Congratulations Square Enix! FF4 surpasses WoW this year. (Source inside)

You have no idea how good you have it.

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Originally Posted by DragonFlyy

Sadly that doesn't say much about Dragonflight. WoW hasn't been good since The Frozen Throne.

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I'd say there's still a lot of things that WoW does very well. It's by no means a perfect game but it certainly caters to a broader range of personal tastes than FFXIV. Both in terms of playable races and class fantasies - I've been pretty eager to get another bow job from Square Enix, particularly one that allows us to tame animal companions and fight alongside them but despite being such a core fantasy trope the archer with a tamed beast is absent altogether.

Then there's the exploration in the open world. Dragonflight added a lot of things to hunt down and find. Whereas the closest thing to 'open world secrets' is a single NPC from the days of ARR that gives you a pair of minions if you bring him a specific item.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I'd say there's still a lot of things that WoW does very well. It's by no means a perfect game but it certainly caters to a broader range of personal tastes than FFXIV. Both in terms of playable races and class fantasies - I've been pretty eager to get another bow job from Square Enix, particularly one that allows us to tame animal companions and fight alongside them but despite being such a core fantasy trope the archer with a tamed beast is absent altogether.

Then there's the exploration in the open world. Dragonflight added a lot of things to hunt down and find. Whereas the closest thing to 'open world secrets' is a single NPC from the days of ARR that gives you a pair of minions if you bring him a specific item.

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You must not be keeping up with Dragonflight.

Here, let me remind you.

World Quests? You better be there at the server reset of you may as well ignore the boss world quest entirely.

Citadel area? Dead. Unless you super outgear it, you won't even be able to do all the dailies there. Good luck trying to kill the rares you summon with keys if no ones there to help you.

Cooking Event? You'll never reach Legendary, as no one does them anymore.

Centaur Hunts? Dead.

Elemental Storms? No one does them.

Cobalt area? You gotta log on at the right times for the only groups doing it or you may as well pretend it doesn't exist.

Winter Storm timeline? Dead. No one ever goes there.

Forbidden Reach? Dead.

The Caverns? Was dead in its first week.

Time Rifts? They'll be dead when the Dreamsurges happen.

Players that come in late to Dragonflight are bombarded with disjointed questlines (So, new players have no idea which ones to do before the other for the story), the quest areas are empty of players, the zone activities are impossible for them to solo so they are told to just skip it. I, like many, requested that Blizzard scale these areas down (as Blizzard easily could, as they had no issue scaling all Mob Health/Damage up by 25% and nerf all healing by 25% - a BAD decision as they did this due to High Key M+ Players and ended up screwing over all the other majority playerbase) and to reduce the grind for them as they're dead areas. That was met with Blizzard being silent and the "white knights" would attack anyone that suggested making things better for other players. Their mindset is that everyone should "Suffer like they did" and "I got mine on patch, so screw you!".

Then there's the WoW Token. It has only gotten more ridiculous as prices rise which means there's no reason to farm or work towards anything that can be bought with Gold. Buy a WoW Token or RMT as Blizzard supports it (Blizzard never removes RMT bought gold, nor bans the Buyers - at most they get suspended. All the Top guilds participate in RMT trade and sell carries for profit. Blizzard knows that they do. They brag about it. Yet aren't banned). I've seen the same Bots trains in the same areas grinding 24/7 and not getting banned until Blizzards 6-12 month ban wave. Then they're back again, as they've more than made their money back to profit and to buy a boost to 60 and a sub.

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

You must not be keeping up with Dragonflight.

Here, let me remind you.

Citadel area? Dead. Unless you super outgear it, you won't even be able to do all the dailies there. Good luck trying to kill the rares you summon with keys if no ones there to help you.

Cooking Event? You'll never reach Legendary, as no one does them anymore.

Centaur Hunts? Dead.

Elemental Storms? No one does them.

Winter Storm timeline? Dead. No one ever goes there.

Forbidden Reach? Dead.

The Caverns? Was dead in its first week.

Time Rifts? They'll be dead when the Dreamsurges happen.

Players that come in late to Dragonflight are bombarded with disjointed questlines (So, new players have no idea which ones to do before the other for the story), the quest areas are empty of players, the zone activities are impossible for them to solo so they are told to just skip it. I, like many, requested that Blizzard scale these areas down (as Blizzard easily could, as they had no issue scaling all Mob Health/Damage up by 25% and nerf all healing by 25% - a BAD decision as they did this due to High Key M+ Players and ended up screwing over all the other majority playerbase) and to reduce the grind for them as they're dead areas. That was met with Blizzard being silent and the "white knights" would attack anyone that suggested making things better for other players. Their mindset is that everyone should "Suffer like they did".

Then there's the WoW Token. It has only gotten more ridiculous as prices rise which means there's no reason to farm or work towards anything that can be bought with Gold. Buy a WoW Token or RMT as Blizzard supports it (Blizzard never removes RMT bought gold, nor bans the Buyers. All the Top guilds participate in RMT trade and sell carries for profit. Blizzard knows that they do. They brag about it. Yet aren't banned). I've seen the same Bots trains in the same areas grinding 24/7 and not getting banned until Blizzards 6-12 month ban wave. Then they're back again, as they've more than made their money back to profit and to buy a boost to 60 and a sub.

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It's almost like WoW is made for people that actually want to do content, and not focused on leveling/MSQ like FFXIV is, I know I know, it's crazy that there actually is content in a game, since you are so used to FFXIV and the 2 days of content once every 6 months, but some games actually do focus on content and not questing and leveling.

As for the RMT part, I am laughing pretty hard, have you ever seen what's under the limsa aetheryte with idle cam ? RMT is prevalent in this game, and nothing is done agaisnt it, it's been left like this for years after years, gil sellers and players are literally trading in the middle of Limsa in front of everyone to see, you can see them with their busy status, and always around level 10, it's very obvious what's going on there, the only difference is that WoW made it legal by putting it in their game, while FFXIV is keeping this stance of "cant see what's going on and cant hear lalalalalala" as everything happens right under their nose

I haven't struggled to find people to do content with in WoW, actually - though I play on the EU servers. I can't speak for any other region.

As for disjointed story-lines, it used to bother me a lot more that quest progression in WoW is out of order and difficult to keep track of. Yet over the course of the last few years, FFXIV's supposed 'story driven' experience has been rife with outright retcons and large swathes of the setting being hastily cast aside in order to make way for the premise of 7.0 which is shaping up to take us far away from the three great continents.

If you're specifically a Scion fan then you're eating well. Not everybody is a fan of the Scions, though - and very little in the way of a meaningful bone is thrown at those who are invested in more than just the game's increasingly stale main cast.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

It's almost like WoW is made for people that actually want to do content, and not focused on leveling/MSQ like FFXIV is, I know I know, it's crazy that there actually is content in a game, since you are so used to FFXIV and the 2 days of content once every 6 months, but some games actually do focus on content and not questing and leveling.

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Most zones being dead equates to a game for people "wanting to do content"? By the way, FFXIV has a mountain of content - just because you personally may not enjoy that content doesn't make it any less real.

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Yet over the course of the last few years, FFXIV's supposed 'story driven' experience has been rife with outright retcons and large swathes of the setting being hastily cast aside in order to make way for the premise of 7.0 which is shaping up to take us far away from the three great continents.

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There's an enormous difference between retcons (which are virtually inevitable in any long-running series) and utterly disjointed questing that can have you effectively time traveling (not for plot purposes) with no clue what's going on. Not to mention at least FFXIV just has a few retcons about the sundering...WoW has entire re-writes of plot and geography.

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Originally Posted by Striker44

Most zones being dead equates to a game for people "wanting to do content"? By the way, FFXIV has a mountain of content - just because you personally may not enjoy that content doesn't make it any less real.

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Yes, zones are dead because... people are doing end game content which is instanced, no way ? What's next ? The sky is blue ? As I said, WoW aint like FFXIV, people in WoW actually spend their time doing m+, raids or other instanced content, not MSQ and RP 24 7 or hang out in main city afk all day, WoW has people playing for the content, not to be a social hangout all day long.

As for mountain of content, you keep coping there bud, you've been coping for months already with your responses, it aint worth to even try to change your mind.

You can compare PF and WoW's group finder, it's night and day the amount of parties every day, even during content droughts.

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

World Quests
Citadel area
Cooking Event
Centaur Hunts
Elemental Storms
Cobalt area
Winter Storm timeline
Forbidden Reach
The Caverns
Time Rifts

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Jesus, they get all of that for $15 a month? No, seriously. As someone who mostly just plays FFXIV, it's astonishing how WoW still gets new content regularly compared to FFXIV. We barely get anything per patch, which is every five months now. And didn't you and your ilk claim that FFXIV had more content than WoW? And all of it was playable and such-and-such?

Why does FFXIV have to be the MMO that people feverishly defend despite its flaws? I thought WoW held onto that mantle? Now we're the shitty game.

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Originally Posted by Striker44

Most zones being dead equates to a game for people "wanting to do content"? By the way, FFXIV has a mountain of content - just because you personally may not enjoy that content doesn't make it any less real.



There's an enormous difference between retcons (which are virtually inevitable in any long-running series) and utterly disjointed questing that can have you effectively time traveling (not for plot purposes) with no clue what's going on. Not to mention at least FFXIV just has a few retcons about the sundering...WoW has entire re-writes of plot and geography.

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XIV does have a mountain of content.

If you have not played the game before.

All of this 'mountain' of content you refer to, is stuff that active players did on patch, years ago, when it was actually considered content.

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Originally Posted by caffe_macchiato

Jesus, they get all of that for $15 a month? No, seriously. As someone who mostly just plays FFXIV, it's astonishing how WoW still gets new content regularly compared to FFXIV. We barely get anything per patch, which is every five months now. And didn't you and your ilk claim that FFXIV had more content than WoW? And all of it was playable and such-and-such?

Why does FFXIV have to be the MMO that people feverishly defend despite its flaws? I thought WoW held onto that mantle? Now we're the shitty game.

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All dead content.

You seem to have missed that entirely, just so you can complain about FF14. It's so bad that players are going back to Shadowlands and refusing to do any of that. As the only active content in Dragonflight is an hourly Time Rift which has more than half the players AFK on the pillars until the Rift opens open for a few minutes of content. Then it's over.

I cannot recommend WoW to new players as the new player experience is horrid and when they get into Dragonflight they're overwhelmed with dead content that the game sends them to. It wasn't bad at the start of Dragonflight, when content was relevant, but now? It's real bad, and Blizzard refuses to re-scale these areas so that new players/late comers/alts can actually do that content.

Not to mention that a lot of that content is super grindy and doing the same stuff every day/week until you max it out. It's not innovative, and with them being dead zones they aren't even possible to do unless you super out gear them.

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Originally Posted by caffe_macchiato

Jesus, they get all of that for $15 a month? No, seriously. As someone who mostly just plays FFXIV, it's astonishing how WoW still gets new content regularly compared to FFXIV. We barely get anything per patch, which is every five months now. And didn't you and your ilk claim that FFXIV had more content than WoW? And all of it was playable and such-and-such?

Why does FFXIV have to be the MMO that people feverishly defend despite its flaws? I thought WoW held onto that mantle? Now we're the shitty game.

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I mean, you could argue this for all the stuff FFXIV has as well. You might just say "It's all dead content so it doesn't count!" and "Everyone's done it already!"
...but then that same argument applies to WoW. You can't praise it for having the same amount of stuff - or even more stuff - if it's just as dead.

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Originally Posted by Renathras

I mean, you could argue this for all the stuff FFXIV has as well. You might just say "It's all dead content so it doesn't count!" and "Everyone's done it already!"
...but then that same argument applies to WoW. You can't praise it for having the same amount of stuff - or even more stuff - if it's just as dead.

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Except that WoW has content, mainly Mythic+ and raiding, Mythic+ being infinite dungeon runs with scaling difficulty and scaling rewards, amongst other things, something... FFXIV doesnt have. And no, fishing is not equal to M+, there's also a lot more side content and reward systems.

I think if some people actually saw WoW's group finder, and compared it to FFXIV's PF, they would have a big surprise, one is a game for its content, one is just a social hang out with extremely slow drip fed content that has no longevity what so ever.

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

All dead content.

You seem to have missed that entirely, just so you can complain about FF14. It's so bad that players are going back to Shadowlands and refusing to do any of that. As the only active content in Dragonflight is an hourly Time Rift which has more than half the players AFK on the pillars until the Rift opens open for a few minutes of content. Then it's over.

I cannot recommend WoW to new players as the new player experience is horrid and when they get into Dragonflight they're overwhelmed with dead content that the game sends them to. It wasn't bad at the start of Dragonflight, when content was relevant, but now? It's real bad, and Blizzard refuses to re-scale these areas so that new players/late comers/alts can actually do that content.

Not to mention that a lot of that content is super grindy and doing the same stuff every day/week until you max it out. It's not innovative, and with them being dead zones they aren't even possible to do unless you super out gear them.

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It's "dead" (it aint that dead by the way, every time I check there's people but sure) content because it's side content so not many people do it, people are doing the MAIN endgame content, which is instanced and done via either friends or group finder, there are hundreds after hundreds of groups every single day, even during content drought for it. WoW is not a social hangout simulator, it's a content game, with actual proper content.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

It's almost like WoW is made for people that actually want to do content, and not focused on leveling/MSQ like FFXIV is, I know I know, it's crazy that there actually is content in a game, since you are so used to FFXIV and the 2 days of content once every 6 months, but some games actually do focus on content and not questing and leveling.

As for the RMT part, I am laughing pretty hard, have you ever seen what's under the limsa aetheryte with idle cam ? RMT is prevalent in this game, and nothing is done agaisnt it, it's been left like this for years after years, gil sellers and players are literally trading in the middle of Limsa in front of everyone to see, you can see them with their busy status, and always around level 10, it's very obvious what's going on there, the only difference is that WoW made it legal by putting it in their game, while FFXIV is keeping this stance of "cant see what's going on and cant hear lalalalalala" as everything happens right under their nose

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If you want WoW to be your only game and enjoy the latest patch killing the content of the last patch, then go play WoW.

FF14 doesn't have the same mindset as WoW. What you want, it seems, is an endless grinding formula that is WoW where you have literally no time to play any other game BUT WoW. In that case, it's time to retire from FF14, which gives you the freedom to play multiple games, and sell your soul to just playing WoW since that's the type of game style you want and WoW does that best.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Except that WoW has content, mainly Mythic+ and raiding, Mythic+ being infinite dungeon runs with scaling difficulty and scaling rewards, amongst other things, something... FFXIV doesnt have. And no, fishing is not equal to M+, there's also a lot more side content and reward systems.

I think if some people actually saw WoW's group finder, and compared it to FFXIV's PF, they would have a big surprise, one is a game for its content, one is just a social hang out with extremely slow drip fed content that has no longevity what so ever.

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So for anyone uninterested in Mythic+ and raiding, or who has already done all of that content that they want to do - WoW has no content.

And you're saying FFXIV doesn't have a lot of side content and reward systems, really?

I'm sorry you can't imagine that people play FFXIV for its content...but a lot of people really really do. If you like WoW so much better, it's right there for you to play instead. Or hell, you could play both. You have two subs here, so you could just cancel one and pay for your WoW sub with that money and enjoy WoW all the time and FFXIV when there are patches or whatever and you have content you like to do for a few weeks.

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

If you want WoW to be your only game and enjoy the latest patch killing the content of the last patch, then go play WoW.

FF14 doesn't have the same mindset as WoW. What you want, it seems, is an endless grinding formula that is WoW where you have literally no time to play any other game BUT WoW. In that case, it's time to retire from FF14, which gives you the freedom to play multiple games, and sell your soul to just playing WoW since that's the type of game style you want and WoW does that best.

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Exactly, so just say you want to play a social hangout simulator and stop calling WoW's zones dead, it's fine to me I really dont care, but dont come out and start blasting at a game that does content better by saying "irrelevant zones are dead oh no" when it isnt the focus of the game, literally no one cares about leveling in WoW, it's done as fast as possible to max level to join endgame activities, period.

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Originally Posted by Renathras

So for anyone uninterested in Mythic+ and raiding, or who has already done all of that content that they want to do - WoW has no content.

And you're saying FFXIV doesn't have a lot of side content and reward systems, really?

I'm sorry you can't imagine that people play FFXIV for its content...but a lot of people really really do. If you like WoW so much better, it's right there for you to play instead. Or hell, you could play both. You have two subs here, so you could just cancel one and pay for your WoW sub with that money and enjoy WoW all the time and FFXIV when there are patches or whatever and you have content you like to do for a few weeks.

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I literally just mentioned I do play both by the way, and doubt about people playing FFXIV for its content, aside from a week once every 6 months, this game is completely barren content wise except maybe on Aether because it has all the datacenters converged on there.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Exactly, so just say you want to play a social hangout simulator and stop calling WoW's zones dead, it's fine to me I really dont care, but dont come out and start blasting at a game that does content better by saying "irrelevant zones are dead oh no" when it isnt the focus of the game, literally no one cares about leveling in WoW, it's done as fast as possible to max level to join endgame activities, period.

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It doesn't do content better.

It just does the content you enjoy in a way that you subjectively find better.

Those are two very different statements. But again, if you like it better...why do you have two paid accounts here instead of one there and one here, or none here and two there?

EDIT:

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

I literally just mentioned I do play both by the way, and doubt about people playing FFXIV for its content, aside from a week once every 6 months, this game is completely barren content wise except maybe on Aether because it has all the datacenters converged on there.

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You can doubt all you want, that's just stupid. You think hundreds of thousands of people play a game and not ONE of them does so for its content? Does that REALLY sound logical to you?

There's tons of content in this game to do for people that enjoy it. There are people that spend months clearing PotD, or doing it with every single Job. And that's just ONE thing. "barren" doesn't seem to mean what you think it means, and the "everything's on Aether" is a meme. I'm on Primal and don't DC travel and there are pages of PF every time I log in.

EDIT2:

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Are you even reading me ? I already said I play both, also yes I want more endgame content so I do play both at once, don't see the issue with that, since FFXIV is so damn barren with content and people cant handle a single grind once every few years apparently since they have to play their entire steam library and "dont have time"

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You posted into an edit after I posted. If you posted it before, it must have been in one of your walls of text. ;)

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Originally Posted by Renathras

It doesn't do content better.

It just does the content you enjoy in a way that you subjectively find better.

Those are two very different statements. But again, if you like it better...why do you have two paid accounts here instead of one there and one here, or none here and two there?

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Are you even reading me ? I already said I play both, also yes I want more endgame content so I do play both at once, don't see the issue with that, since FFXIV is so damn barren with content and people cant handle a single grind once every few years apparently since they have to play their entire steam library and "dont have time"

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Exactly, so just say you want to play a social hangout simulator and stop calling WoW's zones dead, it's fine to me I really dont care, but dont come out and start blasting at a game that does content better by saying "irrelevant zones are dead oh no" when it isnt the focus of the game, literally no one cares about leveling in WoW, it's done as fast as possible to max level to join endgame activities, period.



I literally just mentioned I do play both by the way, and doubt about people playing FFXIV for its content, aside from a week once every 6 months, this game is completely barren content wise except maybe on Aether because it has all the datacenters converged on there.

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It's a fact. The zones ARE dead. That's content that players cannot do, even if they wanted to, as they were designed to be where all players are funneled to. Then when the new on patch content came out, those zones weren't re-scaled to compensate for no one being there anymore.

You clearly know far less than I about WoW. I doubt you've even played Dragonflight. Yet you have the audacity to try and lecture me? Grow up.

And "activities"? M+ is the only activity that sees any real use and that's because it's the best way to gear. Players complain about it all the time. Raiding guilds died out because M+ was just better and they can see the story in LFR. Raiders are forced to do M+ as well, just so they can Raid. M+ gamers don't have to Raid to stay geared. See the problem?

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

It's a fact. The zones ARE dead. That's content that players cannot do, even if they wanted to, as they were designed to be where all players are funneled to. Then when the new on patch content came out, those zones weren't re-scaled to compensate for no one being there anymore.

You clearly know far less than I about WoW. I doubt you've even played Dragonflight. Yet you have the audacity to try and lecture me? Grow up.

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Yeah you're coping there buddy, the zones aint dead, you can do anything just fine, will it feel a bit lonely ? absolutely, but any endgame content zone (the cooking event etc) has a lot of people there, stop playing on a dead server maybe. You're literally coping. And yes I do play DF, on a high population server so I have no issue doing anything.

The only empty places are leveling zones, because as I said no one cares about them, people rush rush to max level to reach endgame content.

and no, I dont see the problem with M+, it's booming every day, and so is the raiding tab of group finder, dont see why that's a problem, people are happy enough to do it so ? I have a guild that does M+ as well and some side raiding as I pug a lot of the time, and have 0 issues doing so.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Yeah you're coping there buddy, the zones aint dead, you can do anything just fine, will it feel a bit lonely ? absolutely, but any endgame content zone (the cooking event etc) has a lot of people there, stop playing on a dead server maybe. You're literally coping. And yes I do play DF, on a high population server so I have no issue doing anything.

The only empty places are leveling zones, because as I said no one cares about them, people rush rush to max level to reach endgame content.

and no, I dont see the problem with M+, it's booming every day, and so is the raiding tab of group finder, dont see why that's a problem, people are happy enough to do it so ? I have a guild that does M+ as well and some side raiding as I pug a lot of the time, and have 0 issues doing so.

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It's clear that you haven't played WoW in awhile. I also noticed that you ignored the rampant RMT that happens in WoW and how damaging the WoW Token is. I can literally buy WoW Tokens then have one of the few remaining top Guilds, as most are dead thanks to M+, carry me and get me all the cheevos in a month - if that.

And no, those end game zones don't have people there. You are simply clueless and haven't said a single fact about the game you're so passionately trying to defend. It's almost impressive how confident you are in how incorrect you are.

https://img2.finalfantasyxiv.com/f/a...7fc0_96x96.jpg

Is this still the case?

Blizzard is so desperate nowadays, just look at how they just throw their Overwatch2 turd on Steam

Joining this convo late but claiming WoW zones are dead is pure cope. Since i’ve quit 14 i’ve been playing both ESO and WoW. The big difference i can say between them and 14 is that the world feels so much more alive because i see dozens of players in almost every zone i go in because…shocker….there’s actually stuff to do in those zones! Meanwhile in 14 most overworld zones are dead, because there’s just nothing to do in them outside of msq and doing fates at launch.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Joining this convo late but claiming WoW zones are dead is pure cope. Since i’ve quit 14 i’ve been playing both ESO and WoW. The big difference i can say between them and 14 is that the world feels so much more alive because i see dozens of players in almost every zone i go in because…shocker….there’s actually stuff to do in those zones! Meanwhile in 14 most overworld zones are dead, because there’s just nothing to do in them outside of msq and doing fates at launch.

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Oh come on....WoW il give you but I've played most of ESO except Necrom at the moment and that is a lie.....ESO is barren as well there isn't anything to in that game I'm surprised its lasted as long as it has because that community gets less content then WoW and FF14. The map sizes are much smaller and you say feel alive are just copy pasted assets galore...look at Necrom they are just using a load of Morrowind stuff (Really want a Morrowind remake, I'm a massive Elder Scrolls fan) they also split their content up into 2 dungeon packs...the story of a chapter is laughable at best.....if its your main game and you want to do crafting you pretty much need to pay for ESO+ also very little reason to grind for cool looking gear or mounts/pets cause they put them all on the store or make a gear set you worked your ass off for redundant in the next patch. Like I know FF14 has some rough patches in places...but come on.

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

I get it. You are just naive to what's happening on WoW. It's kinda sad, really. The WoW Token has done massive damage to WoW, yet you defend it and try to wrongly imply that the RMT scene in FF14 is anywhere near as bad as WoWs.

You must have forgotten the Brut mount that was taken out of the game to encourage FOMO. It's highly doubtful any significant number of players got that mount without RMT.

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Considering i see groups of lalafell rmts flying from underneath the ground through the roofs of buildings like the gridania grand company area and around fc chest i would say ff14 has a big bot/rmt problem. RMT isn't something that only exist in wow literally every mmo has rmt issues.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

Considering i see groups of lalafell rmts flying from underneath the ground through the roofs of buildings like the gridania grand company area and around fc chest i would say ff14 has a big bot/rmt problem.

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It has a bot problem, but it's nowhere near as bad as WoW.

Ever try WoW Classic servers that Blizzard is hosting? You'll see just how bad it can get as Blizzard literally doesn't care for it. Then if you're playing Retail go to Legion, BFA, SL, or such areas where there is near instant spawns. Those same spots are always full of bots 24/7. It's only going to get worse as WoW is pushing out Cross-server trading. Which means Bots will start frequenting dead servers even more and then transfer their stuff to a high pop server to kill the economy even more than it is already destroyed.

Then there's the trade channel, which allows the selling of carries. 200k. 300k. 400k. 500k. ect. No player is buying a carry at those prices without buying WoW Tokens and RMT. Blizzard knows this. That's why they allow RMT as they do. They let the botters profit enough that they will keep returning after they're banned in 6-12 months.

Heck, there are streamers in the top guilds that RMT while live and sell carries live. Yet are never punished for profit reasons. That and it's the only way those players can put out 100+ hours a week on the game as they aren't working full time jobs in that case.

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

It has a bot problem, but it's nowhere near as bad as WoW.

Ever try WoW Classic servers that Blizzard is hosting? You'll see just how bad it can get as Blizzard literally doesn't care for it. Then if you're playing Retail go to Legion, BFA, SL, or such areas where there is near instant spawns. Those same spots are always full of bots 24/7. It's only going to get worse as WoW is pushing out Cross-server trading. Which means Bots will start frequenting dead servers even more and then transfer their stuff to a high pop server to kill the economy even more than it is already destroyed.

Then there's the trade channel, which allows the selling of carries. 200k. 300k. 400k. 500k. ect. No player is buying a carry at those prices without buying WoW Tokens and RMT. Blizzard knows this. That's why they allow RMT as they do. They let the botters profit enough that they will keep returning after they're banned in 6-12 months.

Heck, there are streamers in the top guilds that RMT while live and sell carries live. Yet are never punished for profit reasons. That and it's the only way those players can put out 100+ hours a week on the game as they aren't working full time jobs in that case.

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you while looking at the wow token :

https://media.istockphoto.com/id/508...GeF0DqFhe_xgo=

you watching the lalas flying under limsa, the lalas instant teleporting from one city to the other, the "busy" level 10 gil sellers trading gil to the buyers, the spammers every 2 minutes or less, the PF for carries and more :

https://previews.123rf.com/images/di...heir-hands.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tanis_Ebonhart

It has a bot problem, but it's nowhere near as bad as WoW.

Ever try WoW Classic servers that Blizzard is hosting? You'll see just how bad it can get as Blizzard literally doesn't care for it. Then if you're playing Retail go to Legion, BFA, SL, or such areas where there is near instant spawns. Those same spots are always full of bots 24/7. It's only going to get worse as WoW is pushing out Cross-server trading. Which means Bots will start frequenting dead servers even more and then transfer their stuff to a high pop server to kill the economy even more than it is already destroyed.

Then there's the trade channel, which allows the selling of carries. 200k. 300k. 400k. 500k. ect. No player is buying a carry at those prices without buying WoW Tokens and RMT. Blizzard knows this. That's why they allow RMT as they do. They let the botters profit enough that they will keep returning after they're banned in 6-12 months.

Heck, there are streamers in the top guilds that RMT while live and sell carries live. Yet are never punished for profit reasons. That and it's the only way those players can put out 100+ hours a week on the game as they aren't working full time jobs in that case.

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Bots and RMT does the same exact thing on ff14 though. I seen bots go unpunished for years on ff14 that i see that have been around since arr even after reporting multiple times.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

Bots and RMT does the same exact thing on ff14 though. I seen bots go unpunished for years on ff14 that i see that have been around since arr even after reporting multiple times.

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I may be wrong but I think the point they're trying to make is that the RMT problem in WoW is compounded by having the WoW token in addition to the usual bot problem.

By being able to sell gold to get Battle.net Balance via the WoW token, players are encouraged to bot themselves to get access to paid character services, items on WoW's cash shop and even other Blizzard games. I don't know if Blizzard ever decided to allow Battle.net Balance to be used to purchase Blizzard merchandise (T-shirts, plushies, etc.) but if so that would encourage player botting that much more.

RMT here is mostly limited to gil (why, people? gil isn't hard to get) and sometimes houses. The cash shop RMT that we used to see was actually scamming and not real sales.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

I may be wrong but I think the point they're trying to make is that the RMT problem in WoW is compounded by having the WoW token in addition to the usual bot problem.

By being able to sell gold to get Battle.net Balance via the WoW token, players are encouraged to bot themselves to get access to paid character services, items on WoW's cash shop and even other Blizzard games. I don't know if Blizzard ever decided to allow Battle.net Balance to be used to purchase Blizzard merchandise (T-shirts, plushies, etc.) but if so that would encourage player botting that much more.

RMT here is mostly limited to gil (why, people? gil isn't hard to get) and sometimes houses. The cash shop RMT that we used to see was actually scamming and not real sales.

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Both games are a gigantic mess RMT wise, period, there is no "better" ,a lot of people who used to use gold sellers in WoW switched to the token, which is the "legit" way to do it, while some are still using gold sellers from websites, in the end, there was no gigantic "addition" of people because of the token, but a lot of people switched from the non legit one to the legit one I am pretty sure.

Also the person in question is literally acting as if they're blindfolded regarding what goes in FFXIV, bots spamming every minute, teleporting all over limsa, doing instant teleports, PF carries and carry sites amongst many other things.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

I may be wrong but I think the point they're trying to make is that the RMT problem in WoW is compounded by having the WoW token in addition to the usual bot problem.

By being able to sell gold to get Battle.net Balance via the WoW token, players are encouraged to bot themselves to get access to paid character services, items on WoW's cash shop and even other Blizzard games. I don't know if Blizzard ever decided to allow Battle.net Balance to be used to purchase Blizzard merchandise (T-shirts, plushies, etc.) but if so that would encourage player botting that much more.

RMT here is mostly limited to gil (why, people? gil isn't hard to get) and sometimes houses. The cash shop RMT that we used to see was actually scamming and not real sales.

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It probably does make rmt/botting worse in wow but its still a big issue in ff14 that isnt dealt with as much as it should. But it also doesnt help that they only have 4 people looking over reports on over 70 servers.