SE consider a free to play option

Goddamn cheapskates. It's a MMO with content that is constantly updated; 10 bucks is nothing.

People are all too happy to pay for DLC that should be on a disc in the first place nowadays but don't want to pay for perpetual updates to a game that is constantly evolving. No wonder the industry is in the gutter.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Darkillumina

Goddamn cheapskates. It's a MMO with content that is constantly updated 10 bucks is nothing.

People are all too happy to pay for DLC that should be on a disc in the first place nowadays but don't want to pay for perpetual updates to a game that is constantly evolving. No wonder the industry is in the gutter.

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DLC is a single payment, different thing

fak no, d3 and gw2 were my first and last mmo's i will ever play that have no monthly to them. totally different mmo. the need to stop using the same genre name for all these mmo's cause they not the same.

FFXIV was only free-to-play because SE, (a historically proud and unapologetic company) wanted to apologize to their fans for the poor condition of a highly anticipated numbered title in their franchise. However, they never had any intention of keeping the game free-to-play. Just as they had announced, when the game reached a point viewed acceptable by the company they began the subscription service and their appreciation (legacy) program.

That said, FFXIV: ARR is a completely different game than what we've all experienced thus far.
I think too many people are bringing up these idea with only 1.0 in mind.

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

Wasn't 1.0 FTP for most of its life anyway?

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I think this is the reason that this idea has been coming up so often.

I imagine there were some people that played 14 when it was free, and didn't continue to play when the subscription fees were added on. I can only assume that these people really enjoyed FF14 for free: saw The End of An Era trailer, have seen the alpha footage of ARR, and want to experience 14 again for free as they had before.

Someone left food out for the stray cats for a while, and now they just keep coming back. Maybe?

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

You seem like youd fit right in the WoW and FFXI community

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What does this mean? Did FFXI turn me into a monster!? ._.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

I have no problem paying for something thats good however. I seen F2P games that offered more then 1.0.

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Which was why 1.0 was free for so long, and they went straight work on the revamp/improvements.
But we're looking at 2.0 now, and no longer 1.0. You'll be getting your free month of 2.0 so you can make the decision of whether or not 2.0 deserves your money! If it's not your speed or not up to snuff, you can just progress through the story and then let your account lapse until they add something enticing.

A great many XI veterans like you and I did this in between big updates/expansions.

We can do it again. Seems like you're still hoping for the game to be well worth paying for. People will burn you at the stake for even suggesting that the free to play/low quality idea might be okay, though.

After all, it's not just another MMO by some company.. it's also a Final Fantasy title made by video game super power SE. Fanatics are going to want it to be P2P and the highest caliber experience possible because anything else for FF or SE seems ludicrous. (And you've played enough XI to know how crazy us FF fan-boys/girls can be, haven't you?)

Cheers

Nothx. All the F2P games OP mentioned are free for a reason....they suck.

And really. It's like 10 bucks a month, are you seriously that strapped for cash? Fucking go get a job working less than one hour a week at minimum wage instead of bitching about not having everything handed to your ADD ass.

I also don't like the idea of "disposable" games that you pick up and play like once a week for a few hours. The fact that they are "free" promotes zero dedication, breeds shitty players, loses a large sense of accomplishment and increases RMT.

Those games aren't F2P because they are good. They are F2P because they have failed and it's a last ditch effort to attempt to draw some players back.

F2p No Thanks!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Riv

Nothx. All the F2P games OP mentioned are free for a reason....they suck.

And really. It's like 10 bucks a month, are you seriously that strapped for cash? Fucking go get a job working less than one hour a week at minimum wage instead of bitching about not having everything handed to your ADD ass.

I also don't like the idea of "disposable" games that you pick up and play like once a week for a few hours. The fact that they are "free" promotes zero dedication, breeds shitty players, loses a large sense of accomplishment and increases RMT.

Those games aren't F2P because they are good. They are F2P because they have failed and it's a last ditch effort to attempt to draw some players back.

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I have ADHD and I can afford the game what you talking about o_o and I balance 3 mmos a social life work and college o.O/ bad side i don't have a social life o_o ADHD lets me do like 3 things at once Its awesome =3

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zumi

I am the type of person who wants to buy a game once not pay any fees for it after paying for around 10 years of FFXI I am pretty much never want to play a fee based game again. Times and attitudes change. Why do you think there is so many F2P mmos now? A lot of people just had enough with the sub model.

While I did pay the monthly fee for FFXI and FFXIV at the same time I felt like I should of been getting more for my money.

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Because they failed to deliver a good quality game and lost a ton of subs so they changed to F2P to salvage the game

Star Wars: The Old Republic - Came out full of gamebreaking bugs(1 year later and 1 of my characters is still broken and unplayable), watered down gameplay and waaaay too many servers. Went F2P in 11 months.

DC Universe Online - While being a fun game they did not deliver enough content to keep player interested and so the community dwindled into nothing. Went F2P in 10 months

Guild Wars 2 - Started with a B2P business model but will cash out on your pockets with small expansions that add very little but cost half as much as launch priced purchase.

All Points Bulletin - While not technically a full MMO, was a great game with great ideas being put into it, had the best character customization I've seen in any game and it only got better from that point. HOWEVER the game grew rampant with hackers while at the same time the company made balances to weapons based off a small minority of the players crying because they died to x. This all spiraled out of control, lack of content updates and no actions being taken to rid the game of hackers caused a massive drop in population. In 2 months the company was put into administration and a month later the game went down. Went F2P and bankrupted the company in 4 months(7 if you count the months the game was shut down).

I could name every game that is or went F2P but the story is the same, the games were not recieved well, lost subscribers and as a last ditch effort they make it F2P to keep the game alive and slowly make their profit. The reason we have a staggering ammount of F2P games today is due to the quality of games are lacking big time and people lose the will to keep paying for a "meh" game.

FFXI lasted 10 years and still counting with a P2P model, WoW lasted 8 years and counting with a P2P model and the latter is still widely accepted as one of the most popular MMOs on the market and the one all these new games have to beat while competing with the other newbloods.

geez im more mad that people keep changing the term F2P into FTP, is not fucking SAME.


https://www.google.com.my/search?q=f...hrome&ie=UTF-8


AND GTFO if you say "Nobody Cares" because the INTERNET DOES! Stupid kids who think they made the INTERNETs

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Originally Posted by Seirra_Lanzce

geez im more mad that people keep changing the term F2P into FTP, is not fucking SAME.


https://www.google.com.my/search?q=f...hrome&ie=UTF-8


AND GTFO if you say "Nobody Cares" because the INTERNET DOES! Stupid kids who think they made the INTERNETs

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Ever googled an acronym? There are so many with the same format.

F2P is the generally accepted format (though we are using that term a bit loosely here since really its a hybrid of premium and free).

Free To Play = FTP. Makes sense to me, though of course having a CS background I read File Transfer Protocol, but in context it doesnt make sense so I read Free To Play.

Just like when speaking there, their, they're - context calls function.

Acronyms are not limited to a single set of words. While confusing it is a completely legitimate action.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Ever googled an acronym? There are so many with the same format.

F2P is the generally accepted format (though we are using that term a bit loosely here since really its a hybrid of premium and free).

Free To Play = FTP. Makes sense to me, though of course having a CS background I read File Transfer Protocol, but in context it doesnt make sense so I read Free To Play.

Just like when speaking there, their, they're - context calls function.

Acronyms are not limited to a single set of words. While confusing it is a completely legitimate action.

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And so humanity has let them self be ignorants... .

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Originally Posted by Seirra_Lanzce

And so humanity has let them self be ignorants... .

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OR that you think you are a lord of English and its usage. (Common misconception of languages is that they are static - they are most definitely not)

I can make words and acronyms when I want how I want, whether they get caught into the mainstream is a separate issue.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Acronyms are not limited to a single set of words. While confusing it is a completely legitimate action.

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Indeed, not sure why Seirra is all bent out of shape over it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FTP_%28disambiguation%29

FTP is used from everything including a function of IMF, a type of cable, a political party in Thailand, a New Deals project, and even a communist French resistance group in WW2!!

It's all about context.

The reasons why pay-to-play MMORPGs go free-to-play - especially IP-Based MMORPGs like this one - is because they fail to keep subscribers interested in the long-term. This is due to a lot of things - lack of communication, of innovation, of variation, and much more. When an MMORPG can't hold itself together anymore from lack of subscribers, then it goes F2P.

This game can hold itself together for a long time (unless Realm Reborn fails horribly, in which I can begin to understand F2P as an option) because it has enough players to keep it going. The company's doing fine enough that financial backing isn't a problem, either.

Not only that, but F2P games are garbage in quality 99 percent of the time (Thank you, Korea). Yes, there are exceptions, but do NOT say that Guild Wars 2 is a viable comparison. Guild Wars 2 is developed by ArenaNet as well as produced by NCSoft. Even if the playerbase were to drop, the game would still recieve some sort of funding because of K-AION/Lineage 2/bunch of other games.

Some could say that FFXIV is the same, being funded by the same sort of company - but what matters is that for each game, their model WORKS. Until the time where subscriptions don't work, I don't see why we really need to put in the effort. A game doesn't need a bajillion subscribers to be considered an MMORPG. If a few hundred thousand isn't massive then you need a reality check. Imagine a hundred thousand people in one room? Do you guys even KNOW a hundred thousand people? If yes, then congratulations, Mr. President.

Some could say that F2P is the way of the future - it is instead an adaptation... to crappy F2P MMO clones and washed-out Western P2P MMO releases-gone-wrong. And, as adaptations go, people seem to expect it, in all of its shitty f2p glory.

This game's model works. Until it doesn't work, I don't see the damn point.

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Originally Posted by Aenarion

Indeed, not sure why Seirra is all bent out of shape over it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FTP_%28disambiguation%29

FTP is used from everything including a function of IMF, a type of cable, a political party in Thailand, a New Deals project, and even a communist French resistance group in WW2!!

It's all about context.

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I read it as Fried Twinkie Pancakes. Usually leaves a better taste in my mouth than FTP games, that's for sure.

I'd rather have the P2P system.
The people who invest the money into it and of course, time, usually stick with the game, making it a tighter community.
I don't want Brazilians infesting this world with their "BR Gib muney huehuehue" and crappy communities like that who'd play the game for 2-3 days, not get what they want/or even get good stuff, and then bolt because it's f2p, who cares right?

Wrong. I don't want to waste my time or anyone's with people with this mentality, which unfortunately depicts 90% of the MMO and gaming community, entitled lazy douches.

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Originally Posted by PinkamenaDiane

With free to play + micro transaction model some people will be inclined to buy funny hats, unique looking armor, weapons, mounts, exp boosts they will actually end up spending more money then like 10 subscribers.

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Except you right? You're not gonna buy sh*t. lol

I assume all you "Pay to Play" people use American Express and gladly pay it's yearly fee when paying for your MMOs? It clearly superior to Visa and MasterCard right?

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Originally Posted by Laraul

I assume all you "Pay to Play" people use American Express and gladly pay it's yearly fee when paying for your MMOs? It clearly superior to Visa and MasterCard right?

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Is this supposed to be clever?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gokulo

Is this supposed to be clever?

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Is that question rhetorical?

What you don't get by asking for F2P is the shallowness of that. How much exp does it take to level? Multiply it by 2 and sell exp boosts. How tough should this fight be? Multiply the damage by 1.5 and sell potions in the cash shop. How should you obtain some nice looking gear? Sell it in the cash shop instead of it relating to game content or being tied to progression. How hard is it to progress through the story? Buy a bunch of items and don't worry about it.

When everything boils down to microtransactions there's no way for the developers to control what kind of experience you are going to wind up having. And instead of a well-crafted, cinematic, elevated art form, you're going to get a cheapened, purposeless, hamster wheel of a way to spend your time. I mean this is Final Fantasy. It's known for its substance. People take pride in making it. If you don't have any pride or substance in your life, maybe this isn't the game for you. If you want to be as mediocre as the games you want to play, go play Aion or some other Korean game that exists purely for that purpose.

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Originally Posted by Gokulo

Is this supposed to be clever?

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I was wondering that myself.. wonder if they know you dont need a CC to play.

On topic: OP wants p2p benefits while someone else picks up the bill by buying a couple "funny hats". No thanks, its all been said already so I dont need to go into detail why this would ruin the game for the people who atcually like it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laraul

I assume all you "Pay to Play" people use American Express and gladly pay it's yearly fee when paying for your MMOs? It clearly superior to Visa and MasterCard right?

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lolwut?


No seriously? What?


I don't even get this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

However games like GW2 which are ftp but have the in-game store where you can buy whatever you need, do not get any money from me because I dont use the store option...ever. And other games I tried that were ftp got stale fast and had more in-game problems than any ptp I have experienced. Comparing ARR to WoW, XI or any established older game is just a silly arguement. You cant expect 10 years worth of content at release.

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I just have to chime in on this, because remarks like the bolded part drive me up the wall.

Guild Wars 2 is not free to play. You (or someone else) had to buy GW2 in order for you (or them) to play it. Without having purchased a copy of the game, you can not create an account of your own, login or play. When you have to spend money to acquire something, it's not free.

The key word here is "Free". It's a very important term when you're categorizing a game as "Free to Play", "Buy To Play" or "Pay To Play".

I understand people say "F2P" as in "no subscription", but that's not what F2P means. A F2P MMO is one like Perfect World, or Allods, or Runes of Magic, where you can download, install, login, create a character and play without having to buy anything. Those are the games that rely entirely on cash shop sales to stay afloat, and those are the ones that really limit the gameplay experience in order to drive more microtransactions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by strallaalaa

fak no, d3 and gw2 were my first and last mmo's i will ever play that have no monthly to them. totally different mmo. the need to stop using the same genre name for all these mmo's cause they not the same.

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Here's another incorrect statement that drives me nuts, so I'd like to clarify it once more...

Diablo 3 is not a MMO. It's an action RPG with optional limited multiplayer. It's no more a MMO than Diablo 1 or 2 were, and they weren't MMOs, either.

I don't understand this penchant people have for taking any new term introduced to gaming and then using it to retro-actively redefine everything else that came before it.

There's a big difference between a game being "multiplayer" and being "massively multiplayer", and it's not just the number of people.

It's true you never see normal patches, they'll make some content updates rarely like once a year maybe a "Big" content update but generally all you see on their main sites are "OMFG CASH SHOP SALE!!!! OMFG CASH SHOP TIERED EVENT!!!! OMFG NEW CASH SHOP ITEMS~!!!"

I mean I'd play Allods because it's a decent game but.... Meh.... It really is pay to win at end game...

Mediocrity Online initial subscribers:

PinkamenaDiane
Zumi

On another note, I think it would be a good idea for them to offer some kind of ongoing trial period, like up to a certain level or perhaps a trial after your subscription has ended for a couple weeks or something. Just to lower the barrier of entry. The barrier of entry to FFXI has always been way too high.

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Originally Posted by Endigiont

lolwut?


No seriously? What?


I don't even get this.

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American Express has a yearly fee on certain "tiers" of its credit cards. I believe the Platinum Card has a yearly fee. They also have cards without yearly fees, though. Either way, you're a "member" not a "user", as AMEX's advertising puts it.

Laraul is just trying to draw a relationship between monthly MMO subs and Yearly AMEX membership fees.

It's a ridiculous analogy so, don't worry. You're not missing much.

It's especially funny considering many people who use AMEX do consider it to be superior to Visa and MC... which would probably figure into why they're using AMEX in the first place. Ya'd think.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laraul

I assume all you "Pay to Play" people use American Express and gladly pay it's yearly fee when paying for your MMOs? It clearly superior to Visa and MasterCard right?

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FYI, I do have AMEX, and I very much enjoy the non-existent yearly fee since it's part of my Costco membership. Oh, and I do like the automatic 1 extra year of warranty on almost everything I buy... and that free $25 statement credit they're handing out today.

What were you saying again?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Neptune

Mediocrity Online initial subscribers:

PinkamenaDiane
Zumi

On another note, I think it would be a good idea for them to offer some kind of ongoing trial period, like up to a certain level or perhaps a trial after your subscription has ended for a couple weeks or something. Just to lower the barrier of entry. The barrier of entry to FFXI has always been way too high.

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A good 14 day trial that allows players to dive in and get a good feel for the game, the pacing, the types of content and such would be just fine. They could even make it an "endless trial" with the limitation of only being able to, say, do stuff within a couple of the starting areas, like Gridania, Central and Western Shroud or something.

Put restrictions on /tells, sending mail, /shouts and such so RMT can't abuse it.

Allow them to do so without having to enter any credit card information.

Voila, a perfectly good way to test-drive the game without having to make any commitments or investments.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Riv

Nothx. All the F2P games OP mentioned are free for a reason....they suck.

And really. It's like 10 bucks a month, are you seriously that strapped for cash? Fucking go get a job working less than one hour a week at minimum wage instead of bitching about not having everything handed to your ADD ass.

I also don't like the idea of "disposable" games that you pick up and play like once a week for a few hours. The fact that they are "free" promotes zero dedication, breeds shitty players, loses a large sense of accomplishment and increases RMT.

Those games aren't F2P because they are good. They are F2P because they have failed and it's a last ditch effort to attempt to draw some players back.

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lol nice!

Man I wish I possessed the brevity and eloquence of some of y'all in these forums... :-/. Seems I'm cursed to be long-winded and verbose when ever I try to convey my thoughts on certain things XD.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zumi

No I haven't free loaded anything I have bought the $75 collectors edition, and paid over a few hundred on sub fees, as well as 10 years of FFXI.

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I'll just quote myself so you can re-read what I said and maybe comprehend it this time...

Quote:

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"You're a would-be free-loader with an entitled attitude who wants others to pay for their entertainment. End of story."

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I referred to you as a would-be free-loader. In other words, "if you had your way, you would have others paying for your entertainment"

Get it now?

Where do you come up with this stuff...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zumi

So SE already has different levels of subscriptions it would be very easy to add a F2P level

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So they add a F2P...which people could just pay the cheap monthly price and get everything. Free to play is great if you hate paying for your enjoyment, which appears to be what this generation of gamers thrives on given the piracy numbers sky rocketing, but f2P always degrades into b2w and your game fails with the general populace that can't spend MORE MONEY on it than you would a monthly fee.

In GW2 you can spend $100s in a day...yet people bitch about a $9-$15 MONTHLY FEE.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laraul

I assume all you "Pay to Play" people use American Express and gladly pay it's yearly fee when paying for your MMOs? It clearly superior to Visa and MasterCard right?

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Actually my AMEX has no annual fee.

And yes you're right, it does have a certain "cool factor" over Visa, MasterCard and even Discover. Lol.

But i pay for XIV with a debit card anyway. :cool:

I've played very few games that are F2P but my limited experience with them has been of low quality which is why I hardly ever make my way back to them. A very limited trial version I can understand, it helps pull in players and build a community, but the monthly fee isn't that harsh. Overall I think the general feeling is that F2P isn't worth the decrease in service and game quality that would probably follow if SE opened that option up. What's more is I don't mind paying a monthly fee but it would bug the crap out of me if I had to watch other people enjoy "1337" gear they bought instead of earned. I like that every item in the game can be earned.

No thanks to f2p rather p2p.

I feel like people tend to behave more when the game has a monthly subscription, and based on my experience it would also make sense that paying over time creates a financial investment in the game, and so people are less likely to jump between p2p games. You may get a smaller influx of players when the game launches, but the game will maintain a more steady/loyal fan-base if it is worth playing.

Part of the reason that WoW is so successful is because it is p2p. People not only invested serious amounts of time into the game, but money, too. The other part is that the game was (ghasp!) good at the time that it came out, and very addictive, so the combination of the addictiveness, plus the guilt of leaving behind an investment is what has helped that game maintain its community. No other game has seen that success because honestly no other game has been AS good, while boasting the amount of content to keep people who migrate from WoW entertained past the free month - which to their credit is not easy to do, since WoW has been around for ages.

Free to play attracts a totally different kind of player, and usually they don't stick around for very long. It can work for keeping a game alive, but usually at the cost of sacrificing the community and consistent content updates.

If this was F2P it would be another Vindictus all 15+Gear in FFXIV;ARR case all +5Melds and i dout anyone wanna see abunch of ppl running arounds OPing the game like that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laraul

I assume all you "Pay to Play" people use American Express and gladly pay it's yearly fee when paying for your MMOs? It clearly superior to Visa and MasterCard right?

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no i use eorzian express

but on another note you could just pay for subs using ultimate game cards

I like p2p :D so when i don't have anymore money, i'll be forced to quit and catch up with console games xD