Zepla: Endwalker is the Worst FFXIV Expansion I have played

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Originally Posted by Blossoming

What the heck? When did that happen? I never actually heard about that one but that’s horrible.

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A content creator named scottzone i think who was doxxed and harassed for saying they would like more then 4 raids in a raid tier which was there only criticism and loved everything else about the game. But was harassed out of the community for it.

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Originally Posted by Blossoming

What the heck? When did that happen? I never actually heard about that one but that’s horrible.

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Yeah, great community BTW is basically a meme because this community is the absolute worst criticism wise, you better not dare criticize this game or you will get attacked and if you have a tiny bit of "public appearance", be ready to have your reputation tarnished, if not to have your infos leaked

The only thing that will one day kill this game, be it in 5 years or 10 years or more, will not be Yoshi P, not the WoW players, but the community itself.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

A content creator named scottzone i think who was doxxed and harassed for saying they would like more then 4 raids in a raid tier which was there only criticism and loved everything else about the game. But was harassed out of the community for it.

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A good example of #GCBTW

Tbh our community can be scary

I always heard that our community is friendly but personally i never built any successful bond/contact in-game.
When i almost did it, ended in a weird and dramatic way.

Most people in-game won't attack you randomly...and that is good, i guess. I mean..why we are considering a bonus such normal behavior?



Now Endwalker is lacking in need for commitment, the Twelve was not used as it should be and my queues take longer than i expected.
Today Primal PF had 4 duty-related stuff open and 14 "others" filled with night clubs, bars and cafe.


Yoshi P is happy about the game, from a complete fail to money printer, his mission is complete, the first arc finished.

i don't know if i feel optimistic about the future.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

A good example of #GCBTW

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Whats also sad is the forums has a group that actively went after aveyond and a few others for there criticisms if they still do that and derail threads over any kind of criticism or if someone isn't liked or speculated to be a titanmen alt that starts a thread.

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Originally Posted by Elissar

i don't know if i feel optimistic about the future.

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Ill judge it after it happens and we get into Dawntrail.
We went through Covid BS, and SE was 'possibly' taking from FFXIVs success and slowed things down. I jsut wanna have the blind optimism that we are Full speed ahead next Expansion.
Issues have ben brought up many times, Id like to think they have been listening, they have just been silent about it and never addressed it.

Cant say for sure, Im not a Psychic, but I like to belive they will deliver, or at least try to.
Im sure they dont want to be in teh same position for the game like BFA and Shadowlands.
1 bad(ish) expansion, they saw that they can bleed. Patch it up, and make sure to never take a hit like this again.

If FFXIV really is this big money maker, they cant afford to have a Critical Failure.
Hopefully SE and the Devs know this.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

Whats also sad is the forums has a group that actively went after aveyond and a few others for there criticisms if they still do that and derail threads over any kind of criticism or if someone isn't liked or speculated to be a titanmen alt that starts a thread.

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It had more to do so with alot of his ideas to "Fix" the games story.
Some of which was questionable and laughable, and even had some narrative Oversights. And he was pretty much saying "Do exactly what these games do, and dont do your own thing. Because I just want more Heavenward"
Which hey, to each their own.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

It had more to do so with alot of his ideas to "Fix" the games story.
Some of which was questionable and laughable, and even had some narrative Oversights. And he was pretty much saying "Do exactly what these games do, and dont do your own thing. Because I just want more Heavenward"
Which hey, to each their own.

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Even if all his ideas weren't that great and essentially wants each expansion to be a copy of heavansward storywise no one should be mass reported or harassed off the forums for criticism or because someone isn't liked or because no one agrees with them.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Ill judge it after it happens and we get into Dawntrail.. I jsut wanna have the blind optimism that we are Full speed ahead next Expansion.
[...]
If FFXIV really is this big money maker, they cant afford to have a Critical Failure.
Hopefully SE and the Devs know this.

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I used to say and think the same way, i don't know if my history is accessible but you may find exactly the same words there.


The problem is: recently i started to play Warframe again. I played during the beta and always come and go.
Now i am positively surprised by how many farming loops the game has while you can run free and do what you want and how you like (free to play btw).

https://i.imgur.com/QVeORDl.png
You have tons of characters (warframes), multiple builds, some core stuff to reach your maximum potential and a decent grim dark lore. I can say the same about Path of Exile. I am able to spend my whole day in Warframe and PoE, i used to do the same in Tera and Mu online but i can't do the same in FFXIV without RP.



I am using Warframe, PoE, Tera and Mu because they have/had farming loops that requires some commitment, however, at the same time they give you freedom like FFXIV does. The last time that i noticed a good farming loop in FFXIV was back in Heavensward. You could attach your relic progression to roulette and crafting. IMO we need more of that and more open world/overworld content.


For EW, my greatest expectations was the Twelve (we even talked a little bit about it before official announcement), now, for Dawntrail, i expect something for Grand Company and open world.

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Originally Posted by KitingGenbu

Lol Bro, since you joined the forums recently you're probably not aware the forums have a post limit per day. All they're doing is trying to make you use it up. Can't say posting about this was worth it though.

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Sorry, this just made me laugh that someone thought OP is a new user unaware of how the forums work.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

Even if all his ideas weren't that great and essentially wants each expansion to be a copy of heavansward storywise no one should be mass reported or harassed off the forums for criticism or because someone isn't liked or because no one agrees with them.

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I dont know if he got Mass Reported just for sharing his (sometimes questionable) ideas. But yes, nobody should be harassed for any reason. And it should go both ways, not just with people you agree with or because you dislike somebody..

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Originally Posted by Elissar

I used to say and think the same way, i don't know if my history is accessible but you may find exactly the same words there.

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Just gotta wait and see.
Not snorting copium and saying Everything will be ok, but I dont like to get all excited and make predictions and assumptions. I do like to be surprised though.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

Sorry, this just made me laugh that someone thought OP is a new user unaware of how the forums work.

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Not everyone is terminally online the forums like we are

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

On a little tangent, I do see some irony in how the perception of content creators seems to change depending on whether people do or don't agree with them.

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Yeah I see that happen rather a lot in regards to content creators. They can do no wrong until they happen to say one thing they disagree with, or they are foolish ‘GCBTW’ pushers until they criticise something, and only then are they worth listening too. I am sure some people on this forums agreeing with her now once dismissed her in that past. Its one of the reasons why objectivity is near impossible in places like this, and honestly I do not believe anyone who says they speak from that position.

Also, its not cool people to actually go after Zepla herself or make fun of her name etc. Its fine not to be a fan/disagree with their opinions, in the end this is just a video game we are talking about, but there is no reason to punch low.

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Originally Posted by Renathras

No, attacking other players is not a valid outlet for frustration.

"Bullying is exactly what the school needs to see to get administrators to accept the children need changes" is not an acceptable take. Hurting or attacking innocent people to get your point across is wrong. Zepla has a huge megaphone. She could make her critiques without badmouthing people and be listened to. The badmouthing alienated half the audience outright, so is bad for getting listened to (the people agreeing with her are ones not alienated by it as they often engage in it themselves...), but that aside, it's unjust to attack the innocent for the crimes of the guilty. Moreover, to preemptively attack people for something you imagined they might do but that they haven't even done.

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If you are viewing this as some sort of personal attack, I don't know what to say, other than I'm not surprised. She's not bullying anyone. Not the first time I've seen this happen, and not just from you either. Again, she is being proven right. It's about time someone with influence within the FF XIV community took a stand. I just wish it had happened sooner.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

If you are viewing this as some sort of personal attack, I don't know what to say, other than I'm not surprised. She's not bullying anyone. Not the first time I've seen this happen, and not just from you either. Again, she is being proven right. It's about time someone with influence within the FF XIV community took a stand. I just wish it had happened sooner.

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They seem to consider everything as a personal attack recently in various threads. Its not the first time think people are attacking/harrassing them.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

They seem to consider everything as a personal attack recently in various threads. Its not the first time think people are attacking/harrassing them.

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Some people are eternal victims on this forum, that person is one of them, they always feel attacked or harassed and will cry about it and write walls of texts, it's just zzz

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Some people are eternal victims on this forum, that person is one of them, they always feel attacked or harassed and will cry about it and write walls of texts, it's just zzz

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That seems to be happening in recent threads when no one even mentions them and somehow they feel there being called out or harassed. And now they feel a youtuber/streamer is bullying/harassing them instead of a forumer this time. Its a very big stretch when a streamer is criticizing something for 30 minutes and feels personally called out and bullied.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

That seems to be happening in recent threads when no one even mentions them and somehow they feel there being called out or harassed. And now they feel a youtuber/streamer is bullying/harassing them instead of a forumer this time. Its a very big stretch when a streamer is criticizing something for 30 minutes and feels personally called out and bullied.

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I think if someone feels attacked from criticism or concerns about this game, maybe it’s them who should take a break.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Just gotta wait and see.

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Thing is, and this really isn't a dig specifically at you, but I've seen numerous other comments along these lines. Be patient. Just gotta wait. We don't know. Usually used to stifle any discussion. If we wait and wait and wait, nothing gets voiced, no concerns are raised. We should be talking about this stuff. Relics, job design, midcore difficulty, game design (seriously, why did they not have something for BLU to do? It's dead, again, cause once you get the spells, what next?), Island Sanctuary being subpar. Things that should be critiqued without being told to just be patient, wait and see or go and play something else.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

That seems to be happening in recent threads when no one even mentions them and somehow they feel there being called out or harassed. And now they feel a youtuber/streamer is bullying/harassing them instead of a forumer this time. Its a very big stretch when a streamer is criticizing something for 30 minutes and feels personally called out and bullied.

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Just feel like pointing out that what the two of you are doing right now is exactly proving that person right. Going back and forth making comments bad-mouthing a specific person in a public forum like you're doing is exactly what can be seen as harassing them.

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Originally Posted by Blossoming

I think if someone feels attacked from criticism or concerns about this game, maybe it’s them who should take a break.

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I agree if criticism upsets people to the point they feel bullied/harassed or attacked by it then they should be the ones to take a break rather then the people providing criticism. There are some people that can be rude or call names when providing it but a lot of criticism is valid and well thought out as well.

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Originally Posted by Striker44

Just feel like pointing out that what the two of you are doing right now is exactly proving that person right. Going back and forth making comments bad-mouthing a specific person in a public forum like you're doing is exactly what can be seen as harassing them.

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On that note, I think I'll quote an earlier post of mine that often ends up being rather relevant in threads such as this:

https://i.imgur.com/3qg2I2d.png

The fourth paragraph is particularly notable. There's quite a few posters present in this thread who have repeatedly insinuated some rather awful things about anyone critical of the game who often swoop in and cry foul in response to even the tiniest bit of push-back against them when the rather transparent attempts to stifle discussion, shame specific posters and derail threads fall through.

EDIT: You'll probably have to open the image of the post in a new tab to read it more easily.

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Originally Posted by Striker44

Just feel like pointing out that what the two of you are doing right now is exactly proving that person right. Going back and forth making comments bad-mouthing a specific person in a public forum like you're doing is exactly what can be seen as harassing them.

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ding ding ding. it's like being back in high school lol

"OMG Becky look at her butt"

"RIIGHT??"

"I BET SHE SHILLS FOR SE SO HARD"

"TOTALLY DOES"

"GCBTW AM I RIGHT?"

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Originally Posted by ChrysOCE

Thing is, and this really isn't a dig specifically at you, but I've seen numerous other comments along these lines. Be patient. Just gotta wait. We don't know. Usually used to stifle any discussion. If we wait and wait and wait, nothing gets voiced, no concerns are raised. We should be talking about this stuff. Relics, job design, midcore difficulty, game design (seriously, why did they not have something for BLU to do? It's dead, again, cause once you get the spells, what next?), Island Sanctuary being subpar. Things that should be critiqued without being told to just be patient, wait and see or go and play something else.

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Im not gonna take it personally, but at the same time it is tiring that the very common reaction I see or receive for saying this, is the idea that its being used to Stifle Discussion. Far from it. Not at all am I suggesting that we cant or shouldn't talk about these things, pretend there is no issue and point things out.
NO!
That is NOT my message, and I wish it wasn't the first thought peoples minds go to, especially in this case when Im simply just saying we will see how Dawntrail will be when its released. If they will learn anything from EW, and if we will see improvements. Just gotta Wait and See.

I dont expect you know everything Ive posted, but Im there with you lot that the game needs some fixes.
And I have ALWAYS advocated for "Speak your Mind, no Matter the Pushback"
Just gotta Wait and See. Is not a shield or a Wall to stile or stop discussion.

When it comes to the relics, I have no problem with Hildabrand/Godbert being attached to it. The real problem is that the devs squandered the opportunity to help create our relic weapon by performing tasks similar to what Godbert does when he goes out hunting for materials to create his next goldsmithing art piece.

To me, the 500 tomes thing could have just been the basic starting point for both the foundation of our relic weapon and their upgrades. But after doing that first step each time, we could have been given a list by Godbert/his assistants to go and hunt certain enemies or monsters from the open world, dungeons, raids, etc that we need to defeat a certain number of times or how many times if its a singular enemy.

Think of that like the Monster Hunter crossover questline where we have to kill that MH dragon and collect its materials a certain number of times in order to unlock a new item from the MH vender in Kugane.

But...that's just all I wanted from the relic quests, besides enjoying some Hildabrand story. Would have made the processing of getting our relic weapons feel more special like all the previous expansion's. :<

I agree with Zepla's take on EW in general. For me being a casual andy it has been pretty weak on the gameplay content side. I feel like relics were a miss as you used to have go out of your way to do things and play the game beyond daily roulettes to get them. I understand people saying that they are more approachable for everyone, but at the same time tomestone weapons exist for that very reason. An approachable upgrade that is there for everyone to get if they want bigger numbers. The point of the relic for me was to have a slow burn grind to unlock a really cool cosmetic weapon. That along with relics competing with crafting for my tomes was just not a great thing for me. Variant dungeons were probably the biggest miss in the expansion as I think they should have been tied to the relic process as it was a completely new gameplay system and I think the easiest way to encourage engagement with it is to tie it into the relic weapon that everyone is going to want to work on to some level. I get some people are super interested in the story and want to try and figure out all of the different paths which is great, but after that there is no reason to ever look at them again which is the constant problem I see in EW. Island Sanctuary was never going to be content I enjoy and having hopped in it for the tutorial when it came out and getting the initial 4 levels, I realized that my original assumption was correct and it just isn't something I want to do.

I think the clip in Zepla's video where Ian was talking about what your goals should be for getting players to engage with your game was probably the best description of problems with lack of gameplay content or repeatable content that keeps players wanting to play. I agree with him in the goal shouldn't be to make you feel like you have to play or are required to play but you should just want to play because you have things you find fun or goals that you want to achieve.

I am hopeful in DT that we will get a lot of the things back that we missed in EW and with Yoshida mentioning a whole new battle system they are working on that there is some hope that they will learn from EW and make improvements to keep players like me engaged.

I agree with criterion because how rigid they are with power lvl gear. They allow some sort tokens who takes some amount of grind to get the upgarde. But the rest I'm somewhat mix feeling due bozja and eureka. I thought the start of Eureka was good but mid felt garbage the end was no worth it due of the experience mid part of it. Bozja flaw was the entry was not well design they could do it better imo. I agree for relic grind to grindy. I just hope the grind will there for dawntrail.

At the end of the day we're a decade into the game's active development. Technically longer if we want to count the 1.0 phase as well. The first half of 6.5 isn't launching until early October and the second half doesn't go live until January. After that, we're looking at a release for 7.0 at some point in the summer.

It was far easier for veteran players to take the 'wait and see' approach during early expansions because the development team were still finding their footing back in those days. By now, though, I don't think it's at all unreasonable to expect a bit more than what we're getting - since a lot of the current offerings in Endwalker lack much in the way of staying power and revolve around promoting activities that many players have done frequently already.

I'd say the expansion suffers from the lack of an equivalent of a Bozja or Eureka. My partner and I used to hit up Eureka/Bozja every few nights to work towards our relics and contribute to spawning bosses and chatting with the recognisable regulars. That was our social experience - not visiting venues.

We were excited about the new PvP mode, Crystalline Conflict. Yet it's impossible to sign up as a duo - so it didn't land for us. I say that as someone who has done PvP enough to secure a hundred victories as each Grand Company for the relevant mount achievements.

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3fwXgcZvjQ
Zepla

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....Who? Sounds like a person who hasn't played much of anything.
If you're not having fun, the healthy thing to do is to do something else. And not try to ruin things for others, naturally.

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Originally Posted by Bad_Luck

....Who? Sounds like a person who hasn't played much of anything.
If you're not having fun, the healthy thing to do is to do something else. And not try to ruin things for others, naturally.

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I swear people are so quick to dehumanize and/or discount and treat streamers like their opnions aren't worth anything.

Zepla has been playing years. And was willing to invest time to share her opinion in video and audio format.

While we share our own opinions in text format here.

Your 'who...?' is such an overdone statement it's irritating.

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Originally Posted by Bad_Luck

....Who? Sounds like a person who hasn't played much of anything.
If you're not having fun, the healthy thing to do is to do something else. And not try to ruin things for others, naturally.

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The same way GCBTW ruined the actual semi complex MMO we used to have

People in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones

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Originally Posted by Bad_Luck

If you're not having fun, the healthy thing to do is to do something else. And not try to ruin things for others, naturally.

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She took like 6 months off to play other things. I am genuinely curious at how her opinions ruin the game for others.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Your 'who...?' is such an overdone statement it's irritating.

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Performative ignorance has never really made sense to me.

At best, people buy into their performance and they look.. well.. ignorant and uninformed, neither of which are particularly positive traits. Of course usually people can tell they're just feigning ignorance, at which point it makes them come off as weirdly invested in a topic they're actively trying to pretend they don't care about. It's like a lose/lose situation.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Performative ignorance has never really made sense to me.

At best, people buy into their performance and they look.. well.. ignorant and uninformed, neither of which are particularly positive traits. Of course usually people can tell they're just feigning ignorance, at which point it makes them come off as weirdly invested in a topic they're actively trying to pretend they don't care about. It's like a lose/lose situation.

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I'm assuming they're just trying to look equal parts clever and cute-sy or something at this point.

The only thing I'm hoping that will come of this is Zepla actually bringing up her concerns to Yoshida in the next media tour. I don't watch her because I kind of hate XIV content creators, but I respect her for getting her voice out there in a way that will incite others to speak up about their dissatisfaction too, because the only way the game is gonna get better is if discussion stops getting so stifled everywhere.

In my opinion the whole premise of Endwalker was cool, but it was too spread out. It feels like the sequel to Shadowbringers, but with elements of several expansions mashed together instead of its own thing.

If they had kept the content focused, and more in location it would have been a lot more well received. The writing team seems to do better with focus.

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Originally Posted by Ivtrix

Not everyone is terminally online the forums like we are

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Touché /chars

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3fwXgcZvjQ

"yoshiP said you should go play other games in between patches"
Right, but that doesn't make the expansion any better

https://i.ibb.co/n1Z7fpH/asefgui.png

By the way for the people who cannot tolerate constructive criticism, Zepla has this to say later in the video:

https://youtu.be/p3fwXgcZvjQ?si=khTFAo2ED8Q_Zyty&t=1725

"I'm tired of hearing people say: 'well we don't want this game to just be a huge grind'. No one is saying that, stop jumping to this extreme"

"I'm seeing really unhealthy signs right now, and I think this lack of attention to the game from the devs and this hesitation to criticize the game is going to kill the game eventually."

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Thanks but I do not need you or Zepla or YoshiP to tell me what to think about anything. I am perfectly capable of coming to my own conclusions and acting accordingly.

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Originally Posted by Myrany

Thanks but I do not need you or Zepla or YoshiP to tell me what to think about anything. I am perfectly capable of coming to my own conclusions and acting accordingly.

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Ok that’s nice, but are you going to actually share them and contribute or just appear like you are yelling at a wall

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Originally Posted by Ivtrix

Ok that’s nice, but are you going to actually share them and contribute or just appear like you are yelling at a wall

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Her point is that Zepla has her opinion as such, but that that opinion or stance is not shared by all. She is a streamer, yes, but that doesnt mean she speaks ex cathedra on every matter. Ivtrix: an opinion, regardless of streamer or no, needs to have the same caveat "I could be wrong".

This is her take...but not always the best or the most correct.

Heres one that may not have been considered when it comes to exploratory zones, it may have been on the cards, but the sudden shift to WFH and Covid in general may have thrown off their entire timeline.

Do I know this for certain? No.

Do I think its a possibility that may not have been raised or considered as to why we didnt get another Bozja?

Yes.

Unlike many I am not afraid to say the facts on the matter: I dont know, but its as good a guess as any as to how and why Endwalker headed in that direction.

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Originally Posted by VelKallor

Her point is that Zepla has her opinion as such, but that that opinion or stance is not shared by all. She is a streamer, yes, but that doesnt mean she speaks ex cathedra on every matter. Ivtrix: an opinion, regardless of streamer or no, needs to have the same caveat "I could be wrong".

This is her take...but not always the best or the most correct.

Here one that may not have been considered when it comes to exploratory zones, it may have been on the cards, but the sudden shift to WFH and Covid in general may have thrown off their entire timeline.

Do I know this for certain? No.

Do I think its a possibility that may not have been raised or considered as to why we didnt get another Bozja?

Yes.

Unlike many I am not afraid to say the facts on the matter: I dont know, but its as good a guess as any as to how and why Endwalker headed in that direction.

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The problem with the post is nothing was shared, no discussion was had, nothing at all was added to the conversation. Their post was I don't care what a streamer thinks and I have opinions that I am gonna keep to myself. I am a big fan of having discussions in the forum since that is the purpose but I am not a fan of posting "I have opinions" and that's literally it. We have no idea if there are things they agree with, what they disagree with, why they have those opinions. You are drawing conclusions from a pretty ambiguous post where you can also come to the conclusion they are saying they don't need anyone else to tell them they don't like where the game is going.

I still find it super weird how more people are vitriolic of Zepla for being a ....



Content creator... what a crime.



Than actually bringing up the points she made in the video about the game. People who have this weird grudge against streamers are just showing off how catty and shallow they really are, desperately thinking theyre above them despite themselves being no better with their attitudes.

Should really have nothing to do if the arguments being made are from x person. Nobody cares if you want to express how you dont like somebody. It should be about the arguments being made and honestly good on Zepla for at least bringing up the concerns most of us shared to a broader audience.

I just hope next media tour these content creators dont get cold feet bringing up this feedback when they get the chance to talk directly with the producer.