing XP you'd have nothing like that.

You did other things.