Interesting concept, just hope that playtime (quantity) is not more important than skill and efficiency (quality) to acquire materia.
Materia System
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06-02-2011, 05:14 AMChinook
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06-02-2011, 05:24 AMBharata_Senka
This sounds amazing. I love the idea of the "attachment points", it helps to give another threshold to reach for personal growth; helps to take the sting out of grinding.
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06-02-2011, 05:25 AMSigmakanAlong the same lines, will it be the case where people will be using weapons and wearing armor just for creating Materia, instead of using the best equipment/weapons available?Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine
Sounds like a time sink, which may or may not be a good thing.
Once again, this really will depend on SE executes and implements this. -
06-02-2011, 05:30 AMPeregrineThe system doesn't sound to be at all about skill and efficiency. Simply about the time it takes to wear a weapon out, then take your shot at a HQ materia. IF HQ yay upgrade, gil or trade! If NQ, trash.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chinook
Sounds like the time it takes to wear a weapon out is so that crafters can't run amok with just spamming materia-shot after materia shot to HQ like they spam crab bows already. Now there's a steady depletion of crab bows, but not an infinite paced one.
No mention on whether there are HQ catalysts, or HQ ways to put the materia onto the weapon.
If battlers are allowed to make HQ materia (reasonable, they did the work of loving on that weapon), and crafters are allowed for that rare shot to double materia a weapon (kindof overpowered but w/e if all crafters have equal opportunity)...but gatherers don't get **** to say in terms of the economic power of the new system...well...
such is the life of a XIV gatherer. Right under the bus, every time. Power to the miners! -
06-02-2011, 05:34 AMPeregrineOy yeah. Unless they level-cap the gear and better gear yields better materia. That will incentivize wearing the best gear, and enforce wearing the APPROPRIATE gear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigmakan
Unfortunately that will incentivize destroying the best gear. So...even less of a utility in making midlevel weapons which are just...a wasteland of supply right now. Then you have to start thinking about materia ranks, R30 materia goes in R30 weapons, made from R30 weapons, R50 materia is from R50 weapons that go into R50 weapons.
It's gonna be a big design counter-design chain reaction to make it all work well. It's not just a simple set it and mark that check box off (like guild tasks), or it'll be lolmateria. -
06-02-2011, 05:36 AMAlhanelem
This materia idea sounds pretty interesting. looking forward to seeing it.
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06-02-2011, 05:39 AMSonic_the_HedgehogHuh? The gatherers are the ones that collect the catalysts, without the gatherers there would be no way to join the materia with the items.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine
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06-02-2011, 05:42 AMCairdeasSo wait? the way I read it was you could "Grow" a materia in an equipment just from using the equipment itself or you could force one into it with crafting. (no fail rate.) But to get two materia into a equipment you have to do a special system which has a chance to fail?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_the_Hedgehog
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06-02-2011, 05:45 AMzaviermhigo
So materia is weird crap that builds on my armor and I scrape it off sometimes? JK but it kinda sounds like that from first paragraph of dev post.
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06-02-2011, 05:47 AMPeregrineIt's not about you technically playing a part as a gatherer. It's whether or not you control a rate-limiting step in the process that people will demand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_the_Hedgehog
For the battler, that power sounds like it lies not in their ability to make materia (trash) but in their ability to HQ a materia (win).
For the crafter, their ability not just to put the materia in the weapon (trash), but to put two of them in (win).
For the gatherer...they provide the catalyst? Trash? Win?
Gonna have to make it pretttttty rare for it to be win. -
06-02-2011, 05:49 AMPeregrineBattlers make materia without help it sounds like.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
Crafters put materia into gear using catalysts by gatherers.
That's all I got. -
06-02-2011, 05:50 AMPerrin_AybarraThe way I understand it is that once you reach 100% attachment points, which are attained by equiping gears (maybe some gears attune better together then others) you get to transform these gears into materia which is a crystalized stat augment that you attach to another gear. So you lose the orignal gears to attach to your new gear.Quote:
By using the armor and weapons that you equip yourself with, you will generate "attachment points"* and when your attachment points reach 100% you will be able to convert them into "materia." This is known as "materia conversion." "Materia" is a crystallized form of the weapon and armor’s stats that the player has used and formed an attachment to.
It doesn't just grow on your gear. And you need the help from crafters to attach it to the gear and the gatherers to provide the catalyst to attach it. -
06-02-2011, 05:51 AMSonic_the_HedgehogThis is how I interpreted it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
DoW/DoM "create" materia with their weapons and armor
Crafters are the only ones that fuse the materia to the weapons and items, but in order to do so they need the
Gatherers to collect the catalysts in the field in order to make the process work. -
06-02-2011, 05:51 AMCairdeasQuote:
Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra
It sounds like your converting the Attachment Points not the gear itself. -
06-02-2011, 05:51 AMTeknomanIts like this:Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
*Equip a frostbite or flametongue
*Use it until attachment points hit 100
* go to your local friendly neighborhood crafter and get it turned into a materia
*crafter uses catalyst from a gatherer to create said materia
* gain a materia thats +strength,attack, extra fire damage/ice damage/etc.
* place shiny new materia into the slot of one of a new weapon you want to use or armor
*????
*Profit
The only way I could see not losing the weapon/equipment you converted, is if attachment points reset to 100...but then people would just be able to constantly stack the most powerful materia with little to no trouble at all...and that just wouldnt be fun.
EDIT: I know you cant give people those rare/ex weapons, but there might be a special materia offer system like the repair system. -
06-02-2011, 05:52 AMCairdeasThis sounds interesting. It sounds like you could use the Materia to take the stats from a gear you hate the looks of and force it into a gear you like the looks of. I would enjoy this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknoman
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06-02-2011, 05:55 AMSonic_the_HedgehogI guess I get what you're saying, but there could be multiple catalysts, some rarer than others.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine
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06-02-2011, 05:55 AMPeregrineNope. Battlers make the materia! You'll be able to materia-ize a flametongue just fine that way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknoman
The catalyst isn't for making materia. It's for placing it into the new weapon.
Yeah.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_the_Hedgehog
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06-02-2011, 06:08 AMKiara
Thanks Bayohne / FF XIV Team. :)
It's too early right now, but this bit of information certainly gives us hope. I think the fun and excitement will be in seeing what combinations you personally enjoy / want to have.
It also adds a lot of variety to the game. I could see scenarios where you have:
(Simple examples)
* Iron Scutum w/ VIT +5 Materia
vs.
* Iron Scutum w/ Counterattack 10% Materia
Which one is better? I guess it depends on the player. And even with the "forbidden technique" of attaching 2 Materia (instead of 1), would you rather have:
* Iron Scutum w/ VIT +5 Materia *and* Counterattack 10% Materia
or
* Iron Scutum w/ VIT +5 Materia *and* VIT +5 Materia
or
* Iron Scutum w/ Counterattack 10% Materia *and* Counterattack 10% Materia
If nothing else, it's going to make Items and FF XIV more interesting and fun. :)
Can't wait! (^_^) -
06-02-2011, 06:12 AMTeknomanOhhh nevermind, I see now. Its a 3 step involving all 3 different types of discipline types. Guess I read the first part wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine
In that case, I hope there is some sort of special effect when turning the item into materia. We'll probably have to go on some quest to unlock the ability though. -
06-02-2011, 06:15 AMSonic_the_HedgehogHopefully ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknoman
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06-02-2011, 06:27 AMBalbanesQuote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
HAWT! :-D
/10 -
06-02-2011, 06:28 AMGabbaGabba
hmm i hate to speculate but im going to have to:
if we have an item that we equipped with a materia, say Wand + (+1 INT materia); if we were to take that same Wand and "materialize" it, we wouldn't gain any benefits from that materia already on the weapon? so 'materializing' a Wand and a Wand with a materia attached yeilds the same result? sorry if this sounds confusing
I am looking forward to this though, it takes customization another step and hopefully the time/money sink isn't too long and also isn't too short where people will have the best materia attached to the best equip in a matter of hours after its been implemented.
it would be interesting to see them implement weapons that have crappy stats on em at lv50 and once u get 100% attachment points, u can turn it into a beastly materia. kinda like the lv72 BCNM r/ex weapons that had a latent effect on em. their stats sucked at first but after using it for a while, it unlocks the latent and becomes a really really good endgame weapon -
06-02-2011, 06:35 AMSigmakan
Sounds like Dark Cloud.
Thats a good thing btw. Lets hope its executed as well. -
06-02-2011, 06:36 AMSparkerI can't imagine losing the weapon you used. You earn attachment points to 100 then they are reset to 0 when you make a materia. No way people are having their HQ weapons turned into materia.Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknoman
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06-02-2011, 06:38 AMSigmakanit makes perfect sense that you lose the weapon. If you havent noticed there is a flood of equipment and weapons. This will help 'consume' the mass supply.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparker
If you dont want to lose your HQ weapon then dont turn it into materia -
06-02-2011, 06:39 AMJynxI think that may be the point to weapons converting into materia. It's a nice progression system that rewards us for using weapons for a long time. Also a bit of a nostalgia effect you could technically turn all of your old weapons into materia to bring them along with the next weapon you upgrade so you could almost have a legacy materia that was the culmination of your entire leveling process.Quote:
Originally Posted by GabbaGabba
*edit*
I also hope weapons and armour do dissapear when converted to materia, there needs to be some form of consumption to help crafters stay in a dynamic market instead of it slowly stagnating from saturation. -
06-02-2011, 06:41 AMSparkerIt doesn't make perfect sense. People are reading too much into this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigmakan
"By using the armor and weapons that you equip yourself with, you will generate "attachment points"* and when your attachment points reach 100% you will be able to convert them("them" means the points you've earned, not the gear) into "materia." This is known as "materia conversion." "Materia" is a crystallized form of the weapon and armor’s stats (Stats from the weapon, not the weapon itself) that the player has used and formed an attachment to. " -
06-02-2011, 06:45 AMLaughlynWow sounds promising & exciting, i smell "Enchantment" for some reason lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
Thank you for the information, looking forward to it. ^.^)b
- Noomy -
06-02-2011, 06:48 AMYazoo
Oh! Sounds awesome! Every discipline have a place in the system. I'm so excited!
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06-02-2011, 06:54 AMRentahamsterActually, in this case the antecedent to the preposition "them" is ambiguous and can either refer to the points, or to the "armor and weapons".Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparker
If you read the original Japanese post, it's a little clearer that you turn the actual item into materia. -
06-02-2011, 06:55 AMSonic_the_Hedgehog"Them" could be talking about armor and weapons as well. After the "conversion" the weapons and armors are gone and all that is left is the weapon and armor's stats in crystalline form. If they said Materia is a crystallized form of the weapon and armor, then we'll have a bunch of people thinking they could wear crystal gear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparker
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06-02-2011, 07:06 AMSephr
Whilst I'd agree that it might be a good idea to consume weapons/armour, I think the whole 'oversized weapon pool' thing would eventually sort itself out once we got new content and the current range became less desirable, and perhaps alternative and cheaper synths than weapons and armour themselves are made available.
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06-02-2011, 07:09 AMPhysicyoud still have a wealth of level 50 items no one needs. This system will basically create a destruction of item system thats voluntary, though, i wonder are they going to get rid of item durability with this? hmmmQuote:
Originally Posted by Sephr
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06-02-2011, 07:20 AMColdbrandI don't think removing materia should destroy it. I'd like if you were able to learn spells and or abilities from materia like FFVII, or especially job traits. But really, please keep calling it Materia, and please make the "crystals" spherical and look like the materia of FFVII.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
Actually, I really hope this isn't like synergy in FFXI, I REALLY hope it's not like augments, make it so you can craft specific materia and allow for combinations to unlock new effects. I don't care for randomness on my gear. -
06-02-2011, 07:20 AMzaviermhigo
I thought you would build up ap on gear and they would give you materia slots for extra enhancements. just speculation. it was a vague statement in my opinion.
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06-02-2011, 07:34 AMAmineri
Just want to point out that Bayohne mentioned weapons and armor .... I surely hope that tools are included in that.
This way, EVERY class can participate in creation of materia. One possibility / hope / speculation is that the experience that went to the now-defunct physical level is used to create the "attachment points" needed to convert said item into materia.
Also, using an NPC (who presumably charges gil) to convert the items into Materia is a wonderful (imho) new gil sink. This system creates both a gil sink AND an item sink... :) -
06-02-2011, 07:35 AMSweetheartI can only say, great job and great system /clap :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
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06-02-2011, 07:36 AMindira
materia system was just your magic and stuff in ff7, we already have that, were just missing traits and ablitys for each class like right now its too universal Job specific.
if they add something like that it should be none item system should let it be made another way, cuz just going to the markets and buying one is blah and typical, should be like ff8 draw mako from points on the map then build the materia you want from a list your character makes from quest then have that materia forever then you can upgrade it later or level it up. that would be more RPG and something you can build off of.
--just my version. -
06-02-2011, 07:37 AMCairdeasThats how I read it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparker